Radio

[flyvirgin]

Hello My Fellow pilots,
I am starting my intense ppl course today havin passed all 7 exams, Im starting the flying.
It went well today but im a little worried with the radio,does everyone have this problem when starting out.
I was very nervous and said some things that i should'nt have.
Any feedback would be nice.
cheers.
Adam

[champair79]

Adam,

Don't worry, we all have our moments on the radio. When first starting out, as soon as you press that 'mike' button, your mind will almost guaranteed go blank!

Just practice the radio with your instructor on the ground or even just read about it at home and get to grips with everything.

Plan exactly what you are going to say before keying the mike. Just remember that the controllers are only human and they won't eat you alive if you make the odd mistake (they will know if you're a training flight!). Your instructor will also point out any errors and its just a case of taking it all on board and learning from your mistakes.

A bit more practice and you'll be on the radio asking for clearances, frequency changes etc without even giving it a thought. ;)

Champair79

[TheGorrilla]

Press the tit and say what you want. ATC provide YOU with information and give you instructions to help keep you safe. Remember communication comes last in the age old list of importance, aviate, navigate and then communicate. Talking to ATC won't produce a big magical hand of god that can let you back down to earth safely, it's all up to you.

ATC are there to provide a service to you so don't be nervous.

[wsmempson]

Generally, when you're flying about and getting (or requesting) a FIS or a MATZ penetration (don't ask for a MAX penetration, as I once did - that is something different and will elicit confusion), what the people on the ground want to know is

Who are you? - Call sign
What are you? - a/c type
Where are you from?
Where are you going?
Where are you now? - position, height, QNH
What do you want? - type of service, flight rules...

And try not to tell them your lifestory along the way.

I found it very helpful to sit in the lounge of a busy club (preferably with a full tower and ground service) and just listen until I had 'zoned in'.
:)

[BackPacker]

and said some things that i should'nt have.

Don't worry. They are used to hearing things that shouldn't have been said and generally will not hold it against you. Not for a long time anyway. Unless it was particularly offensive or particularly remarkable (read stupid) and you have a voice that's easy to remember. In which case I suggest paying them a visit, bring chocolade chip cookies and humbly apologise.

If it's an official NATS-provided service (as opposed to AFIS or A/G) it will probably be caught on tape though, so if it was incriminating, call a lawyer.

[flyvirgin]

Haha i was nothing offensive,Just when i was taxing down november1, i said. "line up and hold". it just came over me hahaha

[dontpressthat]

Another helpful method.. Get yourself a cheap airband and spend some time listening to your local twr freq. Just sit in the car for a while before your flight and have a listen, once you have mastered how your local field 'works' it will give you more confidence to go elsewhere and get stuck in.

DPT

[Whiskey Kilo Wanderer]

Hi Adam,

Following on from dontpressthat, I’d recommend a transceiver rather than a scanner. It will be a bit more expensive, but worth it in the long run. As well as listening to local traffic, you can pick up other things like ATIS and Volmet. During your training and beyond, the transceiver will serve as a back up for the installed radio in the aircraft. If you eventually go down the LAA Permit or Microlight aircraft route, you can use it as your main radio. The only caution I’d offer is that you don’t leave it lying around at home where younger members of the family might play with it and start talking to the aeroplanes:(

During your training, try and get to meet the people on the other end of the microphone; Air / Ground Operator, AFIS or ATC if you operate from a ‘Tower’ airfield. That will help to convince you that you are dealing with a nice bunch of people. Bear in mind that the radio is there to help prevent aeroplanes banging in to each other, it’s not essential to present word-perfect comms to someone sitting in a chair on the ground.

When you are using the radio, try and relax. I know it’s easy to say and we have all suffered from ‘mike fright’ at one time or another. After a while you don’t worry about messing up on the radio, as long as the message gets through in the end. Even the experts get it wrong from time to time, see the ATC Humour (Merged) thread on the ATC Forum – it runs to 52 pages and counting!

A couple of things I’ve picked up over the years:
Relax and smile before you speak. When you are nervous the vocal chords tense up and your voice comes out higher than usual. People do this when they answer the phone. Notice how the voice changes when they know who is calling and relax a bit.
Suck a Polo or your favourite sweet to overcome the dry mouth syndrome. Chewing or bubble gum are probably not as good for this function…

Good luck with the training.

Safe Flying,
Richard W.

[flybymike]

Talk yourself to sleep at night muttering circuit rejoins etc.....:)

[411A]

When I started flying at age 17, I had already been listening on the ATC frequencies for quite some time.

Funniest I ever heard was ....

Good afternoon Los Angeles tower, Speedbird 591 at the outer marker.

...a long pause, then the tower replies...

Ahhhh, what kind of bird is that at the outer marker?

No reply.

Then the tower says...

Whatever bird that is at the outer marker, you are cleared to land, 25L.

It got better, later on.

When Speedbird 592 was ready to depart, it was....

Good evening tower, Speedbird 592 ready for departure.

Hello Speedbird 592, cleared for takeoff 25L.

...a long pause...

Ahhhh tower, just so you know, 592 will use every bit of the 12,000 feet ahead, please don't be alarmed.

The tower replied...

We never get excited 592, we've all had three martini's for lunch.


An absolutely 100% true story, as I was there in my DC-6B and heard it firsthand.
591/592 by the way, was the LHR-LAX vv B707-436 nonstop flight, and yes it used every bit of 12.000 feet to get airbourne....as I found out later flying some of these very same aeroplanes, after they had been sold by BOAC.

Relax and enjoy the flying...the radio procedure will become second nature before long.

[Il Duce]

"Press the tit and say what you want."

Interesting.............................

[Miserlou]

Hello flyvirgin.

To begin with well done, welcome and good luck.

Do remember that the radio is the least important part of your duties and of the aircraft.

The less you say the better. Who you are and what you want is sufficient.

There is no requirement to speak to anyone when in uncontrolled airspace and your first call on 121.5 will get you help just as quickly as if you had been in contact with flight info.

They are there for your benefit; you are responsible for the aircraft.

It is also possible to depart and arrive without radio at many GA airfields where radio is the norm.

So relax and enjoy.

[whowhenwhy]

Worryingly I've not read a single post that directs flyvirgin to CAP 413. While I agree with a lot of what has been said, as someone who both flys and controls, there is nothing better than knowing the standard phraseology. It keeps your transmissions short so you won't end up telling your life story and it saves the controller asking you for some information that you've missed. At the same time, after "aviate, navigate and communicate" the most important thing to remember, is if you don't know or there isn't a "standard" phrase, then just speak english! Safe flying!!:ok:

[Fright Level]

Good tip re CAP413, there is a link to the CAA document here (http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP413.PDF).

Last year the CAA sent all commercial pilots a glossy booklet with standard calls from start up to shutdown, I understand they were planning a PPL version, but I guess that would only be sent out to existing licence holders.

CAP413 is a little overwhelming as half the RT calls are not relevant to a PPL, but if you can read through it, you'll soon pick up "standard phraseology" which is what it's all about.

[Saab Dastard]

flyvirgin,

I had no problems with the other exams, but R/T in the air was definitely a problem, and I was very concerned about the R/T practical. I did an evening ground school course with an ATCO and it was - without doubt - the best use of time and money to resolve that issue. Not only did I fly (pun intended) through the test, but my R/T as a whole improved dramatically (and I hope, has remained at a decent standard).

SD

[WALSue]

I started my R/T night school after about 4 hours of actual flying so it did help me a lot for the first time I had use the radio 'for real'
Well worth investing a bit of time and money even if I still have times when the PTT button disconnects my brain.

[Put1992]

Invest in an airband radio, and copy their voices :}

On a serious note, i would get an airband radio, to listen to the speed, and pronunciation of certain phrases, read the books, and you'll be fine :)

[Fright Level]

Personally I wouldn't suggest an airband radio. The cheap ones have mechanical tuning and it's impossible to know what frequency you're on let alone preselect one. A digital one where you can select the exact frequency is better but in most cases, unless you are near an airport or radio transmitter, or have a decent roof mounted aerial you'll only hear one sided transmissions from airborne aircraft.

At ground level, VHF radio range is extremely limited and without hearing two sided dialogue you're wasting your time.

Listening and learning radio calls in relation to what you are actually trying to do is much more important (taxi, take off, MATZ, radar services, flight information etc). A £20 airband radio is a waste of £20, a £150 one, a waste of £150 for what you are trying to achieve. Practise is the best teacher. Good luck with it all.

[flyvirgin]

Thank you for all your post's.
Just letting you know its only my second day on the radio and Im picking it up aready,Started the circuits today to.
Cheers for all the feedback Gents

[crispey]

Just a slight technical intervention to EDDNR.There are many places in UK where you can hear both sides of the VHF airband with a very basic radio.Without an external antenna too.Where I live for a start at 30nm from Manch I can hear a lot of stuff going on including the ground transmissions from EGCC.And nearly all the airway/radar stations in the north.

However it is not strictly legal to listen(there's a sticky in here somewhere about that)neverthess I agree that it does no harm to listen if only to get the feel for it.It helped me.

[jaycee58]

Well, I did my first MATZ penetration today, at Wattisham, (not solo...that'll be tomorrow, weather permitting) but I handled all the radio calls and I was rather pleased that it all went ok (except it was embarrassing to find out that the transponder didn't work) but, as my RT examiner mentioned, I still tend to talk too quickly!!

I think a lot of students tend to have RT trouble at first. I though I was ok on a radio. I use one at work and have an amateur radio licence but I was a disaster for the first 3 months in the air. The PTT isn't called the "brain disconnect button" for nothing!

Passing the RT practical was a good boost for my confidence and hopefully it'll only get better from now on.

If you're having trouble, don't worry! you're not alone and you *will* be ok on the radio in the end.

[IO540]

It went well today but im a little worried with the radio,does everyone have this problem when starting out.

I think it's hard for everybody. I found it very hard. Now I have best part of 1k hours and still need to think a bit before making calls.

Like any language, aviation radio is highly context sensitive. After a while, you know what to expect, and this makes it a lot easier.

Unfortunately PPL training is run as an intensive '45hr' course so they drop you in at the deep end, making you do the radio early on. It's easy to get a total brain overload.

[411A]

Unfortunately PPL training is run as an intensive '45hr' course so they drop you in at the deep end, making you do the radio early on. It's easy to get a total brain overload.



IF a private pilot cannot answer the radio in a reasonable manner, they absolutely do NOT belong at the pointy end...fact.
Learn and learn some more, that is the key.
Have a problem with the ATC communications?
There are many internest sources, learn and be prepared.

NO excuse, whatsoever.
Period!

[Il Duce]

Just curious, but how many flyers out there choose to aviate without using the radio because they don't feel that confident about using it as competently as they think they might?

[Penny Washers]

A point for all radio beginners to remember is that the system is VERY complicated. You can't learn it all at once, and most people are only familiar with the parts of it they use regularly.

There are NINE different radio regimes (at least!) each one involving different requests, replies, or authorisations. I doubt whether most people can even name them all, and only a radio instructor could claim to be comfortable with them all.

Just to start you off, there are THREE different regimes, depending on the type of air traffic service available at an airfield. Anyone like to list all the others?