Ryanair recruitment propoganda?

[CIPO]

So a memo regarding recruitment from managment states 18 resignations & no need for OCC courses?
I've heard up to 200 resignations since May & OCC courses cancelled as there are no DE Capt's???
So who is telling the porkies.........

[Callsign Kilo]

The later is probably closer to the truth than the former, especially concerning DECs. In terms of resignations, no one really knows. I too have heard a variety of speculations. One thing for sure, the memo and the base visits spell out something. There is more potential for people to leave.

Think to yourself, when do we really only get memos from management? Only when they are concerned about what we are doing. The Balpa recognition campaign, upping sticks and ******* off....I'm sure there are more instances?

[pimo]

That memo made me smile, i felt like they are talking to us like if we were 3years old.i thought they were smart but this is showing me they are scared!

[wayupthere]

That memo made me smile

Me too, considering my week off magically turned into a week out of base during Sept in the new roster which was news to me. :}

It must be all our fully crewed bases need more heads after everyone hurting themselves falling over from laughing so hard at that memo :ok:

[mary mary]

Quite. So who is this DR anyway?

[Aldente]

From PB's memo

"the vast majority of Captain positions are planned from the current pool of co-pilots,with very limited external recruitment"

Maybe, but how many co-pilots will there be in the pool and for how much longer ?

You might find the "current pool" has emptied out a bit by next year .......


;)

[EGCC4284]

Emirates Pilot Recruitment Roadshows In Uk.

20th Sept Gatwick
21st Sept Stanstead
22nd Sept Stanstead
23rd Sept Luton
24th Sept Manchester

Starting 10 am and finishing 1300 .

[superced]

LCC and slavery......same story . Specially ryanbeurk.

[HighLow]

:=
PB, the vast majority of us aren't stupid (can't speak for the minority).

The memo is a clear attempt at propoganda....and it may be effective for some issues, but when dealing with the obvious pilot shortage within Ryanair...closing your eyes, sending a memo, and hoping the problem goes away, well this problem ("impending crisis") will not disappear UNTIL ....

You and your staff sit down, ask the question WHY are people leaving??......the answer is obvious:you are now the victim of your own decisions...market forces are now dictating, no longer is ryanair. pb and those around him need to start listening to their pilots, offer stability, place them near their homes and family.

What FO's are telling me, the current practice of threatening your high houred FO's all to go for command or face the consequences, this strategy is just simply not going to cut it anymore. They are going to WALK! Increasing, I notice many of the FO's I fly with very serious about their career and future, and recognise their own value/worth due to the skills they have.

RYR. the time has come, you really have to do more, placing your workforce close to their families and friends, it takes little effort on your part, click of a button and in the long run, for both management and pilots, it has massive benefits.

You will retain your staff, and steady the ship, because at the moment, this ship is SINKING.

[D O Guerrero]

Aarrghhh...!
PropAganda!

[superced]

low cost will be always low cost never forget that... with them the only way is to run away....

[bigdaviet]

Even if there is a pilot shortage at the moment, they'll be able to catch up through the winter. They've got 4 months of many planes grounded. In this time more SFOs can be upgraded, and as we all know they'll be replaced with the cheaper cadets.

[Tarzanboy]

This RYR is becoming a real tumor in aviation.

Please stay in that "company" all of you!
Let them treat you bad!
NO FRILLS RULES!

Seriously, I am surprised no real actions have taken place in the past.
Isn't it getting time we ban the slavery?

[dannyalliga]

In this time more SFOs can be upgraded, and as we all know they'll be replaced with the cheaper cadets.

True about the cadets even if there are very few coming down the line lately.
You can upgrade SFO's (pass rate permitting) but consider also that they will be moved to 5/3 bases somewhere on the other side of Europe on a lower salary sometimes even making less money than F/O's (like in the case of old VS new BRK contract);with the market picking up again not a good recipe for their faithfulness once they have logged a few hundred hours in command.

Another consideration about the winter is that while you upgrade SFO's you are taking flight hours away from others who are already flying less, making ****e $$$ and obviously attending roadshows and interviews.

Extra care should also be taken when talking about Captains because I already know a few who are working on the new reduced terms in a base miles away from anything they consider home and who are actively looking around for options.

PB will have to face reality sooner or later.

[RAT 5]

Why, if it is true what is told on here that RYR are short of captains across the network, does RYR insist that you can not have a command at a base of your choice, but have to move. (if it is true) This will disrupt family life if you are unabale to move the whole clan, inflict reduced real rest/recovery time at home, and thus impose social stresses which will be carried to work. There will also be financial penalties incurred. Not a good recipe to sustain a career with a company.
In the NTSB report into the Dash 8 crash of the commuter in USA the FAA concluded that the employer had a duty of consideration as to how the roster and general work practices impacted on the social/work balance of their crews. It was a saftey issue. Surely, imposing a move away from home, unnecessarily, so as to be upgraded, does not follow this guideline and is not best practice. If you refuse the command there are financial penalties; if you accept there will likely be less financial penalties, but sever social ones. This is hardly good for moral and certainly does not follow the CRM guidelines that are thrust down our throats every year. When will airline management apply CRM principles to their attitudes towards crews and stop treating us as 'cost units', 'pieces on a chess board' that are moved around with FTL limits, and recipients of 'mushroom mangement' techniques. It is galling to attend regular refresher days telling us how to behave towards one another and act like a team, then for management to behave 180 degrees opposite. It is a disgraceful indictment of 21st century industrial relations that this is the case. LoCo operations and success does not mean lowlevel respect. Indeed high level repsect and appreciation will likely improve profitability of Loco low fat operations. Will the blind not see?

[d105]

RYR is desperate for CPTs. At my base we all fly up to 100hrs per 28 days regularly. There's guys out there being placed on unpaid leave (BRK) because they're at their maximum hours for the year. Another issue is that more and more FO's are waiting for their command upgrade. There's tons of good guys with a family making good money as FO. Why would they go for a command only to have RYR move them to some ****hole on a 5-3 roster away from wife and kids.

[SVENSK]

Interesting....I guess I will stay tuned...

[RAT 5]

If you're a contractor how do you get given unpaid leave? If you don't fly you don't get paid; so what's that about?

[Fly4Fun]

If FR is that desperate for Captains why they don't accept non type rated Captains? If they start recruiting again direct with the company (insted of Brookfield) maybe they would fill the gap.

[Mikehotel152]

If you're a contractor how do you get given unpaid leave? If you don't fly you don't get paid; so what's that about?


We all know that contractors at RYR are merely employees with fewer rights. You know the answer to your question. ;)

[OFDM]

If you refuse the command there are financial penalties;

is there any truth in that?

'forcing' people to upgrade would seem like a really bad idea, but who knows...

[Callsign Kilo]

You can't force a person to upgrade, because ultimately the person has the final say in the matter. They can fail the course!

[Whippersnapper]

Some SFOs are reluctant to be promoted because they will face a base transfer, with the associated lower pay scales that are lower than their existing FO scales and additional living costs and commuting difficulties. Many have young families, too. Some have told me they have been threatened with base transfers as FOs if they don't pursue commands.

[Uncle Wiggily]

Why would they go for a command only to have RYR move them to some ****hole on a 5-3 roster away from wife and kids.

simple...so they can get 500 Captain hours and get the hell off the sinking ship!

[DirectDIKAS]

I know a FR captain who upgraded fairly recently and was indeed forced to go to a base where he does not want to be, Hes only getting fuzzy promises from PB about getting to the base he wants sometime next year, so now with Jet 2 recruiting, once he has 1000 hours pic (Jet 2 requirement), hes off, and good on him, FR need their ass kicked, if your gonna treat people this way, with the current climate, they gonna **** off to an airline that will help them.

Its such a simple thing to get guys into the bases they want but I genuinely think FR enjoy going "he wants to go to 'A' ok well lets send him to 'B' for a minimum of 12 months"(often 2 years) so Im loving the fact that now guys will put up with 'B' to get their hours then its "seeya"

DDA

[Whippersnapper]

I can't help but wonder why Belfast's runway, which ha been sufficient for several years of operations, has suddenly been deemed too short and the base is being closed. It couldn't be just to redistribute the pilots to shore up under-crewed bases elsewhere, could it?;)

[F.O.E.]

Having my month off cancelled and holiday plans ruined I have asked if I could have just a week off in September..... "no crew leave available at any base for FO and CPT we are currently asking people to work their days off."
Have agreed to work additional 6 day weeks to help but all they have done is work me on day off and put me on standby on my schedule working week.... thank you but I'd rather get the 35hrs over 5 days rather than 6 days.

When do I have my months leave?? answer they don't know. So i expect I will find out which month I off when BRK OFF days appear on the bottom of my roster. I find this unacceptable and a further indication that the latest memo from PB about full capacity and only 18 people leaving as rubbish!!!!

[Callsign Kilo]

Unacceptable...Ryanair....no leave for anyone.....screwed up on the numbers.....it's not rostering, crewing or ops who will suffer. You will pick up the slack for management incompetence and colleagues walking away. Same sh1t happening at the orange brigade. If you want anything to change then wave two fingers in their face on the way out the door. When crew shortages start effecting the bottom line then the boys and girls who call the shots will get involved. They will want to know why people are walking away. If flights are being crewed presently and current attrition rates will ensure a winter schedule then I doubt they even know about impending issues.

[zerotohero]

Catch 22 then

You have to leave to be missed! lol - but then your gone and cant return.
So how do we work it, we have no union/backbone
the chances of enough guys getting organised and saying we need it sorting or we walk is beyond slim, its only going to happen from people leaving for other airlines unfortunately, so bring on massive recruitment.

[Whippersnapper]

Catch 22 then

You have to leave to be missed! lol - but then your gone and cant return.
So how do we work it, we have no union/backbone
the chances of enough guys getting organised and saying we need it sorting or we walk is beyond slim, its only going to happen from people leaving for other airlines unfortunately, so bring on massive recruitment.

Forget about the unions - we had BALPA in EZY for two years before the CC signed away £400pcm net from FOs' flight pay, FO loyalty bonuses (10% for me, but potentially worth up to 15% of salary), agreed to a £1100 deduction for crew food (the food amount was subsequently halved, too, which constituted theft in my book) and two weeks leave per annum, all without a membership ballot and against membership feelings.

All that temporarily improved things in that company was an unprecedented level of resignations. They improved the rosters dramatically, but it seems to all have slipped back again with BALPA CC still crowing about what a wonderful job they are doing for the members and how good working for EZY is.

Unions only work in companies that will respect agreements. The others are right - the only thing that usually gets managers' attention is tumbleweed blowing across an empty shop floor.

[FRying]

To everybody reading this, captains, F/Os, wannabes : STAY AWAY FROM RYANAIR. This is a ****e airline. They have orgasms from talking to and pilots in undesirable terms. There is no dialogue, no nothing between pilots and management. Money is crap considering such factors as aside expenditures or retirement plans, etc... And they will work you like a mule.

After all, they want CC to land airplanes. That gives you an idea on the amount of consideration they will grant you.

Just the name of this airline makes me sick.:yuk:

[Sky Goose]

nice one FRying......

all based on undisputed facts i suppose..;)

oh dear

I work there, I does have its issues, but youre talking out of your a$$...

After all, they want CC to land airplanes.

troll by any chance..?

[HighLow]

It won't be long now everyone, the wheels are about to fall off the trolley (sooner that u think)..... RYR will about to get what they deserve, and dont listen to the management line, that all is ok!!! It is a fact people are leaving this circus.

MOL, i am shedding a tear as we speak, couldnt happen to a nicer guy...but the reality is that this CEO is SO FAR detatched from realilty, he doesn't even believe that a pilot shortage is a threat to his operation......how little does he know....his recent flipant goes to show you what he thinks of the pilots who maintain the airlines high saftey record. (MOL has just insulted and offended the very same professionals he needs to sit in the left seat, to satisfy Command Upgrade requirements. SFO's, will just sit where they are, why should they help? especially after they know how much their CEO thinks of them)

It is common knowledge that this fool is more a distraction that anything else. He has no direct access to running of flight operations...the only power he has is occassionally "barking" his usual predicatable rants....

Getting a cabin crew into the flight deck? (yup okay, i will have what that CEO is sniffing too, he must have finally cracked, this is NOT some amazing marketing strategy, its just some deadbeat making careless wreckless remarks).

The really annoying thing is that Shareholders and Management who deal with this man and at the same time, the managers within the flight department who help to maintain the safety of this airline do not issue a memo to pilots stating that MOL's position does not reflect theirs. Sadly, we have not seen anything from management on this.....Very Disappointing!!!

Flew with 5 FO's last week, and 4 of them have applied to Emirates !!
PB, your recent memo , the only use it has is as toilet roll

[FRying]

Totally agree, hilo !

Sky goose, DO ME A FAVOR.... ! :eek:

[eagerbeaver1]

Skygoose

FYI

Ryanair's Michael O'Leary says air stewards could land planes in emergencies | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/article-1309444/Ryanairs-Michael-OLeary-says-air-stewards-land-planes-emergencies.html)

Think before you open your mind.

[CHfour]

FRying,

Sky goose, DO ME A FAVOR.... !

I'm with Sky goose on this one. You're entitled to your opinion but that rant was way over the top. Maybe you were chopped or rejected for an upgrade with RYR? And surely you didn't believe the bit about the single pilot ops?

[Dan 98]

Maybe MOL should have bought A319's, then all his pilots (if they don't already) would know what he was everytime they got to 20ft: " Retard, Retard"!!!:E

Cheap publicity maybe...........................:ugh:

[FR1A]

29th July 2005, 18:18 #9 (http://www.pprune.org/2007182-post9.html) (permalink (http://www.pprune.org/terms-endearment/183509-ryan-air-looking-capts.html#post2007182)) FRying (http://www.pprune.org/members/92424-frying)

Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: my cockpit
Posts: 122

Why join Ryanair while less bully airlines with better T&Cs are ready to hire anytime in gorgeous places around the world ????
You'd have to be completely mad to actually consider joining Ryanair, whether as a captain or as a first officer.



Looks like you didn't take your own advice.....

[dannyalliga]

Almost every F/O i spoke with has been asked to work on days off lately and not only once but several times during the last few weeks.
Captains are flown to the max as usual and they hardly ever have a STBY day.
It's true that up to now I haven't yet heard of anyone specific who resigned to join EK but I suspect it's because of the long application/selection process and the 3 months notice. I think the interesting part will come in 3-4 months from now :E:E:E
On top of that more and more people are talking about selections in other outfits too like Jet2,Lufthansa Italia, Qatar, Korean.
These useless and easily replaceable copilots are looking around.....

[Sky Goose]

eagerbeaver1

Thanks for the link, didn't realise he would actually say something so ridiculous.

Anything for free publicity, but I think this ones gonna bite him in the ass.

[q1W2e3R4t5]

With all this talk of people leaving, due to leave, planning to leave and everyone else going high on average hours what is going to happen. We still have nearly seven months left in the current flying year. Winter will help to slow things down but like a previous poster said after the three months notice expires one might ofset the other.

Someone needs to take command of this company fast before it's too late.

[FRying]

FR1A, Precisely. I DID take my own advice...:E

[superced]

This MOL is just a big "Merde".

[Cloud Bunny]

It's true that up to now I haven't yet heard of anyone specific who resigned to join EK

Well, I personally know 5 who have left/are about to leave and thats just to EK. I agree with Danny, there are many many more who are looking elsewhere. I also know a couple who are leaving for EY and FlyDubai. It certainly will be interesting to see what the numbers look like in a couple of months time. With a bit of luck I will be included in that number!!:} Or maybe they will realise that the place is going down the loo and do something about it - pay new Captains a Captains salary for a start would see plenty stick around. Then maybe not be so random with the base allocations for seconds. I've said it a million times, this could be such a great job but the big men at the top (and the little ones that sit next to them) just wont see it like that.
We were talking on the Flight Deck today about MOL's latest attempt at PR with the F/O thing and we came to the same conclusion that he is starting to resemble some crazy dictator, drunk on power who thinks they are infallible. I think when he finally does us all a favour and resigns there could be a great job for him in North Korea. :p

[D O Guerrero]

It's all rather reminiscent of Comical Ali.

[superced]

This BIG **** MOL is just pathetic... he has millions and millions but he's just a poor guy...ridiculous...sad...pathetic.