Orlando Flight Training - Joke! [Archive]

SweetChariotXV

5th Apr 2009, 16:41

Rhyspiper
I have been debating about going there for hour building

If its only hour building you are after, look at palm beach flight training.. found them to be pretty good and reliable with decent equipment. Have also heard plenty about Aussie Air - even though have not used them myself, friends have and have all said rates are very cheap.

Man_C_Flyer

5th Apr 2009, 16:49

http://i701.photobucket.com/albums/ww17/man_c_flyer/n688995435_5220621_2458.jpg?t=1238950127

SweetChariotXV

5th Apr 2009, 18:33

Its a Mickey Mouse place over in Orlando, quite literally!

From my experiences with NAC.. they are just as useless, if not worse! It seems Mickeys influence is not contained to Orlando only.

Keygrip

5th Apr 2009, 18:57

Wish they were Mickey Mouse - that lill guy *really* knows how to run a company.

KSM

5th Apr 2009, 21:25

I hear alot of good stuff about EAA-fly.com maybe some one can tell me more good or bad dont matter just it is the truth

Mickey Kaye

6th Apr 2009, 07:37

Isn't it a case of damage limitation now that (I assume) your in the states.

What about doing loads of your hours at night? or come in at say 06.00 in the morning?
I do hope you haven't paid up front.

wis3384

7th Apr 2009, 11:19

SweetChariotXV
Never Ever Go to aussie Air, they have only 25 students from Spain which they paid them in full of 100,000 for 0 to ATP license, 15 hours of Learjet and and Airbus 320 type rating!!!!!! they 've been punked and they are staying over and cant do nothin because if they did anything they will lose their money and wont have even a PPL from these 100 grand.
Aussie air does have any visa authorities they were doing illegal pilot training for international students ...so give them time the end is near for these :mad:

Owlperson

7th Apr 2009, 16:34

Guys, thought I would check on the OFT position before moving further. They advise that they have 40 aircraft on line and that it was a paperwork glitch that grounded the PA28s. Red faces but all aircraft now flying.

SweetChariotXV

7th Apr 2009, 17:02

wis3384
Never Ever Go to aussie Air

Well in that case avoid aussie air. As I said in my previous post, I have not had any experiences with them, just that I heard they had good rates. However if they are a cowboy outfit, and messing people about, then by all means, just like NAC.. avoid them!

But disregarding them from a training perspective maybe as far as just renting a plane goes, could aussie not be a cheap option? That I dont know.

However I do speak from experience regarding palm beach flight training, and they were very pleasant to deal with and rent from.

civil aviation

7th Apr 2009, 20:04

Why are OFT still allowed deliberately misleading advertising on PPRuNe?
e.g. OFT say JAA PPL £4595 but click through and you find the real price is actually $8525 which is over £1000 more !
Is this a case of money talks with moderators on the payroll?

JOCK 113

7th Apr 2009, 21:23

Is it Man C Flyer, Albion Mct, Alan Mtc or is it just good old Alan Mct******
Anyway Alan, I just wondered why if you had problems with booking an aircraft you didn't say anything to me earlier, especially when we were discussing your wind limitations today.
And by the way, you really should tell the truth and let everyone on PPRUNE know that you already hold a PPL and that you have just finished ATPL groundschool.

gdukkoq

7th Apr 2009, 22:16

Exposed !!!!

alanmtc

7th Apr 2009, 22:24

well arent i glad i got told about this in the early stages. not too sure where you get your information andrew, but with all due respect (not that you gave me any respect in that last post) your talking bull. i would appreciate it if you called me to speak about this. i will PM you my number. not the sort of thing i need from the chief pilot of my school right in the middle of atpl exam week is it.

alanmtc

7th Apr 2009, 22:27

and by the way my name is Alan McIntosh....

James D

7th Apr 2009, 22:47

Not sure what all the fuss is about. Its a bit of a lottery with instructors i admit but i never had any problem with OFT for my PPL.
I had a couple of issues, i went to Andrew's office and spoke to him face to face, he went out of his way to resolve my problems.

kinghorn

10th Apr 2009, 00:24

I too have had no problems with Orlando Flight Training and today passed my Private Pilot checkride. It took a few more hours than I might have liked but I have the licence now and that's all that matters.

As for the situation with maintenance, if an hour-building student is going to take an aircraft out for 14 hours a day (8.00am to 10.00pm), the 100-hour inspections are going to come around pretty quickly (almost weekly)!

wis3384

10th Apr 2009, 19:48

EXPOSEDDD !!! BIG TIMEEEEE!!! nice Q-tip lol

9287Excellent

10th Apr 2009, 21:30

I was recently at OFT to do my PPL and myself and the others that I went over there with were appalled at the attitude of most of the management towards us, especially considering we were the customer. Just going back to the first thread, we were all told we would have our PPL's in 4-5 weeks and it took nearly 2 months before the first one in our group got his check ride, that was with almost perfect weather, planes only in maintainence for 100hrs, etc, although they could have done with being in for longer as some of them were in terrible condition!

The owner of the company is a money grabbing degenerate :mad:, who is just generally a nasty piece of work, his "how much money can we screw these people out of" attitude, becomes very apparent when/if you meet him.

The majority of instructors are excellent, there are now quite few newer instructors there, so I don't know about them, but the instructors we had were good. However the way they are treated by the management staff, one or two inparticular, is appaling.

Basically, if you want to go to a school that tells you a pack of lies most of the time, will try to con you out of as much money as they can, compromise your safety in the aircraft and put you down at any opportunity they can, especially if you have a problem with them or the way they opperate, then OFT is the place for you, if not, I'd look else.
Also, there is a very, very funny video about OFT/Space Coast Aviation, on youtube, if you want a good laugh, go and watch it, but having been there myself, I find it very hard to believe!

DeltaGolf

10th Apr 2009, 21:34

Avion Air at Orlando Sanford Airport is a good place to rent and do time building, good price , good aircraft and good maintanence on them.

JOEFRIDAY2

13th Apr 2009, 05:00

Folks,

This one of those flight schools that has a great website and makes everything sound lovely and smashing.

The truth is that this is a company that you want to throughly investigate with an on site visit PRIOR to enrolling and committing a large sum of money. They run a lot of people through this school because they are great at marketing.

Did you ever wonder why they don't have a picture of their physical facilty in their adverts? This place is not pretty. It is not what you would expect. The stories you read about the planes are true.

They get a lot of UK students that prepay large sums of money. Don't ever give this school, OR ANY FLIGHT SCHOOL more than $2500 in advance for flight training in Florida. Don't get caught in their trap! If you prepay large sums of money then you have NO RECOURSE when things aren't as they are supposed to be.

Talk to former and present students. Ask them if they would go back.

I didn't go to this school. I looked at it but it scared me. When I did do my flight training, I did run into other students that went to this school and they were not pleased. One of them came to our school to do his checkride becuase the FAA examiner would not fly in this schools aircraft.

YourControls

13th Apr 2009, 13:37

Yes marketing is their speciality. By the way, has anyone managed to have a look at their hilarious video on Youtube? The only students they could get to talk on the video were the new students (who at that point had been there for about 2 weeks) as everyone else refused to pretend OFT was a great school and sing false praises so they could get extra customers. They also managed to pass off their Merritt Island base as OFT and not show Euroflight which is quite frankly a sh:mad:hole.

Also never mind the admin in the video, they are most definitely NOT that friendly. :ugh:

Also look out for extra charges on your account. Flights you didn't do and $50 charges for leaving storm windows open, accidentally dropping pens or plotters in the aircraft which they class as ''rubbish'' or not tying down aircraft even though someone will be flying it 5 minutes after you land(charges not mentioned when you sign up of course :ok:)

wis3384

13th Apr 2009, 14:16

DeltaGolf
EAsssssyyyy Budddyy Avion Air? please let keep it on OFT and dont let us start with Avion!!!!:=

Grass strip basher

13th Apr 2009, 14:29

"$50 charges for leaving storm windows open, accidentally dropping pens or plotters in the aircraft which they class as ''rubbish'' or not tying down aircraft even though someone will be flying it 5 minutes after you land"

You have to be joking:uhoh:... they charge you for this?!?! I did a night rating with them about 5yrs ago.... sounds like they have gone a long way down hill since then. If someone tried to charge me for dropping a pen I would shove it up their a**e and take my money elsewhere.:=

Keygrip

13th Apr 2009, 15:49

Yes, $50 is a bit steep for leaving a window open, you're right.

Now you give us your own suggestion for ending the dozens of occassions when so-called professional students don't comply with the check list and leave the window open, then a summer thunderstorm rolls through and soaks the inside of the aircraft - next person can't fly it till it dries out (and it stinks!!).

Drop a pen? That's not the *really* the deal now, is it!! I can't count how many times I've encountered aircraft littered with empty, but dirty, coffee cups, dripping cocoa-cola cans, discarded weather print outs and flight logs.

What do you suggest?

The school sends out a cleaner, at no cost to you, to tidy up after you and make it all pretty for the next guy? Quick valet service? Clean the windshield for you?

If you want to be treated like a professional then act like one. It's not a big job to take your rubbish out with you - nor is closing a window.

Of course the charges are Draconian - that's their whole point. Comply with the rental requests of the school and you won't have a charge, will you.

YourControls

13th Apr 2009, 16:11

Keygrip, sorry but here are some details I didn't mention earlier...

Closing the storm window wasn't on any checklist. It would be completely reasonable to charge people if they had been told they had to close the storm window and there would have been no arguments at all, had this been the case.

Yes, a pen. Two people were charged for leaving a plotter in the same aircraft and neither of them had left it there. They decided not to move it so if the student who had dropped it came back, they would have no problems finding it. One person was charged for leaving a cushion in the aircraft, a cushion that someone else had left on the seat previously. Of course some people did leave actual rubbish in aircraft like coffee cups etc and other things you referred to and those people were fined justly as that WAS stated as a ''no-no''.

If only they did clean the aircraft :=, they would be decent if they were given a wash every now and again...

As I said, we would have paid any fines and taken full responsibility for not following the rules if we had known that they were the rules.

Rhyspiper

13th Apr 2009, 16:29

SCXV cheers for the heads up, will look into it.

Regards

Rhyspiper

Keygrip

13th Apr 2009, 19:30

Then, yes, Your Controls, if that is truly the case you are 100% correct in your complaint.

I'm not sure that *here* is the time or place to *make* that complaint, it should be at flying school level. Though I'm sure you are going to say that you did argue the case at the time.

How "two" people are charged for the same plotter (in this example) is an oddity. How did the billing department know that the offending article was there - and if the first pilot had already been charged for the "offence" then how can the second one be guilty of it too?

It clearly cannot be the second pilots rubbish if the first one has already been found guilty of leaving it.

This entire industry leaves me in despair. It's a complete shambles from the (so-called) top, all the way down.

YourControls

13th Apr 2009, 20:59

How did the billing department know that the offending article was there - and if the first pilot had already been charged for the "offence" then how can the second one be guilty of it too?

They knew because a :mad: (the same :mad: all the time mind) walked around with a camera and took pictures of the aircraft in between people flying them whenever he had time off from his ''busy'' schedule. Well no, we coudln't see the logic in this either.

This entire industry leaves me in despair. It's a complete shambles from the (so-called) top, all the way down.

Unfortunately true :(

9287Excellent

13th Apr 2009, 21:16

Yes, like "Your Controls" has already said, there was a complete an utter :mad:, who on the days this person could be bothered to turn up to work, they walked around with there camera and took pictures to prove that an aircraft either wasn't tied down or according to them, it wasn't tied down tightly enough, even if it wasn't the student who had tied the aircraft down (in the beginning the instructors do it to show the students how to tie it down correctly) the students still got charged for it!! This person also did start charging students for not tying an aircraft down, when there were no tie downs to tie it down with, this did stop eventually when they realised there were no ropes in those positions!! The charges were only removed, though, if you went and persistantly kept speaking to the admin staff about it to explain there went any tie downs there to tie the aircraft down with!!

So yes, anybody thinking of going to OFT in the future, keep a look out for these charges which appear as "Miscellaneous" (usually) on your account!!

civil aviation

14th Apr 2009, 21:48

Further to my last post on this topic, I have and will not be going to OFT but why won't the moderators respond on OFT misleading advertising on PPRuNe?
Is this another example of money talks?

Booglebox

15th Apr 2009, 02:40

Still training with OFT- everything that's been said since I last looked in is pretty accurate!

Keygrip's point was excellent in that the steep fines are intended to stop people leaving trash in the plane, but I can verify (YourControls made this point already, I hope I can explain further) they are applied without the person being fined being notified, for the tiniest item. As for leaving the storm window open- this is central Florida, and on a normal day I consider an open window to be no less than a courtesy!! The tie down rule is stupid but, as far as I know, necessary for insurance / liablility reasons, and is rarely enforced, unless a certain helicopter instructor decides to walk around with a camera and a notebook (remember the uniform debacle, anyone?). You are right about the flight training industry being a shambles, a family member used to work for Cabair (parent company of OFT) in the 70's, and was encouraged to go fly with frost on the wings and airframe... needless to say, common sense was firmly applied.

Also, I'd just like to second that the OFT video is indeed hilarious.
YouTube - Orlando Flight Training and Space Coast Aviation Part1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CW162-LJS0Y)
And, I think that Euroflight is indeed a bit of a dump cosmetically, but apart from the one toilet IMO it is a whole lot better than the OFT terminal building. I guess as far as training school buildings go it's not too bad, but then again I've been based in an abandoned fire station before now...

One more thing- prospective students, listen to the sage advice about keeping your hands on your money!! :cool:

spinning

20th Apr 2009, 20:51

Myself and seven other mates are heading over to florida to do our JAR PPL.
If OFT had bothered to reply to any of the comments above we might have given them some credit but they can forget it now !

We have a place to stay sorted out in Cocoa Beach FOC as one of the lads owns the pad. Can ony one else suggest somewhere near merritt island or cocoa beach to do a JAR PPL seeing as OFT couldnt be bothered ?