Cambridge Airport [Archive]

Luke Davies

13th May 2001, 22:19

The sooner they close down this airport and cover it with rows and rows of Barrett Homes the better as far as I am concerned.

What gives amateur flyers the right to drone around for hours over densely inhabited neighbourhoods at the legal minimum height in noisy and environmentally catastrophic light aircraft?

Does an indivisduals desire to fulfil his or her pilot fantasy overrule the right of an entire community to quiet enjoyment of their property?

I estimate that about six people completely ruined an otherwise idyllic weekend for five or six thouxsand households in South Cambridge. How can that possibly be defended?

Imhotep

13th May 2001, 22:31

I take it you didn't know the airport was there when you bought your Barrett home?

fast cruiser

13th May 2001, 22:41

get a life

Fuji Abound

13th May 2001, 23:51

Having recently visited Cambridge I can only say what a brilliant airport. There is a bus into the city every ten minutes, and the city is of course superb. I would encourage as many visitors as possible to this excellent facility. Thank goodness the airport was there before the housing estate, and continues to train pilots to take its five or six thousand inhabitants on their hols. Of course thats fine as long the pilots learn somewhere else. It always seems to me strange when you see the huge number of people that attend air shows and obviously get a great deal of pleasure from doing so, but seem to think the pilots learnt their skills on Microsoft Flight simulator. Just the biased point of view of a pilot with a love of aviation you understand - no offense intended, just another point of view.

[This message has been edited by Fuji Abound (edited 13 May 2001).]

WalkingChequebook

14th May 2001, 00:20

Just one solitary baaastard with a lawnmower ruined my weekend!

Lawnmower or Aeroplane? Given the choice, I'd take the flying machine!

Get a life might be appropriate..

WC

AC-DC

14th May 2001, 00:52

I guess that you have never flown abroad. How do you think people learn to fly? You can not do it by correspondence. When your Jet took off from Heathrow on your last holiday YOU have ruined the day for many more. When you take your car to the road you make noise so why not sell it and ride a horse?
We live in a modern society where ALL have equal right. We have to respect your wish for quite and to respect your wish to pursue your hobbies but you deny the same from other. Many aircraft owners wants to fit silencers on their aircraft but the CAA do not approve!

Capt Crash

14th May 2001, 01:21

Luke

I'm sorry that you Saturday was ruined, mine was to, flying all day. Just a few points:

The circuit height has been raised to 1000' agl from 800' in the last couple of years to reduce the impact of aircraft noise.

The airfield is the "gateway" to Marshall Aerospace and the company would find it hard to survive without an airfield. Due to the nature of activity that takes place at Cambridge the cost of maintaining the airport is very high, costs are reduced by trying to operate the airport commercially.

Close the airport, close Marshall Aerospace. Can the 4000 employees come and live in your house??

I am sorry that you have a problem with aircraft noise, have you spoken to the Airport Manager about it?

Zlin526

14th May 2001, 02:02

Luke who? Is this not an aviation related forum? If you wanted a sympathetic hearing why not write to your local council, not on a forum almost entirely made up of pilots, enthusiasts and journo's. A bit like complaining about hunting and country sports in Country Life!
Besides, I had an awful day. Driving to the airfield, got stuck behind some ors in a camper van. Did I complain? Did I F**K! :)

[This message has been edited by Zlin526 (edited 13 May 2001).]

Dog On Wheels

14th May 2001, 03:54

'drone around for hours...... at the legal minimum height'

What, they do circuits at Cambridge at 500' above any person, vessel, vehicle or structure? Must be entertaining to watch.

EricTheRed

14th May 2001, 04:04

I live next to a motorway and am sick and tired of the noise all those cars, buses and trucks make. I have written to my MP, demanding that he take immediate action to severely curtail vehicular movements on the stretch of road passing my house.

The local rail network is now under increasing pressure (from me) to cut down on its traffic - or face complete closure. I simply don't want this kind of noise on my doorstep. I find it unacceptable that a diesel-powered locomotive, pulling thousands of tons of freight, aggregates, animals or people should be permitted to rumble and thunder through my neighbourhood. The disturbances caused by trains must stop.

The terrible noise of children at play, in the neighbouring school, was reduced somewhat from the initial 87db, following my vociferous representations to the Education Authority. After a short period at around 57 db, the level of noise increased, back to the original 87db and, as a result, the school has been closed down - on my insistence.

So far, my memo to the Pest Control Department of my local counil has not been actioned. It contained details of a certain bird species which, since the start of spring, has been waking me at dawn with its "mating call". This is noisy AND disgusting and I have, therefore, suggested that the council employ marksmen, lay poison or humanely capture the creatures and release them to a bird sanctuary, where they will be unable to cause distress to taxpayers, like myself. My MP is in agreement.

More recently, I have enlisted the help and assistance of Mrs Sytner (wife of Frank, the BMW dealership boss). Together, we will fight to prevent cows from mooing to one another and making smells in the countryside outside of normal waking hours. Pollution of rural areas should not be tolerated by people who have paid a premium to live in the country.

As soon as we have raised sufficient funds, our activities will be broadened to include lobbying the European Parliament to fund the latest genetically modified sheep larynx. This new bioresearch project will virtually eliminate "baa-ing" noises from the country - making it a more peaceful place to live in.

I phoned my local airfield this week and demanded that they widen their circuit, so that all aircraft going downwind should pass directly above my village and use my yellow bouncy castle as a left base marker. I would be able to feel the good vibes coming from first solo students, and people just having a fantastic time getting a life and expanding their horizons.

Me - well, I'm just a new-age-urban-warrior Not-In-My-Back-Yard (NIMBY) campaigner, who likes to sit on his arse in the garden on sunny weekends and do nothing but whinge about other peoples' business and things that make the world go round. When the weather is bad my telly drowns out all of life's nasty noises.

Please help me, Mr Luke Davies, to make the world a better place, by sending 50 pounds or more this week - to keep the campaign running.

You know it makes sense.

ETR

barbox

14th May 2001, 05:05

AC-DC, yes he does fly,,,,, but ONLY by BA (they have safe pilots, evidently)according to one of Luke Davies previous posts!.

Perhaps he thinks that BA pilots only train on Flight Sim 2000 and dont drone around in GA aircraft for hours on end?.

Captain Noodle

14th May 2001, 07:20

ETR, that post was fantastic.....

Not much sympathy from the Noodle either Luke. May I suggest

1. Permanant Headphones to eliminate all modern living noises, make sure fashionable and nice colour so as not to look like a dork.

2. Luke could you provide some medical advice to help with operation to modify sheep larynx, maybe cows butt modifications could be done here as well.

3. Why stop at humanely killing the birds and animals, lets do the same to the kids.

4. The Flintstones got it right with their feet powered car, have to wear silencer footwear though!

Long live the Urban Warrior!

PS, On a more serious note, you buy a place near an airport. What really did you expect?

Noodle

Evo7

14th May 2001, 10:48

I may be wrong here, but what's "environmentally catastrophic" about a Tomahawk? Given that there are many thousands of cars running around Chichester at any time, compared to maybe a dozen light aircraft (on a busy day like yesterday). They could burn fuel like an A320 and would make precious little difference. As it is, I can't see how they make any...

Sadly, Cambridge, like Chichester, is the sort of town where people move when they have become too old and/or boring to remember that some people enjoy different things to them. Now, in Chichester, they're stuck with Goodwood, although it doesn't stop them moaning, but dare to suggest something *new* - radical things like a cinema (gasp!) or nightclub (ooooh!) - and you'll get shouted down.

Luke Davies, if you are really sad enough to have your weekend ruined by something - anything - making a noise, then I honestly pity you. You need to lighten up. Badly. If you're trolling then go somewhere else - I'd suggest http://www.slashdot.org/

Captain Noodle

14th May 2001, 10:54

Evo, very amusing web site you posted and appropriate too. Had a great laugh.

Noodle

Evo7

14th May 2001, 10:58

Captain Noodle

Thinking about it, Luke Davies post must be a troll - he can't expect a serious discussion based on a post like that. Slashdot is fairly famous for just that sort of pointless cr*p.

Evo.

Sensible

14th May 2001, 11:18

I think we are being somewhat uncharitable with some of the comments here, poor Luke moved in next to an airport, yes, he probably bought it cheap BECAUSE it was next to an airport, but he didn't realise that airplanes made such a noise. Why should anybody think that Luke should move and not the airport, what about his civil liberties? If I moved into a house next to the motorway and found the noise of traffic too much to bear, I would expect the motorway to be closed or re-routed. :)

A and C

14th May 2001, 12:44

This is just another bit of property speculation , buy the house cheap because it is near an airport and then protest untill the airport is closed and then reap the rewards.

This was tried at booker when an instructor doing EFATO trainning was taken to court on a trumped up charge of low flying , the evidence provided by the worst of the local NIMBYs.(fortunatly the court was wise enough to see the truth ,unlike the CAA )

The best of this is that now when selling a house disputs of this nature must be disclosed ,hopefully the guy who started this thread has just shot himself in the foot.

Bouncy Landing

14th May 2001, 14:35

My initial thought was: Lukes post was a wind up...... I hope it is!

If not he is one sad guy. If he hates aviation so much, how come he has had 14 posts and been registered here since Oct 2000? Maybe a professional "stirrer"?

Physician eh? Well when Drs clean up their act (who else can get away with professional "murder" and assault with a mere wrist slap from their "prefessional body" (self interest union & regulator <joke I think> ) then maybe Luke can talk more authoritatively.

Lets have BALPA or AOPA (as appropriate)REGULATE aviation, and if we kill / assault / rape / maim the odd person, then they could suspend our membership for a month or so, and for the worst incompetances, order a check flight......

Cambridge is a great airport - don't give Cambridgeshire council any excuse to listen to pr*ts like this.

For the record I live right under one of the SID routes for Heathrow, and guess what, the next door neighbour yesterday trying to cut his lawn with a grossly inadequate electric mower was much more intrusive than 747s clawing over at 1000' on climbout.

Nishko

14th May 2001, 18:07

What happened, fail your skills test? Poor eye sight? I try to be professional, but the likes of you make my blood boil... http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/frown.gif

Presumably you never ride in a car, train, bus, airliner, motorbike, own a dog, use a drill, hoover, flush the chain, have sex (obviously) Cut the grass, to name but a few noise producing activities.

Having lived in the area for 20 years, I can tell you that south Cambridgeshire is about the least flown over area of the city.

Get over it, Oh yeah, and watch out for blue ice! ;)

[This message has been edited by Nishko (edited 14 May 2001).]

Nishko

14th May 2001, 18:11

P.S.

If I may quote you from a previous post of yours...

"...Finally I should to say that I am not a pilot, and I fly rarely as a passenger. However I work in a highly technical environment (I am a radiation oncologist specialising in the treatment of deep seated brain tumours) where small errors have big consequences. And I know from bitter experience how easy it is to make mistakes (in fact that is one of the reasons that I started to fly less often).

I have been using PPRUNE for a long time now as a spectator and I have usually found it an invaluable adjunct to the news whenever an aviation story comes up (Concorde, Egyptair the Duxford/Kray story). But on this thread I was so surprised by the reaction that I felt moved to register and contribute.

It looks as if professional pilots are flying into the same sort of turbulence that doctors ran into about six years ago. One lesson you should learn from what's happened to us...if you dont regulate yourselves effectively someone else will come in and do it for you, which isnt a very pleasant experience. "

Luke, I must appologise. You clearly are an expert on everything. Pretty bloody rich having a so called Doctor telling pilots how they should conduct themselves.... Now then, where can I find a good old Oncology forum to stir up...? ;)

P.P.S. Your house is now in my GPS - and if you don't stop posting ill informed and ridiculous posts such as the Cambridge airport one, I'll post the coordinates here for everyone to enjoy! :)

[This message has been edited by Nishko (edited 14 May 2001).]

babble

14th May 2001, 20:08

Dr Davies aside, it's a fact that there is an increasingly powerful environmental lobby out there. If we brush it aside we do so at our peril.

Over the past 40 years, transport aircraft engines have been getting ever quieter, driven by successive chapters of ICAO annex 16. Light aircraft engines on the other hand have remained largely unchanged. The typical Cessna or Piper is as noisy as it was 40 years ago and (apart from a few vintage cars) light aircraft are the only vehiecles in the country that still burn leaded petrol.

If it is to win arguements in the face of environmental lobying, GA needs to show that it is at least taking environmental concerns seriously. This will mean developing quieter engines driving slower turning three or four blade props and burning unleaded fuels.

There is a group of Rotax powered Ban Bis at Cambridge which are significantly quieter than the spam cans. I don't know if they still burn AVGAS, but at least they are showing the way.

Nishko

14th May 2001, 21:20

I feel that any argument regarding the use of less polluting fuels is a valid one, but I really think that we have to get this whole environmental thing into perspective.

GA aircraft such as 152s, PA28s etc etc are such a minor percentage contributor to the overall level of environmental pollution that they barely deserve a mention. If you offer them up against cars, trucks, airliners, busses - then spam cans don't even figure (Mr Davies admits travelling on airliners - was it an electric airliner Mr Davies?). I don't hear Mr so called Doctor Davies complaining about the increasing number of stupid roofless busses that plough around the most sensitive inner streets of Cambridge carrying mountains of fat tourists around the city. These busses are noisy and incredibly dirty when it comes to emmission levels, as well as causing lots of traffic jams in the centre that further add to the pollution. My point is that in the big picture the campaign against GA on an environmental basis is a completely bogus argument.

What we are seeing here, as has been the case for ages, is a concerted campaign against a relative minority of people (i.e. GA pilots) who are singled out for whatever reason, probably because they do something that the majority of people neither understand or have the resources to do so. These campaigns feed on a general lack of understanding of aviation in much the same way that the media does every time an aircraft is involved in an incident.

Slightly off the topic, but an example of ridiculous predudice is this:

My life insurance is loaded by 120% because I am undergoing commercial Pilot training, and also fly privately. Heaven forbid that they find out I drive a car to the airport or statistically they'd have good grounds to refuse me insurance all together...

Frankly I am sick to death of these self appointed self riteous idiots such as Mr Davies who use blind arguments that make little sense to further thier own causes. Either ban all fossil fuel burning engines, and ban all noise making activities and forms of transport - or none of them. We should not allow ourselves to be victimised by a few vocal locals. It is a sad reflection on our so called democracy that such a tiny number of people can cause general aviation so much damage. http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/frown.gif http://www.pprune.org/ubb/NonCGI/frown.gif

Capt Crash

14th May 2001, 21:21

Doc

Do you have any idea how many ambulance flights there are into Cambridge every week??

I hope you don't object to those flying over you house or should they go to Stansted and get stuck on the M11?

Cambridge is a fine airport and services Adenbrokes and Papworth. Give us a break we could be flying you or your family in a ambulance flight one day.

Nishko

14th May 2001, 21:32

Yeah! Well said Captain (nice roast dinner by the way) :)

barbox

14th May 2001, 21:37

Quote 'deny the right to quiet enjoyment of their property' Luke?.

You live near an airport, and no doubt purchased it when it was near an airport.

At my flying club we have the same residents complaining time after time and being very offensive to whoever answers the phone, we even get the blame for fighters from the local RAF base!.

Eases off in summer though when no doubt they switch their attention to complaints about the local motorcycle cafe 'venue' which attracts some 4000 bikers on a sunny evening!.

However both the cafe and the airfield were there WELL before the natives moved in, and they no doubt benfitted from a lower price?.

If they built an idealic golf course next door they would no doubt complain about golf balls landing in the garden (worth £3 each)!.

Typical LOGGED complaint,,,a bloody ffffing Spitfire has just come overhead, whatever next?.

No doubt 99.9% of all UK residents would have a video cam handy if they knew a Spitfire would make a 'final' approach over their house!.

Now clear off and get back to working part time charging a fortune for health insurance patients in your 'spare' time and making everyone else wait some 2 hrs after their alloted appointment when doing NHS work.

barbox

14th May 2001, 22:03

Oh and Luke,,,,

Used the following to have a look at an aerial view of YOUR house (to see what the 6 inconsiderate pilots saw at the weekend).

http://www.192.com

(Name search to find your address/phone number and postcode)

Then

http://www.getmapping.com

(To use a post code search for a free aerial photo of your house).

I could then use your coordinates as a waypoint in my GPS (as could everyone else), however I wont, just as I have not actually published your address & contact details here.

The Internet is really an amazing thing, as is the voters roll (via 192.com) and the recently completed UK aerial survey.

HighWing

14th May 2001, 22:49

You might have some sympathy if there was nowhere in the country you could plop yourself that was deviod of airfields.

These days, sadly, it is all too easy to find aviationless terrain...

Evo7

15th May 2001, 00:46

Wow, and I thought that I was pi$$ed off at his post.... ;)

Saab Dastard

15th May 2001, 01:20

Babble,

You are absolutely right about the lack of advance in light aircraft over the last 40 years.

I read an interesting article on tuned exhaust systems for aircraft piston engines - while there is an increase in weight due to the exhaust piping, this is somewhat offset by an approx. 5% increase in HP. But the real gain is in substantially reduced noise levels.

However, any such modifications require major mod. approval, which is apparently too expensive to be realistically retrofitted to the bulk of existing light aircraft.

Why it is not factory-fitted on "mass produced" aircraft such as Piper, Cessna, Robin etc. I don't understand.

Noise reduction like this would remove a lot of the ammunition the "antis" (writing that was sooo like writing "nazis"!) use to support their "cause"

SD

------------------
Hoping and praying should never be confused with planning...

Captain Noodle

15th May 2001, 02:55

Evo, you are a funny person.

WOW is right. There are some pi$$ed off people hammering at the keyboards.

Hope I don't ever offend any of you.

Luke, mate, get on the keyboard and defend yourself, or at least erect a tarp over your place to ward off any 'stray' flour bombs from Barbox's aerial photography mission.

Regards
Noodle

[This message has been edited by Captain Noodle (edited 14 May 2001).]

barbox

15th May 2001, 03:28

It really is amazing how Anagrams are relevant to a persons name, try these for size Luke Davies!.

Value Skied

I Evade, Sulk

Kid, Leave Us

or for the Welsh PPRUNErs,,,,,

Leak Dive Us

g-oose

15th May 2001, 04:46

The original complaint seems unnecessarily provocative (and given the time of posting perhaps it is indicative of the level of distraction the original poster and undoubtedly many of his neighbours were driven to over the weekend). However, the reactions in subsequent replies also seem to be equally uncompromising.

For a start here is someone outside of aviation sufficiently interested in aviation to spend time on an aviation forum. He posts an all too common complaint and precious little effort is made at a reasonable response.

I would imagine that the airport was as busy as any other on one of the few good flying weekends so far this year. With so many movements (anyone know typically how many on a sunny weekend?), isn't it possible that, with only 6 people implicated, the original poster has suffered at the hands of an inconsiderate few, and that the majority of flying activity at the airport was done with consideration for the amenity of those who do not care for flying?

If the above is an accurate picture (I don't know, but then the original complaint doesn't make it clear), then a more constructive response would surely have been a little more sympathetic based on attempts to eliminate such inconsiderate and isolated behaviour?

Wouldn't this be a much easier way to stave off determined opposition (which, with such responses, it's quite possible this guy has just become) than simply stand there and shout "we were here first" (which attitude does nothing to address the problem)?

"...if you dont regulate yourselves effectively someone else will come in and do it for you, which isnt a very pleasant experience." That seems to be a real danger at the moment. Isn't it the case that if we in GA spent more time and effort listening to and trying to be reasonable with dissenting voices, those dissenting voices might be prepared to be more reasonable with GA and we might be spared the regulators?

TwinNDB

15th May 2001, 10:07

Get a life!!! I have absolutely no sympathy for people who move into an area and know that the airport is there...and then complain about it.

Get stuffed.

Evo7

15th May 2001, 12:17

g-oose

While I cannot speak for anyone else, it was the nature of Luke Davies post that upset me.

Had he posted a reasonable comment outlining what he felt the problem was and asking for advice about what could be done, I bet he would have got assistance here. As it was, he posted a deliberately inflamatory comment. Read his first line. It got the response it deserved. It's called trolling, and it has killed more than a couple of websites that I was once very fond of.

If he has the guts to come back and try and be a bit more adult about things, then I'm sure he would get a different response. I'm not holding my breath.

fallen eagle

15th May 2001, 14:50

Hi All, been away for the weekend so quite amazed at the response to this post.seems one or two of us feel that it shouldnt even be present,why all the replies.we should not have to fight and argue our point against a NIMBY on these forums surly.I thought this was a site for professional and private aviation persons!!judging by the number of posts from this person its obiously a wind up and he is just a sad git who gets off on so many people responding to his views.Possibly no one in the real world listens to him.Why not invite him to a PpRune bash to share his views,we could always have an air ambulance standing by,just in case ofcourse,!! Lets just ignore him in the future, Bye for now

dde0apb

15th May 2001, 17:09

I agree that Luke made his point amazingly badly. The trouble is that people like him, if he is serious, get listened to by the like of South Cambs council. And that is bad news.

There's a piece in Flyer this month about some silencers that the White Waltham fleet have fitted to their Warriors: good for them. If Cabair would do the same at Elstree and various others at their flying schools in noise sensitive areas then we would have effective counter arguments against the awkward difficult councils full of councillors who never think that the pilots who took them to Malaga or Lanzarote trained on the same PA28s that they are now complaining about.

Unless we get serious about reducing the noise in our aeroplanes someone will do it for us: like they have in Germany.

Nishko

15th May 2001, 17:26

dde0apb,

I agree, but who will pay for it, the Lottery? Many GA pilots I know already bear enormous cost burdens thanks to rising landing fees, fuel costs, FM immunity, JAA in general, I could go on... I think it's a good enough cause! :)

Nish.

dde0apb

15th May 2001, 18:03

Nishko: it's a good question and I don't have an answer, except to say that I suspect most circuit traffic at most noise sensitive airfields is school planes, and that fitting silencers to these would probably address 75% of the circuits flown.

It's not an easy job to persuade people to pay more for club planes, but I reckon that where I fly, fitting the whole fleet with silencers like the one in Flyer mag. would cost GBP6,000. Spread over two years @ 4,500 hours a year flown by club planes, you are talking less than £1 an hour. Amortised over the life of the engine (say three years @ 750 hours per year) it's less than 50p per hour.....

AC-DC

15th May 2001, 18:05

Nishco
You can't pay don't fly. I know that some will roast me for that but this is the world we live in.
Noise is a problem that needs to be addressed, not to be ignored. The problem is that the CAA and the FAA do not like silencers. For a small club or privet individual the cost to licence such a mode is too high, you also need to licence it for each a/c type and for each engine. At Elstree the C-336 & C-337 are not aloud to land because of the noise they create.

Nishko

15th May 2001, 18:24

AC-DC,

"....You can't pay don't fly. ...."

Oh yes, of course, well done!!! Why didn't thousands of other people think of that first? You are clearly a remarkable intellect for solving this complicated problem.

It has obviously passed you by, but GA pilots already do pay huge amounts for their flying already, far more than they probably need to thanks to ever more restrictive legislation and unfair pricing. Do you really think that placing them under yet more financial obligation is a fair way to take this problem forward?

We are still in great danger here of a complaining and very vocal minority dictating the dos and don'ts to everyone else, and comments like yours put you in danger of ranking among them.

I agree that if noise is created for an unreasonable period of time, and at a ridiculous level it is a problem, but we are talking here about a small number of people who want silence around their own personal castle regardless of the rest of the world around them. They are no doubt the same people who were seemingly surprised by the existence of Stansted airport when they moved to the village of the same name. They have little chance of closing that down, so they start rounding on smaller aircraft flyers instead.

If you live right near to an airport, then you will hear aircraft flying circuits - tough sh*t, move somewhere else. If you don't live near an airport then you may hear an aircraft fly over occasionally, and the noise (which is quieter than your lawn mower) will pass in a few seconds. Big deal.

I suspect these people aren't really complaining about noise - they are probably just expressing a far deeper problem, a problem seated in their intellect.

[This message has been edited by Nishko (edited 15 May 2001).]

New Bloke

15th May 2001, 19:03

I think emotions are running quite high here and that is why it is getting a bit personal. As Private flyers we do have to address the issue of noise and I believe we do already go a long way to addressing it. Circuits have been moved from the traditional square shape to more “neighbour friendly” shape. Take off at Elstree for instance and you turn left about 20 degrees before you are over the far hedge. I think we should all do our bit and make sure we have the correct approach plates and possibly phone the remote airfield for a noise briefing before we set off.

I live close to a gliding site (if it weren’t for comments made to me by someone in the Billy Pickles thread, I would just say where I lived) and personally I hate the sound of strimmers and lawnmowers far far more than Aircraft noise. My neighbours seem to relish in lighting bonfires whenever the sun is shining. I hear more burglar alarms go off each summer as residents go away (and some of them seem to go on all bloody night) and yet, in talking to one of my neighbours recently, he stopped as a glider sailed overhead and said “noisy buggers when they come into land aren’t they” I kid you not. Now for those that don’t know, gliders make a swishy whistling noise and I suspect it gets swishier as they put out the airbrake, but steady on!!! My point here being that some people will NEVER EVER accept us. This wasn’t a jealousy thing, this guy could buy the Airfield if he wanted, but whatever lengths we go to we will NEVER appease some people.

With that in mind, let us do what we can, let’s try to avoid that village on 2 mile final, let’s stick to the published circuit, and then say “Sod You” to the clowns like my neighbour who will never be satisfied.

AC-DC

16th May 2001, 19:30

Nishko
“You are clearly a remarkable intellect”

Thanks for the compliment love you too.

“It has obviously passed you by, but GA pilots already do pay huge amounts for their flying already, far more than they probably need to thanks to ever more restrictive legislation and unfair pricing. Do you really think that placing them under yet more financial obligation is a fair way to take this problem forward?”

I run my own a/c and I know just as you do (or even better) what are the costs involved. I was looking to fit a new silencer on the a/c (in order to reduce noise) at a purchase price of ~ £3500. The reply from the manufacturer was that it will not fit my a/c and that there are not enough left of it to make it commercially viable.
Being a ‘remarkable intellect’ I’m going to upset you even more. I do agree with some of the JAA regulations, i.e minimum number of hours, a yearly test for multi and I do agree with the CAA stand for a bi-annual. I personally try to get about 10h of training a year (I have a wonderful wife that I love dearly and will miss her terribly if I die), do you want me to tell you how much this cost? I hope to get 5h training during the next month.

“I suspect that these people simply object to anyone being 'up there' and so can't help but want to bring them down”

You are wrong again. These people can not tolerate that you me or anyone else does something that is not acceptable by their standards.

Yes, there always be people that will complain regardless of our preventive actions. Elstree has 4 (yes, FOUR) circuits patterns, do you think that these people stop from complaining? You can not win them all but you can try to disarm them. If it costs another £1500 per a/c than so be it! As a privet owner I have to pay the lot, if you rent you will pay another small number of £ if at all.

Now a question for you. What have you done in order to voice you concerns about the future of G.A (other than posting on Pprune)? Did you join Action For Airfields? Have you sent some letters? Did you speak with your parliamentary candidates/M.P about the subject? It is election time, they are very busy but they will speak with you, try it, it works, I did it.

AC-DC