faa or jaa

[Erik Robinson]

I've got my ppl and am plannning no doing my cpl and cfi in the near future. I was just wondering what are the differences in the FAA and JAA licences and if the FAA is transferable to JAA once CPL qualified??

[Matthewjharvey]

Requirements for FAA and JAA are very similar flying time wise but the JAA CPL requires an incredibly lengthy period of ground training followed by 14 exams. As you know, the FAA only requires 1 written to be taken for the CPL. Hence if you opt to get the FAA CPL and instrument rating you still have to sit the exams, do an approved course of flying to requirement for the JAA CPL and the whole 50 hour course for the JAA instrument rating. It is a bloody hassle. If I were you I would work out where you will be likely to get a job and then choose the license type. You cannot do the flight tests for JAA instrument ratings in the US, similarly the writtens have to be taken in Europe as well. It is a lengthy process to get a JAR license even if you have all the required hours, at least 6 months to a year.

Good Luck

[englishal]

the other option is to get the FAA IR, CPL ME and then build hours (CFI) until you can get the FAA ATP. Once you have the FAA ATP and 1500 hrs I think, to transfer to JAR ATPL requires you to take the ground exams (ATP) and sit the IR flight test, which you should pass a piece of **** as you have been instrument rated for around 1000 hrs.

To get a FAA CPL ME IR from PPL level will cost around $20,000 compared to the horrendous JAR costs of around 25,000 GBP just to get you a CPL with just IMC !

It depends how rich you are, if you have bags of money and want to live and work in the UK, go and pay OAT 55,000 GBP for your JAR Frozen ATPL, if not, go spend some time in America and get your FAA ratings, and then you'll realize what a rip off JAR is !

[willbav8r]

Of course, the other side to the coin is if you get the full JAA ratings, it takes about 20 mins at the FSDO to get the FAA ratings (other than a "frozen" ATP which doesn't exist in FAA land).

As said before, all depends on where you think that you might end up (and be ABLE to end up) and, how much dinheiro you have to drop.

Best of luck.

Wil

[Erik Robinson]

Thanks for the replies. If I had more money I would like to do it in the U.K. But with around a saved budget of $20000 I'll probably be staying in San Fran for a few years. I'll just have to marry my english girlfriend! Am I mad.
Cheers

[rolling circle]

the other option is to get the FAA IR, CPL ME and then build hours (CFI) until you can get the FAA ATP. Once you have the FAA ATP and 1500 hrs I think, to transfer to JAR ATPL requires you to take the ground exams (ATP) and sit the IR flight test, which you should pass a piece of **** as you have been instrument rated for around 1000 hrs.

Not quite true. 500 hours must be in a multi-crew environment which, effectively, means getting a job with a Regional - difficult without the right to work. Also, this route requires the ATPL Skill Test (rather than the IR) which must be taken on a multi-crew aeroplane.

[whoateallthepies]

Going the other way, I have a UK ATPL(H)/IR. What would I have to do to gain a FAA helicopter ATP and IR? Is it as simple as 20 minutes in a FAA office?

[Matthewjharvey]

In response to rolling circle, I assume he means the FAA ATPL requires 500 hours multi-crew. If he does then he is incorrect, there is no multi crew requirement, actually the toughest part of reaching the FAA standards for an instructor is normally the 500 hours of cross country (greater than 50 nm) time required. If you are talking about the JAR requirement obviously you are correct. But still to obtain the FAA ATPL is the best way to go as it avoids the rediculous requirement to do the full JAR I/R course of 50+ hours. This absurd regulation means that someone like me who has an FAA CPL/IR/CFI/CFII/MEI and 1500 hours, many of which are instrument needs to spend over 10 grand to convert to the JAR license, where I will be doing basic stuff that I have been teaching in the US for years.

[Julian]

I did hear a rumour last time I was in the US that there is regional out Nevda way that for $5000 will give you 200hours (unpaid of course!) in the right hand seat of one of it internal commuter planes. As I understand it the plane (I will try and find out who and what!), is essentially a single pilot operation but they run this 'scheme'.

So guess that would work out about $12,500 for 500 hours if required, still less than a JAA IR rating! :D :D :D

Julian.

[rolling circle]

Greaser, I have just re-read my previous post and do not see how you could have assumed that the 500 hour requirement referred to the FAA ATP.

Just to make it clear - In order to avoid the full JAA IR course, one must hold an ICAO licence including a type rating and 500 hours experience on a multi-pilot aeroplane. One then has to pass all 14 theoretical knowledge examinations and the ATPL Skill Test.

The ATPL Skill Test has to be taken on a multi-pilot aeroplane for which a type rating must be held. If the Skill Test is taken on the type on the ICAO licence then no further training is required. If, however, the Skill Test is to be taken on another type then a full type rating course must also be completed.

As to the idea of paying for hours - It is possible to have hours built in multi-pilot operation on single-pilot aeroplanes counted towards the 500 hour requirement but only if the operation is mandated for multi-pilot by the national Authority. It would appear that the regional referred to by Julian is not mandated for two-pilot operation by the FAA but is a single-pilot operation which can, when necessary, operate two crew and, therefore, the hours gained will not count towards the 500.

In any case, if they are using a single-pilot aeroplane, as defined by JAR-FCL, it would still be necessary to add the cost of an approved type rating course on a multi-pilot aeroplane before taking the ATPL Skill Test.