£50 Pounds to send your CV??????

[babymike737]

I saw that Ryanair have an advert for Pilots. A link on pprune. I clicked on it to see what they have to offer. (i'm not looking, just out of interest). On the website they are demanding you send £50 to send them your CV! Is it me or are they having a laugh? I have heard lots of funny things about Ryanair , but shoot me down, I couldn't believe it! What are the administration costs to read one CV? £50??!!! I was rolling around on the floor in stitches. You couldn't make it up!! And they give it back to you if they offer you a job!! I have never heard such a load of bollox in my life!

What a lovely first impression counts experience of meeting someone. They take cash off you to say hello! What are they like when you work for them. Do they charge you to use V-Nav? What about salary deductions for using autoland, after all, it was the plane that landed itself!


I wouldn't work for Ryanair out of principal! I'd rather change career!

[SAA]

It does not suprise me. Same here I would rather do this IT job I hate for the rest of my life than work for them!! :mad:

[G SXTY]

They do it because they can.

The £50 charge came in not long after 9/11, when pilots were being laid off and people would have sold their granny for a job offer. It has been with us ever since, because for every person who sees it for the exploitative money-grabbing scheme that it is, there are plenty more who are desperate / daft / naive enough to stump up the cash. If pigs learned to fly and everyone refused to pay, the charge would disappear overnight.

I would never ever work for a company that charged me to apply for a job, but there are clearly enough people out there who are prepared to.

[Wodka]

They are the gutter of this industry...

I would rather be on the ground than give those cretins money to read my CV :yuk:

[lazy george]

G SXTY your dead right. The same also applies to paying for your own type rating but lets not start that debate again.:{

[Mercenary Pilot]

It's pretty simple, just don't apply. Everyone is aware how they treat the customers and staff so if you don't want to be part of it, save yourself £50. :ok:

[Day_Dreamer]

Initial selection through financial penalty may well be considered as natural selection.
Almost every airline receives over a hundred CV's per week which takes maybe 5 minutes to read, the math is simple 500 minutes 8hrs 20mins or over 1 working day.
By charging this limits the numbers received down to those who are really interested in joining and reduces wasted time.
Also as Ryanair charge for their type ratings (Not Captains) those with the £50 are more likely to be able to find the funds to progress further, £260 for the interview and sim check £22000 for the rating.
From what I have seen after 35+ years in aviation the Ryanair knockers here will never be anything else but anti, its time they grew up and accepted the facts that in todays environment we all have a choice one is to pay or not to pay, the other is to sit on a fat A... waiting for a job to come to them. (it will not)
Most new Ryanair pilots already know what to expect, the costs involved and the renumeration received. its their choice.
If when I started there was a job like Ryanair, I would not have though twice before applying.
It took me 2 months to get a flying job, which lasted 5 months, (Redundant) then a job flying turboprops for 5 years before getting that first jet job.
Integrated course £7000 including accomodation. first job £1200 per annum.
Today we have much higher costs but low costs still recruit cadet pilots who can expect to receive £30000+ in the first year.
LAY OFF SLAGGING RYANAIR
If you have specific gripes and have worked for Ryanair then post, otherwise stop wasting band width.
No I dont work for Ryanair, nor have I ever worked for them.
Travelled with them a few times and will continue to do so.
Tin hat on and waiting but at my age who really gives a damn.

[SAA]

Its that attitude that makes the industry what it is today!!! :D

[Mercenary Pilot]

Its that attitude that makes the industry what it is today!!! :D

Nuff said :D

[Canada Goose]

LAY OFF SLAGGING RYANAIR
If you have specific gripes and have worked for Ryanair then post

Err excuse, me but OK, the poster doesn't work for Ryanair, but he has a valid gripe, and though you may consider him wasting bandwidth, people do occassionally feel the need to vent !!

Integrated course £7000 including accomodation. first job £1200 per annum .......I'm guessing you've missed a '0' off those figures ! Good job it's not the VNAV ! Sorry could'nt resist - I know we're only human !

Travelled with them a few times and will continue to do so.
....never have.....never will !

As with the other posters, I'd rather be doing my engineering and earning decent dosh than working for them ! My choice, just as other people choose to go off with them. Unfortunately, there will always be these 2 camps !!

End of.

[BerksFlyer]

Day Dreamer,

I really do not understand people who share your view. If no other company in any other industry does this then why should Ryanair? They are a joke.

we all have a choice one is to pay or not to pay, the other is to sit on a fat A... waiting for a job to come to them. (it will not)

Who on earth are you to say that good people with a good enough mind to see the truth (unlike yourself) will not get a job unless they pay this pathetic cost?

Natural selection my balls. If it were, it would be selected on aptitude and ability, not money.

Today we have much higher costs but low costs still recruit cadet pilots who can expect to receive £30000+ in the first year.

I'm sure they would rather get paid little less and be treated with at least a little dignity.

At your age though, I guess who cares? Think about the future of the career if all the pilots closer to retirement shared that view. It sure isn't looking good, is it?

[G SXTY]

in todays environment we all have a choice one is to pay or not to pay, the other is to sit on a fat A... waiting for a job to come to them. (it will not)

Indeed - and many of us who chose not to pay have found jobs with airlines that do not charge for CVs, or sim assessments, or type ratings, or uniforms. My lot even let us have free water on the flightdeck.

I agree with another point too:

Most new Ryanair pilots already know what to expect

They certainly should. Ryanair's attitude towards low-hours pilots (and pilots in general) is headline news right up there with the pope being catholic and bears defecating rurally.

I understand the appeal of lots of hours on a 737NG. I understand the desperation to get a first job that leads people to pay to join an airline. The trouble is, the more people that demonstrate they'll do anything, pay any price to become an airline pilot, the greater the temptation for other airlines to follow suit. Erosion of Ryanair pilots' terms and conditions today means erosion of everyone else's tomorrow.

That's only my opinion, and people might disagree with it, but I don't believe that stating it is a waste of bandwidth.

[adwjenk]

Here we go again :ugh:

[Day_Dreamer]

There is no such thing as a free type rating.
You end up paying in the end by lower salaries, sometimes only reaching full F/O salary in year 5.
Some other companies offset their training risk by asking for the new pilot to put up a bond for training ahead of the course the onus is then on the new hire to achieve the required grade or lose the cost of training.
Selection is not 100% accurate and some do fall at the training hurdle.
There are no charities out there these days, so risk should be shared if not carried by the pilot undertaking the training. Its also motivating.

In answer to how much I paid in 1970/72 I did not miss off any zero's either in costs or salary, in those days a jet captain's salary averaged £12K to £15K. per annum.

You cant blame Ryanair for driving down salaries, it the current economics that drive down salaries, each bean counter wants to save money, so after fuel and aircraft leases how can they do that, simple hit salaries.
Share holders want dividends, increased overheads cant do that so your salary decays in real terms.
But Ryanair pay by results, i.e. you work you get paid

My terms and conditions were eroded long before Ryanair came on the scene in the strength they are today. And after 3 redundancies I would have worked for free to get back into the air, to keep my skills alive.
T & C's they are worse today than in the early 80's.
Bring back employers like Sir Freddie, he knew what the travelling public wanted and looked after his crews. A lesson to todays managers who think they have been there and got the T shirt.

There will always be those who exploit and those like Ryanair, who tell it like it is and say "Take It or Leave It" those are our terms.

Can we please stop slagging off Ryanair or any other Low Cost for their practices.

[BerksFlyer]

Here we go again :ugh:

The OP has a valid gripe.

Why shouldn't this sort of thing be brought up?

It's being discussed and this is the sort of thing that should be in this forum, it's perfectly related.

It just happens to be the case that 80% of the negative comments are about Ryanair, and this is no coincidence judging by their little money making schemes like the one being discussed now.

[adwjenk]

Ok,

This forum is related to gaining the first job, not for job hunting pilots with a few thousand hours or under current employment, if you actually read the Ryanair website the £50 charge is only for experianced 737 f/o's.
So technically if we are being really picky here its not in the right forum now is it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dartagnan]

"it's pretty simple, just don't apply. Everyone is aware how they treat the customers and staff so if you don't want to be part of it, save yourself £50."


it 's pretty simple, just send your CV and don't pay the 50 quids...

but, this, guys, you haven't figure out that it is possible to send a CV without paying....:eek:

send you CV by thousand!!!:ouch:

[Mercenary Pilot]

Also worth mentioning that there are a few ways of having your CV considered by Ryanair without paying the £50....

It's not what you know, it's who you know (or who's E-mail address to be more precise)... :suspect:

[Nathan.Hunter]

Not that i agree with £50 per CV or paying for your Type Rating

but no1 is forcing you to do so!

if you want to be a fool and pay it, pay it!

if you have brains then you wont!

send your cv in and tell them to shove the £50, they may let you throu on balls!

[helldog]

adwjenk if what you say that the charge is only for experienced 737 f/os then is that not even more ridiculous? You would think that they would be very happy to hear from guys that have the type on their licence rather than put them off by imposing a 50 pound fee to view their cv.

[potkettleblack]

MOL I think your numbers are a bit squew iff:) I think you will find that a FR cadet is on around 15k in the first year. But as with all the FR publicity and marketing hype the devil is in the detail. In reality it is half that as they don't get paid during training (conversion course nor line training). They might also have to accommodate themselves at their own expense at any of the bases to get through the training. They might get to the dizzying heights of 25k or so in year 2. By which time they will be posting CV's left right and centre once the ATPL comes through to get out. Flybe who are the other big player in recruiting low timers pay low 20's and it goes up in very small increments. A skippers salary is really only survivable if you have made the lifestyle choice to live outside of the major cities and brought a house many years ago when prices were low. Lets not even get into what Jet2 and the other locos/charters offer cadets.

Excess of 30k hhmm. If you pay for a type rating and then end up at the bottom of the market it will take years to break even, let alone get the money back you paid for the multi/CPL/ IR and MCC.

[BerksFlyer]

You cant blame Ryanair for driving down salaries, it the current economics that drive down salaries, each bean counter wants to save money, so after fuel and aircraft leases how can they do that, simple hit salaries.

To an extent you can.

They still make profits don't they? MOL still takes bonuses doesn't he?

It's not only pay that's the issue. It's their treatment of employees that is nothing short of appalling.

MOL's attitude costs the airline plenty of money. Look at all the times they're in court! Why not get rid of him to save money? Oh, sorry, of course he's too busy trampling over everyone else's profession, with particular emphasis on the pilots to whom he's hellbent on destroying as professionals.

[gone till november]

What!:confused:

Pay that loser £50:eek::=

You'd be better off bending over and wiping your arse with it.:ugh::ugh::ugh:

If its your 1st job then you literally pays your money and takes your choice but its the thin of the wedge and even the ridiculess list of things you have to pay for now will only get longer.

If your experienced your better off looking elsewhere and spending the half ton on a big foxtrot oscar curry and a few pints

[Nichibei Aviation]

I agree, this is going too far.

Ryanair invented the self-sponsored fATPL training philosophy.
Ryanair invented the self-sponsored type-rating philosophy.

These philosophies have been adapted extensively by other airlines.

Ryanair is now inventing the pay-to-look-at-my-CV philosophy.

Just boycott it people.
Anyone wants to start a student pilot's union?

[dartagnan]

BTW, it is illegal and against the EU law to send money with your CV.

it is illegal to ask CV and money.

[youaintseenme]

What is it with you lot???

I don't think any one who works for Ryanair (or applies for a job with them) is having a gun held to their head!

Stop yer flippin whining!!!

If you don't like it then don't apply!

Pilot jobs are just like everything else......supply and demand. Quite clearly there is enough demand (by pilots) for Ryanair to get away with it.

I don't approve of it and I don't work for Ryanair either, but if people want to pay Ryanair to submit their C.V then let them do it.

There are those that are Ryanair pilots, building their hours, gaining experience, unlocking their FATPL's and getting better jobs a few years down the line.............................................and then there are those who still flip burgers!!

It's YOUR choice!

:E

[BerksFlyer]

There are those that are Ryanair pilots, building their hours, gaining experience, unlocking their FATPL's and getting better jobs a few years down the line.............................................a nd then there are those who still flip burgers!!

You speak sense, but this attitude that seems to have been adopted about using Ryanair as an hour building airline then moving on to another airline isn't really thought out. It discounts the fact that as this happens every other airline still has to compete with Ryanair's low cost base and as a result of this they are under pressure to adopt the same conditions as Ryanair. Eventually, there will be no where better to move after unfreezing because they will have had to match Ryan. Catch 22 I guess.

[youaintseenme]

Berksflyer,

You speak sense, but this attitude that seems to have been adopted about using Ryanair as an hour building airline then moving on to another airline isn't really thought out. It discounts the fact that as this happens every other airline still has to compete with Ryanair's low cost base and as a result of this they are under pressure to adopt the same conditions as Ryanair. Eventually, there will be no where better to move after unfreezing because they will have had to match Ryan. Catch 22 I guess.I am down off my soap box now ;) and I have to agree with you. This is a real problem but kinda comes under the heading 'That's Life!'

It would be nice if all pilots voted with their feet and cut the supply chain that perpetuates this practice, however there will always be someone else ready to step in and take a place. As said by someone else earlier it's a dog eat dog world out there.

We all want cheap flights (as passengers) don't we? We all want cheap food in the supermarkets but we know this will ultimately close down the little guys.

You are quite right.............Catch 22.....

The same thing is going on in the instructor world, work for peanuts and get treated like sh*t, but hey, we still do it (coz it builds hours!!).

I spent 3 years as an instructor and gained 1500 extra hours along the way, I also earned considerably less in that time than I would if I had worked for Ryanair.

So the bottom line is...............would I have joined Ryanair if given the chance?

Oh yes!

:)

[helldog]

Gone till November, that post cracked me up. P!ssed myself.:D

Youaintseenme. I suppose that you are right in saying 'thats life' But we pilots seem to be the only ones that have to live with this kind of stuff. Lets say you turned up to a building site where there was a job going that required you to undertake some training. Maybe operating an earth mover. Plenty of guys around that can operate smaller equipment that would be ideal for the job. Now you get a dude come in out of nowhere that offers to pay for his training just so he can get the job. He would be called a scab, fruit would be thrown at him and some union thugs would beat him up. Its lucky we pilots are somewhat more civilized and just say 'thats life'!

Now please, this post is tongue in cheek. I am in no way suggesting we beat up type rating payers, or throw fruit at them. Also I am not calling them scabs. I have been tempted by these scams as well! Still I am trying to make a valid point in a light hearted way. So no vicious attacks on the good name of helldog please.:ok:

[IrishJetdriver]

As one who started at ryanair last year and came from another low cost sector carrier I would make the following comment:

It is not easy to get that first job especially if age is not on your side. How long do you keep waiting for? I agree that paying for your rating etc is not ideal, but you did pay for your fATPL etc and I presume it cost a lot and you'd rather not waste it? The likes of Ryanair give everyone a fair crack of the whip I think. They don't appear to worry about age. There was a 45 year old 1st jobber on my course. I believe you can offset your course cost including accomodation against UK tax so maybe it's not ultimately as bad as you think. You get to fly new 737-800 and fill your boots with flight time. You get a very steady industry leading 5/4 roster pattern......and they do pay you. Not a great deal as a new cadet I must admit but once you have 500hrs you are better off. Also it is not everyone who has to pay. I had no 737 experience however my previous experience means I have not paid them a penny for anything. This was the same for 50% of the new intake on my course last year. Personally, rather than knock LCC and their attitude to paying for type ratings, why not think they could be giving someone the chance of their life to fulfill their dream? If you wouldn't pay up either because you have another job already or you have sufficient income to warrant waiting for your 1st job then you have no reason to criticize others. If in 3 years time the new Ryanair cadet is taking home 5k per month in the left hand seat and you are taking home 2.3k in the right seat of a turboprop then perhaps ponder on who has come out of this rather well?

[babymike737]

I am sure that Ryanair is great to work for, and 5 on 4 off sounds great! I am not complaining, whinging, or moaning about it, and I would hate to be wasting precious "bandwith", but to ask for 50 quid to get a cv read doesn't really strike me as good business sense! Even if 1000 pilots pay the 50, thats only 50 grand (not a lot to ryanair....well you would have thought anyway:ugh:) it's a dropped bollock if you ask me! If Ryanair pays so well and gives lots of time off, why do pilots use it as an hour builder then? Sound like it's a career move going there? How much do they charge for your P45??

[Day_Dreamer]

To those who have replied to me via this thread.

Read my Posts correctly and you will see I do NOT work for Ryanair.
English comprehension both written and oral is a JAA requirement.
Not selective reading.

I have over 35 years in this profession as a Line Pilot and Trainer, with over 18000 flying hours so to those who think i may be in the right seat YES I can occupy both.

I support Ryanair, but may not agree with some of their practices.
As I said before there is choice out there and one is Ryanair.

Too many of you out there, through either sour grapes or lack of real knowledge are knocking Ryanair at every chance they get, on any thread that mentions RYR.
What I want to stress is that this is a free world and everyone can post here and have their say, right or wrong, but dont make it so personal.

My opinion is that you should stop trying to intimidate, and offer constructive advice to those seeking such through these threads.

Here we were asked about the £50 charge to read a CV.

The answer is simple if its the way you want to go then you must first get your CV read so pay up or do not apply.

Yes there are other ways as previously mentioned without having to pay the fee.

Can we have a TIMEOUT here from slagging off the men and women who work for Ryanair.

[Philpaz]

Most of the people who actually work for Ryanair have nothing but good things to say about it. What never fails to ammuse me is how many people sit on Pprune all day every day whining and moaning about everything and anything, i get sick of seeing the same names pop up time and time again. Perhaps if those people put as much effort in to finding a job or god forbid work and save for a TR, then they would be in the RHS instead of sat dreamimg about it.

Oh and i dont agree with charging to view a CV:=

[c_hris_EGNV]

im the type of dumb ass who would pay it,we get into so much debt to get our licence im sure a few more thousand wont hurt £22050 :ugh: