Changing Times

[Ryan5252]

Hi All,

Before you switch off, I assure you it's not simply another is the US better than UK question I am asking. Personal circumstances have dictated that I will (happily) be moving permanently to the Florida in 2 years time. (Wife doing a PhD has offer for a job and green card sponsorship).

It has always been my intention to gain a PPL (done) and build on that to hopefully become a competent enough pilot to instruct. My flying is going well and I am not adverse to filling flight plans and GARs for flights across the FIR from Ireland to England and back. I planned on building my experience by gradually flying further afield but now the time has come where I have to make some relatively immediate decisions.

I am delighted to be going back to Florida and on a permanent basis. UK/EU flying is becoming so restrictive in terms of EASA reg's coupled with less accommodating airfields (£75 at EGPK last week!!) and rising prices across the board, I envisage only pilots with commercial ambition 'sticking at it' in 10/20 years time.

I'll cut to chase and pose my question; should I carry on with my flying as I'm doing now or should I get the ATPLs, CPL and FI sorted quick sticks before I go out, or should I relax and fly when I can and do everything else when I get out there?

Ideally I would like to hit the ground running when I get out but I imagine I will be able to complete the training FAA style without much financial reservations.

Would the increased costs of doing what I want in the UK combined with any required FAA conversions when I move away outweigh the advantage of saving my money now for flying experience and completing the training in the US at a more reasonable rate?

Advice from both sides of the pond would be fantastic, but any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Perhaps this may be more suited to the Professional Training boards? (I consider myself GA through and through and most of them boys are snobby :=)

Cheers
Ryan

[IO540]

If you are going for US licenses and you are going to live in the USA, doing anything much in Europe is going to be a lot harder work in comparison.

You can do the flight training here but checkrides are hard to organise and examiner availability is uncertain.

But if you want to do all possible stuff in the 2 years then go for it ASAP. You will need 1500hrs (incl 100 night) for the ATP and you can do that in G-reg C150 :) You don't want to turn up in the USA in 2 years' time and needing to hour build the 1500hrs - it will take you ages and pure hour building is utterly boring.

[mcgoo]

He wont need an ATP if planning to instruct, just CPL/IR and the instructor rating(s).

[172driver]

I am not quite sure I really understand your question:

What are you actually trying to achieve at the end?

You mention instructing, but then CPL and ATPL. Do you, in the end, want to fly commercially? For the airlines? Or do you want to become a full/part time instructor?

Perhaps spelling out more clearly where you want to go with your flying would get you better answers.

All that said, lucky man !

[Ryan5252]

Sorry my mistake. Laziness on my part. In the end I want to instruct. I do not want to 'fly' for the airlines. I refered to the ATPLs meaning the ATPL theory exams so I can do my CPL then FI.

Opps!

Ryan

[mcgoo]

It will be a lot cheaper and simpler just to do the FAA ratings rather than do JAA and then FAA.

[Big Pistons Forever]

It will be a lot cheaper and simpler just to do the FAA ratings rather than do JAA and then FAA.

Absolutely: If you want to instruct just get a FAA Cpl and FI. There is none of the ATPL theory exam silliness that CAA/JAA requires before you can hold a Cpl.
The practical part of the FAA Cpl training is, however IMO more demanding than the European standard. Florida has a large and dynamic flight training industry so I think there will likely be work available, although it won't pay very well. The good news is you have the most important thing going for an entry level commercial pilot....a spouse with a good job :ok:

[thing]

Hey whatever, best wishes on going to Florida you lucky person! I was going to do an accompanied 18 month tour at Cherry Point but good old Gov UK decided I was better served fixing AWACS instead. Oh joy.

[Pilot DAR]

One thing to add to your consideration is the very real prospect that once in Florida, it might be viable to buy a decent time builder plane, and tour around while building time. This kind of independant experience building will make you a much better pilot, and thus instructor. I'm always leary of the 300 hour wonder instructors, who, themselves, have hardly left the circuit. If you own a plane, you can go on extended cross countries (and there is a LOT of country there!) and you'll be amazed what you'll learn!

Time building on a plane you own is much cheaper than renting. When you're done, sell the plane for what you paid for it! As it sounds like flying is more expensive in the UK, save your money, and put it toward buying in the US. You can always hire an instructor, to train you as you need on your plane.

[thing]

Don't forget to buy an alligator proof liferaft though.........

[IO540]

You need a CPL to be a CFI (this is US terminology; a UK "CFI" is just a self appointed title for the bloke who runs the flying school) and a CPL/IR to be a CFII.

As mentioned, you don't need an ATP to instruct but I wonder if perhaps you need one to instruct or sign somebody off for an ATP checkride?

A US ATP is relatively achievable. The Euros screwed their up with the 500hr multi crew requirement (which is totally out of a private pilot's reach financially; well maybe Elton John could do it) but in the USA you can get a single engine ATP in a C150. (Won't be of any use done in a C150, with no TP/jet type ratings, but you get the idea). You need the 1500/100 hrs TT which many private pilots have, and the ATP is still only 1 written exam. The real work of the ATP is of course in the type rating(s) which is where it should be.

[englishal]

I'd just fly for fun here and wait until you get to Florida to do the rest. You will need 250 hrs to do the FAA CPL but of course if you are going to do the IR then that will use up 50 or so hours.

I'd go to florida and convert to the FAA PPL and add the IR. Then train for and do the FAA SE/ME CPL. I'd then add the initial CFI rating, then the CFII and MEI ratings. You might find that if you choose your flight school in Florida carefully that once you have finished your training they may offer you a job as a FI.

I certainly wouldn't bother with the JAA ATPLs at the moment, though if you wanted to continue training you could do worse than going to the USA for a few months and doing the PPL/IR.

(I'd go to California as Florida is flat and boring and full of old people :D)...

[172driver]

Ah, that's a lot clearer now! In any case, quite a few posters have already beaten me to it: keep flying for fun over here and then do your license and ratings once in the US. I would start learning the theory while still here, so you can hit the ground running once across the pond and get the theory exams out of the way asap.

Don't go down the conversion route, this is a house of cards. Once you arrive, just do a standalone FAA PPL, then the IR, CPL and if you feel so inclined, ME.

You don't need the ATPL for instructing, but if you feel like doing it - in the US nobody stops you. You just need the requisite hours. Luckily, they don't have a CAA or EASA :ugh:

[flybymike]

a UK "CFI" is just a self appointed title for the bloke who runs the flying school)

I am not sure that is altogether true.

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/Standards%20Document%2036%20v2.pdf

Page 5 gives further details, (although applies to commercial training.) It is a bit vague regarding qualification criteria but I am pretty sure a recognised CFI has to meet minimum criteria set down by The CAA/JAR. I dont think for example a new recently de-restricted FI could set himself up as a CFI of a new FTO overnight. Doubtless someone on the instructor forum could advise further.

[Ryan5252]

Thank you all for the insightfull replies. Certainly some for food for thought there!

The good news is you have the most important thing going for an entry level commercial pilot....a spouse with a good job
and too well she knows it!! :{