Flying in France and Italy???

[cjuk28]

Hi all
I am going to Venice on a trip in the next few weeks in a C182 with a pal and am looking for any tips and tricks as to flying through France and Italy.
I have CPL ME IR. Not yet ben out of the UK other than in the States.
Any help ideas of route places to stop etc would be much valued.
Pm me if you wish.
I was intending to head towards Marseille and then across to Venice
CJUK
ps our starting point is In Yorkshire

[172driver]

First Q: IFR or VFR ?

VFR, France looks daunting on the charts - but isn't. You'll see that most of the R/P zones have very low ceilings, so anything above, say FL 65-85 is plain sailing. Accommodating controllers, nice n'easy. Just don't try to refuel at some small field between 2-4pm local.

Italy reputedly much more complicated (only have limited and dated experience there myself), but expect to fly across the North @ 1000 - 2000 AGL if VFR. Again, this isn't recent.

Read up on Venice Lido (guess that's where you're going).

[IO540]

You buy the charts and (assuming VFR) plan the route on them, as per your PPL training.

[davelongdon]

Here is another question for everyone....cloud is scattered...so you climb on top....with still being sight of surface...say at the suggested fl65-85....but then the cloud starts to close up below.....is it a simple 180 and descend...keep going on top...or descend through the closing gaps....reason im asking is due to higher ground having to fly higher in France.

DB

[AfricanEagle]

cjuk28,

you can get info from local italian pilots at VFR Flight - il forum di chi vola per divertimento - Aviazione Generale, VDS, Ultraleggeri - Index (http://www.vfrflight.net/index.php)
in the section "welcome foreign users"

[AC-DC]

Very easy in France. In Italy make sure that you know your MSA as ATC might tell you to be at 2000’ MSL while the mountains at your position are 3000’ MSL. In a situation like that just refuse until you get what you want. Near Milan you will be asked to stay below 2000’ and follow some VFR routes, keep your eyes open as it can get busy there. Make sure to have enough pens available so you can fill all required forms on arrival and departure. Make sure that fuel is available for you as sometime it can be a bit tight.

[IO540]

cloud is scattered...so you climb on top....with still being sight of surface...say at the suggested fl65-85....but then the cloud starts to close up below.....is it a simple 180 and descend...keep going on top...or descend through the closing gaps....reason im asking is due to higher ground having to fly higher in France.

Oh yes, that old problem :)

If you are purely VFR and navigating by map reading then you need to avoid getting caught above a solid overcast, and turn back if this happens.

If you are purely VFR and navigating by radio (GPS, etc) then this is not a problem. Unlike a UK issued PPL, a US issued PPL does not require sight of surface for VFR, so you can continue the flight, but you still need to have done your homework so you can land VFR. With a coastal airport, it is obviously easy (if not legal) to descend over the sea, outside controlled airspace obviously, and then call up the destination when you are below the cloud. But you need to be on the ball on the weather data to do this.

If you are IFR (needs the full IR) then it doesn't matter :)

One big difference between the USA and Europe is that here many airports require prior notice, for landing, for customs, etc, and most have limited opening hours. So before each flight you have to contact the place you are going to, to check this. One can "officially" discharge this by reading the AIP but IMHO this is not good enough - especially in Italy. France is pretty easy. PPR for Customs is getting very common now though, everywhere.