Crash on Take-Off at Kandahar

[ORAC]

NATO: Fighter jet crashes at Afghan base
(AP) – 21 minutes ago

KABUL — A NATO official says a fighter jet has crashed at NATO's largest base in southern Afghanistan, the second major crash at the base in two days.

Capt. Ruben Hoorncelv, a spokesman for the NATO-led force, says a fighter jet crashed inside Kandahar Air Field during takeoff at 7:20 a.m. Afghanistan time Monday. The two-man crew ejected from the jet and are being treated at the base hospital.

Hoorncelv says there is no indication insurgent activity caused the crash, but that officials don't yet know why it went down. The jet caught fire and emergency personnel responded.

A Russian-owned civilian helicopter crashed at Kandahar Air Field on Sunday, killing 16 people on board.

Hoorncelv says he thinks the rash of crashes is coincidence.

[green granite]

Reuters have it as a helicopter?

KABUL (Reuters) – A helicopter belonging to the NATO-led force crashed on Monday on a airfield in Afghanistan's southern province of Kandahar, an alliance official said, a day after a similar crash killed 16 people there.

The two crew were being treated for their wounds, he said. The helicopter crashed shortly after take-off and was on fire, he said, adding there was no immediate indication that it had come under fire.

[DuckDodgers]

Grizz,

inappropriate to comment on the aircraft type until officially released!! PN you are indeed correct.

[5 Forward 6 Back]

Several NATO spokespeople are quoted in the open as saying it's a Tornado.

A Tornado fighter jet crashed inside NATO's largest base in southern Afghanistan on Monday in the second major crash on the base in two days, officials said.

The jet crashed inside Kandahar Airfield during takeoff at 7:20 a.m. Afghanistan time (0250 GMT), said Capt. Ruben Hoornveld, a spokesman for the NATO-led force. The two-member crew ejected and were being treated at the base hospital.

There was no indication that insurgent activity caused the crash, he said, but officials could not immediately say why the plane went down. The jet caught fire and emergency personnel responded.

NATO didn't identify which nation the jet came from, but a U.S. military spokeswoman in Kabul, Lt. Cmdr. Christine Sidenstricker, said the jet was a Tornado _ an aircraft commonly flown by British forces.

The crash happened one day after a Russian-owned civilian Mi-8 helicopter crashed at Kandahar Airfield, killing 16 people on board. Both Kandahar crashes follow a string of deadly aircraft downings elsewhere around Afghanistan in recent days.

Hoornveld said he did not know why two aircraft had crashed in Kandahar in two days.

[ORAC]

The impression given is that it was during the take-off roll and that the aircraft wasn't totally written-off (damage to aircraft and not wreckage...)......

Independent: Crew injured in RAF Afghanistan jet crash
By Mark Bulstrode, PA
Monday, 20 July

Two RAF crew members were being assessed in hospital today after a British fighter jet crashed during take-off in Afghanistan.

The Ministry of Defence said the GR4 Tornado was damaged at Kandahar Airfield, in the south of the country, at 7.20am local time (0250 GMT).

A spokeswoman said the injuries suffered by the crew - the only people on board - were still being assessed.

"The RAF GR4 Tornado crashed during take-off," she said. "An investigation has been launched but the crash definitely wasn't due to enemy action. The crew ejected safely but they did sustain some injuries, which are currently being assessed in a hospital."

She added that accident investigators were analysing damage to the aircraft.

[sprucemoose]

Glad to hear that the crew were the only people onboard the Tornado - nice work, Indy!
Get well soon guys.

[cessnapete]

'A spokeswoman said the injuries suffered by the crew - the only people on board - were still being assessed. '

Do we have a new secret version of the Tornado with more than two seats? Mod spokespeople seem to have very little knowledge of their subject

[VinRouge]

Hope the nurseys give the lads something to remember Kaf by!

Get well soon lads.

[L J R]

Guess you need a very long range cab to get them direct to Nottingham

[Lima Juliet]

Guess you need a very long range cab to get them direct to Nottingham

No need, there is a very good scanner at the KAF Hosp. However, I seem to remember the Nurses were a bit ropey during my brief visit :{

Get well soon, chaps...

LJ

[Jumping_Jack]

Cessnapete, it's more likely the journos being fed the info don't know much about the subject (no reflection on them, just fact). If the spokesperson had said 'the crew escaped unharmed' you can bet that the first question would have been 'what about the pax?'!

J_J

[Chris Kebab]

cessnapete - you may be an expert on military fast-jets but I can assure you most punters haven't a scooby. I think JJ has probably got it spot on. I have had to brief journo's on mil flying in the past and apart from a couple of defence correspondents they hadn't a clue.

I was also crassly mis-quoted in a national newspaper and had to live it down in the crew room for years afterwards!

[Ewan Whosearmy]

I was also crassly mis-quoted in a national newspaper and had to live it down in the crew room for years afterwards!

In the interests of being able to judge for ourselves the severity of the journalistic misdemeanour, i think we should be told what you said and what you were quoted as saying. :ok:

[Squirrel 41]

And back to the point - glad to hear the crew got out, get well soon!

S41

[30mRad]

Bit of a surprise to hear the news, but really chuffed the guys got out ok.

Get well soon guys.

30mRad

[BootFlap]

Attn TorDet:

These things happen fellas, god speed to crew and I know you will crack on and continue to deliver as you have been since you took over. Fleet banter aside, good job (but we were obviously better.........., well apart from when we weren't) :ok:

[Chris Kebab]

Ewan - No chance mate, I'm not opening that can again, at least not sober!

Rather annoyingly if you have some relevant words it now pops up in Google; there's a challenge for you!

Certainly made me very cautious when it comes to sound bites selectively "quoted" in the press.

[6foottanker]

Glad the guys got out, but this happened only a couple of hours after another of the same type had overrun the end of the runway on landing... Not such a good day for the force.

[rolandpull]

No mention on the RAF web site yet.

[Gainesy]

another of the same type had overrun the end of the runway on landing...

Don't they have a hookwire there?:confused:

[rb199]

Yes there is one at KAF

[Jumping_Jack]

.....but it didn't work! :sad:

[rolandpull]

The heavy duty one was put in just for the Tonka's quite recently. A lighter weight model was there for all of the jonny foreiners jets.

[Gainesy]

.....but it didn't work!

:confused: So what's not to work? Or did they have a hook skip?

[30mRad]

Not that un-common, hook skipping, but makes your eyes water when it happens, esp on a high speed abort. Not much time to make the "stick with it" or "eject" decision, esp if there is a barrier at the end of the runway too. Anyone seen any pictures of the incident/accident - I remember seeing an amazing photo of the harrier and ejectee not long before they left.

[North Front]

Is it me or do I sense a bit of bad news being buried? After the initial AP report there has been no reporting of the accident at all......

[Wrathmonk]

Is it me or do I

smell a fishing trip? New PPRuNer asks a loaded question. Could be a journo. Could be someone who knows/saw what happened and is desperate to tell the world but wants someone else to tell all just in case the black omega (surely they would have upgraded by now....) comes round!;)

Perhaps, as well, in a world of roadside bombs, snipers, insurgents and deaths an incident where everybody "walked" away and the good people of WB would not be required it just isn't news worthy to the journos. Personally I think good drills on the MoD PR machine not to go overboard on this. Do the Army highlight all their traffic accidents (granted this will cost a bit more but you get my drift!)

30mRad

Not sure but wasn't the Harrier incident known about i.e he had reported a problem and therefore every man jack with their digi cameras was ready just in case (and also to avoid being on the BoI!). I get the impression (IMHO, and not wishing to speculate) that neither of the Tonka incidents had the luxury of more than a nano-second of warning/decision.

[North Front]

I maybe a Prune newbie... well, a sparse poster, but rest assured that I am not a journo. I guess you are right to suspect, though, WM. Point taken but check out reporting of previous such incidents. I am a little surprised at the assumption that the taxpayer won't care where £20M+ has gone... buy a few hels?

[RileyDove]

Wrathmonk - I don't think there was a reported problem with the Harrier - certainly it didn't affect the flying of the type elsewhere. As for the Tornado's - there has been a distinct lack of information - I guess helicopters of lack of it the current flavour though!

[Postman Plod]

I guess all the folks on here are interested in is are the crew OK? Other than the initial reports stating the crew were having their injuries evaluated, there has been sod all else - either in the news or on here. Journo or no journo, its not an unreasonable question surely?

Army road accidents generally don't cost £20M+ a pop.... :}

[Wrathmonk]

Riley

Sorry I wasn't very clear. I was led to believe that the Harrier driver had reported a problem (i.e. declared an 'emergency') and therefore all the crash teams, execs, rubber neckers etc all had time to get into position. What I didn't mean to infer was that there was a fleet wide problem associated with the incident.

Postman

I think it would be fair to say that where fatalities are not involved the press releases on the crew (as per the early posts) are more than is required. I'm sure if you knew the individuals you would be able to find out. This is no different to when the MOD report wounded soldiers - all they say is that they are receiving treatment etc. They don't go on to say what their injuries are (and neither, IMHO, should they).

[Ivor Fynn]

From what I have heard (rumour only) it smacks of a cock up!!

At least the boys are OK.

So what is Vgo?

Ivor

[Bo Nalls]

So what is Vgo?

I know the definition, but do you know the actual speed for the ac fit/temp/altitude etc? Did they abort before or after Vgo? What were speeds for Vr, Vgo, Vstop & VstopRHAG? Was Vgo the go/no go decision point or was that something else such as VstopRHAG?

Too many unknowns at this stage to be throwing around accusations of a cock-up.

[30mRad]

And Vgo is for single engine performance not a double burner failure, which is what is rumoured. With the exit off the runway, I suspect it was a high speed abort above Vgo and below Vstoprhag and the hook missed for some reason.....

[Ivor Fynn]

Vgo is Vgo! ie can't stop! Vr and Vstop are irrelevant past Vgo.

you can always rotate and jettison that is why the GAF work very different balanced field.

I wait with baited breath.

Ivor

[artyhug]

Now now Easy Street,

How dare you bring facts into the discussion! This is Pprune after all and the ill-informed and downright obnoxious must be allowed to speculate and accuse at free will with little relevance to what actually happened in any incident.... ;)

Now do carry on everyone I love how much better it makes me feel to read the wafflings of the idiotic!

[SirToppamHat]

I am a little surprised at the assumption that the taxpayer won't care where £20M+ has gone... buy a few hels?

1. Don't care as long as the crew got out.

2. In terms of the airframe this won't be replaced by another bought-in; You can't go to Tonkas-R-Us and buy them any more.

3. I am guessing that an allowance is made for war and accident losses anyway.

4. I am guessing the main costs of replacement to the MoD will be for the 'bolt-on' additions required for theatre ops, that presumably will be required for the replacement airframe.

5. See point 1.

By the way, did I miss something or was the recent loss of an Mi-26 not reported widely either?

STH

[barnstormer1968]

STH
No, I do not think you have missed anything. It was odd that the Mi 26 was not mentioned in the press. I assumed it was something to do with the reason why it came down:(.
The F15 did not feature much either.

[Wader2]

BS, not British news therefore no interest.

From what I have heard (rumour only) it smacks of a cock up!!

Oh good, that will save having a BoI.

[LeggyMountbatten]

It was odd that the Mi 26 was not mentioned in the press

Do you mean this (http://defenceoftherealm.*************/2009/07/uncomfortable-truth.html) Mi26?

Edit: broken link. Article appears on this excellent blog

Defence of the Realm (http://tinyurl.com/5o3dp6)

Hope this works!!

[Jackonicko]

Now if you were reporting that something had been u/s for a period (eg history), that would be interesting. But reporting current status?

Even as a journo, I cry:

BEADWINDOW!

[barnstormer1968]

Hi. I could not get your link to work (but thank you for providing it), but in any case I was inferring it was not widely publicised as some incidents are.
I have seen/heard three separate reports on the crash, but none were as detailed as they could have been (even without giving away secrets)

I guess what annoys me is that non British losses are not reported in the media, and although I do not think it is because other nationals are seen as non entities, I do sometimes wonder if anyone has an agenda to make things seem less deadly than they actually are.

From what little I know, this was a Russian owned aircraft (i.e. non UK), while the Canadian helicopter incident made national news (again non UK, but with one UK national onboard)

[VinRouge]

It was third down on the BBCs news articles front page...

How much publicity did you expect?

[grizzled]

The MI-26 was / is a UK story. The media just haven't figured that out yet.

[Cows getting bigger]

Some would argue that the Mi26 story is no different to AN124s shifting big things or IL76s doing AVTUR runs.

[TheWizard]

More on the Mi 26 incident here if anyone wants to read about it.
The Press Association: Helicopter shot down in Afghanistan (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5hA9EDgU0n6DcG-Oyb3tA6ZOsRumQ)

[VinRouge]

BBC NEWS | South Asia | Afghan helicopter crash kills 16 (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/8157939.stm)

Was the other one I thought you meant.

[LeggyMountbatten]

Hi. I could not get your link to work

Edited with another link

I guess what annoys me is that non British losses are not reported in the media

Take a look at this
EU Referendum: "Unsafe" gun runners supplying "Our Boys" (http://tinyurl.com/kkpgvl)

for an informative take on the UK connection

[barnstormer1968]

Thanks for the link. Although it's quite sad to admit, I do enjoy looking at the pics. I find the Mi 26 to be an impressive beastie.

I even stopped work today, and rushed to the beach, so I could see the German (Heer) CH53 on the sea front at Weston Super Mare:8