JAA to FAA

[stoneyrosetreered]

Having decided I would like to go to America to rack some hours up with my JAR PPL A before coming back to the UK to do all the ATPL usuals, the question is, how do I go about getting my license converted (if that is the right word)? Is there a lot of money involved? Do written/practical tests have to be taken?

I'm sorry if this has been asked before, I tried searching in this area of the forum and it wouldn't let me.

Thanks.

[SpatialDSim]

The rules have changed a bit since I converted to the FAA religion in '99, but I went into the FSDO office in Philadelphia with my "insert country" license and a medical and walked out 10 minutes later. Now you need to demonstrate Ameriglish capacity, but that's about it. No radio license.

BUT.

Beware, once you convert to FAA religion, all subsequent ratings MUST be done to FAA to count to your FAA rating. You can't get a JAA PPL, then convert religions (get your FAA PPL), then go back to your infidel JAA CPL/MEL, and come back to fly in the US of A using the higher ratings. It's a One-Way ticket baby.

'Nother But

It's not really a full-authority FAA PPL that you get anyway, it's a provisional based on your JAA rating. If the JAA rating ever expires (my "same country" PPL did just that since to keep that rating I must fly at least one hour every 12 months..... In "same country", with a "that country again" instructor. Wasn't aware of that detail, now was I?) your FAA ticket is as good as the paper it's printed on.

Talked to the FAA, they were kind enough to inform me that my hours count, but I'll have to do the written and flight test over.

If this isn't fun, why am I doing it?

[BackPacker]

If you're only going to do hour building in the US, then the easiest way of doing this is by getting a "piggyback" PPL. This is an FAA PPL whose validity is dependent on the validity of the underlying JAA license. Search the forum archives (if they let you) for the word piggyback and there's a lot of info.

This is the official place to start: http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/foreign_license_verification/

If your intention is to add ratings to your FAA PPL (like ME, IR) it's best to do this on a standalone FAA license, which means doing the PPL theory exam and the flight test all over again, but this time FAA-style. This avoids building a house of cards.

[RTN11]

How long does the paperwork take?

I'm also looking to do some hour building in the US, but after my 6 month ATPL groundschool course. When would be a good time to sort out all this paperwork?

[BackPacker]

I've never been through the process of obtaining a piggyback PPL myself, but what I've seen is that on the US side, things are almost instantaneously. It's the UK CAA which allows itself 14 days or so to issue the verification of authenticity to the FAA.

All in all, worst case should be around three weeks, I guess.

Furthermore, for a piggyback FAA PPL which you're going to use for hour building or holiday, you don't need TSA clearance and/or an M-1 visa. If you want to obtain a standalone FAA PPL you definitely do need TSA clearance, and most likely need an M-1 visa.

[stoneyrosetreered]

Thanks a lot for the replys, piggyback looks perfect for me. Cheers

[Sam Rutherford]

Piggyback is free (as far as the FAA are concerned) and really easy. The only 'hassle' is that you need to actually go to the US to collect it - but just plan that in for the first day you arrive (when you wouldn't want to be flying anyway).

I'm now doing my FAA IR on my piggyback licence, no problem.

If your licence is UK CAA based then you need to send them GBP18 (I think) - er, obviously??!!

Sam.


PS a couple of points, you will need an FAA medical, and to fly a biennial flight review to keep yourself FAA legal.

[Shunter]

Couple more points. You do NOT need an FAA medical to fly on a piggy back license. The license remains valid subject to your JAA PPL remaining valid, and your JAA PPL requires a JAA medical in order to exercise.

Legally you do NOT need a BFR. This has been recently confirmed by the FAA. The currency of the based-on license (ie. your 2-yearly SEP renewal) is sufficient to exercise the privileges of the FAA license. That said, you almost certainly won't be able to hire a plane in the USA without evidence of a BFR.

Here's a handy article I knocked up a while back regarding getting a piggy-back license (all info current and correct): http://flyerwiki.netsplit.com/wiki/FAA_Piggy-Back_License

[IO540]

This "does a piggyback FAA PPL need a BFR" business has been done to death on every pilot forum going, and people have got written replies from different bits of the FAA which directly contradict each other.

It will remain a grey area until somebody obtains a ruling from a higher level of the FAA.

It is just like the other old chestnut: "does a JAA PPL meet 61.3" e.g. can you fly an N-reg in Germany on a UK issued PPL?

And there are some more. Night flight in the UK (in any reg plane), not under SVFR, on an FAA PPL with no IR.

We could collect these up :)

[gfunc]

Just a point on the medical - either a current medical for your 'original' PPL OR an FAA is fine. It's in the docs online somewhere.

I had my piggyback FAA PPL issued with my UK PPL and a FAA class 3 medical, since I've lived this side of the pond for 5 years and its a bit difficult to get to the nearest CAA doctor. I guess it's all to do with validity - my UK license is valid (one of the old lifetime ones), just not current in the UK without a medical.

Cheers,

Gareth.

[B2N2]

Legally you do NOT need a BFR. This has been recently confirmed by the FAA. The currency of the based-on license (ie. your 2-yearly SEP renewal) is sufficient to exercise the privileges of the FAA license

OMG...here we go again:
Regulation 61.56:
(c) Except as provided in paragraphs (d), (e), and (g) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of an aircraft unless, since the beginning of the 24th calendar month before the month in which that pilot acts as pilot in command, that person has—

(1) Accomplished a flight review given in an aircraft for which that pilot is rated by an authorized instructor and

(2) A logbook endorsed from an authorized instructor who gave the review certifying that the person has satisfactorily completed the review
Full reg is here:
Electronic Code of Federal Regulations: (http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=307d7ef77d01731f7d149a9b356902d2&rgn=div5&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.1.2&idno=14#14:2.0.1.1.2.1.1.35)
And here is an excerpt from the FAA Inspector's Handbook concerning the issuance of a "restricted based on a foreign license":
8900.1:
I. Advise Applicant of Part 61 and Part 91 Rules and Requirements. Advise the applicant about the rules and requirements contained in 14 CFR part 61, Certification: Pilot, flight instructors, and ground instructors; and in 14 CFR part 91 (flight review requirements, recency of experience requirements, required logbook entries, etc.). As a point of emphasis, make clear to the applicant that a flight review (see § 61.56 ) must be administered by the holder of an FAA flight instructor certificate with the appropriate ratings before he/she may exercise the privileges of his/her U.S. pilot certificate. The proficiency checks administered by a foreign flight instructor do not count as meeting the flight review requirements of § 61.56 .

Full text can be found here:
Flight Standards Information System (FSIMS) (http://fsims.faa.gov/PICResults.aspx?mode=AreasOfInterests&area=05&subject=02&regulation=61)

If you call a random FAA office and speak to a random FAA inspector they may not know the correct answer unless they look it up in 8900.1
Not every inspector deals with this on a daily basis.
But the above is the exact quote from their own handbook so I hope that satisfies IO-540 also....:ok:


Trust me, I don't sit here for 30 minutes making this stuff up as I go along..:ugh:
Can y'all just leave the interpretation of US regulations to people that actually work and live and FLY in the USA....rant over

[echobeach]

Sam
you can do the whole thing if you want in the uk without going to USA. I now have my us piggyback credit card pilot certificate, covering my jaa sep and mep ratings, a current FAA class 2 medical and a current bfr. I have travelled no further than farnborough and it was most straightforward.
I very much want to go to USA and do some flying but this bit was done here.
Now have tsa clearance, done in Oxford, and just about to do written for FAA ir.
The FAA make it all very easy.
It can all be done in uk if time is important.

[Sam Rutherford]

With whom did you have the piggyback licence meeting in Farnborough?

Thanks, Sam.

[echobeach]

I phoned the NY international field office(very helfpul). They gave me the contact details for Adam House in uk. He is very busy but extremely helpful. if you can be flexible in time and meeting place he can do all the paperwork in a few minutes. I went to farnborough. His contact details are in many pprune threads or from the IFO.
It was all very straightforward especially I was given the impression you could not easily do this in uk.
EB

[Captain Stravaigin]

If you are going to spend some time in the States I would be tempted to just get a Stand Alone FAA Certificate. The exams are fairly easy and rather than just punching holes in the Sky you will get some different flavour flight instruction. Having a US licence may be of use in the future.

As regards BFRs I do them in the UK with an instructor who has both JAA and FAA privileges, do the 1h flight and he signs it off as meeting both Authorities requirements.

[S-Works]

Quote:
do the 1h flight and he signs it off as meeting both Authorities requirements.
I rather hope not. as there is considerably more to a BFR than simply bang around for 1 hour in the air.

Indeed, but there is not for the JAA 2 year flight. So someone meeting the requirements for a BFR will automatically meet the requirements for a JAA flight........

[S-Works]

Yes I know, but the flight itself should not need to be more than 1 hour and as the BFR stuff is more prescriptive it also meets the requirements of the JAA flight. I think that was the point that was being made.

[bubo]

I have done the paperwork for validation of JAA PPL and I have the letter in my hands. But someone told me you need to have 3 hours of night flying to get the "piggy" licence after a visit to FSDO office. Any experience with that ? I do not have NIGHT in my JAA PPL. Do I really need to have it before going to US ?

[englishal]

No you don't need the night flying element for your piggy back PPL but you will be restricted to day time only when flying under the FAA PPL.

There are various other things to be aware of too - the FAA PPL can fly "vfr on top" yet if you have a piggy back PPL and no IMC or IR on the JAA PPL then you are limited to "in sight of the surface"....

[BackPacker]

yet if you have a piggy back PPL and no IMC or IR on the JAA PPL then you are limited to "in sight of the surface"....

Actually that's only true for a UK-issued "JAR-FCL compliant" PPL. Other "JAR-FCL compliant" PPLs may not have that same restriction.

But essentially, yes, all the limits of the underlying license will apply to your piggyback license as well.

[flyasthesky]

Hello everyone, hope this is the right place to put this question. I've sent away for my FAA licence around the last week of September of this year, Sent my letter to the U.K CAA and my application along with my licence copy and medical to the FAA in the states. This was all through fax as I thought it would speed the process up. I've heard people say it can take 6-8 weeks however I thought it was strange that I never got any confirmation that my application is being processed or has been received, is this normal?
Thanks for your time and sorry if this has been asked before.;)

[drogue chute]

Flyasthesky... I had the same thing happen to me - I was waiting to do my FAA CPL checkride in the US based on my UK PPL, my only hold up being that I was waiting for license verification to come through.
I eventually rang the FAA to be told that they had requested the info from the UK CAA and recieved no reply from them... 2 months before. After a lot of frustrating calls to the CAA I discovered that they had recieved my payment and permision letter to them and promptly filed my paperwork. This meant that when the FAA wrote to them a week or 2 later, my paperwork was in a file somewhere and nobody bothered to look for it.
After a lot more shouting etc. my Dad (I was sitting in the US at the time and he did the chasing on my behalf to save me the hours on hold on the telephone) managed to get them to expedite the whole thing through and I recieved an apologetic phone call from someone in the CAA over the whole debacle.

I recomend you ring them to see what's happening!

[flyasthesky]

Thank you for the replies guys. I paid the CAA the relevant fee, sent away my credit card details so they could debit my card etc. I nominated the Orlando FSDO as well. I suspected this wasn't the norm. Oh the joys of ringing the CAA and trying to get information, I'm look forward to it already:rolleyes:. Thanks for the replies again.