When does a pilot set QFE

[bluehawaii]

Does anybody know when a pilot sets his altimeter to QFE during the approach and landing, as well as when to set QNE after Takeoff departure if flying in places like Russia or China where such procedures are in force.

[galaxy flyer]

When leaving the transition level, just like the changeover to QNH. In Russia, the normal transition level is 1500m QNE. Same on departure, when cleared above 1500m, changeover at or below 1500m. ATC will prompt you by adding "on standard" when cleared to a flight level.

GF

[411A]

When leaving the transition level, just like the changeover to QNH.

In addition, for those operators who do not use QFE, QNH will be provided, if asked for....at least in our ops, previously.

[Der absolute Hammer]

Yes but at go around if on QFE, set QNH and take off with QNH set.

[TopBunk]

Serious question:

Do any airlines actually operate using QFE these days?

Surely as all the EGPWS systems and terrain databases are referenced to QNH, then QFE (certainly in Western airlines) must be very few and far between.

[Agaricus bisporus]

Ryanair and the RAF???

[Gargleblaster]

When does a pilot set QFE
Hopefully NEVER !

[A and C]

Ryanair setting QFE.............are you sure?

As said above setting QFE on the B738 will result in EGPWS problems.

( the RAF don't have anything modern enough to have EGPWS so its not a problem for them )

[Georgeablelovehowindia]

This may go back to when Ryanair started with Britannia Airways' ex 737-200s. The first officer's instruments were non-ADC suck/blow and the pick-off for the cabin pressure was off that altimeter. It led to the captain landing with QNH set and the first officer on QFE, if I remember correctly.

Surely they're not still doing that, are they?

[Der absolute Hammer]

There was a recipe for disaster?

[spekesoftly]

This may go back to when Ryanair started with Britannia Airways' ex 737-200s. Or back to when they started with Rombac 1-11s, because in those days quite a few Airlines used QFE.
But I speak to dozens of Ryanair pilots every day, and they all use QNH now.

[galaxy flyer]

DaH

Ok, what do you do when the initial clearance is to 600m QFE? Yes, once airborne you will be quickly recleared above transition, but you must be ready to level on QFE.

GF

[Der absolute Hammer]

Some operators (Air UK) used to land in QFE in the UK and take off on QNH. I do not defend the system which is an RAF throwback. As for 600m...I do not think I ever received a clearance in meters and also never a clearance expressed in QFE.

[411A]

....and also never a clearance expressed in QFE.

Likewise.
Maybe something...new?
(sure hope not...:})

[FlightDetent]

Ok, what do you do when the initial clearance is to 600m QFE? Yes, once airborne you will be quickly recleared above transition, but you must be ready to level on QFE.
1. Brief correctly beforehand and be prepared.
2. Add delta P[elev] to QFE to obtain QFH, crosscheck with METAR (QNH) or ATIS/ATC. The importance of this cannot be overestimated.
3. Set QNH.
4. Use coversion tables provided on charts to work out proper altitude in feet that corresponds to instructed height in meters.

Lenghty? Prehaps. Complicated, no.

FD (the un-real)

[Dan Winterland]

Some military airfields around the world use QFE, and some of my companys' destinations are combined civ/mil and require the ise of QFE - in metres. We set the QNH and make the adjustment when setting the alt on the ACP. If we have a second standby Altimeter in metres, we set the QFE on that.

[galaxy flyer]

FD

We just set the cockpit to meters, set QFE, and at transition, set QNH. Just the opposite on the way down.

GF

[FlightDetent]

That is the easiest way, true. But some hulls do not have metric altimeter fitted, or metric option for AP interface. My present type does have such features an we use it for metric FLs. Below TL, if QFE would be entered in lieu of QNH, Auto press, TCAS ! (on some) and EGPWS are affected and need to be turned off. While MEL relief is possible for TCAS and EGPWS that are otherwise mandatory equipment for us, the conclusion is that deselecting a completely functional system just because you are not keen to develop and train proper procedures is beyond legal scope. Sure it is down to operator to evaluate which method best suits the fleet, destinations, frequency, and experience level.

Yours,
FD (the un-real)

[Dave Gittins]

Not exactly easy to set QFE in Colorado Springs :}

[Georgeablelovehowindia]

BOAC's VC10s had altimeters with little handles which extended from the baro setting knob, so that the QFE could be wound off quickly when landing at Nairobi or Johannesburg, for example.

Following the 747 'ground prox' incident at Nairobi, they became a QNH airline. This was following a previous incident with a Comet when the wheels actually touched the game park and trundled along through the grass for a short distance.

[galaxy flyer]

Perhaps, I assumed something, but I thought the thread starter had Russian Federation ops in mind. The only area that currently ALWAYS uses QFE. And, yes, the initial clearance will be to something like 600m QFE at UUWW. Transition is at 1500m.

My steed can do 16.00 inches on the altimetry, can swap between Imperial and Metric, so metric QFE ops would be a "no-brainer" even in KCOS.

GF

[Denti]

Or 200m in UUDD, anyway, still have to use QNH as QFE operation is prohibited, its just how Boeing build it. It is not really a problem with proper training and the right charts.

[galaxy flyer]

Denti

Boeings do not have a switch to change from Imperial to Metric altimetry? Yes, i do know that many airlines don't train QFE, so cannot use QFE in Russia. Frankly, once you have done QFE there, doing the conversions just seems more hazardous than not. And I did the conversions, inches to Hpa, set the altimeters, then converted QFE to QNH in the C-5. What a recipe for disaster and several close calls.

GF

[Dan Winterland]

"Not exactly easy to set QFE in Colorado Springs"

British altimeters tended to have a much greater range on the subscale setting to accomodate setting QFE at high elevations.



"Boeings do not have a switch to change from Imperial to Metric altimetry?''

The ones I used to fly had them. It's an option.

[galaxy flyer]

While mechanical altimeters, at least US ones, were limited to 28.00 inches (that is about 1800 feet of field elevation depending on actual station pressure) check your EFIS altimeters. Ours will go to 16.00 inches which is a lot of field elevation, how much is a guess at those pressures.

GF

[Denti]

We can (and do) switch to metric which is simply additional displayed information, but not used for data-entry (MCP is still in feet). However QFE operation is prohibited, that is not a company but a Boeing restriction.