Turn direction - A320

[sharpshooter41]

In case of engine fire after takeoff (e.g No 2 Engine), would it really matter if a left or right turn is done to land back on the departure R/W.

In case of a right turn would the flames be directed towards the fuselage??. I thought the speed would keep the flames going straight back.

Comments please.

[Neupielot]

I would have thought the "fire" is contained in the engine unit itself. no? But then i'm just a noob still trying to learn too:O.

[Tight Seat]

Don't think too hard about that one. Fly the eng out proc ( emerg turn if one is needed).

The only time you should be thinking about fire and flames direction is when you stop on the runway.

Hope it helps.

[sharpshooter41]

TS

Thanks. I also think on the same lines. However, a sim inst. thought otherwise.

[rudderrudderrat]

a sim inst. thought otherwise.
Doh! I can't believe it !

Ask him why the hot exhaust from the engines doesn't hit any part of the aircraft - or does he insist we should never make a turn, in either direction, once airborne?

[leftwing]

well when there is a engine fire, believe it or not, an awfull lot is dangerous ;)
however, flames will be directed straight behind the aircraft, due to the shear speed at which the plane is travelling, a simple bank will not be sufficient to direct the flames in any other way, the ratio of speed:banking angle would be huge

[leftwing]

well when there is a engine fire, believe it or not, an awfull lot is dangerous ;)
however, flames will be directed straight behind the aircraft, due to the shear speed at which the plane is travelling, a simple bank will not be sufficient to direct the flames in any other way, the ratio of speed:banking angle would be huge

[Loose rivets]

The second post is for the opposite engine-out scenario.:p

[Hahn]

And what would the sim instructor do with an engine fire on both inboard engines of an A 340?? Too bad you can´t tell him to get a life!

[Right Way Up]

Simple Hahn, Roll into a 90 degree bank and use elevator to turn. :}

[pilotsaab]

ok wat is the route to follow for an engine fire after V1 ,,is it the SID if no engine out failure has not been published????? like this SID after takeoff at 1000feet or 2.5dme whichever is earlier turn right track 050 to intercept radial outbound 040 and climb at or below 7000feet to X,,,,,and do i have to account for the MSA which is 3700feet so that i dunt run into an obstacle,,,can i level off at 3000 and not worry abt MSA after making a right turn instead of climbing to 7000 with one engine messdup and so that to decrease my workload,,,and then request radar vectors for single engine ILS,,:ugh:

[sharpshooter41]

Matter resolved.

Thank you

[Jetjock330]

Try turning right off rwy 23 Geneva and you will become the fireball ball!

This is a useless idea if ever I have heard one!:ugh:

[clunckdriver]

Resolved? I hope this means your sim instrutor is now out of a job, never heard such twaddle! On second thoughts I have, but only on PPrune, never in the real world.

[sharpshooter41]

CD

Resolved!!!! No, the sim inst. is not out of a job.

What I meant was, that, atleast I would not be telling people to worry about which direction to turn, when there are more imp. things to handle correctly.

Cheers:)

[dovish]

Hello all,
my question is not regarding a turn with engine failure however the topic is the right one.
When we use the headin knob to turn we shoul pull and turn so the aircraft turns the direction the heading knob is turned. If we turn and pull the aircraft assumes the direction closer to the selected heading. What if the headin is the reciprocal (180 turn) selecting and pulling the knob witch direction will the aircraft turn?

[arearadar]

I was always taught that you shouldn`t turn into the dead engine ie. Starboard engine out......turn left. There may, of course, be reasons where this is not practical, sometimes.

Dave

[john_tullamarine]

Vmca is very dependent on bank angle. Therefore, if you are back in the vicinity of Vmca, bank away from the operating engine may increase the real world Vmca sufficient to catch you out.

However, if you are well above Vmca - which is for most takeoffs - potential handling problems relating to direction of turn is not a significant consideration.

[kenparry]

I was always taught that you shouldn`t turn into the dead engine ie. Starboard engine out......turn left. There may, of course, be reasons where this is not practical, sometimes.

On what aircraft?

For any Perf "A" type, that is complete nonsense.

Have you heard of emergency turn procedures to avoid terrain following an engine failure above V1? The terrain does not position itself to suit only an failed engine on a defined side of the aircraft. In the real world, airliners are necessarily capable of turns either way with an engine inop. Such things are trained as a matter of routine in simulators, and done in reality if needed.

[Slasher]

I hope this means your sim instrutor is now out of a job...

Sounds to me he's applying RR Dart fires where the engine
is embedded in the wing (F27, Viscount). Also one had to be
mindful of a turn due to prop effect (torque etc). The Rolly Rip
Dart IMO was dangerous because of all those bloody magnesium
components.

Pod jet engines are safer, and unless it doesn't blow itself to pieces
the rest of the aircraft structure is quite safe. Fuse mount pins ensure
only the engine will fall off and not take the wing with it.

[Capn Bloggs]

Immediate visual return to land? Turn left so the captain can do the landing with the runway in sight during the base turn (assuming that he/she is the more skilled :confused:).

Flames aren't going to touch the fuse when in flight. Too much breeze blowing them straight back IMO.

[Meikleour]

Arearadar: This is the old adage that is often mentioned when one reads the memoirs of former WW2 bomber pilots and I believe was taught at the time. This probably had a lot to do with very marginal rudder authority on these old types plus the slipstream effect on the "good wing" which may indeed make it safer to turn into the live engine rather than risk loosing rudder authority if too much bank were to be applied towards the "dead"wing.

As other posters have mentioned, Vmca can be critically affected. After the BEAtours B707-436 training accident the CAA carried out Vmca testing which showed that for that mark, the Vmca was increased by 20kts with a wings level climbout versus one with 5 degrees of bank into the live side as was used during certification. I still have the Bulletin in my archives!