Making friends and influencing Cabin Crew

[Michael Hunt]

Talking to a couple of the cabin crew the other night and there's a story doing the rounds via the grapevine and a cabin crew facebook page that a 777 captain took exception to a couple of crew finishing off the leftovers of the business class meals etc. and promptly called the company to have some Cathay security meet the plane on arrival.
Apparently the F/O covertly informed the cabin crew involved and let them know that it might be a pretty good idea to remove any leftover catering from their bags before arrival.
Anyone else heard this one?
The cabin crew have got the ****s big time and whether the story is true or not the captain in question would be well advised to bring his own sandwiches and thermos for the next twenty years or so I reckon.
Those birds have got memories like elephants.
After hearing who the Captain was it made the story very plausible. Arrogant young man at the best of times.

[hongkongfooey]

So what you are saying Mike is the captain was playing the CCs game, try and stab your colleagues in the back as silently and sneekily as possible ?

Good on him :ok: maybe he has been one of the many to fall foul of the oxy thieves down the back ( apologies to the handful of good ones )

[Michael Hunt]

Not trying to say anything mate just chucking it out there for comment and to see if anyone else has heard it doing the rounds.
It is a rumor network after all.

[Captain Dart]

Uncalled-for, 'fooey, maybe you have had your own issues with them?

For some of the CX girls, yes the English is marginal and most are lacking in the personality department, but they still do a damned good job for what they are paid, what they have to work with and who they have to work for.

Have you experienced the 'service' from the hags at QANTAS or on North American airlines recently?

[The Wraith]

I'm with Dart on this one. They have a hard enough time as it is without some Capt or FO causing them grief as well. And then we wonder why they don't like/trust us.
They're generally a good bunch of people and I'd take them over QF/BA etc any day!

[404 Titan]

Michael Hunt

You weren’t flying with me the other night were you? We were talking to the ISM and FP about this very story. I wouldn’t know this captain from a bar of soap because I’m on another fleet but his actions were nothing less than disgusting. I’m just glad that the F/O was able to give them a heads up.

Fooey. I personally find most of the cabin crew are actually quite OK if you actually give them the time of day. Granted some of the locals can lack in the personality stakes but most of them are OK.

[The Wraith]

Incidentally, any clues as to who the Capt was? I'd want to make it clear to the CC on my flights that I wasn't with him! I don't want my food or drinks "tampered" with!:ok:

[badairsucker]

Arrogant young man at the best of times.

Well, could be quite a few young arrogant types on the 777. A well known very short and I mean VERY short English skipper or the taller aggressive verbally challenged Aussie or the short uptight VYR based Canadian.:ok::ok:

[hongkongfooey]

I could'nt give a flying :mad: about their looks or personality, I was referring to the " good job " they do of letting pax roam around the a/c with the seatbelt sign on, reporting other staff for BS misdemeanours ( no not me, but an awful lot of people seem to have stories ), reporting their own CC ( are you going to try and tell me this is not the CX CC culture ? )stealing things from the aircraft etc.

Like I said, I apologise to the good ones, from what I have seen over the past few years they are in the minority.

[Capt Toss Parker]

Arrogant??

Was some one calling me? Anyone need to be dressed down over something obscure?

I'm sad to say that it looks like I've been "out-wankered" this time. I usually go to work on a daily basis and try to make the day out as horrible and uncomfortable as possible, but attacking the girls and calling security on them is a whole new low!

I'm impressed! I'll recommend this man for a star chamber position! :ok:

PS: I'm an arrogant OLD man ... COS 08 COS no one else would have me!

[badairsucker]

I was thinking of including you Toss but it did say YOUNG....:ok:

[SweepTheLeg]

Have to say I heard this rumor from some cabin crew the other day. Have to call BS on this one. Know the Captain in question and there is no way this happened.

Same thing with that ISM Frankfurt rumor. Or what about the Gold Coast BC roommates both pregnant by the same cockpit crew? Sorry hate to debunk that one too.

I know I know sucks not having anything "interesting" to gossip about.

How about that monster payrise, eh?

[Beta Light]

I have experienced first hand "how NOT to make friends with the CC" , cannot help to think that after that little childish move from our leader I now understand why some girls are not to keen to come to the flight desk unles it's duty related.
Fortunately this is the exception in my CX experience.

Personally I find under the circumstance and with the culture differences our CC is doing OK. ( No, not dating or married to one)

And as Sweep the Leg confirmed, and least 2 myths BUSTED

We have way to little excitement in our work environment, a great breading ground for some hot rumors.

As for the Captain wanting to report CC as rumored ..... unfortunately "Plausible" from 0.001% I have worked with.

[Harbour Dweller]

Either way, this Capt's reputation is f#%ked with the girls now.

There's no stopping the gossip once it hits the rear galley. Truth or lies won't matter as it will be set in stone that he's guilty.

[nitpicker330]

This isn't the same 777 ace that reduces the fuel is it?
The one that a lot, correction all FO's hate flying with?

[geh065]

No Nitpicker, not him. He isn't young anyway!

[crwjerk]

I was told about this a couple of weeks ago. The FAU President posted a Facebook message to all the members to let them know about the incident and who to watch out for. An "Alien".... Meaning....... Overseas Chinese.

[LongTimeInCX]

IF the story is true, and thats a big if, even knowing this newish captain, then Tyson744, I would say the FO did a good thing by alerting the cabin crew.

We shouldn't be going out of our way to drop our work colleagues in the sh1te.

As for whether it's true, yes he is a young individual not lacking in confidence, has been known to carry on like you would prefer he didn't, however, like many of the other recent rumours, I believe it would be inconceivable he would knowingly commit culinary suicide for the next few years till cabin crew memory fades, even he is not that stupid.

Incidentally, whilst an ISM was plugging me for info the other night, she said even poor old Frank still takes his own sandwiches.

I hope this myth comes out in the wash as "Busted"

[Director Fury]

I now that the CN is question has been constantly calling up ISD and demanding that they quash the "rumor"...where there is smoke there is generally fire. Arrogant t wat, either way he should grow a pair.:*

[okey]

Good evening All.

Before we do another job of burying one of our own based on heresay and dubious facts (ever noticed that hardly any other airline groups on this forum appear to do this as much as us?)can we just confirm:

1)The cabin crew were just finishing off some food in the galley? ....or....
2)Packing their bags with all and sundry to cart off home or where else?

Well, even if we hear straight from one of the horses mouths we'll only get one side of the story anyway. So we can't confirm it. So all that follows is conjecture.

1 happens as standard ops...so... someones telling some serious porkies and throwing fire on a story damaging someones reputation on an anonymous forum.

But if it's case 2. Well that's called theft isn't it? Here or anywhere else.We take any more than a used SCMP off the jet or a peeled banana and get caught that's game over. The issue of salary, language, whether you think the skipper is a top guy or a dropkick etc is totally irrelevant. Everyones got an opinion.

I have no knowledge of the facts, good guy, bad guy, serious, short, tall relaxed, based in timbuctoo? I really don't care. A long time reader of this forum but this is my first post. I just cannot contemplate why people want to hang a colleagues name and reputation out to dry on an anonymous forum, instead of giving him the benefit of the doubt.

Don't like the way he runs the ship. Fine. For those of you who aren't running it now and are passing judgement on him, you'll be running it before you know it, try keeping everyone happy all the time and you'll end up a basket case. Think everyones going to love you. Think again. How many different cultures are you dealing with on any given day? Fact is he's running it for the duty period. He's not getting paid to make friends. However making some is a desirable outcome if at all possible and most of us work hard at it.

Cabin crew don't like the way he runs the operation. Definetly a shame. We appreciate the work you do and looking after us most of the time and we realise your job , whilst different to ours is extremely difficult at times. "Whats that Mr Jones, you'd like to verbally abuse me and now you'd like me to get you a meal and a tasty beverage as quickly as possible, certainly sir".

But sometime a line has to be drawn and he gets paid to draw it.

He handled the situation in the way he saw fit. That's what he gets paid for. Whether he handled it well, badly, over the top, or turned a blind eye thats up to him. Pilots trying to keep everybody happy all the time is a recipe for bad things to happen.

A quiet suggestion whilst operating on limited and grey info. Standard ops as a left seater here. Did you go over the top fella, did you go bananas over case 1? none of us are perfect. Next time your joining the marching band leaving cx city tap one of the crew on the shoulder with a quick apology, "sorry I was having a bad day" reasonable apology, reasonably accepted., don't want to accept it fine. And of course no one involved has been sacked or disciplined over eating the leftovers.

Case 2. Caught thieving.Handled it as he saw fit. Are the cabin crew ops manuals vague on the consequences of a five finger discount? Probably not.We'd all do it differently or possibly the same. In the words of one of our gentleman flyers now happily retired when faced with (possibly, who really knows) the same scenario. A mad rush of bags being filled with everything from glasses to caviar right in front of them. "you do know I'm the Captain and he's the First Officer right ladies and gentleman? Please do us the courtesy of not doing that in front of us, good day to you"

Like most stories I only heard that second hand. But what a dignified way of handling a tricky problem. However, what if the station manager walks on board and see's the captain presiding over a pilfer fest and goes into an undignified rage .One of the crew looks up and says "the captains here and he didn't say we had to stop, so we thought it was ok". Guess who's going to the fleet office and who gets to go home to bed?

Anyway back to my cave. It's a rumour network. But that doesn't mean we have to hang our colleagues in a public forum. Sinner or saint. Isn't that what the bar is for?

By the way to the previous poster who suggested he "grow a pair". Ever faced down a group of hostile cabin crew? Thats a pair. Or you could just head over to the AOA forums. It's pistols at dawn and queensbury rules over there at the moment. But you have to tell your name.

Cheers all.

[Flap10]

Although I completely agree that you shouldn't hang a colleague based on rumours, I disagree in the way that you defend the act of dobbing someone based on something so petty, regardless whether this rumour is true or not.

We've all, at some point or another, had the haagen Dazs ice cream, or dare I say it, the leftover wine in the bus after a tiring sector, so in a sense we are all just as guilty. If you can't draw the distinction between a serious offence and one that doesn't even deserve a mention, well then you are either retarded or vindictive.

Nobody respects or trusts a snitch, irrespective of which side he/she is on.

[spannersatcx]

we have a directive, NO food to be removed from a/c anyone caught doing so WILL be sacked as it is deemed as theft.

[CokeZero]

spanner

no taking food or wine off the plane. we just tip the win down the drain... what a waste.

i wonder how much waste cx produces by this method? Answer: not a lot as we are constantly running out of food onboard all the time. the management have been skimping and cutting back now for years.

as regards to the issue at hand - i'll go with flap10 on this one

[Night Watch]

spannersatcx

That's the last time I offer you a sandwich when you come to sign off the book! ;)

[okey]

Sorry ladies and gents. Just can't believe one of our guys would go all out and call security over a few leftovers. Just doesn't add up. Very unfortunate day for relations if that's true. If there's actually anything to this rumour there has to be more to it than that.Only thing I see that's that black and white is the pages of FCOM 3.Retarded & Vindictive. No. Imperfect & ready to hear both full sides of the story before ready aim fire.. Yes.

On a general note.

"Flap 10" said "Nobody respects or trusts a snitch, irrespective of which side he/she is on" . (apologies if I got the quote wrong) For some things I'm right with you. For others I have to differ.

To the guy who snitches on someone for taking 2 dollars out of the tip jar to call a cab and get his mates home safely after a big night out so they don't have to drive. No respect.

But....A guys mate mugs an old lady out of the blue for her handbag. Its got her pension money and heart medication in it. The guy asks him to return it. Tell's him he'll help him out with the money he needs, do anything reasonable to help him give it back to her and not get stung. He just won't give it back to her, all options exhausted, the old lady is still without the meds and rent money...You hate to do it but you snitch. Respect.

[spannersatcx]

ah but Night Watch as long as I don't remove it I'm ok :ok:

[Oval3Holer]

It is my understanding that anything perishable left over after a flight may be removed from the plane. Have I been misinformed?

[geh065]

As far as I know, we are allowed to remove 'unconsumed' crew catering and 1 used newspaper from the aircraft per person. I would assume that if the food is consumed already, that you are also allowed to remove it off the aircraft!! :8

Do the cabin crew get crew meals on shorthaul sectors? If not, what counts as crew food for them? Everything the passengers leave over I guess?

[Harbour Dweller]

spannersatcx,

Just remember the laxatives. Turnarounds can be short. :ooh:

[Capetonian]

Just to throw in something here about removal of left overs, particularly food, from aircraft. When I worked for an international airline in SA, we used to remove the unused food and take it to underprivileged children in a home near the airport (except the caviar from First which used to disappear!). I was stopped by customs one day and told that this was highly illegal and I would be fined heavily if I continued to do it.

The miserable old so-and-so from customs was the same one who used to ask me for copies of 'Manchete' off the 'plane, a Brasilian magazine which in those days used to show the bits of ladies's bodies which in SA were covered by black strips.

No food, no Manchete.

[Busbert]

In most countries port health and quarantine go nuts if you remove food from the aircraft (Customs and Excise get cross about alcohol coming off aircraft). At a UK airline I worked for, it was policy that it was OK to eat leftovers on the aircraft, but anyone caught decatering off the aircraft would be dealt with severely. The CC used fry up the Upper Class steaks for the ground engineers, and leave lovely steak (breakfast) baguettes at the forward galley for the engineers meeting the early arrivals. It was a nice start to the morning, particularly if you had been dragged out to look at a major inbound defect.

It is not just a matter of 'stealing' from the company, it can get the airline in deep sh1t if employees are found breaking quarantine and customs laws.

Ratting out your colleagues is another story - if the Capt wants to make a point it should be done 'internally' rather than grassing out to external parties. Not good to air your dirty laundry.

Busbert

[boxjockey]

It was a local guy. It was also confirmed by another local guy. Some people just need to grow a sack and handle things the right way.

box

[Michael Hunt]

Local/Kiwi was my mail from Cabin Crew.

[etrang]

Nobody respects or trusts a snitch, irrespective of which side he/she is on.

Does that also include the FO who, in the situation described above, snitched on the Captain to the CC?

[The Messiah]

Yes etrang nobody seems too worried about the F/O's behaviour in all this. Poor all around.

[crwjerk]

Big Picture....... Food Wastage....... Pilots using duvets....... Nit picky bull****.......... Saving a dollar to make a dime......... 2 BILLION USD PROFIT AT LEAST!!!!!!!................ = no need for cost cutting.............

[Flap10]

Does that also include the FO who, in the situation described above, snitched on the Captain to the CC?


Actually a snitch is in reference to someone that notifies or informs a higher authority of illegal activities. What the FO did, and rightfully so, was to WARN the cabin crew involved. Unless you consider people emailing RT/PC vol 8s to be snitches too, well then I can see how you might see the FO as a snitch. :ugh::ugh:

[boxjockey]

Flap 10,

Well said!!

box

[etrang]

Actually a snitch is in reference to someone that notifies or informs a higher authority of illegal activities.

It also applies to getting someone in trouble with their colleagues or friends. If various posters on this thread are correct then the FO's actions put the Captain at serious risk of food poisoning and worse.

[The Messiah]

The F/O could have told the ISM, "just to let you know I have heard the company are starting to do spot checks after landing".

[CodyBlade]

Quote from CC last night:'''I would be very careful with people who handle your food!''

Yikes!

[iMad]

Nobody knows the full truth except the persons in question, so I'm not here to judge the rumour itself.

What has been observed throughout the years though, from various pilots and cabin crew, both local and expats, is that the Captain in question does not consider himself a "local", he refuses to speak Chinese (considered very rude and aloof in Chinese culture), and I would dare go as far as saying he's not proud (to put it mildly) of the fact that he has a Chinese face and surname.

For those of you who choose to believe these rumours, please don't paint the locals with the same brush as you would this Captain.

[NoAndThen]

Nobody knows the full truth except the persons in question, so I'm not here to judge the rumour itself.

What has been observed throughout the years though, from various pilots and cabin crew, both local and expats, is that the Captain in question does not consider himself a "local", he refuses to speak Chinese (considered very rude and aloof in Chinese culture), and I would dare go as far as saying he's not proud (to put it mildly) of the fact that he has a Chinese face and surname.

For those of you who choose to believe these rumours, please don't paint the locals with the same brush as you would this Captain.

Really, iMad? Don't paint the locals with the same brush as this Captain? Because your post is an embarrassment to the "locals." It's guys like you that are going give local pilots a bad rep. What kind of comment is it that you would "dare go as far as saying he's not proud (to put it mildly) of the fact that he has a Chinese face and surname."

From your post it's obvious you're way worse than this rumor. Let me guess, you are either the FO who ratted out this guy, or some bitter local who has been Cat D'd.

[geh065]

Just because someone looks chinese it doesn't mean that they can speak it! Surely people know that many of the locally employed pilots who look chinese grew up overseas and can't speak a word of it? If people don't realise that, I don't think they are smart enough to deserve a job here.

[iMad]

Any local who knows this Captain knows he has this reputation.

Let's get this out of the way. He speaks Chinese. Fact. When he overheard some CC talk behind his back in Chinese, after the flight those CC got an earful (in English of course..)

This culture thing, as expats you won't feel it, everybody speaks English, all is well. But within a Chinese group (off-duty of course) if you refuse to speak Chinese then unavoidably you will get a reputation. This rumour is happening in a predominantly "chinese-rich" CC environment, so I feel people need to understand the background, why it is believed this Captain is capable of pulling off what is rumoured - a betrayal of a group of people. noandthen you think this is way worse than the rumour? well so be it, but unlike the rumour itself I know this is the truth.

I'm sorry but exactly how am I giving the locals a bad rep? I'm merely pointing out a fact, a local culture nuance. I don't know how you would feel if an English person refuses to speak English in England to you, but in the oriental culture, anyone who looks like a certain ethnicity but pretends he has nothing to do with it tends to get the thumbs down. If you don't like it, too bad. You're working in an Asian airline, living in an Asian culture, get over it, you can't impose western values on Asian cultures all the time.

It has been pointed out in previous posts that he's a "local", next thing you know everyone assumes all local captains rat out on fellow crew members. I do not want people to think that.

[geh065]

He is on a local contract....that does not make him a local. If he understands Chinese it does not mean he can speak it himself, or to any degree of decent ability. I know plenty of chinese who grew up overseas who can understand chinese but it is pretty ugly when they speak it and they know this, so rather than embarass themselves with bad pronounciation, they speak english. Fair enough too.

[Sqwak7700]

Surely people know that many of the locally employed pilots who look chinese grew up overseas and can't speak a word of it?


They don't geh065, because China is one of the most racist societies in the world. There is no immigration and assimilation in China - or even Hong Kong. You are never truly accepted as an equal citizen and therefore will always be treated (and feel) like an outsider. Doesn't matter if you are born here or live here your entire life.

That is why it might be hard for a local to understand that someone who might look Asian with a Chinese name does not in fact speak or understand Chinese. They have no concept of true immigration or assimilation like Americans, Canadians, Australians, or Europeans might.

Ever watch Chinese television? How many times do you see a black person, or even a white person, or any other race but Chinese?

[Cpt. Underpants]

This has racist undertones that are totally inappropriate.

I DO speak passable Cantonese (I'm very Caucasian looking) and have many local friends. I've known them for over two decades and although SOME locals have xenophobic leanings, it's predominantly due to ignorance.

I have found them to be warm, friendly, welcoming people who have made my family and I very welcome and have given us endless opportunities.

Have you ever experienced the warmth and humour when "they" realise you can speak Cantonese? Try it some day. I'll wager that apart from (poorly enunciated) directions home, 90% of our foreign crew can't string a sentence together.

[Sqwak7700]

Have you ever experienced the warmth and humour when "they" realise you can speak Cantonese? Try it some day. I'll wager that apart from (poorly enunciated) directions home, 90% of our foreign crew can't string a sentence together.


Yet you are still not allowed to become a full HKG citizen, that is the point I was making. I'm sure they love it that you speak Cantonese, but that is besides the point.

At the end of the day, a line is drawn and you will always be an outsider. :hmm:

This has racist undertones that are totally inappropriate.


Sorry, but it is simply the truth. I agree, discriminating against others is wrong, but that is the way the law works in this part of the world. Asia has a very long way to go in these regards, it is not only the Chinese.

The Japanese are even worse when it comes to xenophobia and racism. There are second and third generation Japanese citizens that are shunned from their communities and whose children are not even allowed to go to school because they are not true Japanese.

[gjanf]

I agree with Okey in Post 26: unless it's a really serious crime, you don't rat out your mates. IF the rumour is true, then I don't think anybody did the right thing. IF the CC were stealing, then they should not do so, obviously. IF the CN was not happy with what he saw was happening, then he should have spoken personally to the CC and told them to put the stuff back, not rat them out. IF the FO was aware the the CN had ratted the CC out, he should have gone to the ISM and said something like "There are checks at security today, make sure your crew are not taking anything off the aircraft that they shouldn't". No names needed to be mentioned.

Bottom line: by all means do the right thing, but don't rat out colleagues to do it. :ok:

[VforVENDETTA]

Instead of choosing to show authority and tell them to put it all back and now as he watched, he chose to act like a backstabbing sneak etc... This kind of character doesn't deserve anything more than what he was attempting to do to others. It's ridiculous to suggest he deserves to have his name protected. He attempted to get those CC fired. Whatever he gets in return, is fair game. He's even too stupid for his own good to tell others and brag. I know, he didn't have the balls to stop what he didn't like and should have stopped and wanted to still stop it, or just meant to do it as viscously as possible. No respect or regard for this character either way. He deserves the few drops of Visine eye drop in his coffee that will give him the super runs for days. ;-)

[Michael Hunt]

Jesus the requirements for being a good guy must have changed somewhat since the last time I checked.

[jonathon68]

This sort of cockpit vs cabin crew gossip gets blown out of all proportion about once every year or so.. The gullible are quickly drawn in.

However, it is rare for the blame to be so publicly attached to an easily identifiable specific individual.

The absurdity of the reported incident makes most sensible grown-up people very skeptical about the whole thing. No hard facts, flimsy story etc. The only clear information is the posting on the internet of the supposed identity of the "master-criminal".

Why waste time just destroying his name/reputation on the internet. Surely, we have all the evidence we need to just drag him out of his house and throw him in jail etc? But, wait a minute.. What actually happened? Where are the facts? Who did you hear this from?

This is yet more stupid crew b*llsh*t. If you can't detect that, and then feel the need to spread the rumour, then shame on you. But wait a minute.. What if this rumour was actually about YOU?

Any normally intelligent individual who has spent some time in this industry, has learned that miss-communications are incredibly easy. No.. if you think you communicated your issue well, think again. Even if you think you did - you probably did not.

Add, the fact that many people involved in our day to day operation, are not native English language speakers. In addition as pilots we are generally high on IQ, and low on EQ, in much the same style as Dr Spock in Star Treck. Quite often we just don't "get it", in just the same way that the people we are working with don't seem to 'get" what we are telling them.

In an ideal world.. a Captain and ISM would not leave the aircraft without resolving all major differences. It is relatively easy to do this on the flight deck (if you pay attention, and are not oblivious to the sensitivities of your work mates) It is much harder to keep in pace with the mood beyond the cockpit door.

[The Messiah]

This sort of cockpit vs cabin crew gossip gets ............................................................ ..It is much harder to keep in pace with the mood beyond the cockpit door.
Sorry Jonathan but that was just blah blah blah blah blah blah. What is your point?

[moosp]

Well I get what he is on about. Are you one of those who don't get it?

Then it is addressed to you. Try again, and then re-read some crm stuff.

[HotDog]

The way I heard it, Capt. asked purser for ice-cream, Purser said none left. By chance Capt. caught purser on camera, putting ice-cream in her bag, had a hissy fit and called security to meet CC on arrival. I hope this Captain can make an adult decision when it is really needed as his resolution in this matter was very churlish. Must have had a lot of egg on his face when nothing was found in CCs bags on arrival; thanks to the F/O's fore warning!

[Traffic]

HD

Not too wide of the Mark

You may recall in years gone by we had a skipper on the Marrow called Ronnie Wong who in an earlier life crashed a Porsche Spider into the retaining wall at the Macau Grand Prix. Well his name wasn't Ronnie Wong but he was Macanese and certainly spoke Cantonese (and I should add as a footnote was held in the Stanley internment camp as a young lad by our Japanese friends!).

The F/A's never quite understood where he was coming from or going to, especially from the way he interacted with them.

As they say...deja vu all over again.

I scream, you scream, we all scream for ice cream:ok:

[okey]

Bearing in mind this is entirely all rumor and hearsay wrapped up in a fact vacuum. Do you reckon he made a few adult decisions during the command course? Must be a really bad egg to be annoyed by being told fibs and then witnessing his/her crew "liberating" the items there were supposedly none of from the galley. He really should have told everyone how wonderful they are for putting him in that position shouldn't he? Sure everyone thinks he's a top guy when he's organising that urgent jumpseat or sorting the taxi fuel to get the purser home on her days off.

Sounds like the F/O was a nice chap but is it now standard ops for F/O's to countermand a skippers safe decision however well intentioned said F/O may be? Don't get me wrong, there's some mighty fine decision makers wearing 3 bars but is "I like your decision so I'll go along with it", and "I don't like your decision (ref safe above) so I'll find a way to countermand or short circuit it because I think you're being a bit of a plonker" an option now? Did the F/O discuss said countermanding/ short circuiting with the skipper before acting? Brave new world.

P.S. Ice creams a good thing.

[VR-HFX]

Wow...Capt Toss..can we get you to prescribe some downers on the fleet...I have to PAX to NYC next week!!!!

[Capt Toss Parker]

Just do a roster swap and fly with me .... you'll be so "down" at the end of your trip that you'll want to drink battery acid and then throw yourself off the IFC.