10 things that annoy you in aviation.

[AdamFrisch]

Nothing gets me more than inefficiency or reluctancy for change "just because it's always been done this way". Aviation is the king of this.

Obviously, text below should be taken cum grano salis and with tongue firmly planted, but still......:}

1. The TAF's and Metar's. I get it - they have to be abbreviated to able to send over telex. Problem is the telex died, what, 30 years ago? Why on earth are we still reading an incomprehensible abbreviated piece of text?

2. Why aren't TAF's and Metar's combined? Give me the actual weather and the forecast. All in one. Madness having to look in two different places.

3. And IF you're going to use a standard, please make it a standard across the board. It's nuts to have different TAF and Metar values depending on region (one more reason to write it out in plain English - so as to avoid confusions). The US and European TAF's and Metar's are significantly different.

4. You're busy approaching an airport for landing. You have to comply with ATC and spot 5 different other aircraft whilst reading a checklist and a map, at night, all at once. Would it kill the manufacturers to have a toggle that had different settings for Taxi, Climb, Approach, Landing? That way you could just turn a knob to Landing, and the landing light and gear would come out/on. Done deal. When you've landed switch to Taxi and the taxi light comes on etc. Why have a million checkpoints on a list, when one button could accomplish all of it?

5. Why can't I get weather beamed to me in Europe to some device in the aircraft? I can get it on my Iphone, but not to my aircraft?

6. Notams pertaining to your route into the aircraft? Forget it.

7. If you take your FAA PPL in a multi engine, you're not allowed to fly single engine aircraft. WTF? At least JAA has got that one right.:eek::ugh:

8. Bigger fuel tanks. Yeah, so I get it - if I want to fly around 6 relatives all the time then I can't fill the tank up. But when I'm alone, have starved myself to a strand for 30 days and fly naked, I'd like to be able to fly a little bit longer than 450NM. Carrying empty tanks full of air doesn't cost anything.

9. Which way again? Would it kill the publishers of all the worlds VFR and IFR approach/airport plates to print the RWY pattern visually? I don't want to have to read my way through half a page of miniscule font in a shaking plane just to find out that Rwy 21 has a right hand pattern and that so-and-so nimby little village mustn't be overflown...

10. Why on earth can't I carrier wave open the landing lights at most European airports? Would they rather I ditch in the sea in darkness than use their precious facilities after they've gone home at 5pm?

[IO540]

1. The TAF's and Metar's. I get it - they have to be abbreviated to able to send over telex. Problem is the telex died, what, 30 years ago? Why on earth are we still reading an incomprehensible abbreviated piece of text?International standard. One can read the format pretty easily (with practice) and since aviation is driven primarily by airlines (pilots who do this all day), the pressure for change is nil.

2. Why aren't TAF's and Metar's combined? Give me the actual weather and the forecast. All in one. Madness having to look in two different places.As above.

3. And IF you're going to use a standard, please make it a standard across the board. It's nuts to have different TAF and Metar values depending on region (one more reason to write it out in plain English - so as to avoid confusions). The US and European TAF's and Metar's are significantly different.True, but again the only people who are routinely exposed to both, and who have any say, are airline pilots, and they are not bothered.... so no pressure to change.

4. You're busy approaching an airport for landing. You have to comply with ATC and spot 5 different other aircraft whilst reading a checklist and a map, at night, all at once. Would it kill the manufacturers to have a toggle that had different settings for Taxi, Climb, Approach, Landing? That way you could just turn a knob to Landing, and the landing light and gear would come out/on. Done deal. When you've landed switch to Taxi and the taxi light comes on etc. Why have a million checkpoints on a list, when one button could accomplish all of it?Not sure how that could be implemented without some complexity, and aviation design is rarely done by the sharpest knives in the drawer :)

BTW you don't read a map at night (nothing to see; it is IFR) :)

5. Why can't I get weather beamed to me in Europe to some device in the aircraft? I can get it on my Iphone, but not to my aircraft?Some 99% of private pilots are VFR-only, doing £100 burger runs, and they don't need it. The UK ones are mostly so tight you could not get a tightly rolled up fiver up their back end so they would not pay for it.

But you can get it e.g. this (http://www.avidyne.com/products/mlx770/index.asp). It just costs a huge pile of money, and (because in Europe the Met Offices have set up a cartel to sell their prime data even if produced with taxpayer money) the data is much less extensive and much more expensive than in the USA. And because Europe does not have the market for a satellite channel (supposedly) it is done via the very expensive Iridium satphone network.

I have satellite data in my plane (tafs/metars currently) for long flights, using a Thuraya satphone but it isn't a neat integrated system.

It's technically feasible but back to my comment about tightly rolled up fivers :)

6. Notams pertaining to your route into the aircraft? Forget it.It's on a website (http://www.nats-uk.ead-it.com/public/index.php.html). Narrow Route Briefing.

The fact that nearly all notams are irrelevant garbage (because they are so easy to squirt out) is another matter...

7. If you take your FAA PPL in a multi engine, you're not allowed to fly single engine aircraft. WTF? At least JAA has got that one right.http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/eek.gif:ugh:Really?

8. Bigger fuel tanks. Yeah, so I get it - if I want to fly around 6 relatives all the time then I can't fill the tank up. But when I'm alone, have starved myself to a strand for 30 days and fly naked, I'd like to be able to fly a little bit longer than 450NM. Carrying empty tanks full of air doesn't cost anything.I agree a lot of tanks could be bigger. My TB20 (86USG) could carry at least 100-120USG simply by moving the bulkheads which form the outer tank limits further out. I guess the mfg decided to put a limit on the spar stress...

9. Which way again? Would it kill the publishers of all the worlds VFR and IFR approach/airport plates to print the RWY pattern visually? I don't want to have to read my way through half a page of miniscule font in a shaking plane just to find out that Rwy 21 has a right hand pattern and that so-and-so nimby little village mustn't be overflown...Yeah, VFR = very frequently random :)

10. Why on earth can't I carrier wave open the landing lights at most European airports? Would they rather I ditch in the sea in darkness than use their precious facilities after they've gone home at 5pm?Yes. It's called Proper Airmanship :)

I have no idea why it's banned here; really stupid.

However, I could think of bigger things to moan about...

PPR
PNR
PPR for Customs
PNR for Customs
etc
Airports not replying to communications (crap management)
Limited airport opening hours (= lack of GA utility).
Lack of hangarage at most airports (discourages the basing of a half decent plane there).
Hardly any GA airports have instrument approaches.
Mandatory ATC for an instrument approach (UK) ensuring GPS approaches are never likely to have much relevance because most ATC airports already have a conventional IAP.

and other stuff like that. In comparison, obscure TAF formats are a non-issue, IMHO.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

6. Notams pertaining to your route into the aircraft? Forget it.

I've had notams relayed to me by controllers on more than one occasion. Such as "did you know that after you took off a piece of airspace at such-and-such has been notamed closed because of an unexploded bomb?".

I think I'd rather have that then yet another gadget to learn how to use, remember to switch on, and take time away from looking out the window.

[J.A.F.O.]

1 People who go on about how the FAA and JAR are different
2 People who whine because there's not an app for landing their aeroplane
3 People who make up words like reluctancy
4 People who think everyone else should want to fly their way

That's it, only four, I'm quite content really.

[AdamFrisch]

However, I could think of bigger things to moan about...

Please do - I saw this as a springboard for a good moan thread!:ok:

Well, I did read the map as I'm doing my FAA PPL right now, as part of the syllabus is 3 hrs night flying. And trying to navigate in the LA basin, at night, with constant ATC and trying to spot at least 3 other aircraft in the pattern at Santa Monica (where both right hand and left hand circuits to same rwy take place simultaneously) is quite a lot to do when you have to read a checklist and flick switches that are in the dark. I'm sure it's just because I'm not used to the plane or the workload, but I thought that there must be a better way.

1 People who go on about how the FAA and JAR are different
2 People who whine because there's not an app for landing their aeroplane
3 People who make up words like reluctancy
4 People who think everyone else should want to fly their way

That's it, only four, I'm quite content really.

Maybe you can print that on your little pocket memorizing card?

[Deeday]

text below should be taken con granul salisEhrm.... it's cum grano salis (sorry, Latin roots kicking in).
And while I'm in pedantic mood, reluctance does have an alternative spelling (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/reluctancy).

[AdamFrisch]

Ehrm.... it's cum grano salis (sorry, Latin roots kicking in).

Changed.:ok:

[J.A.F.O.]

And while I'm in pedantic mood, reluctance does have an alternative spelling.

Only three things then, even better.

Maybe you can print that on your little pocket memorizing card?

I'm unlikely to forget.

[Scott Diamond]

1. 3rd world countries; not everywhere has the technology for this system from what I've been told!

2. As confusion could easily occur between the two and the content is completely different. Want them together? Print them out on the same page. :ok:

[Pilot DAR]

and aviation design is rarely done by the sharpest knives in the drawer http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/smile.gif


ah, achem!

[Dan Winterland]

1. The TAF's and Metar's. I get it - they have to be abbreviated to able to send over telex. Problem is the telex died, what, 30 years ago? Why on earth are we still reading an incomprehensible abbreviated piece of text?

Not everywhere. Some palces still use AFTN/SITA. And ACARS sends them in the same format. I see you have an iPhone. Get the Aero Weather APP. It translates them.

2. Why aren't TAF's and Metar's combined? Give me the actual weather and the forecast. All in one. Madness having to look in two different places.

They have different validities. METARs are published every 30 or 60 minutes, TAFs every 3 or 6 hours. You could publish the lates TAF with every METAR, but not everyone would want that, especially environmentalists.

5. Why can't I get weather beamed to me in Europe to some device in the aircraft? I can get it on my Iphone, but not to my aircraft?

You can. It's called ACARS, but it costs.

6. Notams pertaining to your route into the aircraft? Forget it.

Again, by ACARS.

[ei-flyer]

BTW you don't read a map at night (nothing to see; it is IFR)

Maybe you don't but I do. There's plenty to see.

Answer to the original question... JOBSWORTHS!

[Captain Smithy]

Things that annoy me in aviation:

1) Know-alls who hang around pilots' internet forums havering tosh. See point 2). :hmm:

2) As someone mentioned above, people who think everyone should fly their way, i.e. everyone should use this method of navigation, everyone should fly this aircraft, everyone should do this, that, whatever. Pish. I'll fly the way I want, i.e. the way I was taught, as long as it is entirely safe, legal, sensible and doesn't cause any hassle to others. You do the same. :hmm:

3) People who arrive near busy CAS/airports without a clue of local procedures and expect everyone to bow to their wishes. GPS junkies (not all GPS users, rather the magenta-line-followers who don't have a clue how to use it properly and end up staring at the display all day) are sometimes bad at this, requesting direct transits that take them through ILSs, approach paths etc., completely ignoring VRPs, lanes etc. Causes ATC endless hassle. Check procedures before you go and follow them, so that you don't get the controller distracted from directing several 757s on the approach around about you whilst you err and emm on the radio as you faff about asking for a silly transit that you won't get. :rolleyes:

4) People who complain about aircraft noise. Easy remedies for that... Stick earplugs in. Go and listen to music. Put the washing machine on. Switch on the hoover. Or bugger off and live somewhere else where you can mump and whinge for the rest of your miserable sodding life to some other poor sod. :rolleyes:

5) The green movement, which has a considerable chip on their shoulder against our hobby/career. Fack off and leave us alone. :=

6) The government, which has a considerable chip on their shoulder against our hobby/career. Solution as per that of point 5). :=

7) Folks who continually ask how much it costs to fly.

Picture scene if you will; talking to colleague at work, old friends I haven't seen for a while, chatting up bird in nightclub, whatever.

"So what hobbies do you have then?"
"Oh, I'm a pilot."
"Really? How much does that cost then?" :ugh:

What does it matter to anyone else how I spend my meagre wages? Without fail the first question uttered when the "P" word is mentioned.

Rant levers to idle. :)

Smithy

[PilotPieces]

Fuel gauges.

Why is it that in every aircraft I have flown I do not have an accurate or RELIABLE way of knowing how much fuel I have in the tanks? Im not talking about fuel planning, but how has technology moved on so far and left fuel gauges in the past.

I say "fuel sufficient" only because I know that I am flying around with 4/5 times more fuel than I actually need because the gauges cannot be used and no matter how well you try and calculate fuel burn, the actual will always be different.

Put a fuel gauge in aircraft that works and I can use please.

[dublinpilot]

Geez....must have been a serious bout of bad weather in the UK!

A lot of grumpy moany people....get out and fly some more....it will put you into a better mood! :ok:

Surely flying is all about having fun, and enjoying yourself, and not about finding as many things as possible to moan about!

[wsmempson]

Captain Smithy:

"7) Folks who continually ask how much it costs to fly.

Picture scene if you will; talking to colleague at work, old friends I haven't seen for a while, chatting up bird in nightclub, whatever.

"So what hobbies do you have then?"
"Oh, I'm a pilot."
"Really? How much does that cost then?"

What does it matter to anyone else how I spend my meagre wages? Without fail the first question uttered when the "P" word is mentioned."

My suggestion is to answer that question by saying that you have absolutely no idea how much your hobby costs.... thus neatly openning a completely different can of worms.;)

[Kiltie]

People who drop in to conversation how many hours they have. As if this is supposed to reflect a high level of skill or experience.

Lazy R/T.

Controllers who raise their voices at nervous or hesitant private pilots.

Ignorant management at airports who choose not to answer e-mails.

Precious flying club committees and the divisions created between local pilots and aircraft owners.

[Flyingmac]

Pilots who don't indicate when entering a roundabout, making you wait then turning off before they get to you. Pilots who drive in poor vis on sidelights. ATC that vectored me right round their zone because my mode C had gone tits up.

[Cows getting bigger]

1. People who ignore the POH - notably those who add a few knots for luck.
2. Egos and arrogance - pilots who don't accept they are fallible.
3. Carburettors - why do the manufacturers still peddle them?
4. People who believe the only GA aircraft type is a Cessna/Piper.
5. Pilots who bring an aircraft back with minimal fuel and then expect the next pilot to fill it up.
6. Kneeboard/headset discussions.
7. "How fast is your Arrow?" discussions.
8. People who cut you up in the circuit.
9. Flying clubs where two geriatrics who have hardly flown in the last decade still have overwhelming influence.
10. Pilots who extend flaps/gear etc at limiting speeds.

[neilgeddes]

The early evening long TAF that gives you hope that tomorrow will be flyable - and then it isn't :ugh:

[FlyingOfficerKite]

1. Students who don't show up;
2. Students who show up late;
3. Students who are not-prepared (didn't read up on exercise/no equipment etc);
4. Spanish ATC who let aircraft in ahead of you - as long as they are Iberia and in the Northern Hemisphere;
5. French ATC who let every Air France aircraft take-off ahead of you, provided they have their engines running;
6. The stewardesses who ran a poll for 'sexiest pilot in the airline' and when asked told me I wasn't even on the list!;
7. Refuellers who think the World revolves around them;
8. Trial lesson candidates who don't tell you they feel unwell until they splurt it all out;
9. BA strikers - especially when the country is in recession, airlines are on their knees and vast numbers of people out of work why should they complain about their already preferential terms and conditions? (I don't like to criticise but it all seems very badly considered); and finally
10. Security procedures and personnel (how do you permanently remove someone's sense of humour - and be consistently good at it everywhere in the World?!)

KR

FOK

['India-Mike]

10 things that annoy you in aviation.

Well, I'm going to buck the trend and say 'none'.

I have always felt privileged to be able to fly, and recognise how fragile (financial, medical, etc) that privilege is. I've never quite been able to get over the fact that every time I line up I'm being 'allowed' to commit aviation.

A cantankerous and sometimes cruel mistress but never an annoying one:ok:

[IO540]

Why is it that in every aircraft I have flown I do not have an accurate or RELIABLE way of knowing how much fuel I have in the tanks? Im not talking about fuel planning, but how has technology moved on so far and left fuel gauges in the past.

I say "fuel sufficient" only because I know that I am flying around with 4/5 times more fuel than I actually need because the gauges cannot be used and no matter how well you try and calculate fuel burn, the actual will always be different.

Put a fuel gauge in aircraft that works and I can use please.

They exist but cost a lot of money. For less, you can install a fuel totaliser (flowmeter) e.g. Shadin or JPI and forget the gauges...

GA aircraft electrics are not yet at the 1972 Vauxhall Viva stage, for the most part.

must have been a serious bout of bad weather in the UK!

You are not wrong ;)

Mind you, today I did some ILS receiver testing... very satisfying to compare the tracking with a GPS in the OBS mode, set to 0.3nm FSD :)

Ignorant management at airports who choose not to answer e-mails.

Or faxes, or they hang up when they hear you speak English. Or airports whose published GA contact # is the passenger flight hotline ....

TBH, emails are not the method of choice for reliable comms anyway. The majority of published emails don't work for businesses generally, not just airports.

[Barcli]

people who claim to have flown everything

people who claim to be qualified flying instructors but actually are CRI's

people who claim to run legitimate AOC charters

People who claim to have a professional licence ( CPL or ATPL)

People who lie about there total hours experience

people who spend too much time on these forums and dont actually fly very much

:O:O:O:O:O:O:O:O:O

[stevef]

Anyone involved in aviation who doesn't know how to spell the name of the building that aircraft are kept or maintained in. :(

[AdamFrisch]

Navigating" the LA Basin and the SF Valley is straight forward at night.

Well, for me it's quite a high workload. I've not flown at night much before and the ATC and various Bravo airspaces with different floors around this area certainly keeps me on my toes.

As for SMO traffic... If you check the Airport Facilities Guide
http://naco.faa.gov/pdfs/sw_156_11FEB2010.pdf
SMO has a very strict noise abatement policy - it is not called the 'little republic of Santa Monica' for no reason.
03 has a right traffic pattern and 21 is left. No touch and go's pattern work is permitted after dusk for the same reason.

But when they come in from Malibu/Palisades or North West, they fly a right hand circuit to rwy 21 as advised by the TWR. That's what happened the other night - multiple aircraft coming from NW joining a right hand downwind, whilst we came from the mini-route above KLAX and joined the lefthand circuit. I'd never encountered this before and it was hard to spot all of them whilst doing all the other stuff.

[er340790]

Sorry, I wouldn't know when to stop...:}

[Captain Smithy]

Another thing I grow somewhat tired of is the inevitable comparisons, nay cliches, mostly from non-aviation folks, drawn from a certain Hollywood movie of 1980s vintage about a group of US Navy pilots. Many references when talking about anything/anyone aviation-related are made to said film and its prat actor, fancy sunglasses, flying jackets with badges all over, chatting up females, pratting about on motorbikes and F-14s etc. The sound track was decent but that's about it :rolleyes:

There again like most things in life I just laugh them off. Hope I didn't come across as being some cantankerous git in my previous (flippant) post :)

Aviation is great. Some minor irritances, mostly from outside quarters, but great nonetheless.

Smithy

['Chuffer' Dandridge]

People who suggest "the 10 best/worst things" lists.
Student pilots who slag off the CAA 'cos it's trendy and makes you sound like one of the guys. Get some experience first.
Student pilots who get their licenses and then have to buy a set of Raybans, a square box pilot case and a headset "to look like a pilot".
Pilots who can't navigate and expect a GPS to do it for them.
CRIs who think they know everything, but who couldnt quite make FI.
Panshanger.
Retired pilots who insist on calling themselves "Captain"
Baby Instructors with 300hrs who wear epaulettes and captains bars. Also Flying schools who insist on it..
Pilots who havent got a clue about propwash and it's effects at a crowded parking area.
Guardian reading NIMBYs who move next door to an airfield and then expect it to close "because it's against our human rights" !
People who waste time and sound like a miserable git completing lists like this

:E

[Pilot DAR]

My life in aviation is amazing. I spend my days listing the things that make flying, and it's people great.

I count on appreciating those aviators who try to avoid fulfilling Chuffer's list!

[kevmusic]

As my Dad used to say, "There's no bad beer. Only beer and good beer".
Same applies to aviation. :)

[Dan Winterland]

1. The cost.
2. The dire state of the 1960s fleet of GA training aircraft.
3. The cost.
4. The CAA.
5. The cost.
6. The British weather.
7. The cost.
8. Flying club coffee.
9 The cost.
10. The resident flying club expert who has to regail you of his anecdotes and advice without bothering to find out who you are or what experience you have. All clubs have one and you can usually spot him because he's wearing a flying jacket with badges of aircraft of which he has never flown.

[IO540]

As my Dad used to say, "There's no bad beer. Only beer and good beer".

I think what you mean is that sex is like a pizza: even when it's bad, it's still very very good :)

[kevmusic]

Oh, I dunno. Ever had a Tesco pizza? :}

['Chuffer' Dandridge]

Chuffer... you went over board there with a list of 11....

Sorry, was on a roll and just couldn't stop...:ok:

[NorthRider]

1. The moment of advancing the throttle(s) as you begin t/o
2. Braking out of the clouds just at minimums and seeing the rwy in front of you
3. When a student finally learns shomething after doing it wrong for a million times
4. Flying a single engine piston in uncontrolled airspace on a beautiful summer evening
5. The smell of JetA/100LL
6. The camaradery among pilots
7. Pulling 6G
8. Taking someone up for the first time and seeing them smile and remembeing that what is normal and everyday to you is still special for most.
9. The rush of performing a very complicated task at the very edge of your capability and getting it right.
10. The view

Rubbish...hate it, everything about it...:}

[Pilot DAR]

Yeah Northrider, you've got it...

I'd like to add:

Having to slightly roll the ailerons during a landing, to see if you're on the runway, 'cause you cold not feel yourself touch,

Feeling the slight acceleration as the second float comes out of the water during a glassy water takeoff,

Doing a helicopter toe in landing in a rocky mountian river confined area, so small that after you flew over it the first time, you lost it,

Having the tower controller ask you if the plane you just landed is STOL equipped, when it's not,

Finally getting the gear down after an hour of flying around with a landing gear failure,

Finding a lost boater in the middle of the lake at night, and leading rescue teams to them,

I could go on.... even past 11!

[liam548]

Some good suggestions you bring up.

The thing that annoys me overall is just how dated most things to do with flying are. Similar to your comments about telex and tafs etc

I also like your idea of different modes for landing/cruise/takeoff etc

;)

[IO540]

PilotDAR is right that there are many joys in flying, which no doubt is why we hang in there despite all the crap we European have to put up with.

However I think it is useful (in a perverse kind of way) to focus on the crap with a view to developing procedures to minimise its effects, for that makes flying (especially going places) a lot easier.

[AdamFrisch]

I actually think EASAs JAR, when fully implemented, could clarify and be beneficial to European aviation. Most of the problems today stem from differences between the Euro countries (but under the veil of JAR). Once one rule fits all, then everything will become a lot clearer. Even if that means that maybe a loved national rating or procedure falls by the wayside.

Flying is great and wonderful. It's just the crap around it that sometimes gets you down.

[IO540]

I actually think EASAs JAR, when fully implemented, could clarify and be beneficial to European aviation. Most of the problems today stem from differences between the Euro countries (but under the veil of JAR). Once one rule fits all, then everything will become a lot clearer. Even if that means that maybe a loved national rating or procedure falls by the wayside.

I don't think so.

EASA is likely to deliver a "pan European NPPL" which is a good thing for VFR pilots.

However, the majority of purely-VFR pilots do little more than burger runs. What EASA will do for the rest remains to be seen. Introducing a VFR license is relatively easy (once the local CAA job protection stuff is sorted, and the French have got what they wanted). In fact JAA more or less delivered that - the medicals were the main issue.

Also there are thousands of pilots who would most strongly disagree about losing the "loved national rating" you refer to...

And I can guarantee that EASA is not going to do anything whatsoever about idiotic airport management, which is by far the #1 issue for pilots using GA for something real. This is totally outside its mandate.

EASA is about licensing and similar paperwork. Once you have collected your bits of paper, that issue is done and dusted, more or less. It doesn't affect the next flight.

[DB6]

Real irritations:

JAR/EASA
Nimbys, windfarms & eco-twats
DfT (who used to be called DoT until they did something so embarrassing they changed their name.Tossers)


TBC...

[Jim59]

I actually think EASAs JAR, when fully implemented, could clarify and be beneficial to European aviation. Most of the problems today stem from differences between the Euro countries (but under the veil of JAR). Once one rule fits all, then everything will become a lot clearer. Even if that means that maybe a loved national rating or procedure falls by the wayside.



Perhaps - but what about Eurocontrol's standardised rules of the air...
EUROCONTROL - SINGLE EUROPEAN SKY MANDATE ON THE DEVELOPMENT OF STANDARDISED EUROPEAN RULES OF THE AIR (SERA) (http://www.eurocontrol.int/enprm/public/standard_page/enprm10002.html)

This is a real problem area.

[Hansard]

Walter Mittys

Logbook cheats and liars

Appalling customer service at many GA clubs/schools

300 hour aircraft owners with an IMC who've been to France a few times and believe they have as much experience/knowledge as any Instructor

[IO540]

300 hour aircraft owners with an IMC who've been to France a few times and believe they have as much experience/knowledge as any InstructorThey probably do have more experience than most instructors (sadly).

[A and C]

I think that I have to agree with IO540, I have met (f) ATPL holding instructors who hve never been across the channel.

Most of them can teach people to fly an aircraft but have no idea how to use an aircraft for traveling.

[mad_jock]

And why would all Instructors have been or wanted to go across the Channel?.

I haven't been across the channel in a single and would be quite happy to put my hand up and say I have a clue how to do it thanks to PPrune but it would be a steep learning curve.

Then again the Highlands of Scotland to the Channel would be a bit of a trip.
Just like from the south coast to Kirkwall would be a bit of a trip going the other way. Flying around in the Cairngorms and dealing with the wx for me is normal as it will be for any northern Instructor. Stick a south Coast Instructor out of Perth to Kirkwall in anything other than CAVOK and they will be in the same situation.

PS I agree a 300hour owner that does go see places will have way more clue than your common garden Instructor. But thats not the instructors fault. Most of us at that stage would love to be able to afford to do that sort of flying. But we can't so we don't. It doesn't make you a bad PPL instructor for not having that experence.

[Iron Chicken]

Wot Smithy said. And:-

People who want non-standard joins when the circuit's busy, and end up cutting you up :*

Instructors who don't think PPLs have any opinions worth listening to :sad:

Aero Clubs which have no interest in what their members want :ugh: :* :(

[Pilot DAR]

It doesn't make you a bad PPL instructor for not having that experence.

Agreed, as long as said PPL instructor flies and trains within thier own experience skill set, and honestly tells a student "I don't know either" when that is truly the case.

You don't need to have "crossed the channel" to be able to teach basic aircraft handling skills well.

You need to have "crossed the channel" if you're planning to tell everyone that you're a pilot who has crossed the channel!

....to use an aircraft for traveling.

Is a very relative thing. I've crossed continents in different types, but found trying to get enough sky in Scotland (pun intended - yes I know "e"), very challenging.

We all fly in our comfort zone (and hopefully are honest about it). The experience comes from safely expanding our comfort zone.

[Captain Smithy]

Today's weather. Horrendous :uhoh:

[The Fenland Flyer]

This weekend's weather, not looking good :uhoh:

[SkyM]

obviusly most of you haven't dealt with passengers...that's def the most annoying thing. Not the notams...

[Hamish 123]

. . . . sky heroes who are dismissive of "spam cans". So a PA28 may not be pushing the outer limits of aviation, but it damn well suits me and my budget.

. . . . similarly, the self-same experts' contemptuous attitude towards PPLs who can't pack in dozens of hours a month. It might take me a while to fill in a page of my log book, but that doesn't make me a dangerous pilot.

(note to self . . . . watch out for creeping paranoia)

[Mark1234]

Mostly positive about flying, but there have been a few things getting my goat recently:

- "Can't do" Britain; particularly flying schools, there is enough red tape already without you adding all your rules and regs thank-you.
- 28 day currency, on a given operator's a/c, particularly on simple types. If I've been flying a PA28 down the road, and have done an initial checkout with you, I do not need a recurrent ride just because I've not flown yours in 5 weeks.
- people who want to turn GA flying into the same button pushing, system monitoring fest as flying a big jet. If I had a computer fetish, I could stay at home and exercise it lot more cheaply; I came to fly.

Thats all :E

[Cough]

Ah but their PA28 will have the narcokingbendixgarmin radio stack with efisclockworkgpsflatscreen nav kit. Hence you need differences training!
Oh not forgetting how differently they all fly!

Still my pet hate... Stripes worn in a single...

[B2N2]

Stripes worn in a single
Poop-suites worn in a single
People who think they can fly
People who think they don't need a check-out
People who think they don't need a check-out because they have "my frozen ATPL's"
People who think they don't need a check out because they have 2000 hrs jet and the last time they flew a light airplane was 5 years ago.
Cheap skates
Cheap skates who don't want to spend 1% of the purchase price of their aircraft on training
People who don't think they need additional training period
Knights of the Magenta Line
Children of the Magenta Line
Last but not least everybody else who flies the little airplane down the magenta line on a moving map display

[Chuck Ellsworth]

How about GPS's that have track lines that are not magenta.....mine has a green track line.

[IFMU]

I am not drawn to aviation because it annoys me.

-- IFMU

[A and C]

It would seem it ture pprune style a few did not read my post in full, the "crossing the channel" was just an example. So for those of you who don't read more than one, the punch line is below.

Most of them can teach people to fly an aircraft but have no idea how to use an aircraft for traveling.

As an instructor you are trainning a person who could launch off across the globe the day after the PPL is issued, so as one who instructs in the southern UK it is likely that the first thing my ex-students will do is fly into europe.

How then could I teach my students properly for the flying that they are most likely to do if I had not done it myself?

Going back to the thread may be one of things ten things that I hate in aviation is people who dont read posts on pprune past line one!

[Pilot DAR]

It sounds to me that "crossing the channel" is one of many "rites of passage" to which a UK or European pilot would asipre. That sounds reasonable to me. The fact that an instructor, or other mentor pilot, would train a another pilot, without having themselves accomplished all rites of passage, is not only reasonable, it's enevitable. There is just no way we can all do it all. Many less experienced pilots with whom I have flown, are off doing the most remarkabe types of flying near and far. Perhaps I will do some of these types of flying too.

The key is that an instructor, or mentor pilot does their job honestly, and gives their best to prepare another pilot for a new experience safely. When that is accomplished, the trained pilot should either have the skills to safely undertake a new adventure, or know that they do not have those skills, and thus seek out more training.

We all have something to teach another, and lots to learn, if someone will teach us. Those who remain at peace with this, will do well. Those who don't agree, are in for a nasty, and probably embarrasing surprise one day!

The fact that you do not know it all, does not mean that you are not very important as a teacher of some things, as long as you are teaching what you know...

[PilotPieces]

I agree with the "students who go out and kit up to look cool" one, however:

1. People who think you need to either fly F-16's or privately own a pitts special in order to wear a nice pair of sunglasses.

2. People who think that class G airspace rules dictate that all aircraft shall give way to aircraft with aerobatic capability.

[mad_jock]

Its not really, its just something that the south coast Clubs seem to make a big deal out of. There is an almost religious sect down there about it. They have Channel crossing checkouts, channel currency etc etc A right money and hours spinner for clubs.

Once you get North of Gamston they don't make such a fuss about it.

The 2 folk that have asked me about it. I have pointed towards this forum. They posted, someone nice pm'd them with a checklist, they went off and flew across the channel. When they got back I asked them about it and they were very none plussed about the whole thing. They said it was like flying to Barra but you could actually get fuel, the locals could speak English you could understand and there wasn't sodding great hills between you and your diversion.

I have flown across the channel many times but its always been IFR burning JetA.

[A and C]

I have to agree with this:-

Its not really, its just something that the south coast Clubs seem to make a big deal out of. There is an almost religious sect down there about it. They have Channel crossing checkouts, channel currency etc etc A right money and hours spinner for clubs.

However you are still missing the point, it is not about just "channel crossing" it is about finding that the guy you are checking out on a new type can't lean the mixture, set a % power for altitude, has no idea what the fuel flow is for the power setting he is using, has no idea what the TAS is for his selected power setting and has no idea what his endurance could be.

The trouble is that these things seem to get "left out" of the PPL course, not by the older career instructors but by the guys who are counting each hour (and penny) towards the jet job they are dreaming of.

Most of these aspiring jet jockeys teach the basics well but fail to get to grips with the performance part of the flight manual and so don't teach the student how to "travel" in an aircraft .............. and if the student is female................. just don't get me started on that subject!

All a bit off topic for this thread but I had to reply.

[BossEyed]

2.Poop-suites worn in a single

Assuming you mean an immersion suit, a single over water would be a very good reason to wear one!

13. People who write "suite" when they mean "suit" :}

[AEST]

To me all annoyances seem to come from a single source:

Zeee Govt!

[mad_jock]

I am in full agreement with you on that A n C.

I think the term we are looking for is most instructors are as much use as tits on a bull for anything that doesn't have an exercise number.

And we now have 200 hour isntructors who were taught by 200 hour instructors etc etc. So as we have said before the industry is Knackard.

[Pilot DAR]

To me all annoyances seem to come from a single source:

Zeee Govt!


The government is the people,

Those people who have volunteered their time to participate in working groups, committees, and similar contributing efforts to the betterment of aviation regulation, really do have a right to comment about the government, if they feel they need to.

Those who just complain, without really extending a meaningful effort to make it "better", well, not so much, in my opinion...

If nay sayers would take the time to really understand the underlying reason for many of the regualtions and standards for aviation, there would be a lot less complaining about the "government", and a lot more introspection!

[Mark1234]

If nay sayers would take the time to really understand the underlying reason for many of the regualtions and standards for aviation, there would be a lot less complaining about the "government", and a lot more introspection!

Completely understand where you're coming from, however I find there's a distinct tendency to legislate everyone to the lowest common denominator; rather than establishing standards that are a minimum and expecting people to be responsible within that, it is assumed everyone is an irresponsible idiot, and regulated as such. I suspect we bring it on our own heads with the litigous society we have created where sh1t cannot just happen, someone has to be to blame, and it's never us.

It may also be a slightly UK thing..

I trained and did most of my flying in Aus - The flying club made no provisions beyond the law as to what my currency should be, or what weather I should or should not fly in. I learned to take a view on conditions, and how comfortable I felt - at first cautious, then with experience took on more.

Returning to the UK I am introduced to currency rules (about which I've already moaned; just to be clear, *appropriate* currency is I believe important), and schemes where the weather gets a colour code and you are told whether you're allowed off the ground / out of the circuit / cross country etc, depending on the flavour of license and ratings you hold, and rules that specify you must not lean under 5000ft :confused:

I'm no sky god - I've racked up a couple of hundred hours over 3 and a bit years - mostly aerobatic and some longish touring trips into country aus. I don't know it all, but I *do* know when to seek advice, or fly with someone if I'm in any doubt. But then I'm pretty sure I knew that as a wet behind the ears PPL - I just needed to do it more often.

[Pilot DAR]

*appropriate* currency is I believe important), and schemes where the weather gets a colour code and you are told whether you're allowed off the ground / out of the circuit / cross country etc, depending on the flavour of license and ratings you hold

Yes, that can be frustrating. I wonder though, what portion of that is the flying club vs the government. Canada (government) does have currency and recency requirements, which in my opinion, are silly lax. No self respecing pilot would fly such a small amount, and call themselves adequately competant, in any but the most favourable conditions.

On the other hand, checkouts vary tremendously with the environment. In my very early days as a renter, I kept myself "current" under the club rules, on the 172RG. The rationale being that I was thus current on all of their other types, which were simpler. Once, I went to rent the 172RG as booked, to be told it had gone mechanical. No problem, I'll take a 172. "You're not "qualified" was the reply from the non pilot desk person - in front of my passenger. I complained to the boss. I was presented with a nice little card, which I was told would be accepted as my evidence of currency for any of the aircraft in their fleet. I was to use it on my honour, and keep myself current. At that time, I had about 200 hours. There was never another problem.

Now, 30+ years later, I welcome checkouts on the different aircraft I fly, but often there is just no one to do it. So I read the flight manual, reherse in the cockpit a bit, and off I go.

To my delight, no mod evaluation flight (which accounts for about a quarter of my flying these days) has never gone wrong, beyond the scope of what I was expecting. I have had some frights doing plain old maintenance test flights though. Those flights, are in my opinion, the ones which are most likely to suddenly require an extra demonstration of pilot skill...

Every pilot is responsible to the whole rest of aviation, for flying within their skill set, and within the allowance for things which could reasonably be expected to go wrong. The more unusual the flying, the bigger allowance they should leave for the wrong thing.

Either we get it right, or we get regulated more!

Regulation is for the guidance of wise men, and for the obedience of fools - Bader

[Sir Niall Dementia]

High viz vests. There is not a single documented case of an aircraft taxiing into a pedestrian, but lots of pedestrians have walked into propellers.

People who think that what they learn in groundschool will never be useful. One day it will be.

People who fly through published IFR approaches without calling the airfield concerned. In the last year I've had two go-rounds as a result and at £38 per minute my boss complains.

People who launch cross country without a plan or a check on the weather.

People who don't turn on their transponders because they are just off for a quiet bimble without needing ATC. Those of us who are using ATC like to be told about you, and while my own aeroplane doesn't have TCAS the kit I fly for work does and I then can tell whether you are a factor or not.

Airport security. I am not going to hi-jack myself and yes I do want my contact lens kit and toothpaste in my briefcase.

Durham Tees Valley Airport. See above. Your security are the most ridiculous and rudest in the business.

People who look down from their mighty spamcans on those of us who own wood and cloth wonders.

People who loudly dispense advice in the flying club bar when most of their flying is for lunch at the airfield down the road.

People who dress as captains for flying their familly and friends. My employers make me dress as a captain and the last thing I will wear in my own aeroplane is gold bars.

People who think they can charge for flying without a professional license or AOC. Do you know the risks your passengers are running or the laws you are breaking?

Rant Off

[A and C]

You must be flying Tiger Moths as that is the only place that I have seen a limitation on leaning the mixture below 5000ft!

But I suspect Not.................

I Think that the people that you are flying with are going to have a big problem by publishing rules that are in conflict with the flight manual, lets take a look at what might happen....................

A newish PPL who trained at this club takes an aircraft on a a long trip and flys the aircraft IAW the club rules on not leaning the mixture, Unfortunaly he runs out of fuel and in the resulting ditching someone dies.

Six months later in court the lawyer for the dependants of the victim gets hold of the fact that the club rule on leaning the mixture reduces the range of the aircraft by IRO 20%. So we now have the court looking at a club rule that resulted in an aircraft running out of fuel when if the aircraft had been flown IAW the flight manual a safe landing could have been made.

If you are running a business you are a fool if you issue rules that contermand the flight manual, it can only end one way in court.

[AEST]

The government is the people,

You are joking right?

[RotaryWingB2]

Durham Tees Valley Airport. See above. Your security are the most ridiculous and rudest in the business.

Ain't that the truth. :mad::mad::mad::mad:

[Pilot DAR]

Quote:
The government is the people,
You are joking right?


Who else could it be?

[Gargleblaster]

I have nothing but good memories about my humble ppl flying. I've flown SEPL VFR in 7 different countries including mountanous regions. My fridge door is thick with pictures that my friends have taken from our trips. I sometimes speculate whether I might have just as much good memories from my flying as people with 10 times as much hours.

Still:

1. Airport staff checking my papers, e.g. pulling something as idiotic as my radio license out and checking it. If you care to know then I'm talking about EKRK. Shame on you.

2. 21 year old instructors with huge watches, fancy sunglasses, white shirts, epaulettes and a really small ego.

3. Pilots who think the size, make or price of their watch matters.

[AEST]

The government is the people,
You are joking right?
Who else could it be? There used to be a king, but these days it's mostly bureaucrats, lobbyists and politicians that rule over the people.

[G-KEST]

My 10 in no particular order -
EASA
CAA
FAA
DfT
Ofcom
This government
The cost of Avgas
Transponders..... esecially Mode S
Weather
Sir Joseph Pilling.................. or is it Pillock?

Rant over............ lets go flying.

Cheers,

Reaper 69
:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad:

[Pilot DAR]

I'm sure glad I don't work for the government, or I'd really feel unwelcome around here!

But, I do work closely with the people of the governement to assure that the aircraft you may fly are safe, and will fly the way you think they will. I'm sure your lawyers will be after me if you think I was not entirely successful.

There are enough complaints on here about poorly designed, and poorly maintained aircraft, that so many pilots are forced to fly. It would sound like the posters are suggesting that the private aviation industry cannot be depended upon to provide the quality aircraft you want to fly, without someone you hire, watching over them. Who would that be?

EASA
CAA
FAA
DfT

.... and my favourite, Transport Canada.

All of these "governments" are staffed by people who applied for a job and go it, because they were the best of the applicants for that job. Were those people each the very best person to do that job? maybe, maybe not, but they applied, and they got it.

Are each of the pilots and maintainers who frequent this forum the very best at what they do? Or did they apply for a license anyway, and get it?

So we pilots and maintainers expect some forgiveness when we violate airspace, ding a plane and so forth - forgiveness from the government people who are being blindly slagged here. Certainly those government people entertain themselves with stories of the stupid things we do too.

So all of those here who are nearly perfect in aviation, do have some standing to make observations of dis-satisfaction about the people of the government, who we know are not quite perfect. What about all the rest of us?

[Captain Smithy]

People who are in positions of power to legislate aviation, yet have absolutely no knowledge or understanding of what they are attempting to control, e.g. EASA, DfT, airfield security jobsworths etc., and hence end up making a complete arse of things.

Pillocks e.g. EcoFascists, Clueless Councils, the Government etc., who take great delight in attempting to build great sodding obstacles in the close vicinity of airfields (mostly in the form of wind turbines that create less power than an average fart) either 1) out of complete ignorance of consequences or 2) in a deliberate attempt to force said airfields to close.

People who come onto PPRuNE in order to moan about things that adversely affect aviation. Oops bugger that sometimes includes me. :uhoh:

Smithy

[AEST]

There are enough complaints on here about poorly designed, and poorly maintained aircraft, that so many pilots are forced to fly. Nobody has ever forced a pilot to fly a " poorly designed, and poorly maintained aircraft". Each pilot has taken that decision based on his own interest (ie looking out for #1). Weighing risk and rewards!

It would sound like the posters are suggesting that the private aviation industry cannot be depended upon to provide the quality aircraft you want to fly, without someone you hire, watching over them. Who would that be? 1. If we depended on govt to improve transportation we'd all be walking barefoot still.
2. Nobody ever hired the Govt to "watch over them". The Govt runs a protection racket.: Give me $ to protect you, or I will make bad things happen to you!! Ever noticed that ze Govt always rely on outlawing competitors for their "services".
3. Nobody has a better motivation for ensuring safe flight than the ones with their backsides on the line.

[G-KEST]

Pilot DAR,

Wow, that really hit a nerve with you. To use some English terms -
I was an aviation poacher from 1954 to 1984, then I was headhunted into the UK Feds (CAA) from 1984 to 1998 as an aviation gamekeeper in GA operations. With retirement in 1998 I reverted to the poaching and have been totally happy since then.

Methinks thou doth protest too much. Get a life and a sense of humour or, if you prefer it, humor.

Cheers,

Reaper 69
:D:D:D:D:D

PS - I had quite the most enjoyable low level aerobatic display practice this evening. 15 minutes of absolute bliss with only 8 litres of Avgas turned into adrenaline and noise pollution.

[Pilot DAR]

Well, not so much hit a nerve.... if it is humour, so be it, no problem.

If, on the other hand, I am reading the posts of people who think it sufficent to (and I think the PPRuNe term is "whinge"), and then satisfy themselves that they've done their part to influence improved aviation, I would like to be seen to be encouraging a "better way".

Years ago, I was dis-satisfied with some expected Transport Canada (TC) policy. I went to public consultation meetings at their HQ in Ottawa, and spoke my peice. I was pleased and surprized to hear the meeting introduced by a top TC staff member saying "We're not all here to get what we want, we're here to get what we can live with".

Over the many years I attended these meetings, and during many other meetings, I found the process of developing regulations to be quite welcoming of the ideas of the users of aviation, at all levels. Did I always get what I wanted? Certainly not! Often I left with a much better understanding of another perspective, and why things had to be the way they were going to be. On the other hand, words I have written are now incorporated in Canadian regulation, because no one else had a better idea, and mine was accepted. One small voice can make a difference.

Yes, I think thoughts of dis-satisfaction about TC, the FAA, as well as some of my clients, and other aviators in general. I try to not fixate on it (but, yes, perhaps I protest too much).

I will use my modest position in PPRuNe to try to mentor my peers to have more positive thoughts about what we do. I read here moaning about "spam cans" - I own one, by choice, I love it! I read about students who dislike their instructors - well it happens, reason could be good or bad, work it out! And I read about pilots whose top of the list for dislike is the regulator. For heaven's sake, do your part to make it better, or suck it up!

As I have been told more than once here, the humour on PPRuNe should be interpreted as being UK based, and possibly mis understood on this side of the ocean. Thus I suppose I am a canary in the coal mine for the PPRuNe humour.

No rant, not protesting, just want to do my small part to stand up for the positive viewpoint.

I didn't do any aerobatics yesterday, haven't for a few weeks, but I did fly my very appreciated "spam can" down to the helicopter base, took a very nice Bell 206 out for an hour, and landed it in the lake several times(on purpose) - what fun!

I am so lucky to be able to fly as much and as freely as I do, and I appreciate it. I could find ways to whinge about it, by why would I? Why would any of us? I'm happy to tell people about how great flying is, I'm going to keep the whinging to a minimum...

But, I respect other viewpoints, so to each their own... slag on naysayers...

[G-KEST]

Pilot DAR

A lovely and well thought out response which I enjoyed reading. I think we are, in reality, very similar people with a real passion for General Aviation.

Recently we have had, in the UK, a revision of the Air Navigation Order which regulates our civil aviation. It has expanded considerably in terms of the number of Articles. No doubt thought necessary by the legal eagles in the CAA and the DfT. If only they gave equal effort to a contraction of regulations as they do to an increase.

EASA are struggling to deal with the many thousands of individual responses made to consultations on Flight Crew Licensing and Operations before they rake over those aspects of our hobby.

In the UK Ofcom are currently in consultation on proposals to charge ground stations for having a VHF frequency which, in the end, is a safety benefit. They intend the same for radio navigation frequencies. Thank God the GPS satellites are outside UK airspace. However with the EU Galileo GPS constellation it looks like we will be charged to use it though EU taxpayers will have funded its development and installation.

I am glad you enjoyed your flying yesterday. The sky, thank God, is there for us to play in without additional charge............... for the time being....!!!

Cheers,

Reaper 69
:ugh::ugh::ugh::ugh:

[Captain Smithy]

Agree with you G-KEST, although I do respect the CAA they are being overruled by "our" Department Against Transport and the borderline fascist EASA, which are the reasons why, I suspect, the latest ANO has expanded considerably, due to more bureaucratic interference by people who wouldn't know what an aircraft was if one smacked them in the face.

The Galileo project is a typical European shambles; no organisation whatsoever plus it will cost a fortune. And they are going to charge us to use it. Simple solution... don't use it and continue using the US system which is free.

The Ofcom proposals are somewhat disgusting, they say it is about freeing up some VHF space in order to make more lesser-used VHF frequencies available (i.e. take away VORs and allocate the frequencies to dodgy taxi drivers), from most folks' point of view (mine included) it seems like a crass, cynical money-grabbing exercise for a wholly discredited, hated, unwanted, bankrupted Government system whose only affect will be to seriously degrade aviation safety and make people more skint than what we already are.

Smithy

[Iron Chicken]

.............. and if the student is female................. just don't get me started on that subject!


Oh dear A and C, all right I will bite - Please do elaborate (Chicken hands A and C a shovel...) Seriously though I do actually find that remark a bit offensive, so I will join you in generalising and paraphrase dog trainer Barbara Woodhouse..."there are no bad students, only...." ah, finish it yourself! ;)

[Pilot DAR]

How dismaying, I was not aware that regulatory change on the right side of the Atlantic was so traumatizing to general avaiation (I'm trying to be sarcastic, I just assumed it would be regulated somewhat similarly as ours). Canada is following along the ICAO path, and that is introducing harmonizations, some of which are costly if you want to modify your aircraft. I don't like it, but I understand it. I know that it will be very important in the future that every Cessna 180, 182, 185 and 206 floatplane in Canada be nice and quiet (no matter what the cost), perchance they should be flying over Paris or Berlin one day (sarcasizm, just so you know I can).

The last time I acted in the capacity of pilot in UK airspace was 1986, so perhaps I am out of touch. The airspace did seem busy by my standards, but welcoming none the less!

I will continue to remind myself how fortunate I am to fly with such economy and freedom. Thus, I still don't feel the need to speak poorly of Transport Canada, and I don't really know to speak poorly of the CAA/EASA, but I'll remind myself to be supportive of you if you need to, to make things better (or at least bearable)!

[AEST]

And I read about pilots whose top of the list for dislike is the regulator. For heaven's sake, do your part to make it better, or suck it up!

I'd love to do that. Now, tell me how do I go about abolishing it?

[Captain Smithy]

What a bunch of moaning-faced so-and-so's we have all turned into... I think we all need to cheer the smeg up and go flying. :cool:

Smithy

[Pilot DAR]

Hmmm... "Smeg" ... So pilots who smeg, don't whinge? I'll learn English yet....

[Captain Smithy]

Ah sorry Pilot DAR you've probably never watched Red Dwarf. :)

Smeg = useful word in place of any expletive, e.g. "Smeg off", "Load of smeg", "What the smeg is going on?" etc.

Smithy

[G-KEST]

Pilot DAR

One last thing before we close this exchange on a personal basib.

I listed Eurocontrol amongst my 10. Their latest effort, crafted over many man years of highly paid drafting, is to propose Standardised Rules of the Air for European airspace (SERA). Not a bad idea since the aircraft does not know it is crossing an international FIR boundary and the pilot has then to obey differnt Rules of the Air from those in his home country. However their proposals, now our ro consultation, have omitted many excellent rules which have enabled pilots to fly safely in UK airspace, some for the last eighty years.

Additionally they have recently introduced terminal navigation charges at regional airports that did not have such charges before.

Finally for the last 30 odd years there have been swingeing en-route charges levied on aircraft weighing more than 2 metric tonnes who file IFR. The cost of these charges is roughly equal to the profit margin on an Aztec or Baron charter flight.

I now spend a day or so a week opposing legislative change by all the alphavet soup of regulators on behalf of another alphabet soup of representative general aviation organisations. Retirement is proving to be a hectic time. All on a voluntary basis of course since none have spare funds available. Yet we, the taxpayers of the UK and EU, pay the high salaries of those in the various regulatory bodies.

It is not a good flying day so I am here at the PC venting a little of my spleen.

Cheers,

Reaper 69
:=:=:=:=

[A and C]

As I said in the last post that I made there are a lot of things that seem to get left out of the training when one of the low time jet dreamers is doing the teaching (this is not usualy a problem with the older career instructors).

Put a young and atractive Female into the plot and the whole thing turns to a can of worms, the jet deamer's mind is even less on the job of teaching than usual and it will show, just ask the young lady to tell you a little about how to switch off the alternator in case of a failure or what the camshaft operates or what the mixture lever is used for?

The blank look that you will get from the young lady is not because she is stupid or is not paying attention, it is most likely because this instructor is not doing his job.

The technical side of the PPL is usualy the worst taught part, with the exams passed more from memory of practice exam papers rather than a true understanding of the subject, add the lack of knowlage of mechanical subjects that females usualy have for cultural reasons and you have a problem on your hands.

Any way Iron Chicken I am sorry if you were looking for an anti-female pilot rant, you won't get that from me........... some of the best pilots that I have had the pleasure to fly with professionaly are female.

[rich_g85]

I'm still only learning, so I don't really feel entitled to moan, but here's my list of my aviation annoyances so far:

1. The cost
2. The unpredictable British weather
3. Military controllers who speak at 1000kts even when the frequency is quiet
4. How the altimeter subscale knob never turns the way I expect it to!
5. Making exactly the same mistake when setting QFE returning to the field

Think that's it, can't complain really!

[BackPacker]

Additionally they have recently introduced terminal navigation charges at regional airports that did not have such charges before.

Actually I think that's not quite true. At least, if the situation in the UK is similar to the situation in the Netherlands.

Those terminal charges (for ATC) were always there, but were charged by the local ATC provider and often incorporated in the landing fee. But Eurocontrol has built a great automated collecting machine for the en-route charges and they offer local ATC organizations (that would probably be NATS in the UK) a very cost-effective way to bill these charges alongside the en-route charges. Far more cost-effective than what the local ATC organizations can provide.

It's for this reason that the LVNL (the Dutch NATS) is now collecting their terminal charges through Eurocontrol, instead of doing their own collection.

More information here, although the page was last updated a year ago and that might be the reason that the UK is not listed: EUROCONTROL - Bilateral Agreement relating to Terminal Air Navigation Charges (http://www.eurocontrol.int/crco/public/standard_page/ssa_terminal.html)

I dare you to find another invoicing/collecting agency/department that's able to boast:
High recovery rate typically 99%+, thereby securing a stable cash flow in euros;
Low collection costs typically less than 1% of the amounts billed, as a result of economies of scale and high productivity.

Have to admit that I've spoken to a few people who have tried to deal with Eurocontrol when a terminal charge was misapplied, because somebody put a wrong callsign in a computer somewhere, and the quality and helpfullness of the support desk is definitely one area where the cost savings come from.

4. How the altimeter subscale knob never turns the way I expect it to!

Magnetic compass too.

[mad_jock]

Or what about the old roof trimming handle in the slab wing PA28.

If you think about it you get it wrong if you just grab it and give it a twiddle its always the right direction.

[AEST]

Additionally they have recently introduced terminal navigation charges at regional airports that did not have such charges before.Not to mention the fact they charge them when you fly VFR and the Airport has no operative navigation aids :ugh:

Finally for the last 30 odd years there have been swingeing en-route charges levied on aircraft weighing more than 2 metric tonnes who file IFR. The cost of these charges is roughly equal to the profit margin on an Aztec or Baron charter flight.When IFR I spend more on fees than on gas and the Aerostar is a thirsty animal. Certainly opting for filing SVFR generally, and will only switch to IFR enroute if the soup is too thick.
I am even considering trading down to a less safe airplane thanks to these idiots. :ugh: