View Full Version : C172 at LCY
nomorecatering
2nd May 2010, 08:04
I just watched a video on youtube of a C172 landin at London city airport. It says it was on a funday in 2006. Seems like some sort of GA fly-in come open day for LCY.
Does anyone have info on that. Is it an anual event?
Well from Oz you could win the longest distance to flyin
Don't think it is an annual event
flybymike
2nd May 2010, 09:21
I believe it is in fact an annual event (discussed on the "Flyer" forums several times, if you do a search.) You have to know the "right people" to get an invitation though...
London City Airport Fun Day
http://www.funday2010.com/
London City Airport : Funday 2009 (http://www.londoncityairport.com/funday/) (2009)
It's primarily organised for the local residents with proceeds going to charity (Richard House Children's Hospice).
GA attendance is invitation only and it used to be the case that one needed some sort of connection with the airport, though don't know if that's still the case. Certainly space is limited on site during the day so numbers of GA aircraft able to attend is also limited.
The airfield operates unlicensed for the event which is why single engine GA can fly in. The aerodrome license otherwise precludes such operations.
Sir George Cayley
2nd May 2010, 15:29
Rofa,
Not your fault, it's a common misunderstanding about an aerodrome licence which I'd like to correct.
LCY have a licence 24/7 365 from CAA Aerodrome Standards. They publish their operating hours in the the UK AIP. The weekend Families Day takes place outside of the published hours and is only available to a/c not requiring the use of a licensed aerodrome.
LCY have local rules about who what and when can operate there; some of which are linked to the Planning Permission.
Any airport owner can set rules and waive them - it is after all their land.
To operate un-licensed one would have to either send the document back to the Belgrano with a stamped envelope asking for it back each Monday or issue a NOTAM - neither of which are in fact practical.
I've always been unhappy that, during the week, LCY seem to take the attitude that an SEP is not safe to operate in and out, yet have a charitable change of mind for the day. A bit like flying Spitfires etc over Buck Palace too.
Wonder what the risk assessment looks like?
Sir George Cayley
On a similar vein -One dark night in 1974 my instructor decided we would go on a jolly and land our Cessna 150 at Gatwick - park alongside huge jets
- have coffee and return to a closed completely blacked out Biggin,
I don't see there is a problem landing or departing SE at LCY - any more than at quite a lot of other airports where an engine failure during the approach would definitely land you into houses. In fact LCY is better because one has the river.
If LCY management say "no SE" during specified periods, or that every pilot landing there must wear pink underpants, that is within their rights. They don't have to give or invent a reason - same as LHR bans GA without giving a reason. Or they are entitled to give a totally bogus reason.
I can see the CAA not liking an overflight of LCY (and there is any number of pilot forum claims of prosecutions under the glide clear rule - not that I have ever seen any of these substantiated) but if one is landing at or departing from LCY then glide clear doesn't apply.
I don't see any need for a risk assessment. In any case, it is self evident that GA can safely operate at LCY so any risk assessment would be bogus.
Sir George,
Fair point, there is nothing in the licence about single engined.
But, on perusing the aerodrome licence for LCY it states...
‘No aeroplane registered in the United Kingdom shall use the aerodrome unless there is contained in its Flight Manual data and procedures for approach path angles of 5.5 degrees or steeper and no other aeroplane shall use the aerodrome unless it has data and procedures for approach path angles of 5.5 degrees or steeper which have been approved or otherwise authorised by the regulatory authority of the State in which it isregistered’.
So, assuming few if any of the light singles that use the aerodrome on the Fun Day have anything relevant to the above in their Flight Manuals (despite the fact in practice it's probably irrelevant), how do they get round the requirement if not by operating unlicenced on the Fun Day?
Sir George Cayley
2nd May 2010, 19:55
Which is precisely the reason the former CX gave me when refusing permission to operate my a/c into LCY despite it was the same Dick that had invited me!
Over to you CAA.
SGC
Well, having flown into the Fun Day once a few years ago in a light single I do have a vague recollection of it being unlicenced for the event with, no doubt, a NOTAM to that effect.
A 5.5deg approach is trivial for any piston single or twin.
I think most singles can fly about 10 degrees, straight down the final approach, gear and max flaps hanging out.
Obviously if you are still doing 140kt at "glideslope intercept" then you are not going to make it :)
A 5.5deg approach is trivial for any piston single or twin.
I think most singles can fly about 10 degrees, straight down the final approach, gear and max flaps hanging out.
Obviously if you are still doing 140kt at "glideslope intercept" then you are not going to make it
Yes, obviously, but that's not the point
fuzzy6988
2nd May 2010, 22:31
Build a larger ramp and allow single engines to land there. Would be superb to visit London or do the odd commute to work this way.