Good.Cheap.Flying school for uni student.

[ba038]

Tried searching around but unfortunately i can’t arrive to what i am looking for.
Studying at UCL -university college London. Could anyone please advocate me of a good cheap flying school around London they can recommend me to.I have limited amount of cash but haven't done a single flying lesson yet. I live in southeast London so preferably flying schools near there.


However, ill like to point out a CHEAP flying school, I would be highly grateful for those who can recommend it from personal experience.

Thank you

ba038

[Shunter]

CHEAP flying school
Sorry, but there's no such thing. Most schools are going to be similar in price. If you can't afford it, you can't afford it I'm afraid.

There are ways to get into the air for reasonable money, although give consideration to what you want out of it. If you hope to get a PPL you may find that the lightweight end of the market won't count for a lot in your logbook.

[ba038]

Thanks for your input shunter.I can understand there isn't much fluctuation with the prices.However the questions still lies if anyone could recommend me a flying school near my location from personal experience.I could very much go to all the flying schools around the green-belt.But that would be very time-consuming and money wasted on travel if i end up not feeling comfortable with the flying school in subject.


Also to add,i will be heading for a PPL.

[Whirlygig]

very time-consuming and money wasted on travel if i end up not feeling comfortable with the flying schoolDo you want to feel comfortable or do you want cheap flying. You might find the two are mutually-exclusive.

Cheers

Whirls

[ba038]

Whirls - If i could have both i would be delighted.But thanks for the scrutiny,i am glad you picked that up.

But lets just focus on cost implications. Hence the word "CHEAP" again.

[moona]

No such thing as cheap in aviation but Stapleford are affordable and reasonably close to your location.

[Pilot DAR]

I will apologize in advance for this sounding like a rant pointed at ba038, please don't take it that way, it's a general statement;

A person who askes on a "Professional Pilot" forum for a "cheap" service in aiviation, is in a back handed way, communicating the message to all of the readers, that he/she is expecting to be over charged most everywhere they go, and this, as an opening move.

Many of us here work in avaiation, and are proud of the quality, and value of what we do. Publically suggesting that we are charging too much is not the best approach to a business relationship.

It costs money to fly, and it is fair that all the people who work to get an aircraft into the air, are fairly paid for what they do. No one is obliged to pay these rates, if they choose to not fly. Once you have chosen to fly, you have chosen to pay. If the people who go a good job are not fairly paid (and make a profit), they will probably move on, then no service is available.

As a demonstration of respect to others, the only time I try to negotiate price, is either when it is simply unstated going in, or if the unit price is stated, and I'm buying a quantity. Other than that, everyone deserves to make a profit. I'll pay their rate without question. If they're atempting a huge profit, either the product/service is amazing, or they won't be in business too long.

I respect the challenges facing those who are struggling to enter aviation, and offer a number of "at my expense" flights to new pilots to do my part to encourage, and extend a helping hand. Welcome, but please respect and appreciate those who are already working here...

Rant over, no offense or rudeness intended....

[Dan Dare]

VGS at Kenley - free (you probably even get expenses)
ULAS - not SE London, but you do get paid to go flying. You do not need to join the RAF afterwards.
Flying scholarships - ATC, Air League, GAPAN etc all give free flying.

If you are determined to pay for your own flying, then why not consider something more realistic (like gliding/paragliding, microlighting) which you can continue until you have enough money to pay for SEP flying. Whichever for of aviation you chose it will never be cheap.

Good luck:}

[ronniehuang]

You will find that rate for the hire of the instructor and the plane, with all things being equal, are pretty much the same in a given area. What will differ in a quote are all the extra things on top of the tuition and flying time. Sometimes the quoted price may not be the total price inclusive of all the costs involved. In those cases you'll be in for a nasty shock.

One more thing. More important than money is the instructor. If like me you're flying a 152, prepare to get very cosy with the instructor. If you don't like the instructor its not going to work no matter how cheap the lessons are.

[ba038]

Pilot DAR (http://www.pprune.org/members/150561-pilot-dar) - I totally respect what you say however i have a sense that you are trying to state that i am undermining the industry by me saying "CHEAP".I certainly do not intend to do that. I am not going to comment any further to kick-off a silly debate and drift of my query.


All the others that have replied i am very much thankful to you. And an extra thank you for staying with the title of the thread.



ba038

[Pilot DAR]

kick-off a silly debate and drift of my query.


Indeed, entirely fair... best wishes on your quest.

If you find your way to Ontario, I have a bit flying for you, perhaps including amphibian - no cost...

[Kolossi]

I presume your request was for powered flight, and I may be stating the b:mad:ing obvious, but as you haven't had any lessons yet, have you tried the UCLU Gliding Club (http://www.uclunion.org/clubs-societies/gliding/index.php)? Could be a good starting point to get in the air, and you may meet like-minded individuals who you can get together with and even form a UCL Flying club to negotiate good rates with a local flying school.

Failing that I do know there's big rivallry between the London unis - I was at Imperial back in the day - but maybe under the shared kinship of London Uni's, you might be able to sneak into a flying society of a neighbouring uni? I thought Imperial used to have a flying society, and although I can't find any mention now you may be able to. Even if they won't let you join, you could talk to them and find out what flying school they use and convince the instructors there to match the rate for your lessons?

I'm sure if you "think outside the box" (:yuk:) like this you can find a way to get yourself a reasonable deal.

Just my two penneth ... :ok:

Good luck!

[cats_five]

Those rates for gliding are incrediby cheap, and with access to the RAFGSA gliders as well it's a brilliant deal IMHO. I know there is travelling to do, but there would be for any form of recreational flying from central London.

Go for it - the skills of gliding will help with power flying once you have the money for it.

[ba038]

Pilot DAR - Thank you. I sure would take you up on that offer if i ever find myself up in Ontario.


Kolossi - Interesting. Thanks for your input. I may well go in and join.Although gliding doesn't really appeal to me.But since i haven't flown yet it may just well be the best place to start!

[FleetFlyer]

In order to avoid the 'CHEAP's not an option' naysers, the phraseology you should have employed was 'least expensive'. It reassures the professionals and those who have spent fortunes that you're aware of the potential costs involved and bolsters their self worth. Seriously, they work hard in a tough environment for poor margins, we'd all need geeing up if we were PPL instructors.

I got my microlight NPPL partly with the cheapest school in the south. My instructor was poor in many ways. I wound up completing at a different school and didn't enjoy 90% of my training at either establishment. I should mention that the second school I went to charged top dollar and expected top performance from me. My lack of enjoyment here was down to resentment at the poor standard of training recieved previously and the amount of catch up I had to pay for. The second school made me a good pilot and demanded high standards, which I was prepared to pay to attain because I wanted to be a good pilot. Now I'm free to roam and learn (it is definitely a license to learn) I've been able to refine my airmanship whith the support of a great flying buddies and good clubs. Putting up with crap training and facilities is often par for the course if you 'go cheap' but this doesent mean that you won't benefit. If you have previous experience such as gliding or flying with friends, or even just a flight sim obsession, you may well be able to get by (YES, GET BY), though you may not enjoy the experience. If you are not particularly good and need a good instructor to get you through, then getting by at a cheap school is probably not the best way.

I recommend going abroad as the cheapest way to a JAA PPL (£4500 florida vs £6-8000 Blackbushe/Elstree/White Waltham). Buy into a sydicate as early as you can as you can be trained on your own aircraft (insurance permitting) and save a lot of money. A lot of people on here will poo poo a US trained PPL but with the £2-3K you have saved you can do a lot of post PPL flying and training over here. For example, with £3K you could get a non-equity share in a CofA aircraft such as a C172, do your IMC rating in 10 hrs at £90/hr wet + instructor at £50/hr then fly for another 15 hrs, all for the same money that a fresh UK PPL would cost you with no extra experience or ratings. (this example ignores the minimum hours requirement for commencing th IMC course, which I've forgotten.)

Another avenue if money is tight is to go for an NPPL (SSEA) first and build hours on a syndicate owned LAA Permit aircraft. Your hours will count to anything you do afterwards and you get to fly cheaply (£45/hr all in for a small Jodel or similar you can go cheaper with an Evans VP-1 but you reeeeally have to want it to fly one of those.) You can then ace the rest of the PPL course at later date with the skills of an experienced pilot and the finances of an employed graduate. (assuming you're not reading media studies)

If you fancy a ride in my aircraft to get some airtime and you can bung me £20 for fuel then PM me and we'll talk. I'm not far from the smoke.

Apologies for all the brackets. (I just can't help myself)

EDIT;Oh, and beer, you have to buy me beer.

[ba038]

FleetFlyer - I read your post very thoroughly and i have to admit you showed me new 2 pathways i can pursue. I would take everything you said into account on my next step.

I just want to point out although i said i am going for the PPL.I am not intending to do a PPL at the so called "least cost" site/airfield. I just want to get a few hours to see the reality of flying.

[Kolossi]

Good to see you taking on the great advice on offer here. It's kind of been conveyed in the posts above, but given your last post, I just want to say it explicitly:

If you initially just want to have a couple of flights in a small aircraft to see what it's like, wander down to a flying club of your choice, say you are interested, and ask if anyone is prepared to have you on board as a passenger next time they go up. Just because "Joe Public" expects to pay £150+ for a short trip doesn't mean you have to, it's just they don't realise that many many private pilots banging in the hours would be more than happy to have some company and get bunged a few quid for share of the fuel (agree the contribution before you go up). Despite some posters on here (who may or may not actually be pilots), the private flying community as far as I've seen it is very friendly, and very keen to share knowledge and experience with anyone who is interested. (Oh, BTW, nothing against the non-private flying community, just don't have first-hand experience of them. Phew :})

Lastly, just to point out as well that the reason you can't pay more than your share of the fuel bill is that they'd be deemed to be earning money from it, which is strictly prohibited for a private (non-commercial) licence. Having paid anything up to your share of the fuel bill however, there's nothing to stop you buying the friendly pilot some beers in the clubhouse eh FleetFlyer? :ok:

[davydine]

If you are looking for a cost effective way of learning to fly (I wont say cheep!) I would second the suggestion about trying gliding, especially as UCL have such a strong gliding club. Take a look at their web site Welcome to the UCLU Gliding Club (http://www.uclugliding.co.uk/)

To give you an Idea, when I was at university in the early 90's I went solo in 50 winch launches and I did this in about a year. I could easily have done it in less time if i had gone flying more frequently. At UCL this would cost you £40 membership, £4.50 per launch and 10p per minute soaring fees for flights over 10 minutes. You could be flying solo for under £300 - now I will use the word cheep!

If you go on to get your bronze badge and cross country endorsement you qualify for the gliderpilots licence which you can then convert to an NPPL with only 10 hours additional training. I am not sure if you can count a GPL towards a JAA PPL but I am sure someone here will be able to tell you!

Gliding does require a lot of time. The costs are kept down because club members work together to help everyone else get in the air. You will be expected to do your share and there will be a lot of waiting around. This is not for everyone, however, I found that being immersed in the gliding environment helped me to learn a lot by talking to other club members and instructors and by watching and talking to other students.

You may not have thought of gliding but the controlls of a glider are exactly the same as a simple powered aircraft (Exept the engine, obviously!) and you will learn how to fly an aircraft. These skills will not be wasted!

It realy might be worth a try!

David

[pasir]

...


Having been out of active fying for some years I am not sure if todays
regulations would rule the follow story out - Anyway heres how a young schoolboy got himself into aviation back in the 70's. While taking my PPL with a down at heel Biggin club in the 70's we had this young
working class lad (as am I) aged about 13 or 14 who would come up to the field after school most evenings and weekends - all the way from Battersea. Making himself available for cleaning and taxying the club a/c for refuelling and general odd jobs etc - and in return I think he was allowed something like 30 minutes free flying per week or so. He was exceptionally keen - obliging , willing and progressed well.

At 16 years 'Steve' took his PPL - and a few years later was wearing pilots wings on a BMA uniform or similar Co. Those who flew with
SLAC Biggin (yes - some a/c were very slack) should be able to confirm all the above.

...

ex G BCVI

[Stampe]

Now the licensed airfield requirement has moved into the past take alook at the club/group that operates out of North Weald their rates are very competitive and I believe they have a few instructors aboard.I believe its still possible to getr there or near to on the extremities of the underground network(Epping on the Central Line).Also considerAndrewsfield near Stansted an excellent outfit reasonably priced with a real club atmopsphere.

[ba038]

Many thanks for all your replies.I may go ahead and join the gliding club(UCL one) as the membership price is very cheap indeed!