Revaliation of PPL by experience when flying under NPPL

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Probably a daft question ...

CAA say I can't fly without a safety pilot for the time being for medical reasons, but they will review in a few months' time, and in the meantime why don't I get an NPPL.

Assuming my GP has no problem with the NPPL medical declaration, I can then get an NPPL and fly solo (and maybe even with passengers).

I can find no reason why these solo hours shouldn't count towards revalidating my PPL class rating by experience, allowing me to keep the PPL class rating alive even without having a class 2 medical?

[S-Works]

Quite correct.

[BEagle]

Under the recent General Exemption, you don't even need a NPPL! If you obtain a Medical Declaration and your SEP Class Rating remains valid, you can fly within SSEA privileges and any limits applicable to your Medical Declaration until your JAR-FCL licence requires its 5-yearly re-issue.

You should address the attention of whoever gave you the information at the CAA to http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/ORS4_689.pdf .

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Under the recent General Exemption, you don't even need a NPPL! If you obtain a Medical Declaration and your SEP Class Rating remains valid, you can fly within SSEA privileges and any limits applicable to your Medical Declaration until your JAR-FCL licence requires its 5-yearly re-issue.
I don't have a five year JAR-FCL licence. I have a lifetime CAA licence.

[BEagle]

In which case you can fly within SSEA privileges with a Medical Declaration for as long as you maintain your SEP Class Rating.

You do NOT need to add a SSEA Class Rating - see the General Exemption:

Medical Declaration with Pilot Licences other than NPPL when flying SSEA, SLMG and Microlight Aircraft

1) The Civil Aviation Authority (‘the CAA’) in exercise of its powers under article 153 of the Air Navigation Order 2005 (the "Order"), hereby exempts any person who holds a specified pilot’s licence from the requirement of article 32(2) of the Order that the privileges of the licence may not be exercised unless the licence includes an appropriate medical certificate.

2) In this exemption a specified pilot’s licence is a pilot’s licence issued by the CAA, other than a National Private Pilot’s Licence, which entitles the holder to fly microlight aeroplanes, simple single engine aeroplanes (SSEA) or self launching motor gliders (SLMG).

3) This Exemption is subject to the following conditions:

a) The licence holder shall not exercise the privileges of his licence in any aircraft other than a microlight aeroplane, a simple single engine aeroplane (SSEA) or self launching motor glider (SLMG); and

b) The licence holder has a medical declaration which is valid in accordance with article 32A(2).

4) This Exemption shall unless previously revoked or suspended, have effect from the date hereof until 30 June 2009.

I pointed out to the responsible chap at the CAA that there was a slight anomaly in that SEP Class Ratings include SLMG and/or Microlight privileges (as long as the relevant training has been completed), whereas the SSEA Class Rating does not. We agreed that, since this would affect very few people and because 'old-style' lifetime UK licences are likely to disappear in a few years under EASA part FCL, no additional legislation is required.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Jolly good, so I get a medical declaration and carry on as before, no paperwork, no money to pay to anyone.

(And no IMC flying solo.)

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Actually that looks wrong. Further reading fails to find any limitation to the type of flying done, only to the type of aircraft flown (2000kg, four seats type of thing), so you can use an IMC rating under the General Exemption.

So ... if this means that anyone can do any flying they have a licence for in a four-seater with a medical declaration that costs you a few quid every five years rather than a full medical every year ... how many people are still bothering to get class 2 medicals?? - just those who want to fly larger aircraft and/or non-G-reg and/or abroad?? How many AMEs does that put out of work?? Where's the RIA for the exemption explaining the consultation that was undertaken??

:confused::confused::confused::confused::confused:

[BEagle]

No, you are limited to flying SSEAs as within the medical limitations of the Medical Declaration.

Which means NO IMC, Night or outside the UK. You are restricted in the same way as you would be if you held a NPPL.

I have asked the responsible chap at the CAA to make this clear!!

[Gertrude the Wombat]

No, you are limited to flying SSEAs as within the medical limitations of the Medical Declaration.

Which means NO IMC, Night or outside the UK. You are restricted in the same way as you would be if you held a NPPL.

I have asked the responsible chap at the CAA to make this clear!!
I've read it all again, and I really can't see where it says that.

I'm quite prepared to believe that that was the intent, but courts will only look at intent if they have to - if the law is clearly written then that's the law, even if it was not what was intended.

[BEagle]

I'd say you have 2 choices:

1. Don't fly solo; or
2. Fly within SSEA privileges as for a NPPL holder.

Your choice. The CAA are being pretty generous in giving you some privileges without a JAA Class 2 Medical Certificate, without requiring any admin or fee. Push the barrack room lawyer nonsense and you'll probably screw things up for others......:hmm:

[Gertrude the Wombat]

Yeah, that's what I'll be doing, but it really pisses me off when the government issues incomprehensible laws and/or ones that don't mean what they say. (I've had to put up with a lot of that in recent years, with their various incompetent assaults on the taxation of small business.)

[BEagle]

I had a long chat with the responsible person at the CAA today and made the point that the current General Exemption is confusing people.

He agreed to revisit this and you can expect a revised General Exemption soon.

This will explain the differences between SSEA and SEP Class Ratings more properly and will also explain the options available for those with temporary or permanent medical 'downgrading' issues.

[Gertrude the Wombat]

I had a long chat with the responsible person at the CAA today and made the point that the current General Exemption is confusing people.

He agreed to revisit this and you can expect a revised General Exemption soon.
Excellent! - I do like it when politics works properly!

(I do try to do my bit, as a politician, to listen to people and change things when appropriate, and I know how hard it sometimes is, so I do appreciate it when others succeed.)

To be clear: I think the exemption is a jolly good idea and I welcome it - my only complaint is that clearer wording would have been even more helpful.

[Jehu]

I've re-read the General Exemption, which seems straightforward enough. However can anyone shed any light on the last bit about having effect until 30 June 2009? Seems to make it a very temporary measure and makes one wonder what is likely to follow. Flight crew licensing is illogical and chaotic enough in these transitional times without, it seems to me, limiting a half decent sensible measure by time.

[BEagle]

The 30 Jun 2009 date is merely there because the General Exemption was issued for 12 months in June 2008. It will be updated next year, I'm assured.

[StickRudder]

You no longer even need to get an NPPL (see CAA announcement something like 23/7/08) .... you can now use your existing JAR licence to commit NPPL privileges only (Daytime VFR, UK) with nothing more than the NPPL Self-Declaration form counter-signed by your GP. Must be one of the few times CAA elected to do something blindingly obvious....but hard luck for anybody who'd just forked out £180 for the sheer paperwork exercise of actually applying for an NPPL !

The only potential downside is that if your licence is coming up for renewal and currency has been maintained using only the Self-declaration route, you apparently have to trade it in for an NPPL at that point.

Cheers for now / David

[StickRudder]

Whhoopps ! ... sorry, missed a whole bunch of other posts :uhoh:, and you guys are well ahead of me....that's what comes of being a probationary Ppruner....anyway, it's a damned good rule change and I'm hoping to get aviating again very soon despite a Class 1/2 grounding courtesy of having been diagnosed with prostate cancer ....