ASIC ?

[farrari]

If you have an airline ASIC and wish to go and hire a light aircraft can you use that ASIC for airport access:confused:

[OZBUSDRIVER]

YUP! it's the same bit of plastic all over the place. Not a security clearance, just proves you have passed a security check.

[joepatroni]

If you are issued with a company ASIC normally you must only use it for company business. The company did not pay for it so you could go and hire light aircraft on your days off. If unsure read the issuing instructions.

[farrari]

So what do you do on those days off to get access? Can you have two - one Company and one yourself ?

[Mr Brewster]

What harm can it do.

They probably wouldn't issue you a second ASIC anyway, which means your employer would be denying you the right to fly after hours (and yes, there are some that would do that).

If my CFO did that he'd cop a nasty-gram, then I'd ignore him :E

[Islander Jock]

You cannot have two ASICs and this very problem has been identified by Issuing Bodies with the Department where a person has an ASIC supplied by their employer but may also need the ASIC for other purposes, ie recreational flying.
Options are: Go to your boss and explain what you are doing. Unless they are a total anal retentive, they should not have a problem with allowing you to use your ASIC. Or, Have your company issued ASIC cancelled and apply for your own. I am not 100% certain but I believe it is possible to process a new application prior to cancelling the previous card. Just so long as the new card is not issued without cancelling the previous one.

[psycho joe]

You definitely CAN have two ASIC cards.

I have two, one issued by the airline that I fly for and the other issued by CASA. One belongs to the airline and will be surrendered when i leave, the other i keep cos it belongs to me.

I wouldn't try using a company ASIC for private use as I know that it's forbidden under threat of death and dismemberment by various important airline and gov' departments. :ugh:

[heywatchthis]

Im with Joe, I have two..
Airline issue and CASA issue.. Info I recieved that it was OK to have two.
Just gotta remember to grab the right one :ok:

[sthaussiepilot]

I had to return the Company one, and buy my own.......:(

Oh well

[overhere]

I also have two - one issued by my airline and one private. While my company allows use of the ASIC for private flying, if I left the airline I'd have no ASIC for a period. Many airline staff have 2...

[Capt Fathom]

From the Australian Government ASIC Website:

What is an ASIC?

An Aviation Security Identification Card, known as an ASIC, is an identification card which is used to identify a person who has been the subject of a background check.
An ASIC is required to obtain unescorted access to the secure areas of security controlled airports that have regular public transport (RPT) services.

Reading this, I can't see a requirement to have an ASIC, additional to my current company card!

My company card is issued by one of the Issuing Bodies!

Whether I am flying commercially or privately is not relevant! I would expect it to be accepted Australia wide regardless!

[farrari]

I am told that it is an offence under the regs to use a "Company ASIC " for non Company visits/use at an airport.This would mean you need your "Own ASIC" for such visits/use.:confused:

[Lasiorhinus]

An offence under the regs?

Which reg, if you don't mind me asking?

Sounds more like an action in contravention of a particular company's procedures, which you may or may not have signed when you applied for your ASIC through them, but not against any law.

[farrari]

Las- The Aviation Transport Security Regs 2005. I am not sure that why I am asking here.

[Lasiorhinus]

There's nothing in the ATSR 2005 that restricts use of particular ASICs. All it does talk about is "a valid ASIC". I'm sure certain issuing bodies that happen to be airlines restrict use of their own cards for non-company use, but that's not because of the regulations.

So in answer to your original question, yes, you can use an airline-issued ASIC for private flying, provided the airline lets you.

[Flash_11]

You don't need two ASIC's there is no stipulation in the Act or Regs that requires an ASIC for work and or for pleasure, a company can not stop you using an ASIC which they have supplied, it is your background check and your proof that you have been cleared for unescorted access.

The only stipulation or offence is if you do not have a genuine need to be in a particular place. ie on your day off you hire an aircraft and go flying - that would indicate you have a genuine need to go airside.

On the flip side on your day off if you go to Sydney airport and want to have a look around the tarmac - well then you wouldn't have a genuine need to be there and have committed an offence under the ATSR.

The issuing bodies are responsible for your ASIC not your company. I have one issued be WAC (Perth airport) which is used for work and pleasure. WAC do not stipulate or control how I use it.

[farrari]

I have been told that some Airlines in Australia make it a condition of emploment that the use of their ASIC is only for access whilst carrying out your duties of emploment. That would mean when you want to go private flying you would need a personel ASIC ???

[PyroTek]

Yes Farrari, what other option do you have in that case?

[Islander Jock]

This is quite an interesting scenario. Nothing in the regulaions specifies that a person cannot have more than one ASIC. However the relevant people in the department assure me that it the intention is definitely that not more than one card can be held by a person at the same time. The
closest reg that comes to this is:

6.35(4) The issuing body may issue a replacement permanent red ASIC in substitution for a permanent grey ASIC (or vice versa), or an airport-specific ASIC for an Australia-wide ASIC (or vice versa), or an ASIC specific to an airport for one specific to another airport.

I know that still doesn't clearly answer the question though.

[dunlopdangler]

An ASIC is an ASIC by definition and it is there to prove that the holder has been security checked to be a proper person to be airside at a secured aerodrome and at the controls of an aircraft. There is no call in the regulations to have a ASIC for every type of flight you go on (private or otherwise) They were designed to weed out any potential terrorists amongst us...;)

[farrari]

Looks like the answers is this. If you have a company ASIC you can use it for personal use UNLESS the company states this is not allowed under their conditions of employment, THEN you would need a personal one as well to go private flying.
I think this is correct :)

[Masif Eego]

That's it in a nutshell Farrari.
Many of us have two ASIC's, as the more well informed folks here have pointed out. That's if you want to keep on the right of the law and your employer.
Cheers
ME

[Deaf]

Two ASIC's, two sets of charges = Bigger govt empire

Nothing to do with security

[Islander Jock]

Not disputing for a moment the fact that there are people holding more than one ASIC, all I have said is what the official position on the matter is. I wonder if those who say they have two ASICs obtained them since September 2007 under the Auscheck background checking system or under the old AFP system? If it was under Auscheck - I would be very surprised indeed.

I will reiterate though that any employer who tries to hold you over a barrel and say you can only use your card whilst in their employ despite the fact that you have lawful reason to otherwise be airside is being somewhat anal. Although I could understand it you are employed casually and you are using your ASIC to work for another employer at different times.

[bushy]

The whole thing is absolutely rediculous. None of this would be necessary if proper security checks were made before issuing pilot licences. Then pilot licences could be used instead of this silly ASIC.

I remember one night a long time ago I flew an aeroplane to Darwin for the RFDS in the wee small hours. An ambulance met us on the tarmac, and when we had transferred the patient he left. We put the seats and stretcher back in the aeroplane, and I said to the medic " I have to put in a flight plan for the return flight, and I bet we can get a cup of coffee at the briefing office."
But we could not. The gates were all securely locked, and we caould not get off the tarmac. So I called the tower and got them to send the security bloke over to open one. He let us out, but wanted to re lock the gate and go home. He had to wait.

Another time in Darwin a security bloke came up and complained that one wheel of my C402 had gone over the line that marked the edge of the high strength pavement. I think he should heve been in the car park instead of airside. A C402 does not require high strength pavement.

At Alice Springs, before mobile phones there was a sign that gave a phone number you could ring to get the magic numbers for the push button gate. After hours (15 hours per day) the nearest phone was 16km away.

This is what our security organisations do.
Why do we need squillions of different types of ASIC's. Why do we need ASIC's at all. Why not use credit card type pilot licences that will open electronic gates?

Since when did commercial organisations "own" govt issued security information? I always thought CASA was a subsidiary of major airlines. This airline owned ASIC seems to re inforce that.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

UH - HO !

R A D I C A L Thinking there 'Bushy'..............

:eek:

And,....coffee at the 'Briefing Office'....... dems WERE the days!!

:)

[farrari]

I'm with you bushy.

[Lasiorhinus]

Essendon's fingerprint scanner access to the apron is a good way to not need a key, but it does require you make your first trip through the gates starting airside.

Cairns Port Authority issues ASICs with a RFID chip inside them, that you can hold next to a vehicle access gate and it opens. (Shame it doesn't work for the pedestrian gates, but most humans can fit through the vehicle gates on the first couple of days after they change the key code).

Simplest of all is the idea of simply writing the gate code on the airside side of the gate.

Or choosing a "difficult" code, like the one at Fitzroy Crossing.:E