Victor Airborne (Merged)

[harrier]

I've just stumbled in and have not read all posts on this matter. The series of photos titled IMG are brilliant.

Has anyone else commented on the fact that this series of photos clearly show that from the beginning of the roll, the port aileron is shown deflected upwards and continues to be shown in that condition in the remaining sequence of three photos until the aircraft is airborne. Whilst this accounts for the aircraft rolling to the left as it gathers speed, this can only occur if the pilot deflects his control column to the left or if there is a technical fault with the aileron control system.

What I'm unable to understand is that the photo, IMG-8401bb[1], showing the aircraft well and truly airborne, it is also shown with a slight bank to the right and the port aileron still deflected upwards.

I've never worked on Victors, but as an ex RAF airframe fitter this aileron situation is alien to my senses. Can anyone put me out of my misery?:confused:

[Flap40]

I've just stumbled in and have not read all posts on this matter.

If you do go back and read the rest of the thread you will find your answer.

[ChristiaanJ]

harrier,
Quick answer.
On the Victor the ailerons are slightly rigged upwards, to alleviate the stress on the outer wing. So on the ground and in level flight, both ailerons are deflected a few degrees upwards.
That should answer your question.

CJ

[TOPBUNKER]

Given that we are now advised that VictorPilot wants to see the video, who was it that tried to suppress the story.

And who asked YouTube to take down the video clips?

[Lancasterman]

You have to sign in or register with the site which is free to see it.
The Victor flying video (http://fightercontrol.forumotion.com/other-military-aviation-related-matter-f19/the-victor-flying-video-t9291.htm)

Please respect the owner of the videos wishes....

[Sam1191]

You have to sign in or register with the site which is free to see it.
The Victor flying video (http://fightercontrol.forumotion.com/other-military-aviation-related-matter-f19/the-victor-flying-video-t9291.htm)

Please respect the owner of the videos wishes....

Thanks for posting! IMO the video explains a lot, looks as if the wind caught her at the worst (or best!) possible moment. It also plays down any hysterics about "danger to the surroundings" as the pilots clearly* have her under control about 2-3 seconds after the "take off". Good luck with the paperwork!

*Edit: ok maybe not clearly (I'm watching it again), but seemingly haha

[Matt Jones]

Interesting. It does look like sufficient speed had been reached to get the nose wheel off the ground in a straight run before the wing picked up the wing.

[nacluv]

Yes, but nose-up is just about SOP for these fast runs - regardless of type.

I suppose it adds to the occasion if only in a teasing sense. Sort of like 'tantric' flying. Except this sortie became, err, fully consummated!

[Dunbar]

Ah, the 'freak gust of wind' defence...which of us hasn't used it at some time or other?:)

[VictorPilot]

That video is from a pretty "cool" angle. For the record, there was no intent to raise the nosewheel - it was intended and briefed to be a "restricted" speed run for several reasons. The cross-wind was a problem, not least as the Victor intakes are more efficient on the up-wind side, than down-wind. More thrust from the right against the gusting weather-cock effect, all variables in real time meant working hard on the nosewheel steering and the rudder as power came on to hold the centre - line. Equally, the cross wind made for more lift from the stbd wing as I think the video shows, but I had no idea at the time of the magnitude of the bank to port that developed so rapidly until seeing the video, nor the amount of stbd bank and rudder I had to apply to head back towards the runway. Visibility from a Victor cockpit is restricted to say the least!! OK for "bomber" straight and level, but not for close to the ground - by the seat of your pants - no computers - flying!!

[dunc0936]

could she ever fly again or be allowed to fly agian??

Duncan

[BEagle]

Yes

No

Next question?

[dunc0936]

so if no to the second question then why, why would it be different to the vulcan or is it along the lines of a Lighting flying in this country?

[ChristiaanJ]

Duncan,
Read the XH558 story...
To be very brief, XH558 was kept nearly airworthy at Bruntingthorpe, AND arrived with 600 tons of spares. Enough people got involved and enough money was found to do a complete Major and get her flying again.

None of that is valid, alas, for the Victor, AND the airframe is way over its fatigue life.
So the story IS different from the Lightnings.

CJ

[andrewmcharlton]

Have we any progress on the details of actually happened? I know VictorPilot suggested he might be able to tell us before too long, would be interesting to hear.

[VictorPilot]

Thanks for your continued interest in my favourite aircraft!!

The situation is that the CWJ routine maintenance and fault clearance is continuing under a plan to get it ready again for the 30 Aug Open Day. The Aircraft Illustrated article appeared without anyone talking to me .... the Flypast article in the July/Aug issue tells it like it was. :eek:

The CAA saw the draft article without comment, but asked for a caveat to be added "At the time of going to press the CAA were investigating the occurrence .. etc etc". Quite a few lessons came out of the "hop", all of which will serve to make sure we do better next time - no - that does not mean formation with the Vulcan!!!

As a matter of interest, when David Walton bought 715, he also got tons of spares. Just what the weight was, perhaps David could tell you, but there were convoys of low loaders and containers unloading at Bruntingthorpe for weeks. At one time we started unpacking them - a mamoth task, and we barely scratched the surface of the 100s and 100s of boxes and crates when hangar usage at Bruntingthorpe was reviewed and we had to stop. There are still tons and tons of Victor spares in containers and a hangar at Bruntingthorpe, we have a spare APU and PFCUs, and even brand new tyres and brake parachutes! Unfortunately, some parts common to the Vulcan were sniped early on in the Vulcan re-build. I do not think any spare Conways are tucked away. Blowing an engine or starter motor are my major concerns. I notice from another thread that RR have done an assessment of the Vulcan engine pool - I would feel happier if they could do a review of the state of the Conways too. Some parts of the airframe are as good as new, but there is some corrosion appearing - a respray is quite urgent.

Still a lot of life left in Tina yet!! I hope! :) Bob

[jindabyne]

Very well done in all respects, Bob - from a now ancient 1Gp acquaintence!

[hurn]

Some good footage here of the 'flight'. :D


n3HaeYVlBw8

[BOAC]

Mmm! That had me gripped! Highish laundry bill, I suspect.:)

[JW411]

That really is quite scary. Was the guy in the right seat (who didn't shut the throttles when ordered at least twice) also qualified on Victors as a pilot at one time or another or was he a gash hand (if you will forgive the pun)?

I also wonder if that Canberra could perhaps have been parked in a more intelligent place considering the strong crosswind from the right?

[VictorPilot]

Glad to say that mega laundry bill was not required but close - just a strong scotch thanks to the management!!

The effect of the cross wind is quite extraordinary - it must have been one hell of a gust when you see how far the aircraft was blown to the left of the centre - line in just a second or two.

The guy in the right hand was a volunteer engineer who helps maintain the aircraft - he was never in the RAF I think. That said he is someone who devotes a lot of time and energy to helping maintain 715 - one of the best. I had no doubts about his ability to respond to the limited duties in the right hand seat on that day. He was not a gash hand, and he cannot explain why he did not respond to my calls.

Canberra comment? Well true but we have limited towing and ground crew at Bruntingthorpe. They did their best.

Bob

[Stratofreighter]

Anyone already seen this clip?
YouTube - LAST FLIGHT OF THE VICTOR 2009 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rh2YSzBdWFg)

Taken starboard of Teasin' Tina, XM715 passes the filmer about ten seconds from break release. The touchdown of the Victor (and the rubber smoke coming from the wheels) is not shielded by the hill, but indeed it isn't too close to the camera. The entire clip is about 1 minute 16 seconds long.

[nacluv]

I assume the tyre smoke is the result of the main gear traversing the last taxiway on the left, between stretches on the grass, whilst the brakes are rather solidly applied. Perhaps the only way you could ever get a Victor to lock its brakes!

Rather you than me, VP. And well done for getting it back together in time, although there is an instant - when the nose first dips back groundward - when there is a definite "oh ****" moment. Maybe not the only one from that clip either...

[VictorPilot]

FYI, The Victor has maxerat brake units, and it is firmly part of Victor technique teaching that you keep heels down and toes away from the brake pedals - the upper part of the rudder pedals - until firmly on the ground and the wheels have spun up. I think I went on the brakes while still on the grass but just before getting back on the tarmac. The puff of white smoke I cannot explain, we did look at the wheel tracks but I thought they were all on the grass - perhaps not though - might have been on the taxyway and then a bounce onto the grass. The main thing though is that the aircraft had a new set of tyres fitted for the event on all but one front bogie - and that was "as new"! As I said earlier, the stbd brakes were hot when we stopped, but there was no apparent tyre wear, and certainly no flat spots on any of the tyres.

You are quite right ...... there was a major "Oh S..." moment as I realised we were flying, and I got the nose down and saw exactly where we were!! :eek::uhoh::mad::ooh: Bob

[PFR]

Nice work Victor Pilot:ok:
I'm not a pilot but can appreciate some skill was required in gathering that back together:D
Many hours flying such "heavies" no doubt comes to the fore in such a situation:)
Also thanks for being so open and transparent about the event and may you and the XM715 team have many more happy times "thundering" down "Brunties" runway:ok:

[Shaft109]

VP - Could you please run through some of the speeds on this? i.e. What speed you lifted off, and landed?

[forget]

VP - Could you please run through some of the speeds on this? i.e. What speed you lifted off, and landed?

Landed? :eek: And while you're there could you please run through why you had take-off flap selected? The whole thing reminds me of the most commonly spoken words before an accident -

'Hold my beer and watch this'. :hmm:

[Howslo]

And another question...

Was the brake 'chute deployed?

[VictorPilot]

I wrote a long reply to these simple questions - but where did it go?

[spekesoftly]

VP,

You are probably aware that over the past few days PPRuNe has suffered some considerable technical glitches. After you submitted your reply, were you able to check that it appeared on the forum? There have been other reports of posts failing .......

(And I've struggled to post this!)

[treadigraph]

PPRuNe has suffered some considerable technical glitches

Probably worth preparing lengthy copy elsewhere then copying and pasting it in at the moment.

VP, sheer vulgar curiosity, do you still log the time in the Victor? Incidentally from one of those videos, I make it exactly 10 seconds actually airborne - a lot of decision making and reaction in a very short space of time!

Cheers

Treadders

[VictorPilot]

Hello again, Just got back here after a spell away. Will respond to earlier questions again when I get a quiet spell. I did not know about the technical glitches, but that explains why my page of writing just vanished!! Yes, I made it 10 seconds too!! Yes, I will put it in my log book!! And yes, a lot of thoughts, decisions, actions, and panic in a very short space of time!!! Bob

[VictorPilot]

The CAA have decided that no action or prosecution is necessary.... I am happy to say!! Bob See you on the 30th!!

[Stratofreighter]

Congratulations Bob ! :ok:

Pffffheeewwww, "Bruntingthorpe" thankfully got away with that one... :ouch: :} :D :E

[MattYorke]

Congrats.

I guess that vindicates the decision to dump it back onto the ground rather than do a circuit - can't imagine if you'd decided to go around that they'd be so relaxed.

Have they requested to see evidence of steps that'll be taken to ensure it doesn't happen again? I guess you'll have a few extra items on the pre-run risk assessment now.

[VictorPilot]

Well that is the latest run with the Victor over, and now 715 is safely put to rest for the Winter! Apart from the Bruntingthorpe crew, I must say a very big thank you to Andre and Ollie from 231 at Elvington, together with Barry, who all pitched in to get 715 preped for the run in good time. Unfortunately, the Comet failed to start, and this rather blocked the Victor taxy plan. Then the BBMF were meant to flypast, and so the Victor had to hold for some 25 minutes waiting for the flypast - which in the end did not happen! So, sorry to all the people who stood in the rain waiting for something to happen!! I hope the wait was worth it to see 715 doing its thing, safely on the ground this time!!

The aircraft AAPP is running well after a major effort to fix the starter motor at the last minute. The engines are all running well, but there is probably a fault with one of the fuel pressure warning sensors. Hydraulics are perfect - rather amazing when you consider all the problems with peaking pumps in the early days ... and 715 sits there with no pressure on the seals for months on end. One rudder PFCU has failed, and one alternator is intermittent, but apart from that, it was a good run.

Hopefully, the aircraft will go into the hangar for the winter months to be repainted, and this will give us the chance to tidy up many of the minor problems: fuel gauging, intercom and radio, sticky contactors, corroded switches, trim indications etc etc. Anyone who can help with these activities, please let us know as we need more experienced hands to keep things going.

Moderator. The Vulcan community have a long thread running under "Did you ever fly the Vulcan". How about merging this into "Were you ever in the Victor Force?" Just a thought as I have had so many contacts from ex-Victor people since May.

Rgds to all. Bob :ok:

[PPRuNe Pop]

Better yet, Bob. Why don't you start one. It will be met with more than a little enthusiasm I am certain.

Merging two very different aeroplanes would not be a good idea. (edit)

Thanks for your inputs, most interesting.

[BEagle]

Considering it's nearly 6 years since I started the 'Did You Fly The Vulcan??' thread, one would have thought that any Victor people with similar interests would have started a similar thread by now....

But there again, they always were rather 'second division'...:p*

I don't agree with merging Vulcan and Victor threads; those who were condemned to fly Fred's bent wing thing should start their own thread!

Vive la difference!!


*As Bob will undoubtedly realise, this is only V-force banter!

[ChristiaanJ]

PPRuNe Pop and BEagle are of course totally right.

PLEASE don't merge the Vulcan thread and any future Victor thread.

I'll be a very happy subscriber to both, but after all they ARE two quite different stories!

CJ

[Tankertrashnav]

But there again, they always were rather 'second division'...http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:www.pprune.org/get/images/smilies/tongue.gif*



Splutter:eek:


fly Fred's bent wing thing


Choke!!!!!!

V Force banter indeed! This is war!

[ChristiaanJ]

Wasn't it a bunch of those bent-wing thingies that got the 607 tin triangle to Stanley?

CJ

[PFR]

Not that I can count myself as one of your number....and I take my hat off to you all, But...
Which one remained in service longest:ok: Last man standing and all that:}
Too valued asset to have it using fatigue life "poling" around at airshows:rolleyes:

Tin hat on:p

[bubblesuk]

It was indeed! had it not been for the "bent wing thingies" then the Aluminium overcast wouldnt have been able to visit the Falklands to largely miss the runway (not stirring honest!):p:E

[ChristiaanJ]

.... to largely miss the runway ...I suppose all the ancients already know the answer to that one.....

Had they tried to put all the 21 bombs on the runway, there would have been a very high chance of 21 holes just next to the runway....
Crossing at a slight angle vastly increased the chance of at least a few hitting the runway, even if you had less control over where exactly along the runway they hit.
And a few was all it needed.

CJ

[Tankertrashnav]

Good job I wasnt nav radar on that bomb run. At Lindholme I set up something of a record with a bomb error of 9 miles, having attacked a reservoir dam in the wrong valley! Had to be included with my other results which meant my average score was something less than impressive! Ensured my posting to tankers though, for which I was eternally grateful. :ok:

[VP8]

Tankernav
"Good job I wasnt nav radar on that bomb run. At Lindholme I set up something of a record with a bomb error of 9 miles, having attacked a reservoir dam in the wrong valley! Had to be included with my other results which meant my average score was something less than impressive! Ensured my posting to tankers though, for which I was eternally grateful. "

Close .................but beaten by Vulcan:suspect:

I was stationed at Cowden AWR in the early eighties when a Vulcan was tasked for an FRA on Target 8 (the barge) called in and cleared Hot...called off wet, we called no spot........


Meanwhile we receive a call from Donna Nook (next range down south) asked if we had a Vulcan booked in for our Barge Target mentioned affirmative...they then asked did we want the score

Gave him 30miles @ 6

VEEPS

[Tankertrashnav]

Thanks Veeps -after 39 years I dont feel so bad now!

[bubblesuk]

I suppose all the ancients already know the answer to that one.....


Don't knock the ancients! i was manning the fire bottls at Brumtingthorpe's CWJ day the Sunday past and Bob certainly handled Tina as if he only flew her 3 months ago......err....hang on a mo.......:E

[PPRuNe Pop]

It seems there was a little more than meets the eye in Bob's story.

Today in the Mail.

Hero pilot averted air show disaster after co-pilot hit throttle of giant bomber by mistake | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1211925/Hero-pilot-averted-air-disaster-pilot-hit-throttle-giant-bomber-mistake.html)

Well done indeed Bob. For one 'orrible minute'..............etc eh.

[nacluv]

A tale of Derring-do indeed. Well done, Bob.

Nice comment in the 'have your say' bit at the bottom:

Now that Mr. Prothero and his colleague have inadvertently discovered that the thing is still airworthy, how long will it be before Bob Ainsworth deploys it - and them - to Afghanistan? After all, needs must, credit crunch and all that...

Bob - had any phone calls yet? :E

[Tankertrashnav]

Heads up for News at Ten tonight

First the Daily Mail, now ITN have got hold of it. The clip which has already been posted on here will be shown on News at Ten tonight, accompanied, no doubt, by the same tosh that got printed in the Daily Mail (not that I disagree with the hero bit, Bob! :ok:). How come these guys have taken so long to latch on to this - has someone been doing some shrewd negotiations on royalties?

[Tyres O'Flaherty]

Didn't like that comment by the ''A330'' Capt, saying that they were committed & shouldv'e flown a circuit.

Vic pilot Bob's quite clearly explained the dodgyness (sorry) of that idea with that airframe. And the results bear out his decision don't they. No injuries, no wrecked classic A/C.

[ChristiaanJ]

Oh dear.
Now Joe Public is going to stick his stupid oar in.

That so-called "A-330 Captain" should have known better.

And of course Joe Press did a great job..... 150 ft height.... landed in "a field".

CJ

[Super VC-10]

The News at Ten report mentioned that an investigation had been carried out into the incident and a report published (as far as I can remember).

No sign of owt on the AAIB website. Anyone know who investigated and where to find the report? :confused:

[ChristiaanJ]

The News at Ten report mentioned that an investigation had been carried out into the incident and a report published (as far as I can remember).
No sign of owt on the AAIB website. Anyone know who investigated and where to find the report? :confused:AFAIK, the CAA looked into the matter, and concluded there was "no case to answer", which was reported at least here. Some letters were undoubtedly exchanged, but otherwise I suppose the "report published" is just ITN journalese.

It was an unfortunate occurrence, very well handled, and I think most of us had a mixed moment of "OMG" and "WOW". Can't we leave it at that, and tell the gutter press to f*ck off, for once?

CJ

PS: And yes, crikey, I admit that when seeing Teasin' Tina show us for a moment she still could fly, it was something special. It made one wish for a "Victor To The Sky".
Yes, I know ... XH558 was the far more obvious choice for at least one return-to-flight.
I think it's unlikely that such an endeavour will ever be repeated.
Wouldn't it be great, though....

[Super VC-10]

Christiaan J,

I asked about the report because if one had been published it would perhaps give a fuller understanding of why the event happened, and what had been learnt from the incident. I'd hardly call ITN "gutter press" though.

[Fitter2]

I'd hardly call ITN "gutter press" though.

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it's probably a duck..............

[Flying Lawyer]

September 7:
A spokesman for the CAA said “The CAA investigation centred upon possible breaches of Air Navigation legislation including the Air Navigation Order 2005 and the CAA Act 1982. Article 148 of the Air Navigation Order states that ‘should it be determined that the offence was not avoidable by the exercise of reasonable care by that person the act or omission shall be deemed not to be a contravention by that person of that provision’.

Therefore, after the investigation was concluded, the CAA did not consider that any prosecution was warranted.

Separately, the management of Bruntingthorpe aerodrome has taken the incident very seriously and will incorporate all the lessons learnt.

The CAA now considers this matter closed.”
Sensible decision by the CAA. :ok:


No sign of owt on the AAIB website.
Perhaps the AAIB didn't consider the incident merited the use of time and resources?
If so, another sensible decision IMHO.


FL

[spekesoftly]

The News at Ten report mentioned that an investigation had been carried out into the incident and a report published (as far as I can remember).I suppose the "report published" is just ITN journalese.ITN made no mention of a report being published. What it did say was:-

"An investigation found that Bob's co-pilot froze because of the stress of the situation"

[Tankertrashnav]

What I hadn't realised from the You Tube clip posted on here earlier was how far to the left they had drifted, and that Bob had had to put the a/c down with the port undercarriage on the grass. Even more dramatic than I had previously thought.

Totally agree about the A-330 captain and a few more comments from instant experts. If Bob had done what he suggested I would think CAA would have been obliged to take an entirely different view than the sensible one they have adopted.

[Flight_Idle]

Presumably the report said who was doing what in the cockpit ect, but is it restricted to viewing by the press, who then use their own style of language?

It seems that 100% of the blame is being put on an unidentified engineer, without any real backround as to what happened.

[sitigeltfel]

If you want a good laugh, go have a look at the article in the Daily Express.

Daily Express | UK News :: Hero,70, lands flyaway bomber (http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/126006/Hero-70-lands-flyaway-bomber)

Utter drivel!

[ChristiaanJ]

Mostly the same cr@p, including the 150 ft, that we've seen before.

But don't you love the photo?

CJ

[hurn]

Was on BBC South Today this lunchtime.

A bit more accurate in that they actually just let the pilot tell the story.

BBC South Today (http://www.bbc.co.uk/england/realmedia/southtoday/southampton/bb/southtodaylunch_16x9_bb.asx)

[Bronx]

Flight Idle It seems that 100% of the blame is being put on an unidentified engineer, without any real backround as to what happened.
:confused:

The pilot's description of what happened is earlier in this thread.

[BOAC]

VP - does the Victor need 2 hands on the c/column for take-off? Just wondered if you were unable to close the throttles? I think my co-pilot's left arm might have been a bit sore in that situation:)

[Tankertrashnav]

But don't you love the photo?


Yup, Victors have changed a bit since I was on them! I was always rubbish at aircraft recognition, anyone care to enlighten me?

[nacluv]

The quote actually says "The Victor bomber, simular to above, zooms into the air".

'Simular' means, of course, 'nothing like'.

BOAC - I think the back of his head might have been tingling a bit, too!

[rab-k]

Probably a re-post but link to footage here c/o Liveleak (http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=643_1252434786).

Sporty...

[BOAC]

BOAC - I think the back of his head might have been tingling a bit, too! - and then, when they had finally stopped...........................watch him try to walk:):)

[Ridge Runner]

Tankertrashnav - you'd struggle to get many in that, the photo is an F-15. RR

[wiggy]

Is that the sound of a head banging against the wall that I hear :uhoh:.....................

[ChristiaanJ]

Ridge Runner - I guessed B1, but without flipping through photos, my guess is probably worse than yours.

CJ

[Herod]

From the Daily Express: But another visitor, quick-witted former Group Captain Bob Prothero grabbed the controls and coaxed the monster 150ft back to earth.

As a visitor, how did he manage to get into the cockpit of a "runaway jet"?

Don't we all just love the press!

[nacluv]

The BBC local news covered it last night. Good old BBC - a day later than everyone else. Plus they saw fit to interview one Bob Protheroe. Don't know what he had to do with it...?

On a plus note, they did actually show footage of the Victor, not a F15/B1/whatever. :hmm:

[aviate1138]

Some of our American cousins think it was deliberate....

This was posted on Avweb along with a video.

AVwebFlash Complete Issue (http://www.avweb.com/eletter/archives/avflash/1456-full.html)

Victor Bomber - Hero or Hoax?

"At an air show, an old Handley Page Victor bomber was supposed to do a taxiby photo op. Instead, it took off. The explanation? The co-pilot accidentally firewalled the throttles. Really? You be the judge."

Someone needs a slap at Avweb.

[LG SING]

I'm also no expert in Victors but I have been flying for donkeys years and have done fast taxi runs. Guys, gotta make sure to not not extend the flaps and make sure sure the thrust was reduced before lifting the nose, all that sort of stuff.

Anyway, what about our pay? Im with one of the worlds biggest airlines, and 'the powers are forcing us to lose a days work a month, without pay.

Not good.

[ChristiaanJ]

Weird.... are the people at Avweb morons or conspiracy merchants?

If they really wanted to do a hop.... they would NOT have choosen a day with the amount of crosswind there was.

Who was the dumb commentator?

CJ

[forget]

And they would have set take-off flap. :hmm:

[Albert Driver]

But they didn't have a brake 'chute fitted so the landing would have been a long 'un!

Not when they were up to the axles in mud...;)

[chiglet]

I like the way the "reporter?:ugh:" used his Left hand [from the LHS] to operate [he said] the throttles.....I think that he was twiddling the trim wheel....could be wrong tho'

[ChristiaanJ]

Edited, because originally referenced post now deleted

CJ

[Flight_Idle]

I like the way the "reporter?:ugh:" used his Left hand [from the LHS] to operate [he said] the throttles.....I think that he was twiddling the trim wheel....could be wrong tho'

The throttles on the Victor are in fact outboard of each pilot I believe.

[chiglet]

I stand corrected :ugh:

[JEM60]

Didn't think that there was anything wrong at all with the BBC report last night. All the facts appeared to be correct, good bit of film, good cockpit shots, a day late, but who cares. I'd rather see a correct report like last night's than the sensational inaccurate reports by virtually everybody else. Credit where it's due.

[Captain Airclues]

JEM60

a day late, but who cares

More like four months late as the incident was on May 3rd.

Dave

[JEM60]

Yes, Airclues, we [and the BBC ] all knew that, but the point of all the broadcasts was that it was now public news that there would be no enquiry, therefore that bit was current news.

[Heliport]

it was now public news that there would be no enquiry

It was now public news that there would be no prosecution.
There was an enquiry by the CAA.
The investigation found no evidence that any criminal offence had been committed.

[Captain Airclues]

I find it very strange that the incident was not reported by the national press and BBC at the time, whereas the incident was fully reported once the CAA had decided not to prosecute. Since when have the BBC not reported an incident just in case there was a prosecution?

In the articles that I've seen, including the BBC item, the decision not to prosecute is not the main news item.

Hero pilot averted air show disaster after co-pilot hit throttle of giant bomber by mistake | Mail Online (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1211925/Hero-pilot-averted-air-disaster-pilot-hit-throttle-giant-bomber-mistake.html)

Dave

[VictorPilot]

Back to the screen again after a great holiday, and 4 crazy days.

Catching up with correspondence in this thread first, people should remember that this run was to be to only 100 Kts. The selection of take off flap was for both aesthetic and technical reasons. I wanted a brake parachute fitted so the aircraft was properly configured, but I would not have streamed it as with that cross-wind it could have put the aircraft into a dangerous swerve as it deployed, and it would have almost certainly taken a door off when jettisoned as the shackle would have been pulled out sideways. ( Known Victor problem) I have already commented on the landing on the grass, and out of interest, the ground was quite hard and the wheels did not significantly dent the surface. I am surprised that anyone thought it would have been better to fly a circuit.

Considering that the videos have been on YouTube for about 4 months, and the CAA concluded their investigation at the begining of August, I was very surprised when the South West News Agency called me on Monday afternoon to talk about the video on YouTube "as a follow up". Having talked my way through it briefly, they wanted a picture to go wth a press release, and said they would get a freelance photographer to call round at 6pm. 6pm came and went, but at 7 a reporter arrived having travelled from Bristol! After going over things yet again and some pictures being taken, he set off back to Bristol, and my parting words were "E Mail me your draft copy so I can check it for fact, and I will bounce it straight back to you." I stayed up late but nothing happened.

7am in the morning, the phone went, and ITN were on to me, talking about the Mail On Line article. For the next three days I was innundated by calls from the BBC, radio stations, national and local newspapers and all - even some of my friends got through! I kept saying it must be a quiet news day, but everyone said "it was a great story"!! Well it was a great story when I read the South West News Agency version on the Daily Mail site, the problem was it was factually incorrect, quoted things I had never said, and was totally sensationalised!! I dont blame ITN or the papers for what they presented, it was the News Agency who "spun" it, presumably to sell it! I only just caught the BBC 6 News that covered it, and did not have time to get my recorder on, and I cannot find it on i player. However, I think it was by far the best including the shots in 715's cockpit, the nosewheel steering, control column, and throttle box. It never mentioned avoiding the spectators (FGS), avoiding housing developments and villages (UGGH); they gave a very good run down of what actually happened. Well done BBC for responsible reporting, and not messing with the Chris Evans show dialogue. I wonder if anyone recorded the 6 O'Clock news version?

Going back over it all - dont believe what you read in the papers!! Also, I think it interesting that the "spectators", "Villages", and "Housing Developments" were included, when none were involved or in danger, and I certainly did not mention them. My guess is the News Agency were tipped off by a "Local" - there are several in the Bruntingthorpe area who want the airfield closed down, and this could have been trouble making. However, what wonderful publicity the Cold War Jets have got for free!! We have already started planning a "Bigger and Better" Open Day next May, possibly including that "tin thing"!

Any volunteers prepared to help? We are desperately short of people who can work on the jets propulsion, electrics, hydraulics, and airframes. Just an afternoon a month would be a great help. See the website.

Best regards Bob

PS I am going to start a new thread "Were you on Victors" - if I can find out how! The Vulcan guys have had it their own way for too long!!

[BEagle]

I hope that the thread for Fred's bent wing thing is as successful as the one for the mighty triangle has been, Bob.

Still wondering where the 'throttle button' is in the Victor's cockpit....:hmm: The Daily Mail report was garbage - real "Giant Jet in Horror Death Plunge!" stuff - I'm surprised that there weren't any orphanages or special needs schools for the 'Hero Pilot' to avoid whilst 'grappling with the controls' or some equal cobblers.

I gave some local rag both barrels after mis-reporting a story about 558 - they did at least have the good grace to print a retraction.

[VictorPilot]

All the airborne stuff has gone away - I think!! "Were you ever on Victors" is now running. Bob