Is NATS AIS narrow route still working?

[Stephen Furner]

Is the NATS AIS narrow route briefing for NOTAMS still working? I just tried to get a briefing for a trip from EGTF to EGSR using distances and bearings from nav aids to specify turning points. All I was able to get was an error message.

I kept getting the message "Error parsing route. Please enter a valid route string." whenever I tried to request a narrow route briefing for the string:

DCT OCK121006 DCT DCT BIG124005 DCT DCT DET335011 DCT DCT LAM094007 DCT DCT CLN279014 DCT

As far as I can make out this conforms with the information given in the NATS AIS help system about the construction of a route string. I tried a few other strings and could not get them to work either. I was only able to get a briefing if there was only one item in the route string e.g. DTC CLN DTC Is there a problem with the NATS AIS briefing service software?

When I tried the contact e-mail address given in the NATS help pages to check the system status I received a delivery failure message bounce back from the NATS postmaster?

:confused:

[hoodie]

Stephen Furner"]DCT OCK121006 DCT DCT BIG124005 DCT DCT DET335011 DCT DCT LAM094007 DCT DCT CLN279014 DCT[/COLOR]

I'd guess one thing it doesn't like is "DCT DCT". Just one "DCT" will do.

[Stephen Furner]

Good point. I thought it might be that as well so I tried just using just a single DCT but still got the error message. Also, in the example in the help pages it shows two DCT

:confused:

[IO540]

I have just done a NRB for a flight today and it is working OK.

[Stephen Furner]

I just tried it again this morning after trying it with two DCT and then one DCT I found that removing all the DCT terms apart from the first one and the last returned a briefing. The route string that finaly worked was:

DCT OCK121006 BIG124005 DET335011 LAM094007 CLN279014 DCT

This format for a route string does not conform to the guidance given in the NATS AIS help system. The example screen shot given by NATS for a narrow route briefing from EGMA to EGNT is DCT FNL DCT DCT GAM DCT

:confused:

[dublinpilot]

Interesting. When I tried to do my own narrow route briefing I got the same problem as you. DCT can't appear between any of the waypoints anymore.

[IO540]

That is interesting because multiple DCTs worked for me this morning.

Maybe somebody has broken it. Probably the same person who has broken pprune :)

[Stephen Furner]

IO540 I also suspect there is problem with the software. I tried to e-mail NATS about this using ais.supervisor(at)nats.co.uk but just got back a delivery failure notice from the NATS e-mail service to say that it was not possible to forward the message to Adam Pearce.

Anyone know a working e-mail contact point for the NAT AIS service that can be used to check this out?
:confused:

[eharding]

IO540 I also suspect there is problem with the software. I tried to e-mail NATS about this using ais.supervisor(at)nats.co.uk but just got back a delivery failure notice from the NATS e-mail service to say that it was not possible to forward the message to Adam Pearce.

Anyone know a working e-mail contact point for the NAT AIS service that can be used to check this out?
:confused:

A sample default NRB EGLM -> EGPE FL020 with a route DCT WOD DCT CPT DCT was working a couple of minutes ago....and the Google Chrome Extension (https://chrome.google.com/extensions/detail/foncpdbdcabckbbkiklmilnaomcniphb?hl=en-gb) appeared to plot it correctly.

Suspect whatever the problem was has been resolved already....

[Jim59]

There is a known problem, introduced recently when the software was upgraded, in that it may include NOTAMs for FIRS that are nowhere near the route entered. Got the following response to email to AIS:


This has happened since our supplier EAD upgraded the system recently. They are aware of the problem and are looking for a solution.

[Stephen Furner]

I was also able to get a briefing for the route DCT WOD DCT CPT DCT for a flight from White Waltham to Inverness. But again even with Google Crome rather than IE I was only able to get the EGTF to EGSR route to work if the DCTs were taken out.

It looks like the use of DCT is dependent on the way the position of the turning points are defined.

:confused:

[Stephen Furner]

I have now had some e-mail from NATS who have tried out the NRB with different route strings. The results for NATS was:

DCT OCK121006 DCT BIG124005 DCT DET335011 DCT LAM094007 DCT CLN279014 DCT
Does not work

DCT OCK121006 BIG124005 DET335011 LAM094007 CLN279014 DCT
Does work (note: NO DCT between points)

DCT OCK DCT BIG DCT DET DCT LAM DCT CLN DCT
Does Work

[dublinpilot]

It appears that using a brearing from a beacon will no longer work with a DCT.

This certainly used to work, becaues I used to use it all the time. (The string is available in PocketFMS flight plans, and I simply copy and pasted it to save time).

However I haven't been using that for for quite some time, because I found the beacons to be very 'hit and miss'. Some were not acceptable beacons, some were ambigious (two with the same name in different parts of the world).

Worst of all some UK ones were not acceptable but there was another one with the same name in another part of the world that was acceptable. This one means that as far as the system was concerned the point wasn't ambigous, so I got no warning, but the system thought I was flying around the globe! :eek:

So I convinced the PocketFMS programmer (Being a beta tester has some advantages :E) to give me a special report where the string is defined in Lat/Long in a format that is acceptable to the NATS notam system (and Lat/Long can't be ambigous). This saves a lot of time putting a route into NATS notam, and as it's simply copy and past, it avoids typo's. It still works with the dct's too!

dp

[Stephen Furner]

Dublinpilot it is a good idea to use a route string format that is easy to generate from the flight planning software being used for the flight. This can save a lot of time and reduce the potential for human error. I was doing something similar with NavBox Pro to get the VOR distance and bearings I used in the route string I had a problem with.

But why not cut out the middle man and the potential for human error in the manual transcription of the route from the flight planning software to the NRB request form? I think the simplest solution from the consumer perspective would be for NATS to make an API available that flight planning software can use to automatically request an NRB using lat long coordinates. The flight planning software could then take account of content of the NOTAMS in any automatic route finding or display them in a simple pictorial form on its graphical display of the route to alert the user.

[dublinpilot]

Yep. I agree completely.

If such a facility was available for NATS, then I'm pretty sure that all the flight planning systems would be tailored to use it.

dp

[Stephen Furner]

I tried narrow route brief again last night and got the same results for the route specification as when I tried it last September:

DCT OCK121006 DCT BIG124005 DCT DET335011 DCT LAM094007 DCT CLN279014 DCT
Does not work

DCT OCK121006 BIG124005 DET335011 LAM094007 CLN279014 DCT
Does work (note: No DCT between turning points)

Either it's broken again or never got fixed when I reported it to NATS.

:ugh: