PPL (A) Skills Test

[LawrenceMck]

Hi Guys,

I posted something similar to this in the Private Flying section of PPRUNE. Please correct me if this post is in the wrong section.

I just wanted to ask the Flying Instructors and Examiners here if you can offer any advice on the Skills Test. I should be doing it within the next two weeks.
What are the reasons that most people fail or get a partial pass? How can I ensure that I impress the examiner and secure a Pass? I realise all Skills Tests are different due to weather etc.
I hear that it's important that Practiced Forced Landings are carried out correctly the first time and that you get the aircraft in a position where you would be able to make a landing in the chosen field on the first attempt. What happens if you mess up a bit? Do you get a second attempt or would a failure in that section result?
Also, what questions are likely to be asked by the examiner regarding the aircrafts systems etc.
Any advice on how to cope with the big day will be greatly appreciated,

Regards

Lawrence

['India-Mike]

All you might ever need to know....:)

http://www.caa.co.uk/application.aspx?catid=33&pagetype=65&appid=11&mode=detail&id=1206

Good luck

[VFE]

Well you'd be advised to download the PPL syllabus and familiarise yourself with the air exercises you've covered - as a good starting point. Then, you could get a copy of the examiners check sheet for the test itself and make sure you know what to expect altho the exmainer will fully brief you prior to the test on the day. My biggest peice of advice is not to forget the carb ice checks so FREDA checks every 5-10 minutes or, whenever you have a quiet moment - the examiner will not penalise you for it!

Good luck,

VFE.

[LawrenceMck]

Hi,

Thanks for your quick replies. I have already read the CAA Standards Document 19 and know it fairly well:ok:.

Regarding the PFL's, is it critical that it's completed successfully on the first attempt?

Lawrence

[glush]

You won't fail if you mess the first attempt up - unless you do something crazy, most examiners will give you another attempt. But you will be required to complete it safely and succesfully.

The PFL is one of the things that many students stuggle with - and unfortunately there is just no substitute for lots of practice, in different wind conditions (i.e. strong winds, calm winds), and from different starting altitudes. It's the best way to build your confidence up.

If you have any doubts about the PFL, your course instructor will be more than happy to spend time with you to practice some more.....

[IRRenewal]

Regarding the PFL's, is it critical that it's completed successfully on the first attempt?

Yes. It's a demonstration of an emergency procedure and the guidance issued to examiners do not allow for a repeat.

[Whopity]

Appendix 1 to JAR-FCL 1.30 & 1.135 Skill Test for the PPL
Conduct of the Test Para 12 states:
Any manoeuvre or procedure of the test may be repeated once by the applicant. The FE may stop the test at any stage if it is considered that the applicant's demonstration of flying skills requires a complete re-test

[VFE]

Ennit marvellous. :} :rolleyes:

VFE.

[davidd]

make sure you do the emergency brief.
i.e when he/she says engine failure, ask if he is strapped in and tell him to brace etc

[BEagle]

davidd - that sort of thing is typical huggy-fluffy nanny-state cosmetic frippery.

Whilst it's important to confirm that passengers are correctly briefed, there's no point in doing that if you can't fly a decent PFL.

The Examiner should be far more interested in your skill than in anything else - that's why it's called a 'Skill Test'!

[foxmoth]

make sure you do the emergency brief.
This should be done on the ground before you start engines, much off it can even be done sitting over a cup of tea, when you have an emergency is not the time to start briefing pax.:=

[hotcloud]

Glush is spot on. There is no substitute for experience, practicing in all wind conditions gives you a feel of the glide distance over the ground. A good pilot feels part of the aeroplane, the more you practice the more natural it feels. Examiners understand that students will be nervous and realise that they may slightly misjudge the landing. A little tip best best to have a slightly high approach than a low one, height can be shaved off by steep gliding turns up to 45 angle of bank, however don't forget to add about 10 knots to your gliding speed. Another tip don't be put off if you make some minor mistakes in the skills test, if you do, let the examiner know where the errors were made, he/she will at least appeciate that you are making the necessary corrections. Good luck and let us know how you got on. :ok:

[LawrenceMck]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for all you replies!:)

hotcloud, you sound just like my instructor, he gave me the same advice earlier. "It's better to be too high than too low" Also he mentioned the 45 degree angle of bank plus the 10kt speed increase.

I've got my test booked for Tuesday 25th March (I've got a whole week to wait!) Until then I'll bury my head in the POH/FM and do some final brushing up.

Cheers Guys,

Lawrence

[awol37]

lawrence
sounds like hotcloud might actually be your instructor
read his profile?
just a thought

awol

[flapsin]

Hi, just to clarify conflicting info, the Examiners Handbook specifically states that only item c (precautionary landing) may be repeated in sect 5 (emergencies) IRRenewal's post was spot on.
Good Luck with your test

[BEagle]

Paragraphs 3.3.1 and 3.3.4 do seem to be somewhat contradictory:

3.3.1 At the discretion of the examiner a manoeuvre or procedure of the test or check may be repeated once by the applicant.

3.3.4 Initial skill tests for the PPL, CPL and IR are subject to a restricted list of permissible repeat manoeuvres and only the following items may be repeated at the discretion of the Examiner: (Includes Section 5, Item c).

Perhaps it would have been better to specify in 3.3.1 that restrictions of 3.3.4 apply?

The weakest points of most Skill Tests I've seen are:

1. PFLs. Often rushed and flown with little attempt to fly a sensible pattern. Glide speed excessively high, flap often taken far too early. Applicants who have been taught the 'RAF' method often perform better than those who haven't.

2. Circuits. By the time the applicant arrives back in the circuit, he/she is often quite weary, so the circuits are often rather ragged. Landings are usually safe, if sometimes less than refined!

3. Practice Diversion. Sometimes I conclude the practice diversion with a join, circuit and go-around at another aerodrome. Applicants can usually find the aerodrome successfully, but their subsequent join and circuit are often rather weak.

Some examiners report weakness in navigation. However, I've found that applicants who have been taught Standard Closing Angle correctly have no real problem. Similarly, those who have been taught a diligent technique for practice diversions have little problem compared with those who are too keen to rush into the diversion.

Good luck!

[BristolScout]

BEagle.

Interesting to see your comment regarding the RAF pfl method. I've always thought it superior but have refrained from teaching it as it constitutes heresy in terms of the syllabus. Perhaps a useful topic for a future seminar?

[Supersport]

With regards to the PFL... firstly, you should know that some instructors like to pick the field for you, others however, don't and the choice will be yours, keep a good look out for a suitable one, make sure you are aware of the wind conditions. (When I did my skills test it was 25kt Gusting 35kt :eek: )

Also, remember it is a PFL not a real emergency, don't forget carb heat & warming the engine gently every 500ft you descend, this can earn you a few browny points.

Finally, although it is a PFL not a real emergency, do not let that comfort you, it is very important. Remember you are (imitating) FLYING FOR YOUR LIFE.

DO WHATEVER IT TAKES to get the aeroplane in that field safely, steep turns, full flap, sideslip... WHATEVER IT TAKES! Quick sensible thinking and positive control.

Good Luck! :)

[foxmoth]

some instructors like to pick the field for you, others however, don't and the choice will be yours,

Most instructors will pick a field for the demo and probably help pick the first one or two fields, after that it should really be down to the student - I know of very few examiners that will pick the field for a candidate!:=

[Supersport]

foxmoth:
Most instructors will pick a field for the demo and probably help pick the first one or two fields, after that it should really be down to the student - I know of very few examiners that will pick the field for a candidate!:=

I know one or two... when I did my skills test it was picked for me... tbh I found it harder. I was positioned downwind from the field, the examiner pulled back the throttle and said, "Your engine has failed, thats your field there (and pointed) land in it!" Then he just sat back and watched me try and sort it out. As I said before it was pretty windy, 25ktG35kt... which made things good fun when I had descended below 1000ft.

Think it would make an interesting topic, I myself feel either way would be fine, I think you'd get a pretty good idea of the student's skill level by picking the field for them, ie their ability to judge the wind and ability to position the aeroplane adequately to make a successful PFL.

[lady in red]

A couple of points to all you posters - please note it is a SKILL TEST not a Skills test. Secondly, nobody has pointed out that the test can legitimately be split in to two parts. Many candidates only achieve a partial pass because they simply become too tired and mess up the circuits or some other section.
Why not break the test in to two and have a rest after the nav section - some people may say that this costs more, but it does not cost more than having to repeat the test sections that were failed. Just a thought

[foxmoth]

when I did my skills test it was picked for me

Only trouble with someone trained that way is that, if they actually have an engine failure they can then spend so long picking a field because they are not used to doing it, that they would be on the ground before they get their field chosen. This is not done just for the hell of it, but to make sure they can actually do it if needed, and picking a field (not necessarily the ideal field, just an adequate one) in good time is all part of it.:ooh:

[Supersport]

foxmoth:
Only trouble with someone trained that way is that, if they actually have an engine failure they can then spend so long picking a field because they are not used to doing it, that they would be on the ground before they get their field chosen. This is not done just for the hell of it, but to make sure they can actually do it if needed, and picking a field (not necessarily the ideal field, just an adequate one) in good time is all part of it.:ooh:

Yeah, I can see where you are coming from. I must underline though, this was only something that occurred during my actual skills test, it was the examiner that picked the field. Throughout my training with my instructor I picked my own field most of the time. Like I said though, either way, I can see the benefits of both.

[foxmoth]

it was the examiner that picked the field. Throughout my training with my instructor I picked my own field most of the time.

Trouble with this is that the instructors will find out that this is what the examiners are doing (if they all do it) - and the natural tendency is then to make sure the student pssses the test rather than knows what they need to.:ugh:

[LawrenceMck]

Hey Guys,

Thanks for all your replies, really helpful:).

I realise that I must know the aircraft inside out that I am to take my test in, please could you give examples as to the sort of questions the examiner will ask, e.g. type of flaps, best rate of climb and best angle of climb speeds, VS0, VS1, VFE etc.

Regards

Lawrence

[homeguard]

For the PPL Skill Test each element is assessed for both knowledge and skill. The end result isn't always too important.

With regard to skill I always expect it to be there even if not well applied. Good application will develop with time.

With regard to knowledge, well ..........? What is most important is that you know where to find it. Knowing the tyre pressures and the take-off run/distance on a standard day etc is not as important as being able to show me where the information can be found and be able to apply it.

Of course you should know the Best Rate/Angle of climb and approach speeds of your aircraft. However a good knowledge of how to use the Flight Manual is most important. The Oral exam will require knowledge of the use of the Flight Manual. Knowing the type of flap isn't so important as knowing the effect that they have. The general knowledge with regard to the different types of flap will have been covered in the written exams. If your asked a specific question in the Oral know where to find the answer, that is all.

I never want a candidate to fail any part and will do my utmost to help them to a pass as, I'm sure, do most examiners.

[LawrenceMck]

Thanks homeguard,

Makes more sense now. I've still got a few lessons left before test so I'll make sure I've asked my instructor every single question I can think of regarding both the test in general and the oral questions.
Thanks for your feedback,

Lawrence

[DX Wombat]

LIRWhy not break the test in to two and have a rest after the nav section - some people may say that this costs moreMy test was planned to be done in two parts as it fitted in better with both myself and the examiner. I paid only the single test fee so I'm not sure why you should think it would cost more. As I understood things, it would only incur a second test fee if one part needed to be repeated.