Cheap type rating for Citation XLS???

[bizjetaviator]

Hi everybody,

Can anybody please guide me for the cheap type rating for citation xls???

[His dudeness]

Define cheap?

OTOH, a 'cheap' rating could cost you dearly, like someone is hiring but wants a guy with, say, a FSI training...which certainly ain´t cheap.

The XLS is an airplane that isn´t cheap to operate, so the usual 'cheap' route on the actual arplane is not the answer IMO. That leaves the known sim training facilities: FSI, CAE....is there anyone else with a XLS sim ?

[bizjetaviator]

CAE is asking for $20 k USD. Can i get it done more chepaer than this??

[OutsideCAS]

presumably you have a job on aforementioned aircraft ?? as for cost.....well, have you actually spoken to any of the training providers mentioned a little earlier on in this thread by other contributors ??

might be worth a little chat to your employer as to his/her preferences regarding you training because cheap isn't necessarily good ! and if your just doing a speculative rating, well...........:eek:

[bizjetaviator]

presumably you have a job on aforementioned aircraft ?? as for cost.....well, have you actually spoken to any of the training providers mentioned a little earlier on in this thread by other contributors ??



Yes i have a job, i did read all the threads i could only find the FLIGHT SAFTY and CAE.

I have to self sponsort my TR :ugh::ugh:

[Phil Brockwell]

....and there it is......light blue paper......and KABOOM

[bizjetaviator]

....and there it is......light blue paper......and KABOOM

but the job is without salary :ugh::{

[Crosswind Limits]

Sorry buddy....... did you say the job is without salary??????:eek:

So as well as paying for your rating you'll get no salary!! :uhoh:

If this is a serious enquiry then you are crazy and your new "employer" is a :mad:

[NuName]

Does "employer" apply when you don't get paid? another plonker.

[bizjetaviator]

This is the reason i want to do a cheap TR

[NuName]

Generally speaking, folks who fly for nothing do not get any respect here, for those who pay for a type rating and then fly for free, you may get a "contract" but maybe not the one your hoping for. You are not doing yourself or anyone else a favour, please choose another vocation, its tough enough without people like you.

[No RYR for me]

So somebody is willing to buy a 6 Mil+ aircraft and is not willing/able to pay/finance a TR?? And worse found somebody willing to fly for free.... :mad::mad::mad::mad:

[cldrvr]

I help out with recruitment occasionally and as a matter of course any CV with a TR with no hours gets binned. It is alarming the amount of cover letters starting with "will fly for free" or "will pay for TR". Plenty of bean counters out there taking advantage of this, but why would I assist someone like that to enter our profession only to erode my TnC's eventually?

If an FO enters our profession to fly for free they won't have much leverage demanding market rates once they move to the left seat.

[Oldschoolflyer]

Don't do it!.:ugh:

[Crosswind Limits]

cldrvr,

I hear what you say and I wish all employers were like yours but they are not. I am not going to be hyprocritical here, I paid for my first TR in 2006. I'd worked as an FI for 2 years and was desperate to move on. It got me paid freelance work then eventually full-time. Was it worth it? I think so.

Now with 2 TR's under my belt and a reasonable amount of jet time I was hoping that I'd not have to do it again but I am beginning to lose hope in the current market. The reason I say this I recently lost out on a full-time job because a newbie FO with 250 hours stumped up £25k for a Hawker rating so fast that I didn't even have time to check my overdraft facility!:{

:sad:

[NuName]

Crosswind, you have said it all. OK, you paid for a type but at least you got paid afterwards. Buying a type is a big gamble for the most obvious reasons but it seemed to work for you. BUT, to buy a type in the full knowlege that you will not be paid is unforgivable. That means you have the money to pay for the type AND you can go without pay. Any fool would know that this is going to put a professional out of a job, and that is why its done, for no other reason than that. If there were not these kind of people around with the wealth (or family) required then the owner would have to take one off the unemployed list. I am sorry but I am unable to have warm and fuzzy feelings towards "pilots" of this ilk.

[INNflight]

Now, go buy a TR if you have the funds like that Thai (?) Prince jetting around Europe every summer with his B737.

Otherwise? You realize being a pilot is not a job but your HOBBY if you pay into it day after day?!? :ouch:

[plugster]

Asking questions about self sponsored typeratings with a non paying job in a professional pilots forum sounds like knocking an abbey's door asking a nun for cheap sex.
Are you for real?

[potatowings]

This is ridiculous man, why the hell would you ever consider doing that.

I know of 4 people who are unemployed and all got offered a job using a rating they currently have and were presented with a bond. Of course they didn't accept, because they come with a rating.

If you not only pay for your rating, but then work for free, you offer no value to yourself or our industry, and by "our industry", I mean all of us that work hard to earn MONEY. Why not go the whole hog... Pay for your TR, work for free, pay for your hotels AND sign a bond!

You are not a charity and as such are doing no one any favors by flying for free, especially not yourself, but more importantly me!

Think about it:
1. Whoever owns that plane has spent millions and can therefore afford to pay both your TR plus your wages.
2. If they can't afford it, then run away, they can't afford the plane, your hotel bills, or you airline flight home when their plane gets impounded.

If it's an operator that's insisting on this, then that unscrupulous b:mad:d is simply pocketing your TR costs and your salary and r:mad:ing you for your time.

Save your cash, invest it in BP and be better off in the long run!!! :=

[bizjetaviator]

So everybody here in the forum are saying doesnt matter how long it takes to get a highly paid job i should wait for it for years and years ...... :ok:

I should not face the reality and should not build some hours on JET.

I should just keep my licence current by paying for IR ETC ETC....

goood :ok::ok:

[NuName]

What experience do you have? How many hours? What licence? Chances are that no self respecting TRO would take you on anyway unless you have their minimum requirements. If you did have the minimum the chances are that you have already been doing something in the industry to get that far. Keep on doing it. There is no pilot out there that would condone what you propose. If the owner expects you to fund the TR and then work for free, why are your alarm bells not ringing? What has he invested in the "captain"? This all sounds mega risky. If you have the money to buy a type and then not get paid that is surley enough to keep you going for a good while, stay out of it and leave it for a professional to do, and insist on being paid, as he should, then you will have done your little bit towards keeping this profession worthwhile instead of helping to bring it to its knees.

[No RYR for me]

I should not face the reality and should not build some hours on JET. If you have to PtoF (only if you are that desperate) make sure:

you buy a type that goes a long way to your goal: in other words 737 if that is what you want to end
You fly a lot of hours
you get paid
it is a stable operator
If not you will be cheaper off with renewing your IR. :8

[His dudeness]

So everybody here in the forum are saying doesnt matter how long it takes to get a highly paid job i should wait for it for years and years ......

I should not face the reality and should not build some hours on JET.

I should just keep my licence current by paying for IR ETC ETC....

goood

Now then, BJA, so in the end you do want to earn a living through flying?


Allright, I´ll break it down for you:

your profile says, you are in Sri Lanka. Lets say, there are 2 Charter operators there:

Company A, who trains its pilots, pays them and generally has a good attitude towards safety etc.

Company B, who presses all it can from its pilots, probably is as cheap in maintenance as it is with its employees.

Your 'masterplan' is to fly for B until A takes one new hires and you will be the candidate to fly for them.

Why this often does not work is, that A either can´t compete with B for a very long time and will be driven out of business by these practices. Another version is, that A employs he same tactics as B. Nothing to win for you then, young Einstein?!
The third thing that could happen to you is, that A simply does not employ people that flew for B.

Lastly, you could get away with it and happily fly with decent salary and good general conditions. UNLESS there is the next special needs person trying to buy himself into the business and undermine YOUR T&C´s.

Go figure.

BTW, I´m a chief pilot (very small ops, so probably not having an impact) and CVs saying fly for food etcetc. go to the bin. Directly, no stops.
I worked long and hard for my career, there is nothing wrong with that. (from school to ATP 12 years, in steps [Electrician, PPL, CPL, IFR]

If its only daddies money you spent, go ahead.

[Spunky Monkey]

Stay in Sri Lanka...We have heating bills here...

[wigwag]

Im not sure, but, perhaps BJA thinks this is a good deal in the current climate, BJA pays only for the XLS type and then gets hours on type.

Compare to others who are paying type rating and line training and then 500 on type also throw in accom and food, then BJA must think this is a great deal.

But it's very interesting to see that as things filter down BJA is after a CHEAP type rating. What happens if he ever finds it ? What corners have been cut in order to fulfill cheapness ?

So many people want to cut corners it all adds up to a very serious situation for flight safety.

Safe flying ya'll

ww