Netjets 1 year on 1 year off??

[babemagnet]

Netjets managment is offering 1 year on 1 year off at a 60 % pay for every year.

Now the problem is if you do not take this oppurtunity there is a chance they can sack you!

The problem a friend of mine is facing is very diffucult: either he can take it, or he can choose to do nothing!

The problem is if he takes it: That he can stay (60%salary) BUT people who did not take that deal can stay as well (maybe) with 100% salary!

The problem if he does not take it: He can be sacked, or he can be luckly that his collegues took the deal and he gets 100% pay!

to my opinion this offer they have to take or not to take is a very difficult and outrageous dillema the crapy Netjets managment has offered.

It is almost an impossible desicion Netjets pilots have to make it can go either way!

The crapy managment recently employed oxford guys! how can you clarify this?

your opinions please on what my mate has to choose

[doubleu-anker]

These are the stupid mind games you would expect from children.

I worked for an American company years ago and someone abused the company credit card. Typically, they over reacted and their solution was to cancel all company credit cards and have us sign for re issued corporate cards issued in our name drawn from our bank account, then claim back.

A lot of crew signed the agreement in good faith. Some refused point blank to agree and the management suddenly became aware they were unable to enforce this, so the "rebels" were re issued with their original company credit cards! What about the crew who towed the company line? Oh, they were told because they signed for the corporate card in their name, they would have to continue with the new process. :ugh:

The above was just one example of the imbecilic behaviour demonstrated by that company.

Americans, don't you just love them some times? :}

[Taxi2parking]

....well they could just fire a whole bunch of guys....personally I think that given the situation it's not a bad approach to the problem of over crewing.

Now why the overcrewing problem exist...that's another question.

[OOOHAAAH]

Everyone stays on 100%, company continues to trade...for a while...then you know what, they close or go bust (or Warren does get fed up), everyone goes, inevitable conclusion in these tough times.

Brave decisions need to be taken.

Dont always blame the employer for having foresight or the balls to be adventurous.Its great in good times, but it then doesnt become the employers that should be solely responsiblein bad times.

Wise up, this is real and everbody is hurting, boh sides of the line.

I say 60% beats nowt and see how it goes.

[Duck Rogers]

Further information here http://www.pprune.org/interviews-jobs-sponsorship/369247-netjets-europe-2.html

[CL300]

As said above, the easiest solution would have been : get the last 300 people who joigned and fire them all. BUT, there is always a BUT :-) ; this is not the way the company is doing business; look around what is happening with other operators when they need to get rid of workforce; notice, payment, bye bye...

At least there is a wide consultation, working groups etc.. of course it is not pleasant to have to choose, of course one can argue that the hot potatoe is in crews's hands etc.. However, theses proposals are targeting everyone from the 62 years old to the early joiners; EVEN the one's whom are NOT yet in the company (ie ab-initios).
You can dump S... on a company as much as you like, but you should recognize when they do creative things. Get the numbers right, breathe, think, sit on your hands for a while, THEN act , speak...

µHave fun, and I wish you all a bizjets company that treat you like NJE does..

[happyjack]

Hmmm. Don't kid yourself CL. NJE are not thinking of your interests one bit. They are trying to cover their butts should this situation blow over in the next year or two. Then they still have a ready supply of "meat" available for easy access whilst minimising todays costs.

If it fits with your agenda you are lucky and I would agree that it is a lot more palatable than redundancy but that is not their agenda.

and I wish you all a bizjets company that treat you like NJE does..

I know of many many ex NJE employees (except no-one is actually employed by NJE) who would take issue with that statement!

[146LUKE]

Would be a lot more bearable if management give up their bonuses.

[doubleu-anker]

CL300

Which option have you taken, if I may be so bold as to enquire?

[CL300]

I will take Voluntary Redundancy, even being on the top 100, and having a smaller chance to get rid off immediately, after 7 years it is a good deal, and it is time to move on...Better than to resign with nothing...or made redundant and having the minimum by law.. But until the 15th of July a lot of things can happen !!!

@ Happy jack
After 25 years in bizAv, Netjets was and still is the best deal in this sector, however people can change their minds and move towards other forms of life.
YOur statement that no one is employed by NJE is obsolete since NJE does not exist as such; you can choose between NSM and NTA.. Make up your mind and answer will follow..

[happyjack]

After all your years' service with NJE to take voluntary redundancy now I can see the temptation. Yes you have done very well indeed. Congratulations.
It's odd to think that the misery of this situation can actually do some people favours.
Are we all invited to the retirement party then? :D

[CL300]

Is it really party time ?
What would have been your answer if I wrote : NONE; I'm not feeling like doing anything, because my Cayenne Turbo is eating loads of fuel, and my spring house in morroco needs refurbishment..
What ever the decision Netjets crews will have to pick up, voluntarily or not, it will be a tough one. Parting or partying.. that is the question..

[Scratch Pad]

I thought willy waving wasn't allowed in here?

[CL300]

But my dear Scratch Pad, (love collins :uhoh: )

you get the level of response required by the thread itself; or it is truly interesting/constructive ( very rarely) or it is the always on 'dump S... on Netjets, they deserve it' type of attitude.
It seems like that whatever the company does , we have a smart harse to deny the efforts and highlight the mistakes; this is very tiring at the end of the day.
All Netjets crew are facing difficult times, like BA, AF, LH, every single company is affected; one's may think that he is firewalled against the odds until those are reversed.

I truly hope that if a fellow pilot has to be made redundant in the BizAv world; he/she will have that much notice and that much option to look for before. And remember, this part is a mitigating part, if this work well, there will be NO redundancies. So for a company in this sector, this is pretty well off. ( no rose tinted glasses here, just plain facts, a solution has to be taken, and this is part of it).

Enjoy your days Off

[postman23]

And did your 'mate' made a choice yet? Must say it is mighty kind of you to start a new thread to help out your 'mate'.
My friends would not do that for me, they always bother me with boring things like BBQs and drinking beer or going on roadtrips.
Given the attitude you put on display here, may I recommend voluntary redundancy? :hmm:

PS: crapy is not a word. I take it you are french?
Perhaps you meant crappy: crap·py (krhttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/abreve.gifphttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/prime.gifhttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/emacr.gif)adj. crap·pi·er, crap·pi·est Vulgar Slang
1. Inferior; worthless.
2. Miserable; wretched.
3. Mean; contemptible.

...which would be the wrong adjective to use as NTA management is clearly seeking a constructive way out of the overcrewed situation, making them far from inferior to any other operator. Or wretched, mean people for that matter. I am not happy with the situation either but throwing mud around only shows your lack of respect.

As said take VR and go explore the rest of the wonderful world of aviation, let me know how you are getting on just in case I get made redundant.

Just spotted your location, nevermind the comment on your origin.

[babemagnet]

He did not made a choice yet the problem is that he cannot cover his bills with 60% salary! but he is afraid of losing his job and on the other hand he likes to stay with 100%. very difficult for him.

[south coast]

So what will you do babemagnet, I mean what will 'your friend' do?

[Flintstone]

Actually for anyone opting for the jobshare option that IS a problem. 60% salary sounds great (and yes, I know it's better than none at all) but those employees can only work elsewhere to make up the shortfall with the express permission of NJ management and if they decide to leave during their year off have to reimburse any pay received. At first sight it looks like a great deal but there are quite a few catches particularly for someone like babemagnet's 'friend' who needs all their current salary just to tread water.

[EatMyShorts!]

Hey Flinti, those employees can only work elsewhere to make up the shortfall with the express permission of NJ managementthat's not quite true. In your year off you can work for another operator without any express permission by NJ's management. The only thing that you need to take into account is that the company may call you back to your 100% contract and you'll have to follow that order within 90 days. Obviously we are not allowed to work for other fractional ownership programs, but that's the only limitation. Cheers, EMS!

[Flintstone]

That's alright then.

Some of your colleagues are a bit confused though EMS. Two of them gave me the same story.:confused:

[EatMyShorts!]

Looks like we need more roadshows and more FAQ-documents :p

[Flintstone]

No, no, no. What you really need are more smoke and mirrors. Ah, I see what you did there ;)

[R Birkin QC]

Babemagnet why can't your friend cover his bills on 60% which is at least €34000/year, with BUPA, Life Insurance etc?
UK minimum wage works out at around €16000/yr working 300 days 9am-5pm.
Total earnings suplimenting your 60% with minimum wage = €50000
This is the same as I earned in the military and no I do not have a pension.
Tell your friend that if he is willing to earn minimum wage (I am sure someone with the ability to be an airline pilot could easily find a job earning more) that in his first year off he is only taking a €6500 pay cut.

Can he downgrade his car? Remortgage his house? Sell the boat? Ebay all the stuff in the attic?

Granted in the year he is flying he won't be able to do another job 300 days/yr but he could still work behind a bar, on a building site or driving a cab on his 5 off. I know it is not the glamorous lifestyle he is used to but we must all adapt to survive. I good friend of mine's father used to be the senior training captain for Cathay and he spent years and years driving cabs and doing odd jobs to get by when times were hard. It builds character!!

Many people are surviving in this world on far less money/yr. Is he going to have his house repossessed on €34000/yr if so he needs to downscale and spend less.

Ducking for cover and standing by for incoming.

[Flintstone]

Roly.....m'learned friend...........mumblemumble

You are of course right and many of us have worked the jobs at which others sneer. Why, I recall when I was given the task of removing lobsters from Jane Mansfield's ar*.................... but I digress.

Then again we have to wonder about babemagnet's motives here. A genuine post out of concern for his/her friend (keeping the options open here) or a not-so-subtle attempt at publicising the NJ situation? Who knows.

Pass the port would you old chap?







*With apologies to Messrs P. Cook & D Moore.

[R Birkin QC]

I'll pass the port but take care to not let it touch the table!:}

[babemagnet]

It is not so easy to sell your house nowadays! that why its hard to survive with 60% on an fo salary instead of 100 %

[swampthing]

EMS.. Sorry to disappoint.. but you are slightly wrong.. you may work for other orginisations " as long as you recieve the written consent of netjets beforehand" ... on the centre page of the volentary programme for crew info sheet... " which must have cost a fortune to print and sent out to all pilots and cabin crew... :ugh:"

[EatMyShorts!]

Wops, I was convinced that no written consent was required, because I read the following question and answer in the FAQ: Question: Just to confirm, flying freelance for a charter operation would be possible?

ANSWER: Yes. You may not work for fractional ownership private aviation operators, as these are direct competitors. There is not a definitive list because new operators come into the market.So, in fact Flinti was right, we still need this silly "written consent" thing... well, it will not be applicable to me, but I was wishing and hoping that it would be easier for those who take LTLOA or JS so they can work outside NJE without any special bureaucratic barriers.

Thanks for correcting me!

[SayMach#]

What do you think out there? Does the reputation of Netjets take a hit and people leave when better times are back in aviation?

[smallfry]

I disagree that NJ reputation should take a hit.
Why? It is suffering from depressed business (like others).
It is taking steps to deal with overcapacity. (partly self induced)
Unlike others it is at least offering some options. The options are not all great, and some people are being forced to make a decision that they would rather not. However, NJ could just as easily said - right, last 300 - you're out!
- In the days of DM that is probably what would have happened, and to be fair, it would have been more efficient and clinical - and cost the company a lot less! But would that do the reputation more damage? - Who knows?

Not a comparison in anything other than semantics, Virgin makes pilots redundant everytime the economy sniffs, BA tries to not make people redundant (union strength). Do you think Virgin has a bad reputation?

[postman23]

@babemagnet

Selling the house would be the last thing your friend needs to explore, unless he has been living above his financial health that is. The argument on the taxi driver is in fact quite valid. Did that myself trying to survive during flight training days. What is your background? With the cash from the VR you can easily renew your previous rating or get another one for that matter. But make sure you have employment options first!
Best of luck :(.

[Rusty Trombone]

Its difficult times for all of us in corporate aviation. My personal opinion is that NJE has done everything possible for as long as possible to avoid the blow.
I worked for NJE for 6 years and Joined the private sector 18 months ago. I am now on my second position due to the climate.

I would seriously consider the options given, there is very little out there I am part of a group all looking for work CE550/H800/GV pilots all looking for work I have been the only fortunate one of late and landed a GV position after 5 months of nothing.
Yes we would all like the cosy Jobs, benefits and salary but i am afraid its very tough in the european market its time to ride the storm.
I was fortunate enough to fall back on my previous engineering licenses GIV/GV/DA2000 until i found another flying position, but even on the engineering side its been very slow, AC not being used less hours less maintenance. FSI are due to lay off soon as well.

I would brush up on any skills you have
:ok:

[No RYR for me]

In the US it works already (slightly different options though) NetJets Averts Pilot Layoffs and Furloughs: AINonline (http://www.ainonline.com/news/single-news-page/article/netjets-averts-pilot-layoffs-and-furloughs/)

Great time to do up the house or get a different degree :D

[doubleu-anker]

".....get a different degree."

Interesting comment. Does every pilot have to have a degree? Do NJ require a dregree from their employees? I know a lot who don't. Some people could consider doing a degree, perhaps.