Rejected Take Off....Contact ATC when?

[Coonman]

In some airlines, in the event of a Rejected Take Off, the NHP contacts ATC before the plane has stopped, and in others, the NHP monitors the stop and then contacts ATC after the Parkbrake has been Set.

Who's more right?

[I-2021]

The second one I guess. RTOs are (hopefully) a non routine event, so it is worth monitoring what the other pilot is doing at that stage. ATC will be aware that you are performing a RTO as you will not get airborne...but since you do not get airborne you would better perform all actions in the best way in order to stay safely on the ground:) When aircraft is stopped, you can talk to ATC and tell them what happened and what kind of assistance you need, if any. Anyway that's just how I see the question obviously.

Bye !

[airman13]

the second one,definitely

[HEATHROW DIRECTOR]

In my experience a) crews have said immediately that they are abandoning take-off, and b) ATC will notice it happening anyway. If it's a major problem I'd have thought that getting the word to ATC ASAP was a pre-requisite to ensure that the safety services were alerted?

[I-2021]

Well yes but the most important thing is to perform the RTO in a correct way.

[Bullethead]

Maybe the only time you might consider a radio call before you are stopped would be during a RTO in Lo-Vis conditions when the tower can't see you.

Pre-briefing it would be a good idea.

This possiility may already be allowed for in approach sequence spacing and so the radio call may not be necessary.

Regards,
BH.

[Ben-B]

I guess it would depend on the specific situation really...

Aviate, Navigate, Communicate says to wait until you've safely finished the RTO...

But if the visibility is too low for the tower to see the runway, then it might be a good idea to make a quick r/t if possible, although atc shouldn't clear another aircraft to t/o or land until you've made an airbourne call anyway...

If there is something like a fire, the time between starting the RTO and finishing might make a big difference if the airport fire services are able to get to the a/c and supress flames in time to save the aircraft from being a hull loss.

It's not going to be a long complicated transmission in any case, it'll just be "********* stopping" with maybe a quick explanation such as "engine fire"...



I guess with an RTO not being a routine thing, each situation will be different... so it depends on each situation

[I-2021]

During a RTO in LVOps with low RVR it is vital to monitor the CM1 and call any deviation. Imagine a reverse unlocked close to V1 while taking off with 125m RVR or less, even using HUD. It is absolutely chalenging in a simulator where you expect that something is going to happen at every takeoff and you are ready for all the worst nightmares that can happen. It gets ten times more chalenging in real life when flying 80hrs/month or even more... I guess that during a RTO the first thing is to stay alive and even better stay on the runway until parking brake set. After that you can start calling the whole world around you and ask for everything you might need.:ok:

[Bullethead]

An air traffic controller mate of mine suggested a call such as,

"Mayday stopping XX"

is all that's needed and it takes a split second to say.

It can always be downgraded but could be easy to forget in the heat of the moment if not pre-briefed. You'll get all the help you need.

Regards,
BH.

[Coonman]

Thanks folks. I think that pretty much answers the question,:):):)

[GlueBall]

Most airplanes have a push to talk switch on the yoke, so it's not a distraction of making a 2 second abort call before a full stop, especially in low visibility with other airplanes on final or in queue for line up. The sooner, the better. The controller can make a mistake. It's all about staying alive. Think about Tenerife.

[Dream Land]

Remember Tenerife? :confused: Not really sure where you are coming from there, IMO opinion I would prefer the NHP or NFP do nothing but monitor the RTO ESPECIALLY in low vis ops, please try to understand that ATC should not be inclined to land/takeoff anyone on you while the procedures in force, ATC, please advise.

I believe the Tenerife accident was more of a situation where two aircraft are on an active runway at the same time during low vis, a big no no nowadays.

[GlueBall]

I believe the Tenerife accident was more of a situation where two aircraft are on an active runway at the same time during low vis, a big no no nowadays.

. . . A big no no nowadays?

Haven't you ever been cleared to "line up" just after the preceding airplane has started its takeoff roll? This happens frequently at busy airports. Controllers don't wait for the traffic rolling on the runway to become airborne before clearing you to line up. So, in fact, it is very common to have two (2) airplanes on the same pavement simultaneously. That's why, from an added safety standpoint, it would be well to do for the rolling airplane to notify the tower of an abort soonest, before coming to a full stop. And as mentioned before, it wouldn't be a distraction for the PM to click the push-to-talk switch and in 2 seconds make the call. :ooh:

[Dream Land]

Not in Low Vis Ops, like I said, ATC has been updated since the S. Tenerife scenario.

[DozyWannabe]

Also, it could be considered contentious associating the Tenerife accident with an ATC foulup when they didn't actually make any major mistake. Non-standard phraseology was a contributing factor, but back then it was pretty widespread - the big one there was taking off in low visibility without proper clearance, complicated by a heterodyne which reduced the situational awareness of both aircraft's crews.

Anyways, back on topic... ;)

[Tmbstory]

The few rejected take-offs that I have done in the past, I always advised the Tower by using the "press to talk" switch on the control column as soon as I made the decision to stop.

As GlueBall says in his post no;13, it only takes a second or so to say XYZ stopping.

Tmb