Crossing Brize Norton Class D

[HLloyd26]

I am planning a trip from White Waltham to Gloucester next week and was going to fly a straight leg directly over/through Brize Class D airspace SFC-3500. I'm new to the area and have not flown up that way before. If the cloud base does not permit me to fly over the controlled airspace, am i likely to be given clearnace from Brize Radar to fly direcctly through? Going round is not a problem but i'm fairly inexperienced so would rather avoid a surprise diversion round if i can, otherwise will just plan to fly round to start with.

Thanks

[Johnm]

Have a plan to go round just in case, but if you contact Brize zone on 119.00 and ask for a zone transit at 3000 ft you'll very likely get one, I generally do!

[DOC.400]

Brize are really helpful -go for it!

They may even hand you over to Glos, but if they don't be aware you have to be pretty smart on dropping them and don't forget to check the Glos ATIS frequency before contacting Glos approach -however, if you ask, Brize will give you the Glos weather and info.

Ask for MATZ penetration and FIS on first contact.

Have fun!

[Fuji Abound]

Almost certainly you will get your clearance. Brize are excellent.

Check you know where the VRPs are.

[Duchess_Driver]

...do you need a MATZ penetration?

It's class 'D' and therefore should be a 'Zone Transit' and F.I.S.

You would, however, require a MATZ from Benson if that's on a direct track but no chart to hand so can't quite remember. Unless, of course, you're going over that as well.

Seconded with Brize Zone being quite helpful - but it all depends on their inbounds.

[Whopity]

Ask for MATZ penetration and FIS on first contact.
Brize don't have a MATZ though they do control Fairford MATZ. Ask for what you want, Zone Transit, aircraft are crossing all day long, so its no issue, even if you transit over the top and call them they will try to put you into the zone and give you a clearance. If there are no heavies in the circuit you can route overhead via the BZ.

[Jim59]

It's simple. Plan a fallback route that keeps you clear and the chances are that you won't need to use it. Go with just the direct routing and you can guarantee that they will tell you to remain clear!

[BackPacker]

In general, zone transit requests are the most successful if you:

Obtain the relevant ATIS beforehand, even if you're not landing
Make the initial call the requisite ten miles/five minutes out
Sound very confident on the initial call, giving exactly the info they need without being too longwindy. The controller really doesn't need the aircraft type, model, year of construction, engine capacity, number of seats, barf bags and everything, just enough info to give him a reasonable estimate of your cruise speed and capabilities. Also only list those turning points that are important to the controller, usually the entry and exit points.
Not only know exactly where you are, but also make sure the controller knows that you know the area. Official VRPs and placenames are good, so are highway numbers if you fly along them, beacons, rivers and such.
Cross the zone in such a way that it minimizes the impact on other operations. If at all possible, perpendicular to the runway(s) in use, and overhead the field. If the field has VFR operations, also think of the location and altitude of the circuit.
Have a mode C or S transponder
Thank the controller afterwards, R/T time permitting


Furthermore, if you want to do something complicated in a CTR, such as multiple orbits for some reason or another, give the tower a telephone call beforehand.

I have crossed the Amsterdam Schiphol Airport CTR (class C) on a number of occasions now, even with multiple orbits for picture taking within the CTR. Great fun if you know what you're doing. I have even heard other people at the club asking for, and being granted, an orbit around the tower at 500'.

[avonflyer]

Either way around you will be going through the AIAA so should be talking to Brize. In my experience they are always really helpful so I would try it out and see if they will give you the transit.

IF you have to go another way around remember that

going south Fairford MATZ is only activated by NOTAM BUT its always worthwhile checking with Brize that it has not suddenly become active since you checked (I tend to request the MATZ penetration and let them come back with - its not active ... better to be safe than sorry)

going North you will have Oxford to talk to as that can be a pretty busy little place..

either way enjoy

[tmmorris]

You'll generally do best if you route via the Brize overhead at rightangles to the centreline (actually that goes for pretty much all CTRs). They usually give a 'not above XXXX' clearance on their QFE.

As stated above, they are very helpful. I've transitted them gazillions of times as I am based nearby.

Tim

[modelman]

I have never had any problems going through Brize and have found them very obliging.(can't really avoid it when flying south from Coventry)
Try to sound confident on the r/t and I'm sure you will have no problems.
You will get a squawk and and a QFE height to transit at.
Call them nice and early so you you do not put too much pressure on yourself if refused.
If the cloudbase is high enough you can transit over the top at 3500'+ but do tell them you are there.
If you've not requested RIS before,give it a try but do keep a watchful ear for messages ( as I once failed to do and got a firm but polite ticking off:()
Maybe an idea to call Benson on your way as they will have info on the para dropping sites in their zone.
Remember that ATC are there to provide a smooth and stress free situation for you-enjoy yourself!

Prob the only reason for not getting a transit is if there is a Royal flight around that time but you will have checked the NOTAMS for this of course:)

MM

[HLloyd26]

Great thanks for the responses guys, very helpful.

[Fg Off Max Stout]

Brize don't have a MATZ

It may not be the standard shape but it's definitely a MATZ. Brize are normally very helpful but if they have heavies coming in or out they may not want you to make a long E-W crossing.

[hoodie]

It may not be the standard shape but it's definitely a MATZ.

No, it's not - a MATZ is not Class D, which this is. Rules & regs very different.

Concur with everyone about their helpfulness, though. :ok:

[Pianorak]

WW - Gloucester route: I have been asked to cross Farringdon - Burford VRPs. As mentioned above, make sure you are familiar with the VRPs.

My backup route: CPT - South Marsden - Blakehill Farm, making sure to stay clear of Lyneham.

[2close]

On direct track from EGLM to EGBJ you'll need a MATZ penetration from Benson then a Zone Transit from BZ (which is most definitely Class D CAS and not a MATZ). I'd call BZ asap on clearing the Benson MATZ, at Didcot, to give yourself as much time as possible to get your clearance.

Be prepared to call them again as you are nearing the Zone boundary to validate your crossing if you haven't received the clearance - it has happened to me on a few occasions (not necessarily at BZ) where I've been given a squawk and the QNH / QFE but not the actual clearance - there could be many reasons for this, telephone, mother nature, shift change - and I've had to call back up.

You could also ask Benson to arrange the BZ Zone Transit for you and possibly avoid the Freecall, then when clear of the MATZ at Didcot they'll possibly assign you the BZ Squawk and hand you over to BZ which saves you having to give BZ your life story all over again. You can but ask - they may not be able to do it but then again they just might.

You have to go back at some point so try a Freecall one way and a Handover the other - I would suggest the Handover from Benson on the way out.

On the way out BZ will possibly ask you to report VRP Northleach Roundabout which should be about 2nm right abeam and isn't the easiest to spot from the air, especially if you're flying a low wing.

EGBJ will ask you to report field in sight and will probably be a standard overhead join.

It's a good route - relax and enjoy. Let us know how you get on.

Have fun.

[Fg Off Max Stout]

Hmmm. I'll check on that - I may have learnt something new tonight. For a military aircraft, dealing with Brize doesn't seem to be any different from dealing with any standard MATZ.

[HLloyd26]

2close-Thanks for the tips. Wasn't actually going to come back that way, was planning Banbury, Turweston then back down via Wescott NDB. But if weather does not permit i will fly back same way so very useful all the same.

Pianorak-Similar alternative route that i have planned, although was just going to pick up an outbound radial from CPT then Fly to Kemble, then up to Glouc. Thanks

[Sky blue and black]

The AIP details the VRP in ENR 2-1-22 and information on MATZ penetrations in ENR 2-2-3-1.

[BEagle]

Given the average standard of knowledge amongst military pilots about the sub-division of UK airspace, it is hardly suprising that many haven't a clue about the differences between a MATZ, an ATZ and a Class D CTR.....

Brize Norton most assuredly does NOT have a MATZ. It is within Class D airspace. Benson has a MATZ, which military aircraft only are obliged to recognise (although civil aircraft are strongly recommended to) - embedded within the Benson MATZ is the ATZ which all aircraft must observe.

Note that, if you are given a height at which to transit the Brize CTR, the top of the CTR is defined by altitude...:hmm:

Quite why Benson, an aerodrome operating only light aircraft and helicopters (now that the corgi-carriers have moved to Northolt), should need a 5nm MATZ is another issue. I would have thought that the 2 1/2 nm ATZ would have been entirely adequate.

[tmmorris]

Possibly something to do with the high levels of instrument approaches there...

The stub is justified, at least.

Tim

[whowhenwhy]

BEagle, they've got a MATZ because they're a military aerodrome, with the stub aligned to the main instrument runway - it's as simple as that. If you come further south to the new rotary superbase :E you'll see that they've still got a stub, but haven't got one to the main instrument runway because they used to have the "protection" from the Farnborough MATZ in the dim and distant! Interestingly (in a dull way) though, Farnborough can provide MATZ crossing clearances to traffic without recourse to Odiham ATC. Only MATZ, not ATZ.

[Duchess_Driver]

Quote:
It's class 'D' and therefore should be a 'Zone Transit' and F.I.S.

I think a Flight Information Service is only provided outside of controlled airspace (but I'm no expert).

Correct....I was implying a F.I.S. (or a R.I.S/R.A.S) for the section of uncontrolled airspace between Benson and the Brize CTR on this side and between Brize and Gloucester on the other.

The change in service being indicated when the controller says "Radar Control..." as you cross the line.

Yep, should have been more specific.

[Spitoon]

I'm not sure that I go along with the argument about only getting a FIS outside controlled airspace. Yes, you may well, even probably, will get put under radar service inside controlled airspce - but it's not a requirement. When I used to control class D airspace most of the GA traffic transited under a FIS without any problem.

Only if they were going somewhere where more positive control was necessary for some reason did they get put under radar, and whenever possible were then allowed to go on their merry way as desired - but I had a radar ID on the aircraft and could control accordingly. Of course, things will change in March - and no doubt it will be clearer for everyone.......

[IO540]

Interesting Spitoon... every time I have been in Class D in the UK it was always a radar control service the instant I entered it, and it was terminated the instant I left the Class D.

Abroad, it's different. One can fly across France, through Class G, E, D and the type of service is not even mentioned. One would assume it is an FIS but they say "N-XXXX radar contact" and then leave you alone except to give you radar contact info... a very nice laid back system. Transits of D are implicit, most of the time; you give them your route and they just say "N-XXXX proceed" and leave you alone for another half an hour.

In case not already mentioned, the airspace above the Brize Class D is Class G - uncontrolled!