Mr Piper Seneca doing steep turns above my house at 1000ft!

[Superpilot]

nice view was it? :)

(one mile north of LCY at 1426 local today)

[Negative Charlie]

I wonder if it was the same one doing the same thing over a certain naturist club south of Wokingham yesterday afternoon?

[Superpilot]

Red and white (at least I think it was a Piper Seneca).

It did look low, possibly 700-900ft.

[This message has been edited by Superpilot (edited 25 June 2001).]

[Negative Charlie]

Could be the same one. Damn, I wish I'd got his registration. Whoever he was he was well under 1000', possibly less than 500', and quite definitely violating the spirit of ANO Rule 5 if not the letter.

Next time I'm taking my binoculars.

[Spoonbill]

Steady on chaps!
If you really want to nail someone for low flying, you'll need something more reliable than " I think it was 1000ft, 500 - 900ft".
I've been in aviation (ATC) for 25 years now and I still find it very difficult to estimate the height of a moving aircraft.
I agree that low flying outside the confines of airshows and taking off/landing is irresponsible and invites unwarrented risk, but if it ever comes to court action you'll need solid evidence, preferably from a video camera which will give some perspective against surrounding terrain.
The idiots who fly in this manner will usually laugh in your face until you confront them with such pictures.

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It wasn't me.

[bookworm]

Bear in mind that under Special VFR he would be entitled to be at that level, though I don't know if Thames is in the habit of granting SVFR clearances unless required by the weather.

[Superpilot]

The weather was fine, I guess Thames must have told him to remain outside at the last minute, so around in a tight circle he went. But as regards altitude, he should've been a lot higher anyway.

[Zlin526]

May have been on a photographic flight, survey or mapping flight, Flying Eye traffic report, who knows?? Lets not nail him (or her) to the wall quite yet chaps.... Aircraft are sometimes flown lower than the legal height minimums for good reason..

[Aussie Andy]

Chill Superpilot! I believe its the flying eye - often seen over the city (and there was an article about these guys in Pilot last year I think...)

[Superpilot]

Am chilled, I didn't want to make a big deal, just wondered if I would be able to get away with it, thats all :)

[Negative Charlie]

Chaps, you're absolutely right about the difficulty of judging the height of a moving aircraft from the ground; it's hard enough from the air sometimes! My only real concern is that if the pilot's skills at steep turns (very impressive, actually) weren't matched by his ability to control the aircraft if an engine failed then *I* was the one likely to be in trouble, not him.

Never having flown a Seneca, or indeed anything with quite that many engines, I have only a vague idea of what's likely to happen if an engine drops out while in a 60 degree bank at (say) 1000'. Would anybody with more experience care to comment on whether this would be a big deal or not?

-C

[eyeinthesky]

The Capital Flying Eye is a dark blue Cougar, but the reserve a/c is white with a grey/red design. Don't think the reserve one was up on the day you are talking about.

The Seneca out of Stapleford (for stations other than Capital) is usually white with blue stripes.

The debate about SVFR is a little incorrect. It is quite possibe that the a/c came from the LL CTR (where SVFR is the only option) into the LC CTR without the clearance being downgraded. Therefore he would be legal to disregard the 1000 ft above obstacle clearance rule provided he didn't break the 500 ft rule.

But my earlier post refers: beware of judging heights when viewed from the ground. 1000 ft is only 330 yards. Go and stand 330 yards from an aircraft and you will be surprised how big it looks.



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"Take-off is optional, Landing is mandatory"

[Tug]

Remember; flying is fun. At least someone was having fun.

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

Can Senecas do steep turns? I tried it once in an Arrow. Even pulling with both hands I couldn't keep the nose up much beyond 50 degress angle of bank. ;~))

SSD