Chinese ATC Altitude Clearance

[bluehawaii]

Can you assist me with this question.Does the Chinese ATC give altitude clearance in meters?

[galaxy flyer]

Yes, they do. Sounds simple, but like most things Chinese, it's not. If in RVSM airspace, one must use meters with ATC, but use feet, not meters in the cockpit, setting what amounts to 100 above normal flight levels--FL291, FL301, FL311, and so on to FL411. All other levels are metric at all times.

GF

[Capt Chambo]

Yes they do. Quite a few are quite low too, a lot are only 900m ~ 3000'.

Things can get further complicated as the Transition Altitude and/or the Transition Level are not always published on the Jepps. they are advised by ATC (but you just try asking for it!). The clue is whether or not they give your clearance to XXX metres on the QNH, which means you are below the TA/TL, or whether they clear you to XXX metres on standard which means you are above the TA/TL.

There are even airfields that only work on QFE. (Though to be fair they do give the QNH, but all clearances are based on the QFE).

Hope that helps.

[de facto]

All airports in china i flew to so far have ta/tl in jepps.
If airport uses qfe,aircraft must have the qfe option.

[Arfur Dent]

Yes. As above but a 'different' system of metres in Russia/Mongolia. All a/c carry conversion charts and each clearance on approach (ie 900 mtrs) has to be converted and agreed with other pilot prior to setting as a restriction in feet! All modern-style aircraft have a 'metres button' but we stil have to do it the long way - just to be sure. A pain and a potential threat too.

[Capt Chambo]

All airports in china i flew to so far have ta/tl in jepps.

Have a look at Dalian (ZYTL).

If airport uses qfe,aircraft must have the qfe option.

Not necessarily. We use a conversion table, accepting the QFE clearance, consulting our onboard conversion table and set our altitudes as per QNH. We tried operating using QFE, but the management decided to revert back to QNH and tables.

Coming back to TA and TLs. When operating into Tianjin (ZBTJ) despite a published TL of FL118, when approaching from the East, and under Beijing radar control you will be cleared to XXX meters on "Standard" ie. a Flight Level, despite being below the published TL.

It can be a confusing place to fly :eek:

[Dan Winterland]

The reason why you have to do the conversion the 'long way' and set the feet conversion in the altitude window rather than rely on the meters function is that since RVSM was approved in China, all the meters levels have been converted to a standard feet level and everyone flys on these.

ATC should make it clear if it's a FL by using the terminology ''Climb FL 4200 meters'' but often they don't. If in doubt, ask!

[de facto]

If the airport is using QFE,my airline SOP says aircraft must have the QFE option.
Does ZYTL have an ATIS? TA and TL are normally stated.AIP?
True,some airport have lets say a published TL of 118,and ATC may clear you to drscend to FL 108.,in that case they will clear you to descend 'on standard'.self explanatory.

[johannschmith]

Those clever Chinese have devised their own special Metres to Feet conversion table which must be used by all aircraft for conversion. Basically they have assumed that 300metres = 1000 ft. Airlines then adopt their own company SOP for the altimeter setting. We get PNF to read the metric equivalent in feet which is set in the altitude window by the PF who also checks that the metric button is pushed (airbus) and checks the ECAM screen for approximate agreement with the cleared level. Both pilots verbally and visually check the results.

[Sue Ridgepipe]

Does anyone know where I can find a reference for standard aviation and ATC terminology in Chinese with pinyin translation?

[galaxy flyer]

Use Metric Levels outside of RVSM airspace; you will be issued a Metric Clearance in RVSM airspace but you must use the IFALPA chart to convert the cleared metric level to "Imperial" level in RVSM airspace, that is, FL 291 thru FL 401. Above FL 401, it is back to metric levels.

Once below the TLv, you will be well below RVSM and using Metric Levels and then, below transition, metric altitudes.

Yes, it is confusing and wouldn't be allowed anywhere but in China. Money talks and nobody walks.

GF