Gone sick whilst on your hols? No problem have some more hols!

[eticket]

A ruling by the European Court of Justice on a case from Spain, means that if you are on your holidays and you come down with something that would have stopped you working that day then you can claim a replacement day of holiday. Even if it means holding it over to the next year.

Who would be an employer?

Claim back holidays lost to sickness, says European Court of Justice - Telegraph (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/eu/6190826/Claim-back-holidays-lost-to-sickness-says-European-Court-of-Justice.html)

[somewhereat1l]

We've had that benefit in Australia for about 20 years, its actually in my contract. I've never used the benefit though, maybe I should :ok:

[hostiegirl]

This is normal for all the airlines i have worked for in the uk!. If you can produce a doctors note then the leave is credited back to you? why is it so odd? it's just a few extra days off does it matter which way around it is for instance if have taken all leave then have flu and signed off for 10 days it is no different still absent from work same length of time.

[eticket]

why is it so odd?Thanks for the replies. I remember one scene some years ago when the Receptionist came back from holiday saying that she had spent it all in bed with a bug and that she felt she should be able to get sick leave for the period. The bosses said 'no' as they felt that Holiday Leave took precedence over Sick Leave and so it was the employee's 'hard luck' that they were ill.

There was no 'replacement holiday time' at the other two companies I have worked for.

It is good to know that other companies / countries are more enlightened.

[Flyingstig]

I can think of a few companies that would find a way around it!!!
:ok:

[bfisk]

At least in Norway this is mandated by law anyway, as long as it is _holiday_ and not just time off.

[WorkingHard]

A simple question please. Do you see your employer as a charitable institution or as someone who provides you with pay in exchange for work?

[Matt101]

do you see employment as life itself or as a means to enjoy the time you have away from work? I luckily enjoy both but not everyone does.... 21 weeks at work then 2 off for flu and no holiday? I think this is a fair ruling.

[low n' slow]

You accumulate holidays to provide som long term rest from work.
Being ill to the extent that you would not have been able to perform your duties at work, does not constitute rest.

Any respectable employer recognizes this, as the employer strives for well rested and motivated employees.

/LnS

[Firestorm]

There are one or two employers who will argue that black is green, and that green is in fact red in order to get the result that they want... I expect that this ruling will be applied selectively in different airlines.

[Bruce Wayne]

There are one or two employers who will argue that black is green, and that green is in fact red in order to get the result that they want... I expect that this ruling will be applied selectively in different airlines.



And there will be more than one or two employees that will exploit the situation to get the result they want too.

[Say again s l o w l y]

This is normal practise even here in the UK. Personally, I think it's madness. If you are ill on holiday, that's just bad luck. It's happened to me before, but I've never felt that my employer should pick up the tab just because I happened to go sick whilst on leave.

[Capetonian]

I requested this in the company I used to work for. I was (genuinely) sick, I had bronchitis, which laid me up for a few days of my annual leave. It also prevented me from travelling on prepaid nonrefundable tickets. I claimed on my insurance for the tickets, and was refunded, and I claimed the days back from my employer.

The insurance paid out without a murmur, HR needed a bit of persuasion, but eventually the leave was credited back to me.

[Matt101]

. If you are ill on holiday, that's just bad luck. It's happened to me before, but I've never felt that my employer should pick up the tab just because I happened to go sick whilst on leave.

Likewise and I agree there maybe some who take the preverbial but I think these are exceptions - I don't believe most people would claw time back for a cold etc. But as has been said before, people do require r&r if the employer wants to maintain a happy and well motivated work force.

[WorkingHard]

"Likewise and I agree there maybe some who take the preverbial but I think these are exceptions - I don't believe most people would claw time back for a cold etc"
Unfortunately I would have to disagree with this. If you want an example then look at the statistics of absence as produced by the Government Central Office of Statistics which shows a clear relationship between paid absences and the size of company where benefits will be greater than a smaller employer. The most glaring example is "public service" (if any one understands the concept anymore) where a full 10% of the workforce is absent at any given time for sickness. I overheard a conversation in a local authority office just a few months ago where one employee said to another "I still have 16 days of my 21 days sick leave to take yet"
If you have a good benefits package then the very best of luck to you but remember one persons benefit is another persons cost and when times are hard then the lean and efficient will be the survivors so what benefits do the losers then have?

[hawker750]

low n' slow
You accumulate holidays to provide som long term rest from work.

Week ends are for rest so does you argument hold here as well? "Sorry boss had a terrible hangover on Sunday so I cannot come to work Monday as I did not have adequate rest on Sunday"

I suppose all the lefties will also include dogs barking, car doors slamming and babies crying as excuses for not coming to work as "not rested"

[Matt101]

If you want an example then look at the statistics of absence as produced by the Government Central Office of Statistics which shows a clear relationship between paid absences and the size of company where benefits will be greater than a smaller employer. The most glaring example is "public service" (if any one understands the concept anymore) where a full 10% of the workforce is absent at any given time for sickness.

Whilst I'd agree that these figures are unacceptably high (not that they are a surprise to me), clawing back leave due to an illness whilst on leave requires Doctor's certification, not the same as the "come back to work just before the seventh day" brigade that make up the figures above.

And as for the visit to the Doctor, unless I was really ill - no thank you! If I want to read back issues Women's own and smell TCP I'll go visit mi old gran! :}

Though perhaps I am just being idealistic (hopefully not naive).

[Denti]

Over here in germany its normal law for, hmm, probably around 30 or 40 years now. Have done it a couple times and it was no hassle at all. However they can and do account off days for sick days, around 0.3 off days are taken into account for each sick day, so for each 3 days sick i will lose one of my 132 off days a year.

[Agaricus bisporus]

This has been part of UK Employment Law for many years.

[Bertie Thruster]

I'm not sure this has been actual UK Employment Law.

Unless this HR Dept has been fibbing!

"As there is no contractual or statutory right to reclaim leave booked where the employee has become unfit for work during the period of that booked leave, the Company will not credit that employee with the days of leave affected."

[tocamak]

I also don't think that this is enshrined in UK employment law (at the moment). ACAS (at Acas - Advice leaflet - Holidays and holiday pay (http://www.acas.org.uk/index.aspx?articleid=806)) gives advice on this area from which the following Q&A seems to give the current standing:-

I broke my leg the day before I planned to go on holiday. Does my absence count as sick leave or annual leave?

It is up to your employer to decide if your absence is sick leave or annual leave. In the case of a broken leg it would be reasonable to assume that you were unable to go on holiday and therefore class your absence as sick leave.
Many employers use occupational health advisers to help them make these kinds of decisions. The Acas guide Managing attendance and employee turnover has an example of an absence policy which may be useful.

[racedo]

Did know someone who had a young lady working for him who did this for 3 summer holidays to gain extra weeks leave, his payback in year 4 was visiting here on the Monday she was due back but her mum stated oh she has gone for 3 weeks.......summary dismissa followed, on appeal she was asked to provide confirmation of flights etc. She withdrew appeal.