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Capt MAC
19th Mar 2010, 12:56
Hello guys and girls!
In my company there is a debate about memory items.Some of us are saying that memory items should be first said by PF and only after that PM should execute them and some are saying that should be made by PM with confirmation from PF but not spoken by this one. All this is because english is not our language and some of us are using this paragraph from QRH as a must "When a non normal situation occurs,AT THE DIRECTION of the PF,both crew members do all mem items in their area of resp. without delay'' .What means in english AT THE DIRECTION,please? Or what do you understand of that words?
Thanks!

rudderrudderrat
19th Mar 2010, 13:16
Hi Capt MAC,

"At the direction" means the PF calls for the appropriate check list e.g. "Fire Engine Check List".

In my previous company, the PM then repeated "Fire Engine Check List" to confirm they understood the correct procedure. Then it was done from memory by the PM calling each action with the PF monitoring and confirming the correct vital actions. When the memory items had been completed, then the QRH was read and cross checked that nothing had been missed.

fullandfree
19th Mar 2010, 13:57
Re 'Fire Engine Check List'

Reminds me of my days as a student navigator in the Dominie, putting out a Practice Pan: ' Practice Pan, Finningley 50, Dominie, 5 POB, simulated Fire Engine, FL 350'!!

capt. solipsist
20th Mar 2010, 02:16
Follow the 4 steps:
- ANNOUNCE (PM)
- IDENTIFY (PM)
- CONFIRM (PF)
- COMMENCE (PF Command)

Example: Engine Fire

PM: "Engine Fire" --- (Announce)
PM: "Number 2 Engine" --- (Identify)
PF: "Confirm #2?" --- (Confirm)
PM: "Confirmed"
PF: "Commence memory items, Engine Fire or Sever Damage or Separation" --- (Commence)

PF: "Autothrottle if engaged, disengage" (Disengages the A/T)

PF: "Thrust lever, confirm #2?" (while touching #2 Thrust Lever)
PM: "Confirmed"
PF: "Close" (Closes #2 Thrust Lever)

PF: Then commands PM - "Continue memory items"

PM: "Engine Starl Lever, comfirm #2?"(while touching #2 Eng Start Lever)
PF: "Confirmed"
PM: "Cut-off" (Cuts off #2 Eng Start Lever)

PM: "Engine Fire Switch, confirm #2?" (while touching #2 Eng Fire Switch)
PF: "Confirmed"
PM: "Pull"

PM: "Eng Fire Switch and/or Eng Overheat light stay/s illuminated"
PF: "Confirmed"
PM: "Eng Fire Switch rotate to the stop and hold for 1 second"
PM: "Start time 30 secs" (most people start timing when the squib light comes on)
PM: "30 secs, Eng Fire Switch and/or Eng Overheat light stay/s illuminated, Eng Fire Switch rotate to the other stop and hold for 1 second."

PF: "Non-Normal Checklist, Fire Protection, Engine Fire or Severe Damage or Separation"
..........

A little anal, I know, but TRYING to be word perfect helps us preclude misunderstandings brought about by our different accents, nationalities and ways of speaking English.

Cheers!

alexban
21st Mar 2010, 18:55
hy CM ... I think that we are the only company that has this problem...but I think we've already solved it. So, it's like this:
The PF give direction as to what case it's on : i.e ' Engine separation.." , then both memebers do the items in their area of responsab with confirmation if required.
Of course,there are still some guys hanging with the old habits, but they'll have to comply with the SOP...as soon as we'll put all in writing..
Discussing this with Bo, they said that we can do it both ways, but we must have a clear sop about this, so e have to put all in writing very clearly.