British help British in Q.A

[Lulu qatar]

All of my Capt on 330 are telling me this days that there is British Inst who was demoted from training to normal capt but now again promoted to Inst B777 . Thay say he can fly 777 becaouse 777 cant do hard landing and 777 do not operate Kathmandu . They also say that that Inst was promoted to Inst against QCAA regulations but pushed by CT I.M and B.W
Am not sure it can be true as we all know QCAA is strict .

[A330 man]

This news is correct and true.
The instructor is placed on fast track 777 instructor.
Indeed he was demoted before; his file has 2 incidents already.

But I heard in addition to the right passport, he is liked by the higher management on the 9th floor because he is a "reporter" i.e. he reports others! You know how this attitude is encouraged in QA.

Meanwhile the 320 captains and instructors will keep flying it till the day they die or resign (whatever comes first).

Another fact: Morale in the flight Ops are at all times low!!!
:DI.M. and B.W, well done.

[Tintin]

So LULU you still here?? You are suppose to be gone!!!!

[NG_Kaptain]

What about Ho, is he coming back too?

[White Knight]

330man - moral and morale are VERY different things, another little querk of the English language...

[JungleJett]

like more on and moron??

[A330 man]

White knight, I appreciate the correction in spite of the smell of sarcasm here.
You have to understand and respect that most of us here are non English native speakers.


U moet begrijpen dat de meesten van ons niet inheemse sprekers zijn.
Vergeet de eenvoudige spellingsfouten zolang u de betekenis ..... begrijpt

Heb veilige vluchten
Als u begrijpt wat ik… schreef moet u James zijn.

Thank youJungleJett (http://www.pprune.org/members/113660-junglejett) for your defense, but I want to keep my answer classy and civilized.

Safe flights everyone.

[shneidertrophy]

History just repeats itself here in QA.

A bit of history chaps:

2000 --> Algerians helping Algerians (look at all the algerians with staffnr 2XX and more)
2001 --> British helping British ( Fleming helping his mates)
2002 --> Egyptians helping Egyptians (remember the Ismael brothers, now running Air Arabia)
2003 --> Qatari helping Qatari (The reign of Hassan and Hamad)
2004 --> Here come the Indians, helping each other, under the leadership of L.M.
2005 --> Indian supremacy continues, number of Indian pilots tripple
2006 --> The end is near, Too much foul play left a stain/many dead bodies behind in the closets!
2007 --> QR is a ship without captain, but mid 2007 the Brits are there again in the role they like the most: COLONISING places!
2008 --> The resurection of the British empire in Qatar Airways under the leadership of the comical duo Ian and Bill! The Nigels at their best!
2009 --> Only time can tell! But allready the number of Nigels is rising steeply! And not on the 320 slave fleet! Nono, on the B777 off course!

Will the Brits be able to brake the Indian record of abusing this company? Will they be able to reach higher levels of personal enrichment than their Indian Brethren? How long before the CEO will see through their play as well, kicking them out on the spot!

One sad record they have broken already: That one of plumetting flight ops morale to unknown depths on the shortest period of time possible!

At least the Indian Birdy Namnam management gave us all something to look foreward to (upgrades/transfers/payrise), the Nigels do not even bother doing that! On the contrary: Hotac quality goes down, pay goes down, no more transfers, upgrades big question mark!!!

I know the Nigels like sodomy, but I did not know they would do it so bluntly! even the vaseline has become a very rare commodity these days! They just DO it!

:mad:

[A320 Man]

You are completely correct;
But to be fair, I prefer the Indian management, at least we were not blocked on the 320 while the 330 and 777 are receiving DECs, they were clever enough to promote the 320 pilots and hire their men on the 320 assuring them to transfer on time.

I received many private messages form accepted pilots who are reluctant to join QA with the new transfer rules and tight regulations for fleet transfer. Most of them are not from the UK and they are offered 320 jobs...they are so scared to be stuck like us, so they are looking for a 330 CCQ or even 777. Otherwise they are looking for a company with better transfer option (that don't change over night)

Example of a received message:
I've been accepted on the 320 fleet but everyone speaks bad about it, but what scares me is the fleet upgrade; I'll be promoted to a bigger fleet someday? How long takes to be captain on the fleet?

[P.Clostermann]

I guess the truth hurts, doesnt'it?

Only problem is by posting these messages and sending this message to the outside world, we are shooting ourselves in the foot!

They WILL offer these guys a seat on the A330 or 777! Their only concern is to get the planes in the air!

Which in return means that the A320 people will be stuck on the A320, and the A330 people on the A330!

[smartpilot]

Well Gents

I have been trying for long to be only a cool bystander, but what the h..k

calling it British empire, I would call it British colony, but who to blame definitely not them, I would strongly blame the internal onlookers management, Did any of them stand up and said no:=, did any of them said unfair:= !!!

QA does not deserve to be such a laboratory, if 50% of the management guys would do and fight for their true believes with respect to the company benefits and disregarding personal fears, agenda and precautions, if they would think and act fair, if the local management pilots would take more positive attitude, I'm sure things would improve, and this cancer will vanish.:D

couple of questions, would love to find answers:
-How come a captain with serious attitude problem, so many reports by senior F/O is transfered to the 777!
-does IM knows anything in our airline, part A or people history to choose transfers or training people!

Again who to blame!
Goodbye seniority and loyalty

[A320 Man]

Dear Clostermann,

I think we have 2 goals to our posts:

1- To share information with other QA pilots, seeking the truth since our management is not sharing info or plans with us.

2- Inform our highest level of management of the damage going on from inside, hoping he will do something about it, if he realizes it is not a forum only for crying pilots, but for pilots who care to improve their working place.

About shooting ourselves in the foot:
our Flt. Ops. Managers ARE already hiring DECs on the 330/777 even before any posts to the outside word about tightening the fleet transfer.

Also the 330 /777 DECs don't stay long, you can check how many monthly resignations are submitted to S.S.

Let me say it this way:
330/777 life style is better than 320 in QA, but at the same time the 330/777 life style & crew treatment is bad when compared with EK, EY, Korean, Vietnam, China (commuting contract for the last 3).

320 life style could be better if the cycle of max. duty / min. rest stopped, which is eased in other airlines by offering commuting contracts.

[Smirnoff N21]

As mentioned before many heads will roll and the plans have been long time back worked out. Remember one thing Britons are brilliant politicians and very accustomed to be under reign of intrigue. No wonder, it's now a matter of who'll keep his seat not to fight for the mutual benefits. Once the commonwealth empire has been restored the stage of revising the package might be an agenda. Good luck.
Don't take it personally take it on the rocks!!!:ok:

[smartpilot]

Hay Man

you either missed or skipped the Shayeb Brothers

[tinki winki]

Qatari pilots WAKE UP its time to visit youre leaders and tell them whats going on in QA . It is youre country and if you dont do anything about it means you agree with it .
British people will in no time make QA BAQA and if you are not blond with blue eyes you will be put a side and watch big boys having fun .
We have 850 pilots and CEO decided to bring 2 moroons from UK to show us whats aviation like . Both B.W and I.M are low hours low experianced pilots with bad attitude and junior too all ,but since they are British let them step on oure back. Say NO to this mistreatment and do somthing about it .
We want A.J as CEO and H.B as GMFO and H.A as SVPNO
Good luck to Qatari pilots all oure hopes are with you .

[P.Clostermann]

Hold your horses Tinki winki.....


Not to sure about what you are saying there....:mad:

[shneidertrophy]

Correct, I forget another illustreous duo in my list!


2003-2006 --> M.Shayeb and his younger brother A.Shayeb! Sweet talkers talked there way into management (M did anyway), but once in they rapidly fell from their throne due to incompetence and politics!
M crashlanded an A320 in ALY after which he basically was kicked out! He is now flying an A330 in EY, on a very VERY low profile. The younger one managed to get a right to left seat upgrade (1 of the 7 EVER!) on A330, although his previous experience is almost neglectable!
Pakistani Americans deploying British tactics: Not a bright idea!

One left over from this era: the cardboard cups with plastic covers we all drink from every day. Check the manufacturer and guess who is a main shareholder overthere....

[smartpilot]

let me add how was A S accepted in QA.
younger brother M S had him in the 320 SIM in Dubai for 01h10min ALONE for practice for his acceptance ride, and guess what the SIM RIDE was payed by QA. well no problem since he came from 727 cargo with no glass cockpit experience:)

Now we have a 3rd Shayeb brother as I have heard on the 777, wont be surprised sooner or later to know that the 2 remaining Shayeb brothers would join their mid brother after taking all the advantage from QA.

Conclusion: lots of people really know how to abuses QA for their personal goals and they are 1st to leave.

NOTE: I know non of the 3 brothers, so not personal @ all just few facts from history

[Black Stain]

Every truthful negative post A320 Man is another brick laid on the path to destruction. Keep it up lads. They cannot stop what's coming.

Don't forget to smile as you pave.

[Lulu qatar]

If out of 100 Qatari pilots CEO cant find 2 with good management skills? That tell us a lot about what he think about locals.
B.W and I.M ETD 120 days but in 120 days a lot of damage can be done .:ugh:

[smartpilot]

Lulu Qatar

If what you said based on a solid info, remember that:
QA does not deserve to be such a laboratory
So hope what ever is coming would be step forward:ok:


is it true DCPT 320 going with B.W and I.M, rumor is around for a while now

[White Knight]

330man - I wasn't being sarcastic, just helpful... I know English isn't everyone's first language so I try and guide people to the correct words... In the case of 'moral' and 'morale' there is a big difference in meaning.......

And no I don't speak Dutch:ok:

[A330 man]

Thanks for clearing the point of mistaken sarcasm, I am happy to be corrected, as you saw I amended the word and gave you the credit

By the way, what I wrote in Dutch was the translation of what I wrote in English, so no offense at all there.

Have safe landings :ok:

[intaomri]

Just something I need an answer for:
1- when was the last time you guys on A330 recall handing/ taking over flights in KIX to/from an Indian crew.
2-How come KIX - DOH flights block time 11hr20min while flight time around 12 hrs.:rolleyes:
Thanks and safe flying.

[NoJoke]

Not just the KIX flights, but quite a few others too. Easy answer; we get paid by schedule block time. The only answer is too fly at a speed that will get you to destination on time, therefore sticking to the block time you are paid for. Don't divert (take extra fuel instead) because you will not get paid for the diversion flight time. It's simple, they play games, then so do we.

Most sensible Airlines build in sufficient block time to allow for delays in taxiing, wx avoidance etc. QA think they are smart with the 'on time departure performance' but PAX are really only interested in the arrival time. That's the time they told thier Husbands, Wives, taxi driver etc to pick them up. We leave 'on time' but then get there 30 minutes late because of badly planned block times. Re-arrange this well known phrase or saying; "Foot shoot the Airways themselves again in Qatar"

[loc22550]

And what About the liar MR P.M...when is his ETD..?
Roster as never been as bad and dangerous since he release his ACN (28 july 2008), regarding an improvmemnt of the system!!(excpecially CPT 320: a disaster!).

[P.Clostermann]

ETD for BW, IM and SD????

Does somebody knows more about this?

[knotaloud]

Wishful thinking? They appear to be dug in and word is PM knew how to cover his tracks in his previous employment? So perhaps he'll blame RP for next month's mess? After all, he couldn't get it out without his help despite the fact he doesn't work there anymore. And watch this space for more cronies joining, this time in safety! Word is that DR is to be overlooked for the boss position there by one of BW's cronies.

[shneidertrophy]

Hey, this could end up to be fun after all!

Just a little bit longer and we will see the Nigels throwing their cheese boards at each other in stead of at us!

History has shown whenever the Britons gained any power, they eventually self-destructed due to the evil-powers of greed and selfishness!

Unfortunatle by then it will be too late for QR and many of us!:hmm:

I hope RD will fight for his rights and if he would be by-passed, maybe it is time to air QR's dirty laundry than from the safety cover-up department!
I know he tried to do his best, but was many times over-ruled by the management asking him NOT to publish certain issues! The where too afraid someone else (i.e the CEO) might read their major **** ups!

[Haywood]

Dear All,

Seems a lot of you do have the right ideas but in my opinion use the wrong forum to make them public.
If you think the CEO does not know - why don't you send the hard, proveable facts in written to him (You do not have to mention your personal details). Still you could inform the pprune comunity about your activities and the maybe results.

It is easy to critisize from behind a cover. Go ahead show your talents and take over responsibility - at least that makes you a new target in pprune of those who critsize everything.

Little things can be done right away, i.e if you get one of those very special OFP's where the flight time is longer than the block time why do you accept them? Don't bring every thing down to payment or non-payment or bad people in management.

First clean your own house and than point a finger to other ones - means use the legal options you have to improve flight operations.

If you don't claim and exercise your given rights you should not be surprised if they will be stripped off you one by one. :{

[A320 Man]

Haywood,
I think the CEO is no. 1 reader of pprune, he is fully aware of what is going on.

I don't know if he writes here at all! but definitely reading all comments about QA.

I guess it is the main reason that make some pilots write here -hoping to draw his attention to problems within the house.

[smartpilot]

Haywood


your either a present management who seeks support and help, or previous management who seeks revenge.

in either cases GOOD LUCK.:p

[loc22550]

MR HAYWOOD., just for your info;

Let me remind you one of the first sentence i heard from Mr AAB during the first pilot meeting when i joined the company:

He said clearly:

"I don't Want anybody to come to my office to tell me what i have to do in this company...!"
So i understood that the CEO is not really open to any critics or remarks regarding "his" company.

[Haywood]

Sorry to dissapoint you: I am neither a present nor a former management member.

Keep posting your smart comments!

[Haywood]

Good to see some qualified posts.

If you are right about the CEO reading all the comments than he is ignorant and nothing will ever change for the better.

[A320 Man]

Haywood,
I think you just mentioned the exact reasons why this airline is not going forward.

[shneidertrophy]

Haywood,


congrats mate! It only took you 6 posts to figure out the key to QRs secret! Some people are in here many years and havent got a clue so far!

Can you see now why we have to use anonymous forums like this one to spread the message?

[A320 Man]

Tomuchwork, oh you got us so exposed, so I will admit that we are working for the best airline in the region.
EK and EY pilots are resigning by the hundreds, waiting to join QA, and we are trying to scare them off so we can climb the ladder of QA!!

But you missed an important point, to improve our position –in any airlines- we need many new joiners to push us forward, if we scare them off, we will just stagnate and work harder (if that is even possible).
I believe you got it wrong.

I guess it is the main reason that make some pilots write here -hoping to draw the CEO attention to the problems within the house.

To prove you wrong...I will stop writing here for few months, I will just observe and see how it will develop till I leave.

Good Bye.

[A330 man]

Hi 320 man,

Where are you?? Are you one of those who resigned lately from the 320??
Is it true that 2 resigning every month from the 320?

[loc22550]

And more to come..,numerous pilots on 320 have passed already interview somewhere else:mad: and now just waiting for the joining date in their new company before handling their resignation to Qr.

[A330 man]

So I guess some non type rated people will be needed on the 320 soon!

I wonder what will happen to the 320 pilots who will stay in QA? will they still be jumped over by new joiners???

[shneidertrophy]

Only ONE should resign from the A320 fleet: That useless chief pilot you guys have there! Whats his name: H.F. aka daggerboy!

He does not give a damn about that fleet and he is only there because he bent over for the CEO a couple of years ago.

Rumour has it that SS (CP A330) last week wrote a letter to QRs most hated person of the moment (P Mc N) saying that the rosters at the moment where illegal, put unnecessary stress on the crews, where designed without any form of crew consideration and most of all, that they where a huge SAFETY hazard!

He hereby emphaisised the apalling situation the A320 pilots find themselves in at the moment!

Imagine this: The CP A330 writing a letter to the manager rostering to defend the case of the A320 pilots, just because the A320 CP has his head so far up his ass that he does not even realise that, in case one of his airplanes has an incident these days, he IS the one responsible!

Ah YES: any new airplane rotation that is demanded by the commercial dept goes through rostering and is ALWAYS presented to the CP of the fleet in question for approval. It is one of the CPs tasks to say yes or no, based on pilot availilbility and his assesment. If he feels that the rotation is not feasible or that he does not have enough pilots to the job (which both is the case on A320 right now), he rejects the demand made by comm dept and they have to look for another solution!

The daggerlover unfortunately has not got a single clue what its all about so he just accepts any request made to his fleet! In any case, he only does long day flights and European layovers so why should HE care?

I just hope something happens soon so he can be put in JAIL!

Thanks GOD I am on a different fleet these days! I suffered enough with this person in the past!

Godspeed to all A320 drivers! You will need it in the future as your fleet is leeking pilots at a high rate!

[Black Stain]

True words Shneidertrophy, but why would the Catamite King replace his most loyal Chamber Boy? What will happen will happen, just try to make the best of it for yourself, because you can't stop what's coming.

[shneidertrophy]

Very true Black Stain.

I can only try to prevent it from happening on an airplaine under my command I guess!

I have to count on the professionalism of all you guys outhere when me or my family are flying as pax! We have to count on eachother for that!

I just hope I can do that! Count on ~the others~!

[AirbusMaster]

I visited the 320 CP to complain about the high fatigue level produced by the horrible roster.


Do you know what did he say?? "This is the nature of the 320 operations; we have to live with it, we are also short of captains"! REALLY??

If that is so, why are you blocking the 320 pilots while hiring direct
entry on the 330/777?? why don't you hire some of those UK NTR captains on the 320??

Indeed S.S. has a vision and the will to say NO when it comes to safety, I feel sorry for H.F. I wouldn't be able to sleep well at night knowing how my pilots look down at me!!

[smartpilot]

Did anybody expected more from H F!!!!

Served the company for 8 years never been considered or selected or even recommended to be a trainer then suddenly was chosen for the CP position for a main fleet like the 320, and off-course pushed into the training with expedited TRE, I would love to see him doing a real training flights like S/O touch and gos on the 320, or S/O early actual landings not just in the box pushing buttons and picking on others mistakes.

S S & H M are the last hopes in this managements.
by the way where is A J! busy or not interested!

[Ashamasha]

for the history lesson:)

[archenergy]

I happen to know of a British captain who has been offered DEC on the A320, he's a line trainer too. Whether or not he will join and help with numbers and perhaps lessen your apparent fatigue remains to be discovered. After reading your posts though I doubt he will be motivated to accept the offer.

[smartpilot]

He will join and will be very motivated, also will get a TRE on the 320 within a time record disregarding the part A or QCAA and most important stepping on all the 320 poor non B pilots as far as IM & BW are here, and a good excuse is customized for him already since the 320 is short of captains and TREs

[A330 man]

archenergy (http://www.pprune.org/members/283640-archenergy) , Don't worry about this UK captain, he will not be offered a 320 position, he will join DEC on the 330 like IM and BW.

When you say he is hesitant to accept the 320 it means one thing: He has other options..

That is exactly what we are talking about here when we say IM and BW are creating a mess in the flt ops.
Such a situation would not arise if the seniority is respected, and the flow goes from the 320 to the wide body to avoid creating such a bottle neck on the 320 fleet.

320 captains are flying about 90- 95 flying hours per month, they are short of about 20 captains!

My question is:

Why hire DECs Non Type Rated on the 330 and 777? not on the 320? and what's the future plan for the 320 drivers?? (beside encouraging resignations?)

[skya320]

Totally agreed with both of you "smartpilot" and "A 330 Man":D:D

[loc22550]

"Why hired non rated guys on 330§777 and not on 320....?"

Well do you honestly think that QR has that much option?
Imagine a non rated guy coming here for interview and telling QR ," well i will only join QR if you offer me 330 or 777 rating...."
What do you think QR will answer....??
I think a lot of guys simply don´t want to come here to fly 320,it´s not worth for a lot of them..(except the "desperated " one..).
That´s the problem we are facing now i think..

[smartpilot]

LOC

It happened couple of times , guys denied the A300 & A320 job offer so next day got revised 330 offer.

and guess what even many 320 rated pilots, got the offer on the 330 even without asking, and good reason as per I.T the former recruitment manager was to bond them and keep them for a while.:D

[P.Clostermann]

There is a real simple solution to it....

Pay the 320 fleet based on duty time and give them a clear career perspective! Nobody should be stuck on that doomed fleet for anything longer than 2 years!

But hey, that probaly would be to logical!

[viewpoint]

HI There:
Looks like everybody forgot the poors F/O waiting for more than 8 months for the upgrade, , you will find more than 20 new potential capts, with all the necesary expirience that the company need to operate the 320, weell adapted to the country, Flight ops, management, eviroment.
So way they still waiting if the need is there????

[smartpilot]

Good point Mr viewpoint

[P.Clostermann]

Straight from the horses mouth(?:}?):

Interviews will happen again in Jan 2009

Upgrade training will continue in feb, once the previous group has finished.

Rate will be around 2/month and so far only on A320.


Thats the latest I have heard. Only time will tell.


Last week a rather expanded group of QR A320 pilots did the assesment at EY. 1/3 failed!!!!!!!So QR might not have a shortage of pilots, they will just have a shortage of capable pilots!

[AirbusMaster]

Clostermann, when you say expanded group of QR A320 pilots did the assessment at EY. 1/3 failed it still means that 2/3 passed.

When the 320 fleet is about 20 captains short, you do the math to see that when 1/3 fails it means trouble ahead!!

Of course your valid point of losing the good pilots should worry all of us here, but again it looks like a plan to push away all the good pilots and hire friends and ex-colleagues of IM and BW!

[smartpilot]

AB Master

You are 100% correct, this is the short term plan of IM & BW.


DOES ANY ONE KNOWS WHY THE (QR RECRUITMENT STOP) THREAD IS MOVED!!!!!

[NoJoke]

I think that if most (or a lot of) the QA pilots that apply to Ethihad fail the interveiw means only one thing. Look at your left or right seat, are they capable? Good luck. QA.

[NoJoke]

As you are an expert on hating the British; do you have any better ideas? Also do you hate your wife, kids, dogs, .... people that are not the same colour? Those that seem to have advantages? The British do not look after each other in aviation; perhaps the ground staff? Go home and look. Kiss the maid and be happy.

F-O

NJ

[Two Dogs....]

Stop whining and get back to work lazy swine, all things Goat are about to change. CP and CPT A320 are about to be axed and I want either job. Watch out! No more nice dog neither. You're here to work and sweat under the full moon you will. The chief is right, pilots are cheap, Nigel has many stiff friends :{

But dont worry, I know how to fix the Nigels. If we all pull together, we can rip the rod from their robot ass and beat them with it :ooh:

[NoJoke]

And your suggestion is?

[AirbusMaster]

FYI half of my friends are from the UK,but when we are at the pub they also cretisize the unfiar policies of BW and IM.
When the new British team come in taking everything for themselves there must be something wrong.

Do you need examples?
1- They are 320 pilots who refuse to help the shortage on the 320 and jump on the 330 asap.
2- They got what they want…but they banned the 320 pilots from moving up like them!!!
3- They want to change the license requirement to be a trainer in QA to be for the JAR compliant pilots only!! In other words…keep the non-Europeans out of training!
4- Hold the planned salary increase last July (CEO initially approved it to attract more pilots) claiming that markets are going down and pilots will be available everywhere, but suddenly we are hiring most of UK XL airlines pilots (on 777) because we are short of pilots! Meanwhile they are both collecting a big fat checque (more than A.J. who is thier boss-on paper at least)
5-Ingoring the seniority on the airline, causing pilots to shop elsewhere (it looks like a plan to replace the current pilots by our ex-colleagues rather than add numbers to the force.
The list goes on.

Do you still wonder why they are hated around here? I guess you have to review most of the comments in this thread and other threads to realize it is a common feeling against 2 managers who managed to unite pilots against them in a very short time!! Read the comments of loc2550,smartpilot,shneidertrophy,a320man,a330man,p.closterm ann,luluqatar,skya320 and others.
How come these 2 managers got a thread named after them? Check : http://www.pprune.org/middle-east/348272-b-w-i-m-reducing-pilots-income-qr.html (http://www.pprune.org/middle-east/348272-b-w-i-m-reducing-pilots-income-qr.html)

To sum up, let me say that I like UK people, but I hate unfair managers even if they are from Mars!

I agree with you when you said ground staff help each other, that happens but they are not our bosses, they don't tamper with the seniority and prevent us from fleet transfer while get it to themselves and their friends under the name of "better standard".
The British do not look after each other in aviation;
I apologize, I could not hold my laugh.

[A330 man]

Well said AirbusMaster, I totally agree with your points mentioned above.

Smartpilot, it shows that you are not on the 320 as loc said, but let me add that you must be lucky enough to be out of the training department also.

People in training get stuck on their types, they see everyone else pass them to newer/better equipments with better life style along their career.

Example: I met yesterday a 320 instructor, he almost suffered a heart attack!!!
After four years on the 320 they have released him to the 330, but suddenly his roster was amended to show TBN instead!! no one called him, he doesn't know what is going on, he was physically talking to himself regretting that he did not resign the training earlier, he could have been on the 340 or 777 now. I believe he did submit a resignation from training yesterday.

I comforted him by explaining that he will enjoy his time as a line captain on the next type and he made a mistake when he stayed all these years in training, he should have enjoyed flying better types to better destination like all the others.
Especially now training will only let the 320 instructors stay forever on the 320 while flying minimum hours on the 330 just to keep it current!

People who stay in training department always regrets it later, even when there is a written policy, it changes overnight effective yesterday, so you cannot predict your future, so learn the lesson from IM and BW, grab what you can while you can!!

[smartpilot]

AB Master, well Done and no single doubt in a single word you have said.

A330 Man, I feel very sorry for your 320 buddy, I was offered training on the 320 but I assumed i had a vision that this would be a long term relationship with the fleet, also wont be fun to work with the current training department management whether CPT or 320 DCPT.
Last but not least, in old days would be an achievement becoming instructor and means something but now a days people hardly walk by them self are instructors

[skya320]

AirbusMaster Well done!! :ok::ok:

[NoJoke]

Thank you. At least you admit you have British friends and as such must realise WE also disagree with the stupid, immoral and underhand aspects of the current 'British' management. I have worked for a number of Companies and have never seen such inept individuals.

My point is this; stop the racist remarks and concentrate on the real problem. The individuals concerned!

[parabellum]

Racist is the most over used and abused word in the English language yet it is the non-English who use it the most and get very upset if they are ever accused of racism, after all, it is the White Man's burden, right?

Never come across so much racist rubbish in all my life as I see on this thread, grovel in it, revel in it, wallow in it if that makes you feel good but better still, have a good look at yourselves.

[Count Bawbag]

Are there any jobs left on the 777 or have they all been snapped up by the XL droves. I got my application in but not heard anything from Q but friends have told me all the XL lot have been snapped up within hours on account of the CP of XL being mates with the CP of Qatar!

[AirbusMaster]

NoJoke, I am glad that we cleared it up, when I say the "British management" I only refer to the new managers without the need to spell out the names, I have no intention whatsoever to insult any specific nationality/race/faith…etc.

You share the same view against those inept individuals, so we have a mutual understanding.
From now on I will call them something else rather than the Brits…can you help me find a proper name …Can anyone suggest a non racist name?

Laurel and Hardy? Abbott and Castillo? The Belushi Brothers? Help me out here fellas.

[JungleJett]

the good fellas.....oh no wait, it refers to the movie of the same name hence the mafia......some might take it as british mafia....so never mind good fellas no good name

[JungleJett]

how about Cheech and Chong?

[JCUERVO]

Beavis and Butt-Head

[A320 Man]

What about one of the next:

Batman & Robin
A team against the fairness!

Doctor Jekyll & Mr. Hyde
They say stuff and do the opposite.

Harvard & Yale
Both British!

King & Kong
Destroying everything standing on the way.

Marks & Spencer
The best tailors for Part A, amended to fit their size!

Mars & Jupiter
Hi Hi in the sky, unreachable by the public, you hear about them but never saw them close!

Peek & Boo
Scaring all the pilots with their decisions.

Salt & Pepper
Useful, but not when applied to an open wound.

Slice & Dice
They are slicing and dicing the 320 pilots in favor of the new joiners.

Starsky & Hutch
Cowboy style operations.

Ying & Yang
The 2 complete each other to perform a perfect circle.

Zig & Zag
They are not straight at all.

[Ronaldo 330]

James L . got promoted on 777 what a shame its only becaouse he is British or what ?
B.W took mine OFF day alowance without asking anyone .
P.M roster me like if am slave
I.M didnt do anything except enjoj Bali ....

[bushbolox]

Edited as appropiate result achieved:ok::}

[A320 Man]

Bushbolox

Your language/attitude can be answered with 2 simple questions:

1-How would you feel if your XL airlines would hire new joiners over your head to fly the new 777 (if you had it) while you are watching? without respect for any kind of siniority?

2-If you were a first officer with QA airways for 6 years plus 2 years as 320captain, With excellent training history from Airbus and QA, should this be enough credential for you as individual to be promoted to the next type? or deserve to be blocked and watch people who think they are better than anyone else get the better types?

Please stop feeling like supermen, there are thoushands of great pilots all over the world who never flew in the UK.

P.S. one of our best trainers in QA is Croation without JAR license!!

Bushbolox, please ask yourself the same question below:

Have you ever considered that you might not be as good as you think.

[NoJoke]

ABM I am glad to see we are both on the same side. :ok: Bushibolox - I must agree with most of your points; However I would start piling up the sandbags!! ;)

[smartpilot]

Mr Captain bushbolox

kindly hold your horses, no one is against XL highly qualified drivers, they are more welcomed to join QA than FlyDubai, but PART(A) to be respected, seniority to be respected, Logic to be followed, we still lucky in the 3rd world to still have jobs to accommodate the 1st world pilots, and we still have big tolerance and patience to be insulted from time to time being from the 3rd world with the dark skin, however now a days, I believe we should be called the 1st world since we have the job opportunity, fair life style and decent living.

@ the end if you read carefully most of the threads, we are not attacking nationalities, we are attacking the post and power abuse, not cause you are X high standard company as per your say it means you come and step on every body's nick, join, adapt and get familiar with the 3rd world then get upgraded, DO NOT USE YOUR EXPERIENCE AND FRIENDSHIP TO OVER RIDE & DESTROY ALL LAWS.


one more thing, most of us here even criticism some of our 3rd world drivers cause they deserve it.
hope that helped with a penny clarifying anything

[viewpoint]

Hi fellas:
don't get tired with the British , save energy for the Italians, they are also coming as direct entry TRE, with alot of experience, licenses, hours, lets eat fish ans chips and pasta together like brothers jejejeje.

[A330 man]

Smartpilot, that was a smart answer, I liked this part:

we're lucky in the 3rd world to still have jobs to accommodate the 1st world pilots, and we still have big tolerance and patience to be insulted from time to time

[Black Stain]

The real Goat World is as Thylakoid stated.

A new Goat manager is appointed, he learns on day one that his dream job is actually very insecure. He will do as is told and alone will shoulder the blame for all previous incompetence when it happens, and surely it will, fingers crossed, after he is dismissed. All he can hope to achieve is short term personal profit and try to build long term favor amongst his compatriots whom he may have to work with again some day.

The only Goat manager without this hang-up is SSS. He doesn't need the money, does not accept the stress, does not fear dismissal and serves honestly because he loves flying. The chief seems to respect someone that cannot be intimidated? Is this not a great manager?

Goat Airways is structurally unsound at the top, always has been, always will, until the chief is replaced with someone other than a megalomaniac. Until that day most managers will either bend over with a thankyou, or take as much as possible, or both at the same time. Arab, Brittish, Yank, OZ, Malay, African..... all the same.

[Two Dogs....]

Yeah but which group of assholes smells the worst? The rod of self-rightousness has been up there so long rot has set in. Read Bollocks Bush....

[vivace]

The tirade is always from the same names so loses a lot of its credibility. Lets be clear about this,the complaining against BW and IM coming here taking an immediate senior position is the same as the normal DEC scenario, QR always operates in this way half of you came straight in and took DEC jobs..its the same tactic just on a larger scale. Instead of straight in as senior management,guys came in straight in as captain...same. I was one,so not complaining just making the comparison. So dont be surprised,you cant complain about management coming straight in,yet accept capt's(DECs) coming straight in...these guys upset the line capts,the DECs upset the FOs....same system...so quit the surprised complaining.

The majority of QR pilots ae from the 3rd world,unacceptable to a lot of airlines...Latinos, Algerians etc...great guys but just not accepted as easily to the other companies in the area,and the UK/JAR management are always going to be in demand worldwide, any job offer will take a UK licensed guy over any one else, its just history...why for decades have the majors sent cadets to the UK...believe me I am JAR licensed but not UK and am now on contracts and the agencies admit any Uk JAR license takes preference.With the larger nos of UK guys on the market ive noticed the competition for good contracts increase,more brits taking the slots. So just accept it, still plenty of jobs for all of us,but they are still regarded as elite unfortunately. Feel sorry for the QR FOs I flew with, most I flew with had only the QR license current and unable to go elsewhere, the company has them by the b**lls with the large number of pilots on the market and DEC's.

[Tintin]

Vivace, nobody complain about BW and IM going straight over them to management position!!!! They /we are pissed because they come and F*&K everybody. While they and there friends enjoy the hollidays.

Dont get me wrong but TRUE leaders lead by example.

They do not reject a new pay package for the pilot while taken houndreds of thousands per month for themself.

They do not downgrade the working conditions of others while upgrading theirs.

In my book they are clowns thats it. They come, do there show take the max cash they can and go....

[smartpilot]

Attention all QR drivers:


All of you are totally unqualified and losers, since the most qualified drivers in the world are jobless now this give them the right and pleasure to come screw all of you not just join and be thankful having a job, so you have only one choice shut up and watch, and appreciate that IM= (INDEED MESS) giving you the chance to stay in the company.


hope you liked this BUSHBOLOX & VIVACE

[icarus sun]

What gets me is the utter stupidity of management. They hire guys who only know how to fail. I suppose they are no threat to present managers. We see it all through the mideast airlines. They last a year or so and then vanish,having done lots of harm. Why cant owners hire people from good well run companies? Thats what emirates did and reaped the results. Just because someone is on the market does not make them great. Hiring mangement losers from failed companies only increases the risk. Lots of ex BA coming on market, do you think they they let go of the best? Expect to see more losers in mid east companies in future. Most managers of failed companies only know how to fail,they do not learn.:ugh:

[Capt Krunch]

My money is in the bank on time all the time and has been that way for more than 3/4 of a decade now.. in fact i can only remember 2 times went I got paid a couple days late and that was due to a in house blunder which was corrected.
so for the time being I will just grin and bare it, until such a time as the pilot market flood gates open once again and I'll be gone in a flash like the rest..

Complaining about the infinite stupidity of our newly appointed management will only prove to shorten my life anyway.. :mad: them and that big white proverbial stallion they rode in on.



Posioned by Compromise
Krunch

[A330 man]

A.J. and the rest of QA ops management are not happy with the poor job of I.M. and B.W. but currently B.W. is denying any knowledge of the "poor management decisions" previously taken.

B.W. says: I did not know about these decisions, or I did not sign anything like that.

Result: all the blame falls on the head of I.M. so he might be removed ALONE form the post.

Can anyone shed more light on this?

[smartpilot]

Looks like BW is smart enough to scarifies INEED MESS to last in his seat, and had a vision and plan since none of the dumb memos or decision were signed by him:D:D, but he wont be able to denny awareness of part (A) revisions regarding the bond and fleet transfers:rolleyes:

[3bthan]

A300 man confirmed that IM is in his last days.
Thanks A300 man for the good news, hope we see much better news!!!!!!!!

[A330 man]

Great news, 3bthan and 300 man

We are counting down the days for IM to leave. I believe we never had such a mess and destruction in the flight ops and training department for a long time, hope the next manager will be able to reverse the damage as soon as possible, so QA will attract pilots who want to join and stay rather than come in to hunt type ratings and jump ship.

What about BW?

[Tintin]

BW? If he is smart he will start walking out by himself!!!

[A300Man]

Er, I don't think I confirmed anything gents. Is that a typo in your post, 3bthan? No worries.

I hope things get better for everyone around here and it's not just aviation that is affected by the current economic climate. In fact, due to the lack of other logical choices at the moment, it is probably wise to follow Captain Krunch's lead and just sit tight and say nothing for a while.............see what happens. Now moreso than ever, the saying "biting the hand that feeds" springs to mind.

A300Man

[NoJoke]

I.M. might being leaving on a Jet plane, but only to Bali again. Last I heard he is on an A330 TRE course, not a sign that he is on his way out. :*

[fatiguedpilot]

now that would not surprise me in the slightest.

[Capt Krunch]

Qatar Airways method of advancement:
Get yourself in a position for self serving.. and then help yourself, feast and take all you can while you can, and lets not forget to use the tools of nepotism to bring in all those friends and family members who have less experience then that of others, and give them all positions of higher being, wealth and prosperity.. do it quick old man because you won't last long here, but rest assured your wrath and devastation will stay around until the end of my time here.

I’m sure anyone who has been around here long enough would already realize, this is the Qatar Airways way. Seen it time and time again.

I.M and B.W. way of doing things is nothing new to QA. the pile smells the same, it just looks a bit different.:yuk:


Poisoned By Compromise
Krunch

[fatiguedpilot]

well what do we all really expect. all the managers know they have a max of 2 years before they start the job, especially if they read pprune, re all the changes in management.
this only ever brings one conclusion to the people that get the jobs, so what do they do, well try to save money from there budgets, try to get short term fixes, so that they get there bonuses, make hay whilst the sun shines, get a pay off when they are fired, go home and get a proper job but with a nice fat pension earned in a fraction of the time.
if the :mad: at the top really new how to manage a business he would pick guys that knew there profession, where managerially qualified and allow these people to do the best job they could with no time limit, unless there was a real cock up.
look at the legacy carriers, it takes time, a whole lot of cash, and in the end recognizing what is important to your business, THE STAFF.:ugh:
this carrier has the money but will never in a million years be the business it could be all cause of 1 mans vision on how to enslave the masses, ER BREAKING NEWS PAL IT DOESN'T WORK.

Honestly in the end i don't blame the guys brought in, cause they know what they have to do in a short period of time. could you honestly say if any of you guys were put in the same boat, would you not do the same. there are exceptions yes, and they have been noted, but most are in the same position as the guys we are all moaning about.

RANT over safe flying

[knotaloud]

I understand what you're saying, fatiqued-one. However, just what has IM done? I can't think of one thing? Maybe I'm missing something here? Anyway, he is gone according to the 'word'.

And as for the other one, I would guess he's on borrowed time but will do more damage before he's tossed out. That's the unfortunate thing.

What a good company this would be with a small amount of good management and some people willing to put the effort in.

Downroute dreaming..............................

[Capt Krunch]

Ammen to that Knotaloud:D

But, it's just a dream and Knotaloud was suddenly awaken by the sound of a man yelling the call for "come to pray" at the mosque, over a microphone speaker system that was surely bought from a 1960's Woodstock auction sale.

Poisoned by Compromise
Krunch

[smartpilot]

Cap Krunch

Please refrain using Religion emulation, if you could edit your last post would be appreciated

[Black Stain]

Hey why don't you be a smart pilot and let your god take care of himself today. Surely, if he is real, he is strong enough to smite Captain Crunch!! I find it bewildering that followers of ALL religions are so paranoid, over sensitive and defensive of dieties supposedly omnipotent.

And are you suggesting that religion is not a significant issue for residents of the middle-east?

............................................................ ............................................

An appropriate response to a stupid post by sp

[smartpilot]

I appreciate any comments to be civilized and polite like mine, this place is neither to discus political nor religious matters, my comment was mere social out of respect to the country we live in.

[A330 man]

Smartpilot, I like your mature and respectful reply. I wish we all take that line while in the "Mature Pilots" forums.
I don't think Capt crunch meant any harm with his post, it's just a personal expression to tell him "wake up".


No need to judge anyone or call each other by nasty names.

Black Satin, I think knotaloud could answer for himself.
Smartpilot, thanks for considering the country you live in.
BlackSatin, thank you in advance for editing any insulting words.

Have safe landings and a peaceful life.

[Capt Krunch]

This is the other obvious problem in this airline.. nearly No One knows how to take a joke.. some are worse than others of course.

No Mr smartP I will not retract my JOKE.
to clarify, Mr SmartP.. the joke was about wakeing Knotaloud from he's dream.. (and what a dream it was:D).. with the noisy feed back and reverberation of an outdoor loud speaker system that resembles something from a woodstock concert.
( Woodstock was a music festival, billed as An Aquarian Exposition, held at Max Yasgur's 600 acre (2.4 km²; 240 ha) dairy farm in the rural town of Bethel, New York from August 15 to August 18, 1969.)

if everyone had a church bell ringing in their back yard and on every corner I would have surely made a comment that would have included reference to Quasimodo the hunchback of Notre Dame.
( The Hunchback of Notre Dame (French: Notre-Dame de Paris) is an 1831 French novel written by Victor Hugo. It is set in 1482 in Paris, in and around the cathedral of Notre Dame de Paris. The book tells the story of a poor Gypsy girl (La Esmeralda) and a misshapen bell-ringer (Quasimodo) who was raised by the archdeacon.)

so much for the joke..
some peoples kids you just can't take out I guess.


Poisoned by Compromise
Krunch

[smartpilot]

Capt Krunch

It did not appear as a joke for me @ the beginning, but after you clarified it, can't stop laughing :O:O:O

so case is dismissed, back to the main concern.

Black Stain you are honoring my ignore list, no further comment

[knotaloud]

Thanks Crunch,

Woke up in time to make sign on but it was the hotel operator who did it. I'm so used to the local 'music' it wouldn't have worked anyway! And I was "dreaming the impossible dream" anyway. Good management.....indeed?

You're right about some people on prune with no sense of humour. After all, they binned Mr Ho, didn't they?

[A320 Man]

Gentlemen, back to the subject of this forum…I will answer knotaloud's question in post # 102.
just what has IM done? I can't think of one thing? Maybe I'm missing something here?

I will quote Airbus Master postas an answer:
When the new British team come in taking everything for themselves there must be something wrong.

Do you need examples?
1- They are 320 pilots who refuse to help the shortage on the 320 and jump on the 330 asap.
2- They got what they want…but they banned the 320 pilots from moving up like them!!!
3- They want to change the license requirement to be a trainer in QA to be for the JAR compliant pilots only!! In other words…keep the non-Europeans out of training!
4- Held the planned salary increase last July (CEO initially approved it to attract more pilots) claiming that markets are going down and pilots will be available everywhere, but suddenly we are hiring most of UK XL airlines pilots (on 777) because we are short of pilots! Meanwhile they are both collecting a big fat cheque (more than A.J. who is their boss-on paper at least)
5-Ingoring the seniority on the airline, causing pilots to shop elsewhere (it looks like a plan to replace the current pilots by our ex-colleagues rather than add numbers to the force.
The list goes on.

Do you still wonder why they are hated around here? I guess you have to review most of the comments in this thread and other threads to realize it is a common feeling against 2 managers who managed to unite pilots against them in a very short time!! Read the comments of loc2550,smartpilot,shneidertrophy,a320man,a330man, p.clostermann,luluqatar,skya320 and others.
How come these 2 managers got a thread named after them? Check : http://www.pprune.org/middle-east/348272-b-w-i-m-reducing-pilots-income-qr.html

Let me add: new disastrous rostering system.
Cancelling the Day off allowance during a layover, so you may get your days off during a long layover (away from home and family) to keep working for 2 weeks in a row.

Are these enough disasters in 11 months work ...or not?

[bushbolox]

Are you guys still here moaning about the British coming over and taking your jobs and ravaging your women with their jumped up (UK)JAR licences.

What a liberty, how dare they. It was much more effective as an airline with Indians running it at Bangalore bank clerk speed. (an official unit of measurment using the amount of paper shuffled in 1 day divided by the total work achieved in a day plus the number of head wobbles and false assurances an hour. Expressed forthwith as 1 Bangle.
1 bangle being equal to the square root of **** all.)

EG " hello Bimji, how much work have you done today on the rosters?"
" Oh dear me Pankash I am so exhausted i have achieved 6 bangles
I have shuffled until i can shuffle no more"
" Well done Bimji but dont wear yourself out there is plenty of time to
finish the rosters for December, its only the 5th of December now"
" Thank you for your concern Pankash. Anyway I must go and put
oil on my neck, I have a hard days head wobbling tomorrow"

Its about time you learned that eventually the British will always manage, the Germans do the rosters and the Swiss run the schedule.

It has always been so.Relax and enjoy:ok:

[cheekymonkey75]

but suddenly we are hiring most of UK XL airlines pilots (on 777) because we are short of pilots!

Erm A320 Man where do you get your info? havent seen any XL pilots at all on B777 yet all ones in training are from Futura(that was a Spanish Airline!) and from Zoom (was UK), Know of one ex XL guy who has takeen command on A320. :ok:

Please try be a bit more accurate befor you bash all the brits we are not all bad! Promise! :}

[A320 Man]

The line you copied from my post was posted initially by AirbusMaster "note the blue background"

But let me ask you this, Does it really make a difference if the new Non Type Rated pilots are from ZOOM UK or XL UK or FUTURA Spain?

The fact is the new management hired them without any consideration to the QA 320 pilots who are on that type for years.

Another fact: around 70 applications from XL pilots were processed personally by Capt. IM then handed to Capt. BW for interview arrangement, so maybe your information is not that accurate.

Please don't take my comments as anti- British.
When you said: we are not all bad! Promise! I already know that, but what these 2 managers are doing is a disgrace –not only for the British- but for any manager in the industry.

[cheekymonkey75]

A320 Man

Understand and take your point about A320 guys, however the guys who have joined on B777 from UK all have considerable B767,757 and B737NG experience on all types. Also doesn't help that there are not many jobs in Europe at the moment for boeing rated guys.

Don't worry us brits are all thick skinned! have to be when our football, rugby and cricket teams are so bad! :ok:

[Wango Z Tango]

Well I for one have no problem with the guys from XL or Zoom with 767/757 experience flooding the place, after all they do need a job and have the medium haul Boeing experience. But I start to draw the line when the company starts hiring 737 types ( or less) as DEC, they did the same on the 330 at a few years ago and we seen and heard of all kinds of problems with regards to the difference in the type of flying. from narrow body light twin to heavy widebody long range ETOPs aircraft.. not smart and not safe... not to mention the eye to wheel high problems.. In the past we have had pilots of light twins who never left their home patch. to come and work here, some of which knew nothing of medium to long haul operations and some who have never experienced.. snow.. or monsoons.,. depending on where their patch was...
well i'm sure some of the light twin pilots may soon have a rebuttle, but the simple fact remains.. widebody long range experience differs from that of a light twin hop and pop type of flying.

in the meanwhile.. UK jocks, welcome to the sandtrap.. enjoy.. sorry for your timing with the newly appointed I.M. and B.W. no hard feelings from my side, after all, i'm glad i'm not flying the usual 90 to 100hrs per month with days off down route.. we need pilots.. for the time being you are it.

Happiness is V2
WzT

[shneidertrophy]

757/767 AND 737NG experience!!!!!

All very well boys but it still is all non type rated experience. Maybe the 767 guys could be considered for their long haul experience but all the rest for me should be put on the A320!

So what they have flown Boeing before? A 757 or 737NG does not have much in common with a new 777!

Besides that, on A320 we as well have many people with many years in the company AND with significant widebody/long haul experience!

No matter what you say, the whole DEC business on 777 is a disgrace and a slap in the face of many loyal QR pilots on both 320 and 330 fleets!

And as a DEC777 without previous experience you should be very well aware of this! No matter how you turn it around, you took somebody elses place and some people will not like you for that reason!

I know, its not your fault and a certain amount of blame should be put with the company, but at least you should be aware of the current atmosphere here!

By the way, they are looking for a deputy chief on 777. Anyone interested?

[Emma Gemma]

I can't believe that you are already beginning to dislike certain characters because they are recruited to a certain fleet which is determined by the management! Highly unprofessional and a rather childish behaviour!

[Capt Krunch]

well everyone is intiled to their own opinion of course, but I for one also realize, many years ago I was also hired on as a DEC in the early stages of the DEC trend here, since then there have been hundreds after me, so what is the difference my i ask.. is it the lure of that Boeing? not a very good fleet at this stage i might add. you want it so bad shneidertrophy there was a ACN a few months ago stating you can request for a fleet change. you should do so.
I can't help think, if you were indeed on the 777 fleet and they hired some DEC 320 or 330 pilots you would not be as loud about it.

meantime, everyone needs a job and this less than desirable airline needs pilots.. so I dont see the problem. Qatar Airlines is still flying, still finding new destinations, still buying new machines to dump fosil fuel on the planet and above all still paying me... sorry, i still but I dont see the problem.

Poisoned by Compromise
Krunch

[shneidertrophy]

You dont see the problem?:eek:

OK, here we go again!

777 is a new fleet and a desirable typerating. It will be the best fleet in the airline in a couple of years.

In most major airlines you will see a certain career planning, which allows you to move from,usually, a smaller fleet to the bigger fleets. This keeps people motivated and happy. They start doing the hard work on e.g. an A320 and after a few years get a reward by moving up.

We have many many pilots on A320 (and as well on A330) that came here years ago with the hope of flying a different airplane after a while. Especially on A320 many people joined after they actually received a promise of a bigger airplane/different lifestyle after some years.
A320 lifestyle is HELL, but survivable if you have certain perspectives.

Untill 4 years ago, it was unthinkable one could join QR on the starfleet. When A320 started a DEC had to join on A300, when A330 started the DECs joined on A320 and when A340 started DECS where allowed on A330 with TR or on A320.
But the new fleets where kept for the pilots allready in this outfit as a form of motivation!

But now everything changed. People are frozen on their fleets while most DEC hiring happens on the brand new fleet in this airline, a fleet desired by many!

So YES, there is a problem Krunch! And a big one! Why would a newly hired DEC coming from a 737 get the privileges of flying the starship in this airline while a poor A320 captain who did his duty for 2 years on the slave fleet has to stay an undefined period longer there?
Let the new DECs fly the A320 and A330 for a while, let them suffer a couple of years before rewarding them!

Once more, DEC 777 with TR I see no problem with! We can all understand that! But like this no no NO.

And do not forget the general controversion of hiring DEC as well. What about the FOs who see their careers being blocked for a long time because of DEC hiring above them?

If you guys do not see the problem with these policies I would like to suggest you to think back a little in your past! Remember when you where an FO waiting for an upgrade? Remember when your current (previous) airline was still doing well and the 737 was the biggest airplane you had while you where flying the ATR or RJ? How would you have felt if DECs would have been allowed on the 737 than??

Stay loyal to your past!


Oh...you mentioned that you can request to change fleets..YEAH RIGHT! Have you tried that one yet? Myself I am on the good fleet but many of my friends did without a result!
Especially on a fleet like A320, short of 23 captains at the moment. Nobody will be allowed to go from there!

You must be very naive if you believe that ACN! Fleet transfers are done on company requirement, not on your demand!

[knotaloud]

Absolutely spot on schneider. By all means employ rated 777 pilots on the fleet but placing 737 etc on that fleet to the detriment of the 320 guys already here is nothing short of criminal!

We have some clowns here who think that a wheel is different to a control stick and that it takes some kind of magic to change from one to the other and this is their spurious argument for giving 737/757/767 DEC's a start over 320 pilots already employed. PLEASE!

[A330 man]

FlyingCroc,
They find them where IM and BW are coming from. Do you understand now their mentality?

[EGGW]

Guys this is a final warning

There is a lot of passion that goes with a lot of issues @ QA, but rants and insults have no place in the ME forum. You will earn lots more respect and put over your point of view better, if you stick to the facts and not throw personal insults.

This thread will be deleted if this continues.

EGGW

[Bus Junkie]

Also, their CAA ticket may allow them to calculate the circumference of the earth at a given latitude, but they still can't spell.
I'm from the UK but have lived in the US most of my life. All my flying has been conducted on the FAA ticket, even that done in the UK in 98. I left the UK when I was 8 and always wished I had stayed. But when I see the attitude of pofc and mirrorimage I'm even more embarrassed of the British than I am of the "ugly American".
Right now careers are awful. Jobs even worse. If you are lucky (or connected) enough to get a job there is no sense in denigrating others in order to pump up your weak self image.
Useful information helps. Snobbery does not.

(sure my spelling and grammar leave a lot to be desired, but I don't claim to be infallible)http://static.pprune.org/images/icons/laugh.gif

[A330 man]

peterowensfanclub (http://www.pprune.org/members/190353-peterowensfanclub) and mirrorimage (http://www.pprune.org/members/285450-mirrorimage), post no. 123 is for you, please follow the rules:


rants and insults have no place in the ME forum. You will earn lots more respect and put over your point of view better, if you stick to the facts and not throw personal insults.

[EGGW]

Had a major clearout of the obvious wind ups and replies to those wind ups. Please realise that some will come in and yank your chains/wind you up, the mods, me and 4HPoler will try our best to manage this. Try not to post after a few beers(if thats your thing).

I haven't got time to edit every post on this thread, as its too long.

Also realise that DEC's are a feature of this part of the world, doesn't make it right, but it happens at EK, EY,QA and others.

Play nice, we are watching

EGGW

[shneidertrophy]

EGGW,

you are right. DEC hiring is a typical thing of the middle east and most of us do not mind at all, as long as it is done following certain rules!

EK: DEC hiring is heavily restricted and only done when needed badly. Very high experience is demanded from DECS so they actually bring extra experience to the company. Type rating and lots of flying hours demanded!

EY: DEC hiring is stopped so the FOs get a fair chance for an upgrade. Only DEC still considered are A320 drivers.

GF: DEC hiring very controversial and on very low numbers.

QR: More DEC than FO where hired over the last 3 years. TR and non TR DEC accepted. Minimum experience demanded. DEC going straight on the major fleets, leaving the A320 heavilly understaffed. Reason being that nobody wants to join QR on A320 so they have to lure them with a big shiny machine! FO upgrades almost nil due to non existant trng capacity or FOs to take their seats.


I joined myself as a DEC in QR, but I joined on the A300 fleet. I did my slave duty there for more than 3 years after which I was given a seat on a bigger machine. So I paid my dues!!!!
And I still think this way is the only honest way to do it!

Start on the base fleets and do as little damage as possible to the upgrade process for the FOs in the company.!!

[NoJoke]

Shneidertrophy, I think you have given a good indication to everyone that this scandalous practice of riding roughshod over both Captains and First Officers alike has been in force for a longer time than the present British Management has been in tenure. As you said, "QR: More DEC than FO where hired over the last 3 years."

I will reiterate the points that I, and others, have made in previous posts. This is not a forum to bash Nationalities and if it is, it should be moved to the 'Jet blast' section. I have seen so many rude, ill-informed, childish and badly written posts here that it has made me cringe.

ShneiderT, I too have been a victim of the same system you mentioned over the last 4 years. Seeing people go in as DEC onto the 330 over my head, but that was under Indian, Irish, and Arabic rule at the time. Realise this - This is the nature of the beast.

Do you think that Iron Mildew or Bully Warden worry about these comments, especially after getting thier monthly cheque? Do you think you are affecting the choice of unemployed British pilots to come here? No my friends, all you are doing is embarrassing yourselves and squabbling IN PUBLIC.

I totally agree that the present middle Management has not got a clue about CRM, but the upper Management must be laughing thier little Nylon socks off at this debacle. Divide et impera! That should be the real name of this thread .......

[Black Stain]

upper Management must be laughing thier little Nylon socks off at this debacle. Divide et impera!

The Catamite King's mind is twisted evil and the Naughty Nigels are just another dancing puppet troup.

If you join that evil system you perpetuate that evil system. Never to be changed from within, but ultimately and thankfully you can't stop what's coming.

[Black Stain]

How insightful Propaganda, but you couldn't imagine just how deep the rabbit hole goes.

As a child the Catamite King was identified a megalomaniac, banished to the Sandpit to complete his evil training and then in 1997 handed the whip for an organization far beyond his level of competence.

[AirbusMaster]

It seems that I.M. was supported recently by a man called S.V.
(He runs an aviation consulting company out of the UK, is the private advisor to the CEO on most commercial and industrial decisions and who is the middleman between Airbus and QR).

S.V. could convince QA management to delay replacing I.M. with A.Q., allowing I.M. to stay as CPT.:confused:

All Pilots.....Brace, Brace, Brace……….

[P.Clostermann]

Smartpilot, maybe he changed and thus he deserves the benefit of the doubt.

So I deleted my post...

Whats the story now? Who is going and who is staying?

As far as I am concerned they should kick out BW as well. IM might not have done much, BW did a lot of damage!

[smartpilot]

P.Clostermann

Happy 2 see such mature opinion sharing, I've deleted my post as well.

for now looks like we must wait & see and hope for the best, also agree about your last part of last post.:ugh: Except IM part

[ramiyns]

This is what I heard lately, This guy is termaneted and transtion to the higher fleet is back to normal,from A320 to A330 to B777.
And A number of nonrated pilots that they were ready to join direct on B777 are on hold now until all the surplus pilots on A330 moved.The number around 40 pilots.
Also Qatar Airways is sending back 2 of the leased A330 this year.

Qatar Airways will for sure scale back the expantion for now or in the near future,then we will see cut down on our benfits or even income.

FLY SAFE and do not think about it.

[KRUGERFLAP]

I've just called his neighbour who lives in Ain Khalid Gate as well. And Idiot Milk is still there. No Packing for now.:=

[Capt Krunch]

well, as far as I know, IM is staying on, maintaining the position of TRE/TRI. but removed from his former management post. to be taken over by A.Q.

ramiyns:
those 330 you speak of have always been scheduled to leave, as they are the lease aircraft and no longer required to re-new their services ( not to mention the worst aircraft on the fleet).
it is true that there will be more pilots moving from the 330 to the 777 in the first quater of 2009 ( no one has an exact figure ) and as far as scaling back, well this is a rumor, as there is no word or evidence of that whatsoever.


Poisoned by Compromise
Krunch

[P.Clostermann]

A320 to A330 to B777?????

That sounds not very realistic, I am sorry to say so.

A320 to B777 is another possibility as far as I know.

I.M. still there, and still in his office ( at least today he was)

[Fubaliera]

Im shocked that nobody talks about direct entry Captains agains on the A320. One guy from UK(non typed rated) started today 10 more soon to come. Maybe this will get the A320 Captains moved up to something bigger and better.

[A320 Man]

If this happens, it is good news for the 320 pilots and it seems fair for everyone.

Maybe QA is going back to the right track in the fleet transfer policy, let's wait and see.

[bluesky dreamer]

Are all new hire non type-rated pilots going onto the a-320? Have you seen any non typed, non 757-767 guys go onto the 777?

[JungleJett]

What the hell are you talking about?????
It's fair??? Is it also fair to the F/Os waiting for upgrade?

[A330 man]

JJ, of course DEC on the 320 is fairer than on the 330 or 777 when not type rated.

No one said anything about stopping the command upgrade meanwhile, the 2 should go in parallel to cover the demand.

QA F/Os with the required hours should be selected for command, qualified captains will also be hired.

The problem is QA is not very attractive for type rated pilots, many non type rated captains join here just to get a better qualification, then our F/O's leave to get the command somewhere else forcing the company to delay the upgrades till hiring F/O's….. the cycle goes on, and I believe that is where the company should be looking to save big money.

[JungleJett]

I still don't understand how it can be "fairer"....Why don't we speed up upgrades since it's a faster and cheaper process than bringing a non-type rated DEC. We have a surplus of F/Os on the 320 and I believe also on the 330 for the moment, and we are at least 23 Captains short on the 320 hence the killer roster that they have been getting for the past couple of months.
There is nothing fair, logical or economical to bypass qualified and well deserving F/Os and bring in DECs.
Or if it is fairer to bring DECs on the 320 then wouldn't it be even "fairer...er" to consider a fast track for junior F/Os with time and experience or even PIC time? They can do as good if not better than some of those senior F/Os who have started their career as S/Os and despite their 3 stripes are very limited in their experience and ability to command.....No disrespect to anyone.

[Black Stain]

JungleJett, your truthfull words prove nothing much ever changes at Goat Airways.

[shneidertrophy]

It is not fair and it never will be fair!

They do no even need to fast track guys, there are enough FOs waiting with the 5000hrsTT and 3 years company requirement to fill the gaps!

The boys in the office just do not want to give upgrades any priority, thats all! And now the pressure comes on from the 9th floor as flights on A320 where cancelled last two weeks, so they react by hiring DEC on A320 now as well!

The circle in QR will NEVER be broken!

[bluesky dreamer]

Are all new hire non type-rated pilots going onto the a-320? Have you seen any non typed, non 757-767 guys go onto the 777?

[viewpoint]

Just one simple question, do the 320 training dep., have enought tri, tre, and li, to coupe with upgrades and DEC at the same time?, so who is going to have priority? the Q for upgrade still long , and it's getting longer every month, if you add DEC you will get a disaster nex year, more resignations , and more money expended in training :hmm: mnnnnnn. may be I have a point here?

[Phantom Driver]

the Q for upgrade still long , and it's getting longer every month, if you add DEC you will get a disaster nex year, more resignations , and more money expended in training.

Resignations??!! Wonder when some of you guys are going to get your heads out from your a**eholes and smell the (roses...). Do you read the papers?Do you check what is going on in the aviation industry? Do you live on planet Earth? There is a time to rock the boat and there is a time to shut the f**k up!

[Wango Z Tango]

LOL Thats spot on Phantom LOL

Thas what i'm thinking half the time when I read some of this crap... :ugh:

[Ronaldo 330]

Read last week flight international Etihad taking pilots , Air Asia as well ,Arabia too and Korean Air . There is job just need to have b....

[viewpoint]

Wango nobody force you to read this post, if you think it's crap just don't read any more.
And Phantom , of course I read the news, do you now how many resignations do we have this year?, do you now how much it's the oil today?, do you think this crisis it's gona last too long ?, I'm just worry about the company future, if people like you still thinking like that, and don't make this company a stable, nice, and career mind place to stay for long time. and by the way I smell roses every morning no asses like some of you guys.
One Q to Phantom , do you join as a DEC ?

[oryxbollocks]

Returning to the topic, has anyone else noticed how our esteemed Flight Ops VICE President, BW, rigs the roster? Flies to Heathrow and a couple of days later, operates Gatwick - Doha.

The result, two paxing captains to cover the 2 sectors he doesn't fly.

Saving money for the company by reducing our hotel standards while pulling this stunt is the height of hypocrisy.

If you're called to pax to or from the London area, ask why.

GB

[Phantom Driver]

Viewpoint;

One Q to Phantom , do you join as a DEC ?
No, but I (and family) do commute a lot with you guys, and I have to say, no matter what the problems up front, your guys and girls do a superb job down the back.Travelling with QR is usually a good experience.

I do sympathise with many of the complaints here regarding DEC's when you have been a loyal servant on the "lower" fleets awaiting transfer up the line. We have all been through the same mill at one time or another with various companies.

All I can say is-Right now, the market is not exactly "rosy", and despite what the pundits say, the grass is never greener on the other side; it's the same s**t wherever you go. It has always been a case of "better the devil you know than the one you don't". You pick what suits you best at the time. But rest assured that this is the same age old cycle, be it in aviation, economics or whatever. May sound like cold comfort , but in the current unfortunate climate, one can only hope. Bottom line -Be patient. All being well, as a professional, your time will come! That is for sure!

[bluesky dreamer]

Are there any non-type rated new hire pilots going into the A320? And yes I know that Qatar airways is low on the list of comfort airlines for pilots. I've live in the middle east before.
At this time a check is a check!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I just want to know what equipment new hires are being put on!
Thanks for any info!

[A320 Man]

oryxbollocks, What you mentioned in your post is a repeated practice by BW.

IM thing is to travel regularly to the exotic destinations for diving lessons in Bali....the Maldives..etc.

Pilots are not allowed to select flights, no fleet transfer, days off requests not guaranteed....etc. even trainers are not allowed to resign, otherwise they are blocked on the current type!

Yet again, what do you expect from people who jumped on management seats, getting a 330 type rating for themselves while blocking the fleet transfer for the senior company pilots!!

Of course they can prove me wrong when they restore the fleet transfer, be fair to ALL the company pilots and start hiring/upgrading to the 320 fleet..etc.

[Fubaliera]

Ive seen in training a Direct Entry 320 from UK, and 2 direct entry 330 captains in training as we speak. Also 330 S/O starting as well.

[KRUGERFLAP]

Welcome to QR JAIL. Guantanamo AIN kHALID GATE is waiting for you.:}

[Oxidant]

Just a small correction guys.

A "Nigel" is slang for a BA pilot. BW never worked for BA, only the franchise "GB". Which he managed to destroy quite successfully. Those at BA would be quite happy not to have him counted as one of them.

[shneidertrophy]

Point taken....

Let's keep it at "The Poms" than! (We have to call you guys something , dont we?:} No offense intended...Frogs, Poms, ...whats in a name!)

Seems like at least 50% of our comical duo has managed to even build up a negative reputation on their home soil!

Oxidant, maybe you could share with us the true and full story behind these two characters?

I would like to know how it is possible that these two managed to get these positions. Hos they manage to keep these positions and how they manage to have even our notorious CEO's decisions revised! Never happend before!

[bluesky dreamer]

1Is there a shortage of F/O on the 320 fleet or just captains?

2Iv'e heard that with the new management there is a preference of upgrading on the same aircraft. e.g. if you're a F/O on the 330 then you up grade on the 330?

3 Is it true that all non type rated new hire F/O's are going onto the 777?

Does anyone have the answer's or gossip?

[NineInchSnail]

right now non type rated FOs are going to 777 BUT they all have serious experience on 737, 747 or 75/76. Other non type rated (mostly RJs) and Airbus guys go to the Airbus fleet (320 or 330).

[shneidertrophy]

A320 has an acute shortage of Capt and a normal shortage of FOs

Right to left seat upgrade is still in a dreamphase and will probably be discarded as it is not fair to all parties involved and basically a very very bad idea! It is a product of dreams of some of the FOs around here but nothing real has been studied by the management. Some initial studies have been conducted and some provision is made regarding this in the training manual but thats it!

Anyway, what are you worried about. If you join now as an FO you should count on 6 years before even being regarded as a possible candidate. There are 500FOs waiting in front of you! Be realistic and do not fool yourself!

Fleet assignement is done based on previous experience and company requirement. In the near future more focus will be given again to the A320 fleet. (DEC A320 just started again last month) as this is the basic fleet overhere and the people in the office do realise the benefits of having a plan in place whereby everybody moves from A320 to A330 or 777!

[Seswa]

shneidertrophy:
I understand what you are saying but, are you being realistic ? Do you agree that the the 330 fleet has approx 230 fo's at the moment and the 777 fleet has more than 60 and growing fast. Please remember that the 777 fleet uses more crews than the 330 as they have and will get more double crew flights such as IAD, JFK and HOU, MLB, GRU, SYD etc etc. So they will and up with more than 250 fo's. That''s about 500 fo's on 777 and 330 together, do you realy think that all those fo's can be upgraded on the 320 ?
Logistically it is not possible simply because the training capacity is not there, and second, it will cost a lot of money !!! Especially for all the boeing guys going back to airbus.......why do you think EK keeps cross fleet training to a minimum ?
Just a thought for a healthy discussion..........

Greetings

[A330 man]

EK keeps cross fleet training to a minimum


I guess that is because there is no big difference in the main elements for any pilot: life style, roster pattern or income between A330/340 fleet and the 777 fleet.
Don't forget also that EK roster bedding system allows most pilots to select few destinations of their liking every month.

All EK planes are wide body, so as a pilot you worth the same value in the international job market.

Let's take EY and GF as an example from the region, they stopped NTR capts to join directly the wide body, you have to join on the 320 fleet. I personally don't mind if I stay on the 330 fleet while QA hires pilots on the 777, but why the 320 pilots have to suffer for long years before they transfer? (if they will ever transfer).

[PozativeR8]

Why do so many people think there is such an impossibility for a Airbus pilot to fly a Boeing or Boeing to Airbus.. it's just another aircraft. different philosophies but still a aircraft.. training cost is the same, they both fly and both land. just get your head around the differences and your off.. what is the big deal, and yes i speak from experience as I HAVE flown both, as have many others within this group of bandits we call Qatar Airways Pilots:}

Happiness is V2
P-R8

[Seswa]

PozativeR8:
Sorry but nobody said it's impossible, i have flown both too, that was not the point.:ugh:

A330 man :
You have a valid point regarding life-style etc etc, i agree with you,...... maybe it would be in the company's advantage to create a Airbus fleet and a Boeing fleet. It would make life style, roster and pay more equal across the fleet. But then you would have the elite guys on the 330 saying that they don't want to fly 320 :\. I am sure the 320 guys wouldn't mind mix flying with the 330........i believe there is NO solution that would keep everybody happy, Unless they set-up a seniority system with a career progress like the major EU or American companies have. Where EVERYBODY follows a career progress, and they don't change the rules every time there is a different management.

Keep the healthy discussion going !

Greetings

[A330 man]

i believe there is NO solution that would keep everybody happy, Unless they set-up a seniority system with a career progress like the major EU or American companies have. Where EVERYBODY follows a career progress, and they don't change the rules every time there is a different management.

Seswa, what you just mentioned is great, that is the current policy in ALL world major airlines, unfortunately, that was QA policy also till last September when the "new management" changed the fleet transfer policy.

I believe that QA WILL eventually revert to the original fleet transfer policy with few exceptions for the type rated experienced pilots.

You also spoke the truth when you mentioned the unfair MFF policy of the 330 pilots don't want to fly 320! While 320 pilots are forced to fly both types!

It will be only useful when everyone flies both types as a completely mixed roster, or back to the sigle fleet policy (again like major airlnes cancelled it before..e.g. Lufthansa, Swiss, Etihad)
It is cheaper to learn from other's mistakes, instead of repeating them.

[Lulu qatar]

Is Brithish couple still around ? Or got a confirmed seat to UK ?

It would be big saving for QR if we send them home 140 000 + 90 000 =230 000 per /month mmmmm multiply 12 wow what a saving for QR .

[loc22550]

Oh..yes..
And all the money saved should be transferred to the crew as the new year Bonus..!:O

[Cycl0ne]

I have been offered an F/O job with Qatar on the A320 fleet. I have some questions that I have not found answers to elsewhere on pprune (or the information is very old), or via contacting Qatar directly (they were not very forthcoming with information).

1) What are the monthly duty/flight hours likely to be? I have read conflicting information about this on pprune.

2) Are there many stop-overs, and if so, what percentage of flights?

3) If they put me in company accommodation, what sort of property will it be, and will it be on a sharing basis?

4) People are saying on pprune that the prospects for transferring fleets onto longhaul are bad. What sort of time frame would this be?

5) Where will I be doing the type-rating? I know they have used GECAT in England in the past, but also understand they have simulators in Doha.

[loc22550]

Cyclone,maybe not 100% correct but close to reality:
F/O infos:

1)monthly flight time....70....hours/Duty time....130...hours:bored:
(you are paid for the flight time (schedule block time)not the duty time.
Unstable roster&expect a lot of change&days off cancelled and postponed without asking you or advising you before:But this is something normal in Qatar Airways, as there is no consideration for crew and their private live.

2)layover..3..4.../month(most of them around 24 hours layover).
320's layovers: Calicut,Chennai,Trivandrum,Kathmandu,Colombo,Dar es salam, Nairobi,Seychelles, Berlin,Stockolm,Vienna, (Geneva from january?),Maldives.

3)As an F/O you will be entitled to a 2 or 3 bedroom flat-No sharing.
You can move out(and take the house allowance) if you want but in that case you will not be allowed to come back into the company accomodation

4) transfer...2...3 years.(but rules keep changing).

5) yes they do have 320 sim in Doha.You might do the full course here.

[Cycl0ne]

Thanks for all the information, I appreciate it.

[BizPilotBrazil]

Hi Guys especialy loc22550, (http://www.pprune.org/members/113878-loc22550)

I was shortlisted on August, and i was not invited to interview yet. Can i expect something to next months?

[loc22550]

Bizpilot...unfortunately i don't have any Crystal ball in front of me,and i'm not involved at all in the recruitment process... so hopefully somebody in a better position than me might answer you question soon...:bored:

[BizPilotBrazil]

Rsrsrsrs.....
Thank you Loc.

Pierre, Could you help me?
Someone wiht cristal ball can help me?? :)
I am expecting something to Jan or Feb/2009

[luck7711]

Twinkie,
Qatari pilots have been shut down everytime they have tried to open their mouthes. They always complained AB mistreats them, but these complaints go nowhere and come back to haunt them later.
Qatari pilots are never united, they step on each others feet. I guess everyone just cares for himself nowadays.

[Ronaldo 330]

This morning 18 Qatar Airways Flights arriving to Doha diverted to Dammam and Baharain due thick fog in Doha. This situation could have been avoided if Flights were delayed departing from orginal destination ( Bah,Kwi,Auh,Dxb,Mct,Ika),this show the present managers from Europe and Aussies are not able to handle situation since there are coming from small low cost carriers.
some of the Indian Sub-continent turn around flights are not legal to operate in case of diversion beacuse captains cannot excersice Capt discretion.
Fuel Policy as per OFP introduce CP-Technical has cost QR lot of money today with delayed departure and divsersion.
Good start on Day one of 2009
Happy New to you all Cheers:ok:

[skya320]

Little more info / updated on questions No. 3 & 5

3. As of now until June 2009 can't request to move out of the compound.
"The Provision of Company Accommodation to employees is a benefit extended by Qatar Airways. It is therefore the prerogative and sole responsibility of the Company to decide whether to provide suitable accommodation or to pay HRA."

5. You will only get to go for training in the UK if they are really backup on
training or the simulator is broken.

[P.Clostermann]

Its even better than that....


If you would have been living in your own paid house untill now and your greedy landlord kicks you out...

And you are lucky enough to be GRANTED a house in the Ain Khaled or Markhiya Biddonvilles....

You would then have to PAY around 3000QR/month to Qatar Airways because they claim you have been saving money all these years living on your own so now its payback time!

5 star airline ran by a bunch of idiots....from all the way up to all the way down!

Keep on diverting boys!

[loc22550]

How comes they will substarct 3000QR/month if you take the company accomodation..assuming you might have save 3000QR/month for a while...??!!:confused:Can't believe this!I known Q.R is turning slowly but surely to a low cost carrier when it comes to the treatment of crew but still...Is this a new indian rule in Qatar airways!
Happy new year in QR!:uhoh:

[Goat Liner]

Excellent, I've been paying a few thousand more than my allowance in rent over the last few years...does that mean that if I apply for an Ain Khalid Bunker I will get 3000 Qrs extra every month!? Surely Qr being a fair company things work both ways!:hmm:

[loc22550]

If we follow this logic ..sure they should pay you...!;)
There is some nice villa for rent on the west bay for only 40.000QR/month, don't worry Q.R will paid the difference one day....:uhoh:

but before that just make sure that thinks are working both ways here...:uhoh:

[scorpio]

actually what i heard is there is an increase by the compound landlord more than the 12000 given as allowance so QR is making the staff pay the difference as for me i always felt that something is not right about QR renting compounds for US no way do something to help us no way :=:cool:

[skya320]

CAPT. 12,000 per month
F/O 10,000 per month