Singaporeair Captain recruitment

[australiancalou]

Anymore informations concerning the singapore airline's recruitment of B777 and A330 Captains?
Moreover eventhough allready discussed cost of living and taxe system in Singapore...
Thx Australian

[chapola]

I've followed the SIA Cargo thread over the past couple of years and gleaned some good information from that particular thread.

What is Main Line like?
Can someone please break down the $210 000 annual salary.

Does that number include housing and education allowances? Per-diems?

I know there were problems in the past with SIA cargo on what was promised during the interview versus what was actually delivered. Has that now been corrected?

Appreciate any information,

Regards,

Chapola

[australiancalou]

I guess this is for the main line...

[jetblues]

I hear that we will shortly witness an unofficial exchange of crews between SIA and VAustralia. VA will pinch some B777 Cpts and SIA will then pinch some Australian pilots with an Australian Base of choice.

[JetRacer]

I hear that we will shortly witness an unofficial exchange of crews between SIA and VAustralia. VA will pinch some B777 Cpts and SIA will then pinch some Australian pilots with an Australian Base of choice.

Jetblue,

If that is true what experience levels are they after?:)

Cheers

[Capt.Bee]

Chapola you may rest assured that no SIA Captain earns $210.000 annualy. The real numbers are much,much higher. Even for the cargo boys. The last years with the healthy bonuses, 13th salary, annual completion bonus, education and house allowances + share options the picture is way,way different. To all SIA wannabes two thumbs up. The DEC program most likely to be restarted march-june 2009. Best regards and good luck to all..... :ok:

[74world]

Capt.Bee

THe DEC program has restarted!!! have a look at the latest Flight International magazine, SQ is looking for 777 and 330 Capts.

Cheers :ok:

[Capt.Bee]

B777/A330 Captains - Singapore - Flight Crew SINGAPORE AIRLINES REQUIRES B777/A330 Captains Singapore Airlines Invites applications for the positions of B777 and A330 Captains based in Singapore. REQUIREMENTS Applicants should have at least 7000 hours total inclusive of 3000 PIC hours on modern commercial Jets In i ...
Job Role: Captain/s | Job Hours: Full-Time | Location: Singapore | Job Position: Permanent | Salary: Annual remuneration of approximately S$210,000 , inclusive of profit | Company: Singapore Airlines | Published Date: 19 February 2008 11:54:01
74world my hat is off mate :ok:
Been told Captains needed early next year, because we are fat on Captains in almost every department. Most likely collecting CVs or something new's going on. :hmm: Good luck to everyone. :ok:

[lepremier]

Maybe we have "fat Captains" in many departments but recently heard that we are actually short. Also there are people not wanting to renew their contracts.....

[BANANASBANANAS]

I don't have the exact numbers but Cargo is also seeing some significant activity on the recruiting front. Quite a few have left/are about to leave for the sand pit - most citing inadequate Housing/Education Allowance as major 'push' factors.

[Caissa]

The advert in Flight refers to an application form available at the singaporeair website.The only reference I can find on the careers website is for Cadet Pilot applications.There is an application form for Cadets which, at a push, would suffice for a DEC position but it is certainly not what would be expected. Am I missing something obvious here or have SQ perhaps got the ad placed in Flight before their website has been updated?

The Flight ad does allow the option of sending an application/CV via the magazine's own system--this seems a little simplistic as I recall many years ago the SQ form being complex with many documents required.

Suggestions most welcome.

Regards,
Caissa

[lepremier]

That's SQ for you I'm afraid....a great place to live and work but their in house "IT and electronic" set up is a shambles. If you manage to get an application form somehow, by all means try it online but if you can, fill it out manually and send it in by mail or even better if you know someone here get them to drop it in personally as well.....not to say that it wont work online but.... belts and braces!!!

[flyingcrazy]

Caissa,
it's in their website. try this:
http://www.singaporeair.com/saa/en_UK/content/company_info/careers/pilot_appointments/pilot.jsp#Header3
once you open this page, just keep scrolling down. If still no joy, PM me, will send you a copy. good luck
FC

[Moussaillon]

Any other base available for Expact contracts ?

[kk pilot]

no - only Singapore

[jetblues]

Curious how strict the SIA rectuiters are re the 3000 hrs on international ops. The international ops part could be open to interpretation. Is anyone aware of B737NG Captains getting a direct entry command on the B777 with SIA?

[Cubbie]

737 captains were accepted before with sq cargo but as 1st officers only and with the promise of an earlier than normal upgrade, as to if any of them got it I dont know

[BANANASBANANAS]

No command course in SIA Cargo for anyone yet, but I believe that there are some plans for command courses for the future. However, this being Singapore, there is (surprise, surprise) a catch. If you are an F/O on contract terms you have to accept a local contract for (I believe) a period of 2 years before being 'considered' for command. If you have 2 children in school in Singapore then thats a combined loss of Housing and Education Allowance of $6150 per month - for at least 24 months - and all for the 'chance' of a command!

Hardly surpising then that we have a lot of experienced and capable F/Os on short finals to the sand pit and Japan.:ok:

[Myass]

Hi guys,

For a DEC on the 330, let's say an applicant has 6750 TT, with 2400 PIC all on the A320, what are the chances?

Does the 7000 TT 3000 PIC stand firm?

Thanks...

[CDRW]

Guys - SQ will move the goal posts to suit their EVERY whim - you just don't know until you apply. 6 years ago mainline recruited numerous blokes onto the 777, who had 320 or 737 command time, and having flown most of their time in the same country.

Jetblue - the SIA recruiters are usually cadet pilots in between training who get seconded to "help" the 4 floor staff. They read an application and file it according to the criteria of the day!

[XIVIL4DEP]

Hi,

Does anyone know whether the B777/A330 positions are being offered along with Expat Contracts i.e. with Accomodation & childrens education covered by SQ ? Do they still offer those ? Or is it only on "National Terms" these days ?

Cheers

[Platypus54]

Have heard that rents in Singapore have dramatically increased recently and that newly arriving expats are having difficulty finding places for their kids in the International schools there. No places. No point in being there if you have to live in a shoe-box by yourself, unless that suits of course.

[Ndicho Moja]

Platypus54, that is a fact. Rents are at pre SARS levels and higher and international schools are jam packed. For two middle school children expect little change from S$50,000 pa and similar or more for rent with after tax dollars.

[BANANASBANANAS]

Singapore governments own figures on the property market at

http://www.ura.gov.sg/real_estate/main.jsp

In the last 3+ years, Housing Allowance has increased by 11.6% taxable and rentals have increased by about 60% - more in some areas.

You can still find the odd condo unit just within the Housing Allowance but it might leave you with a long commute to work and be in a remote location so that everything is a cab ride away. Net result? What you save on the rental you will spend on transport and ancillary costs and your family will feel isolated while you are away flying.

The situation needs addressing urgently but it wont happen until enough people vote with their feet. That is slowly starting to happen in Cargo.

On the bright side. Singapore is safe, clean, efficient and apart from housing, education and car ownership, the cost of living is bearable.

[Asianlonghaul]

Application Form for DEC at SQ
flyingcrazy many thanks I now have the application form So many thanks! I had the same problem as Caissa I also could not find an application form available at the singaporeair website.The only reference I could find on the careers website was for Cadet Pilot applications too. So it looks as if Caissa you hit the nail on the head and SQ got the ad placed in Flight before their website has been updated? I did email them this so hopefully that helped fix the problem. Good luck. Any ideas on the tax in SIN?

[BANANASBANANAS]

Income Tax rates in Singapore:

http://www.mof.gov.sg/taxation/indiv_income_tax_rates.html

You can also apply for 'Not Ordinarily Resident' scheme. See

http://www.iras.gov.sg/irasHome/page03.aspx?id=6118

Provided you have not lived in Singapore for 3 consecutive years you can apply for NOR status and you will be charged tax at a flat rate of 10% on your taxable income for a period of 5 years. It works out overall at about 7.5%, as a portion of your income is tax free as it is earned outside Singapore and is designed to cover down route expenses.

Not really worth applying for as an F/O as you need to earn about $190k pa for it to become worthwhile.

[jetblues]

Any up to date info on actual average income for a B777 Captain based in SIN?

[filejw]

Couldn't find a max age for applicants, anybody have an idea what it is.:)

[Left Coaster]

I believe it used to be max age of 55 for DEC's at both SIA and SIAC...Some mainline Capt's left SIA at 60 and joined Cargo and may work until 62.

[Metro man]

Straits Times article from 24/04/07 quoted a figure of S$271 888 at mid point of the salary bracket. This is made up of basic pay, productivity allowance, overnight allowance, inflight + overseas meal allowance, monthly + annual variable allowance, annual wage supplement and annual profit sharing.

Obviously this is an average and actual amount would depend on the amount and type of flying done, along with company profitability.

For those on expat/contract terms the housing allowance will only get you a basic condo away from town, be prepared to kick in S$1000 - 1500 month extra for the sort of place and location a Captain would have been living in two years ago. Not sure of current rate at Changi Village hotel, some expat SQ captains used the housing allowance to live there permanently. Be warned that hotel rates have skyrocketed along with rents.

Education allowance will also need some help in covering British/American/Australian International School fees.

In short a nice safe place to live and work in, BUT getting increasingly expensive and packages are not keeping pace.

[International Trader]

Good schools must be a problem.
Got a friend there who has been shuffling kids about waiting for places in good school.
He says an immediate place in the Brit school will now cost you SGD $170,000plus the deposits and school fees.

[winglet_fever]

For those that are interested on coming over to lion city, condos away from expat areas range from $2500 (1100 sq foot) to about $4000++ per month. Those in prime areas of the same size will set you back double or more.

A 3 year old toyota camry will set you back about 60k. Road tax and insurance should be about 2k per year.

After all, Singapore is only 650km square. East to west is only about 40km, north to south is about 30km. Much smaller than most average major city.

Cab fare from airport in the east to the most west end of the island will set you back about $25 in the day and 50% extra in the night. I personally cab almost everywhere and hardly spend more than 1.5k per month on transport.

Train fare range from about $1.20 to $3. East to west takes 45mins. North to south about 30mins. north east to south about 25min.

I guess it all depends on what kind of expectation you come with. If you are looking for lifestyle of that of a New yorker staying near times sq, the pay package here is not enough.

If your family can come to terms with living further away from town (gentle reminder of the 650sq km land area), spend your savings from the rental on car to make up. It might just about balance things up.

As for education, it is a tad on the expensive side.

Just my 5 cents.

[Dani]

correct, winglet-fever, and you have to add that the condos close to the airport are the least expensive ones. You pay less for transport, too. The prefered areas are the ones in the east. You only have a long ride if you want to go to town. But to the airport it's very close.

Dani

[Left Coaster]

170K for school? Hope it's a misprint...I have two in a good International school and I can tell you it's way less then that...Maybe you meant $17000?

[skycap]

Left Coaster
Read the line properly
"He says an immediate place in the Brit school will now cost you SGD $170,000plus the deposits and school fees."

You can do this to avoid the waiting list.

[horizonhunter]

Hello everyone,

I am actually a Senior Captain in Europe on the B777. I am seriously considering applying with SQ. I find the informations here very helpful. Can someone tell to me about roster and general work load for Capt?

Thank you,

Horizon Hunter

[N118KA]

Colleague of mine is paying S$27k p.a. at an international school.

S$120k+ ? must have 4/5 kids?

[kk pilot]

See skycap's reply - yep. unbelievable but true - (S)$170,000 gets your kids head of the line priviledges JUST TO GET IN - and that's $170k EACH. The private schools here are bursting at the seams. SingAmericanSchool has over 700 on a waiting list but doesn't have a buy-your-way-in fee - you just have to wait. These are facts. :ugh:

[winglet_fever]

Since you guys are here to experience the liftstyle, why not place your kids in local schools? I know of a Capt from Silkair that used to have all his kids there. His kids' network of local and expat friends are somewhat more of an interesting mix.

If you haven't read much into our local education, i suggest you do a bit of reading up. Correct me if i'm wrong, in terms of standards, it is one of the better ones in the world. Why miss the chance to experience wholesale when you are already deciding on coming to Singapore?

IF i didn't remember wrongly, it will cost you 3.5k to 8k per year in a local or semi local school.

WLF

[kk pilot]

No argument from me as to the quality of the local schools - just a personal choice

[singapore sling]

Reg. local school. Your kids must speak some malay or mandarin already to enroll. Maybe OK for preschool.

[Left Coaster]

I read the line again as suggested, and still don't see where it actually said it gets one to the front of the line by paying extra. I guess I need to go back to school? Maybe new glasses would help, or it it's in code... sorry...:rolleyes:
BTW, there are a couple of International schools currently expanding and building new campuses to allow for the growth of students. The Canadian International School for one.

[winglet_fever]

LC, i dont think you will see that line anywhere.

If you contribute X amount to the school's ongoing "upgrading fund", you will have the priority to jump the queue.

In some cases, parents even volunteer to be traffic marshaller every morning for a year, so that their kid get some form of priority.

Its all about how you want to out shine in the demand and supply market.

[kk pilot]

WF - Sing American School is trying to find another additional campus but I know for a fact there is a very long wait list there - and no amount of shine will change that.

[burnden]

Does anyone have the actual allowances rates for expats with SQ?

I'm talking accomodation, education etc.

It all helps with the planning. Cheers.

Burnden

[BANANASBANANAS]

Housing Sing$ 3350 pcm (taxable) if you are married.

Education. Max of Sing$ 1400 per month per child (taxable).

Neither of the rates cover the costs and they are falling further and further behind.

[Che Xindamail]

Don't forget that Malaysia is just a hop away over the bridge. Johor Bahru might not be the hippest of places, but for those without children it is certainly an option. Not as clean an tidy as Singapore, but improving. Crime is higher than Singapore, but then so is everywhere else in the world. It will save you a fortune in housing, and you still get the housing allowance.

[horizonhunter]

Can someone tell me about roster and duty time?

Thank you,

HH

[kk pilot]

16 - 18 days of flying

some day turns to, say, BKK, or DPS, or GCK, or KL

usually a 5-7 day trip to somewhere

sprinkle in the usual all-night turn stuff to India

rest are 2-3 day trips started with a late night check in with an all night flight to _ _ _ (fill in the blanks)

gone around 10 - 12 nights a month

how's that?

[ArkPilot]

KSJM,

"Police State?" I hope that was tic. If not, you might consider your future elsewhere as it is highly doubtful you will be happy in SIN with that attitude.

My family and I like it in Singapore so if your looking for a negative rant someone else will have to fill the slot.

One thing I will mention, if you are looking for a commuting contract this is probably not the place to be.

How's that for a complaint?;)

[mohdawang]

Singapore is clinically clean with the government in tight control of important aspects of a citizen's life; but to equate it to a police state like PRNK, Cuba etc is preposterous.

Generally very safe to live in with plenty choices of food and affordable domestic help. Housing and living costs are mostly reasonable compared to those in developed Western and developed Asian countries; the caveat being that one does not coming with the expectation of a caucasian business lord looking for a 10 room, swimming pooled mansion with garaging for 4 cars etc. Lots have been written about life in the lion city before.

[horizonhunter]

Thank you.

HH

[burnden]

Thanks Bananas...!

B.

[malyr]

Hi guys!

kk pilot you said 2-3 days off after coming back to base, and then starting at night a rotation of 5-7 days? So you never get blocks of 3-4 days off? It sounds hard work!:uhoh:

Another question, let´s say you have been working for SIA for few years is there any choice to change base to a european base if there is one?

Expat people are friendly welcome at the company?

Congratulations for this very interesting topic:D

[boeingdream787]

Hi. Wondering what kind of a time frame are we looking at between the time one applies and the time one gets any kind of a response? Any pilots who've got responses might know.
Thanks.....
BD

[kk pilot]

Malyr - It can be hard work - very hard work if you consider the toll on your body at age 50+. Sing is a very decent place to live and recover from that toll but it is getting more expensive by the day. I would strongly suggest a back-up plan if eventually things don't work out as you envision (such as the contractual flight time, bonus....).

Forget about living anywhere but Singapore (or KL) - no EU basing - history

You are a "hired gun" - period

787 - took 7 mos to get an interview, another 8 to get the call - had a week to show up with basically no prior notice - that's just the way they do it. Better have your s**t in one bag and ready to roll if you want a position with SIA - there's plenty in line behind you ready to pounce.

[boeingdream787]

Thanks KK,
Ad makes no mention of wide body experience.Kinda a change (pleasant or otherwise?)from the past is'nt it...! Means short/medium haul drivers may apply too??

[horizonhunter]

Hello,

Many of you say that you waited for a response for many months. Was there a recruiting campaign at that time? Were you already rated on type?

Does anyone know how long the wait is for one already type rated with this new recruitment?

Thank you,
HH

[fourgolds]

Can anyone at SQ tell me how flexible they are on the 3000 jet PIC requirement. Would they consider 9000 hrs total time 2000 hrs PIC on A330 and A340( 1700 hrs) and B777 ( 300 hrs) , just curious to see what the market ductates. Its a nice place to live. Also , can anyone confirm it is possible to live in KL or Johor as well. TKS

[swish266]

Hi Guys,
First of all I wish good luck to everybody applying!
And many tnx to those who bother with our enlightenment!
My personal question is:
What will it cost for a family of 3 (one teenager) that will fly in with the suitcases only to set-up?
At my current place it cost me upwards of 20k USD in '99!!!
I know that landlords are asking for 3-4 rents up front guarantee.
Is it still true SIA pays education untill age 21?
For those studying abroad is there an edu allowance cap-off?
I would mostly appreciate an answer from someone who moved there up to max 18 months ago.
Once again tnx for your time.
:ok:

[F.QII]

If you have the 3000 PIC but its all on A320's and B737's is there any chance of a look in for a B777 or A330 command or even some form of accelerated command?

[Metro man]

swish266

A landlord is looking for a months rent in advance, and two months rent for deposit which is returned at the end of the lease less any damages. The agent gets a months rent for commission, if the rent is less than S$2500 a month paid by the tenant if more paid by the landlord BUT this may have changed with the rent increases as S$2500 will only get a reasonable studio apartment. A more realistic budget for a condo is S$3500+ which will get something reasonable, near the airport, possibly furnished. Head to the East Coast and the rents climb sharply, head into town and you may not be able to eat after paying the landlord.

Deposit for the electric is S$400 I think, reckon on S$250-300 month with moderate use of one or two aircons.

Has got very expensive over the last two years and airline industry packages have not kept pace.:(

[Left Coaster]

PLUS... a one terms worth of deposit on your school in Singapore...refundable. PLUS... a deposit for your phone and cable and internet, also refundable. No Offshore schooling allowance at all... Max two kids school allowance... Hope that helps...Cheers

[gb777]

No Offshore schooling allowance at all... Max two kids school allowance...
Isn't that for Sincargo?

Mainline (777) allows child education assistance for up to 3 children AND overseas schooling is also allowed. (CA 2005)

[Left Coaster]

Cargo...anyone from SIA mainline able to clarify? Thanks...

[kk pilot]

2 kids covered @ 1400/mo (max) per month during school months only - not for 12 months, only the school yr of 9 mos. thus around 9 x $1400 best case - however, this amount covers less than half of the cost of private school these days. You can expect around $17k/yr per student out of your own pocket - I'm the voice of experience

yes any approved (accredited )school worldwide should be covered

Anyone thinking about coming here with 3 or more childred and looking for anything other than local schools had better think twice.


and should I mention the rent these days.....?

[BANANASBANANAS]

With the population of Singapore forecast to grow by at least 25% in the next decade rentals are only going to keep on rising.

[horizonhunter]

Does anyone know if SIA have started calling for interviews?

Thank you,

HH

[EL CAPITAN]

So a figure of about 12000-14000 s$ a month incuding rent, school etc, living somewhere on the east coast or closer to the airport for a family of 4, 2 children 5 and 7 years old is a good estimate of all the expenses?? Any imput well appreciated guys...The Capt:ok:

[BANANASBANANAS]

And a net salary (for Cargo) of around $17-18000 if you allow for income tax but not profit share.

You will earn enough to pay your bills and live but dont plan on saving much, if any, of your salary. Profit share wont always be 6 months salary.

Most families with children also feel that they need a car for school runs etc - they dont come cheap either.

[boeingdream787]

Hi,
Just heard from a local source that theres some huge resentment brewing from the ex SLK guys who joined up as SIA F/O's and Captains. Also from current SLK Capts who see this as a somewhat of a lost opportunity....:suspect:. Do i see another EK in the making....??!!?
Not a good time for SIA managment I can see.Would'nt want to be sitting on the LHS of a friend of one of these dis gruntled FO's/Capts....:uhoh:.
Would it be a good time to join SIA i wonder......?

[confirm-finals?]

SIA looking for 330 Fo's too?

Strange they looking for guys when they currently dont operate any 330's...Is the rumour true? 20 a330 due to delay in a380?

[kk pilot]

I would probably forget any possibility of an FO 330 job (or any mainline FO job for that matter) - cargo 747 FO jobs only for now. Mainline Captains are all they want - and other than some transition guys from the 744 mainline and a few Silk Captains, there haven't been any new DEC 777 Captains in over 2 yrs.

To all of the prospective pilots out there - SIA mainline is a very good job - BUT if that bonus goes away or significantly reduces, Singapore will be basically unaffordable with a family. Nice lifestyle now, but slowly (and surley) changing unfortunately.

[Left Coaster]

Did some homework and looked at a car plus costs...minimum to RENT for a month. round figures... 1000 per month...we pay way less for a taxi and although it can be a chore to get one on the street at certain times of the day, it certainly doesn't come near to the rental or lease rates. If you want to own...well, that starts to cost. Purchase plus taxes plus Certificate of Entitlement (yes it IS a prviledge to own one here! But that's Singapore) and you'll find taxi fare is not such a bad deal. If your kids attend any school, there are reasonable companies and costs vary. Or the good old bus/MRT is clean safe and reliable.

[BANANASBANANAS]

Totally agree with you LC. Thats why we use the highly efficient public transport network and dont own a car either. But some people still seem to feel the need to own/rent and run a car despite the high costs.

Bottom line is that a car is a very expensive luxury in Singapore.

[horizonhunter]

I got this from a friend who lived in SIN in the 90's.


Most everything works.
Getting around. It rains every afternoon
at 3:00pm, so you can't get anywhere
without getting soaked. Buses and taxis
all full.
Cars attract something like a 300% import
tax (to keep numbers down) so a friend paid
$US80,000 for an eight-year-old Hyundai (with
its road license). Check out if this is
still the same? Nowhere to go to, but you
still need a vehicle.

Accomms. They probably will take care of
you, but whatever you'll likely be in a high
rise (very nice) in a suburb (very isolated).
All very expensive -- not as high as HKG, but
expect to pay several $US000/mo.

Schools. The American $chool in $ingapore
is top notch, and charge$ accordingly.
Getting the kids there in the mornings
could be a challenge.

Prices. Expect to pay US prices plus 50%,
and you'll not be too surprised. Lots of
decent supermarkets with most of what you
need at a price. Local restaurants are
around the same prices as U.S. Among the
orld's best food from the food stalls.
Clean, cheap, great.
Social. We found a bunch of pretty nice
expats ("If you can't find it in Singapore,
you didn't really need it"), and there are
absolutely terrific opportunities for eating
everywhere.

Safety. No trouble on the streets.

You'll get overcharged as a long nose,
and blonde one, in local restaurants
but it's peanut$, if you don't mind
the discrimination. Fake smile, and
pay.



Does anyone know if they have started calling for interviews?

Thanks,
HH

[Ndicho Moja]

Budget about S$3000/annum for bus, trains and taxis. that should cover for a family. But is is a start. Late weekend taxis from Changi are quite expensive. Rush hour from the East Coast area to Orchard area best part of S$20.

Just to recap what has already been said here; Reasonable housing, not near Orchard Rd, S$50,000-70,000 pa. International school for two middle school children, S$50,000 pa (for both), tax, S$18,000-25,000 pa. Those are the big ones. Food all depends on where you buy and eat. If you can buy at the 'wet markets' for your fruit and vegetable and Hawker Centres (street restaurants) you will save quite a lot. If you buy from the up-market super markets then you will pay.

Services are all pretty good almost every thing works and no obvious graft to deal with.

Just saw an ad' for an apartment on the East Coast area, three bedroom, breaking lease currently S$6000 pm.

Good luck

[boeingdream787]

Hi.
After having sent in your papers,alongwith the application form,has ANYBODY got either a "confirmation of reciept",or a hold pool confirmation or even an interview date,
Approx how long before one could expect either or all of the above confirmations....?? Thanks.
BD

[kk pilot]

Forget about notices, nice e-mails, long lead time, etc - that's not how they typically do business - you'll get your notice when and if they want you - with practically no lead time :ugh: - better have your ducks in a row and ready to show up immediately if you want the job (my own personal experience). Communication with applicants is not a priority.

[Phantom Driver]

Quote:
Forget about notices, nice e-mails, long lead time, etc - that's not how they typically do business - you'll get your notice when and if they want you - with practically no lead time-better have your ducks in a row and ready to show up immediately if you want the job (my own personal experience). Communication with applicants is not a priority.

Not strictly true;my induction process (into SIAC), a few years back was courteous and informative all the way. Lots of communication and no real pressure. Course start date offered was when it suited me. Mind you,those were in the early days of the SIAC programme.

[Left Coaster]

Likewise...prompt replies to relevent questions, course dates offered in coordination with leaving the old employer, all wrapped up in a very informative package. Not sure what HR looks like now, there have been a couple of personnell changes in the the last year or so...(no more Dragon lady!:eek:) I would guess it all depends on how many applied and how many will get an offer.

[nikiball]

Anybody know age limit to join SIA Cargo as well as SIA Passengers?

[skiesfull]

What, no more Dragon Lady??? Sacre bleu! Actually, I found her to be very helpful and prompt in replying to queries.
Can't help with the max age to join Cargo, but the max. age to fly in SIN is 62, but will, no doubt, rise to 65 in good time. I believe it has to do with Singapore's labour laws concerning retirement age.

[horizonhunter]

I have just received confirmation email and invite to interview, sim and med. visit in April.



Good luck to all,
HH

[portquartercv67]

Not trying to be a party-pooper or sour grapes, but those seriously considering joining SQ and required to enter into a training bond, at least consider my warnings in a separate post. Knowledge is everything.

The very FIRST thing you do in the first 5 minutes of entering the office when joining SQ is to sign the training bond. It's not till after, that you start seeing some of the fine print.

eg... the advert on their site says once a year free home base travel. Be advised, it's not really free. You have to pay the departure/airport taxes, which from SIN to the either Europe/USA is about $60 per ticket. But, that's not the real hit. On top of that, they add the FULL non-discounted value of the travel on to your taxable compensation. You will pay 10% in taxes on that. So my home base travel ends of costing me close to $300 per family member. Free? I don't think so. Also, the ticket is only valid to the city that you designate when joining as your "entry city" so to speak. Can never be changed over the duration of your contract.

advert also says: "free generous medical coverage" actually, not really free. again, the premiums the company pays are added to your taxable compensation. AND, (a big and), the coverage offered for your dependents is laughable. Basically covers very minor issues with lots of exclusions, up to a maximum of S$8,000/year. I can not sleep at night knowing that, so I purchase addtional insurance. another net reduction in compensation you had not counted on.

All these things whittle away at the annual package they advertise. And you don't learn about these things until after you have signed a S$142,000 training bond, brought S$56,000 in cash to SIN, not to mention the cost of moving yourself/family there. The S$5,000 they provide for moving expenses will cover the average bachelor. Not a married man, especially with children.

There is lots of other "fine print" that you can't/won't read until after signing the bond agreement.

caveat emptor!

PQ

[chapola]

Thanks for the warning PQ. Sometimes we ignore these things when we are staring at a big new shiny Airplane. Your words give pause for thought.

“When work is a pleasure, life is a joy. When work is a duty, life is slavery.”
Maxim Gorky

[boeingdream787]

Well spoken chapola.....
PQ.....
"brought S$56,000 in cash to SIN".......whats this SD 56,000 in cash that u have to "bring" to Singapore pls...??!!:confused:
And is the 142,000 a cash up front or indemnity bond.....ie do they deduct from ur salary,or is it an insurance against leaving...?? I'm talking expat terms...
BD

[Ndicho Moja]

Yes, stump up with case AS WELL AS sign a bond. Nothing foolish about this lot. I believe that one of the first things they ask and they ask it more than once, is if you are able to meet bonding requirements. If not, "Game over".

Good luck.

[portquartercv67]

Straight skinny on the training bond arrangement with SQ (my numbers relate to my contract, however the principle will be the same).

Training Bond total you sign is for S$142,000. Your liability lineraly reduces on a pro rated monthly basis (S$2367 / month) over 60 months once you have COMPLEATED YOUR INITIAL LINE CHECK (read not from date of joining. Training takes forever!). Bank guarantee in the amount of S$56,000 is part of the S$142,000, not in addition to. This amount you must place on deposit in a bank in Singapore within two weeks of joining (along with all the legal letters that SQ will supply for you AND which you must use). If you default on the bond (leave early), the company immediately exercises its right to these funds and applies it to your bond liability. So, if you leave late in your term, you may owe less than this amount and will receive the balance due you.

The gratuity of S$10,000 per year that they pay you if you stick it out is further financial pressure/incentive to encourage you to stay.

I've made the statement that this bond amount is exorbitant and bears no relation to SQs actual training cost. As a perspective, Alteon training in Seattle will provide you training for a B-744 type rating on your ATPL for approximately US$12,500 and done in four weeks.

None of this was an issue for me before joining because I naively believed the advertisements and verbal statements made to me regarding my compensation and working conditions. I also naively believed that I would be treated with professional respect. Had my experience mirrored these expectations, the bond arrangement was/would have been ok with me.

They will ask you at the interview if you have any questions about the bonding arrangement. We are all human and all will have a reticence in asking to much about this because many will feel it will have a negative impact on one's being offered employment. I don't think that is a misguided concern.

So again, think long and hard before signing such an agreement. Ask yourself if you would as cavalierly enter into a similar financial arrangment in other areas of your life. Once offered employment, request a copy of the bonding agreement and the full contract terms/conditions. If going to mainline, contact ALPA-S and get a copy of their CA. If going to Cargo, go online to CAAS (Singapore's FAA/JAA) and look at the flight time limitations. This will give you guidance on how "hard" you will work and what they can do to you.

Again, Singapore itself is very nice, food great, safe, people friendly and easy to acclimate for you/family. That's the only thing that has kept me here this long (2 plus years), despite the overall negative experience with the company. But it's not enough to keep me here for 5 1/2 years.

PQ

[horizonhunter]

Does SIA offer a pension fund/plan for pilots?

Thank you, HH

[millerscourt]

HH

They do indeed have a " cunning plan " but nothing to do with pensions.

PS No such word as Pension in "Singlish"

[kk pilot]

Haven't seen the actual advertisement myself, but I heard the latest SIA DEC offer (for pilot recruitment) in the aviation publications where it usually can be found is less than 2/3's ($'s) of what is currently in place for those already employed. Anybody have details? A significant downward trend in compensation with the supposedly shortage of pilots? - would be pretty bold if true.

[Fly3]

A buddy in SIA tells me that they are negociating a new collective agreement right now and that things are looking pretty grim. He cautions that the advertised package may not be honored as the new CA will take preference.

[ArkPilot]

PQ,

Nice work on the training bond issue.

While I have had some negative experiences the positives outweigh the negatives by far. SIA/Cargo is like any other job, you do the research then you make a decision.

I would generally recommend SIA/Cargo to any DEC. It is without question the best job I could have, given my situation. That said, it may not be the best for you. That doesn't make it a "bad" job or a "good" job. Rather, it makes it a "good" job for me and my family.

Those of you looking for work need to make up your own minds as to what will disqualify particular jobs during your employment search.

Good luck, and good hunting. May you be as happy with the results as I am with mine.:ok:

[BANANASBANANAS]

Pleased to see you happy Ark. You do raise a valid point. We too are happy in Singapore but that is occasionally despite the airline rather than because of it.

There are imho definite warning signs that SIA are trying harder than at almost any time to significantly reduce terms and conditions and we need ALPA S to stand firm when any CA is negotiated.

[ArkPilot]

And just how do you suppose are they able to stand firm?

Management doesn't recognize the expats right to be recognized by ALPA-S. If they did it wouldn't matter since by law, expats don't have a vote, unless they are a PR, then they don't have housing/education allowance.

We could all join ALPA-S as a show of support, (what's your status?), but that gesture would be largely symbolic.

At the end of the day, it's all a matter of who waits out who and what do you agree to in order to maintain labor peace. We (expats) are guest workers who observe the process from the sideline and offer encouragement to those who fight our battles.

I would still rather be on the sidelines in Singapore than anywhere else. JMHO;)

[millerscourt]

Just look what happened a few years when a previous Alpha-S person stood firm. He was, despite being a PR ( Permanent Resident ) booted out of SQ and Singapore.

As Ark Pilot rightly points out there is no "standing firm". You will get what SQ decide and if you want to say no then like some time ago it 2.5 years to agree a new CA and after the Ministry get involved to settle dispute if Alpha-S still do not agree then standby to be threatened with no back pay which quickly sorted it out last time around.

This is still a good job for some depending on your own personal situation. Personally I would not have left my company to join SQ based on current rental costs in Singapore,and currency exchange rates.

Although the Bond is large you do at least get it all back after 5 years on the line. Just make sure you are prepared to stay the course and know what you are letting yourself in for and do not rely on large bonuses year on as the formula could change and goal posts moved.

[BANANASBANANAS]

So, the only options are to bend over and hope there is more vaseline than splinters on the broom handle or resign?:=

There are other options but I agree you have to tread very carefully.:ok:

[horizonhunter]

It all depends of where you are coming from now.

HH

[BANANASBANANAS]

Indeed it does. But, speaking as someone who came from an airline that couldn't organise the proverbial in a brewery, paid abysmally and generally ceased caring about its pilot workforce, can I say that life in Singapore will, indeed, seem great for a year or so. Then, the reality sets in. Sure, it might pay a little more than where you (and I suspect I) joined from, but 32 days leave v 57? No staff travel to speak of v ID90 after 6 months, fairly low taxation v no tax whatsoever, petrol at $2 a litre v 50 cents? Inflation at almost 7%. House rentals up by almost 100% in 3 years and only 11% increase in housing allowance?

There are some plusses to living and working here and, yes, it is still better than where I came from (by a country mile) but the trend is worrying - very worrying.:ok:

[millerscourt]

Bananas
I know what you mean about the reality setting in. I well remember Phil Squares waxing lyrical about SIA Cargo trying to make out the contract was as good as mainline.He never seemed to position or when he did it was always in First Class etc. He always seemed to fly only 50/ 55 hrs a month and seemed happy with that despite flying pay being reduced as in my book you need to fly 70+ hrs per month to make the job financially viable.

He was fortunate to be B744 rated when he joined so could leave when he wanted to as better opportunities arose but if you read some of his early posts he would have you believe he had hit the jackpot joining SIA Cargo. Then again he had come from AAI which is understandable. I guess the same applies to those from RBA.

[Phil Squares]

He was fortunate to be B744 rated when he joined so could leave when he wanted to as better opportunities arose but if you read some of his early posts he would have you believe he had hit the jackpot joining SIA Cargo. Then again he had come from AAI which is understandable. I guess the same applies to those from RBA.

MC, when I first arrived at SQC, I was very happy and things were very enjoyable. I rarely positioned at all, when I did it was to HKG and in the 3 years I was there I only positioned in Y once. That was a AMS-SIN flight and it wasn't fun.

However, shortly after Capt Gan left, things took a turn south and seemed to accelerate on a daily basis. When I got there, you could pretty much make a request to scheduling any time, then under the new/current CP, it was once a quarter. The trips got worse and worse, the positioning increased and increased and the satisfaction factor went down and down. Multiple changes to the contract, changes in the homebase ticket. Things like that are just the tip of the iceberg.

When I interviewed, Gan made the statement we could expect to fly 75-80 hours/month. I took that with a very large grain of salt and really didn't believe him that it would ever be like that. For me financially, it worked flying 50-55 hours month. I did that on a fairly consistent basis and never really went over 60 hours and seldom went under 45. However, I know plenty of people who made the decision based on the published figures of S$7000/mo of per diem and flight pay.

You're right I was lucky being current and qualified on the 400. I probably wouldn't have considered it had the opposite been true. I and my family really enjoyed the living part of Singapore, so much so, we've stayed in Singapore. One thing I don't miss is SQC. The sad part is SQC could have been a very nice place to work had the powers to be not been so bent on bowing to the pressure from SQ.

[boeingdream787]

So again,shoot me for asking a silly question.But how much would a 777 captain "take home" for say 70 hrs of flying."Take home" meaning after tax cuts etc(Including ALL allowances paid by the company).And is there any overtime whatsoever.What's the cutoff hrs/month for overtime.And is the overtime taxable.Also,pls help here,whats the tax percentage(approx) cut from your gross.Do you pay that in Singapore??
Sorry for this rapid fire.But this forum sure has raise a WHOLE lotta serious and very valid issues....!!
Cheers....

[Ndicho Moja]

Boeingdream878......I am not in Singapore or part of Singapore so cannot answer many of your questions. However, take a look at www.iras.gov.sg. This is the web site for the Singapore tax office and will help with tax rates.

Tax on S$160,000 approx S$16000
Tax on S$200,000 approx S$23000

ROUGH GUIDE ONLY!

[BANANASBANANAS]

The figures quoted above by NM are technically accurate but dont really apply to an expat pilot for 2 reasons:

1. A portion of your salary (out of base allowance) is deemed to be earned outside SIN and is zero rated, and;

2, (Really expat capt only) You can apply for 'Not Ordinarily Resident' status and you are then taxed at a flat rate of 10% on your taxable income (see point 1) for a period of 5 years. Noone knows what will happen once the 5 years are up as it is a fairly new scheme. It is really for capts only as you would pay more tax under the scheme as an F/O. You need a gross salary of about $190k pa to make the scheme attractive.

You can also pay any income tax liability in interest free monthly installments a year in arrears if you wish. Two minor snags with this as follows:

1. By the time your tax bill is calculated there might only be 7 months of the financial year left so the monthly installments (albeit for only 7 months) can be a bit steep.

2. When you leave Singapore you will be presented with a tax bill that must be paid in full prior to leaving. At the moment, profit share would take care of that liability but who knows what the future has in store. If you leave at the end of your contract then the gratuity would cover any outstanding tax bill.

There is usually more to it than it says on the label in Singapore!

[kk pilot]

Your last (aprox) two - three months of work in Sing will be for the gov - don't plan on taking any of that with you - it will all go for taxes - beware and be prepared :mad:

[expat400]

"Your last (aprox) two - three months of work in Sing will be for the gov - don't plan on taking any of that with you - it will all go for taxes - beware and be prepared :mad:"

So what? That only means that the 9-10 months ahead of these you didn't pay any tax at all. Is that a bad deal?

If you are able to plan your life you can set aside the tax every month and pay it all when you get the final bill.

There are many issues with Singapore and Singapore Airlines but tax is definitely not one of them. I paid about 8 % of my total remuneration last year.

Swish. SGD pegged to USD? Then explain to me how it's gone from 1.60 to 1.38 in a little more than a year?
And if you think that scares you from Singapore, where would you recommend people to go? Sandpit? They have a real "peg" to USD. KAL, JAL etc all pay USD so that's a no no.

Europe? Well, you might have found a tax free way but for most guys with families that would be impossible so the Euro salary would be heavy taxed...

[kk pilot]

Those last two/three months of tax are in ADDITION to the tax already being deducted monthly for the preceeding year. To be fair, it is not extra tax, just payment in full seeing that tax here is paid in arrears. If you plan to leave for good, the gov will ensure that you don't leave without paying all of your taxes. That's a big bite of cash when you depart. I have no problem with Sing's tax rate - I do find my rent more than doubling in a year a bit hard to swallow

[boeingdream787]

Thanks a ton for the info guys.The 8-10% tax bracket sure's a relief...!! But i still dont know what would be the approx take home of a 777 captain doing 70 odd hours a month.....:confused: . Would appreciate help there.....
BD

[kk pilot]

After tax, rent, utilities, transport - expect around 6 - 8k sing$ - less if you have kids in private schools - now subtract what else you spend as lifestyle, food (can be cheap or expensive - just depends), etc. Don't always count on 70 hrs /mo either - there are vacation days that will be assigned to your roster if you don't bid them and you don't receive flt pay for those - some months will be alot less than 70 hrs, some will be a bit more. Take heed of the advice given earlier - Sing is getting very expensive - you are buying into a lifestyle here as much as anything and it takes alot of money to fund that lifestyle. The bonus is keeping everyone's head well above water for now - let's keep our fingers crossed that it doesn't go down in a big way

[expat400]

boeingdream787

70 hours 777 will give you about 18-20K monthly after tax depending on the destinations.

Bonuses and 13:th month not included.

Right now they are flying 80-90 hours a month so an average of 70 hours a month is very realistic.

[locblue]

B777 Captain: in S$ per month

Basic: $9300
MVC (Monthly Variable Component) : $767
AVC (Annual Variable Component): $767 x 1.15 (paid lumpsum in June for whole year)
Meal Allowances: $2000 (on average, including in-flight & overnight allowances, incl 6 weeks leave, tax-free)
PPA (productivity allowance): $4000 (on average, incl 6 weeks leave)
Transport: $120
Bonus: Between 3 to 6 months of (basic+MVC+AVC)...simplified explanation
13th month "Bonus": 1 month (basic+MVC+AVC)

Income Tax (approx): $2500 (locals), $3500 (expats)

For expats:

Housing: $ 3200 (adjustable, barely, $3100-$3500)
Schooling: $1400 per child for 2 children
Gratuity: $10,000 per year (on completion of contract)
Joining Bonus: Upto $30,000 possible

SI (Service Increment) for every year of service: Approx 3% of basic, incorporated into basic. This year may be more, as inflation has touched 6.6% versus an average of 2-3% over the past 15-20 years.

Expenses:

Housing: $4000-6000 for 3-4 bedder, in reasonable, expat-friendly areas
Car ownership: $1000 (basic japanese sedan) $1500 (basic continental)...(all incl, assuming $70,000 Toyota Altis - $110,000 Opel/Audi, 10 year loan, 10% down)
Taxi: $700 (if no car)
School fees: $2000 per child at any good international school, all incl
Live-in Maid: $650-$800
Groceries: $1000 (family of 4)
Eating out 4 times a month in restaurants: $600
Utilities: $400
Cable TV: $150 (most channels)
Misc: $1000
Others: Your preferences

Flying Patterns: Comfortable mix of long, medium, and short haul.

Typical Patterns, variations abound:

Europe: 5 days, Day 1 report around midnight, Day 2 reach europe early next morning, Day 3 stby for 4 hours, Day 4 dep to arrive Day 5 SIN early next morning. Patterns can stretch to 8 days.

N.America: 7 Days, Day 1 SIN-E Asia, Day 2 E Asia - Day 3 N America, Day 4 stby for 4 hours, Day 5 dep N A - Day 6 E Asia, Day 7 E asia - SIN. Patterns can stretch to 11 days

Australasia: 3 Days, Day 1 report evening, Day 2 arrive oz, Day 3 dep oz in the morning - SIN. Patterns can stretch to 4 days.

Africa: 4 days, Day 1 report after midnight, reach CPT, Day 2 OFF, Day 3 dep CPT, Day 4 arrive SIN early morning.

S Asia: Upto 4 hours, expect turnarounds. Beyond 4 hours, at least 24 hours at dest, extending to 96 hours for some stns depending on frequency. Midnight express much loathed.

SE Asia: Mostly turns, occasional nitestop.

W Asia: Between 3 days and 8 days. Nothing typical. Most tiring is SIN-DXB, 24 hrs, DXB-SIN.

E Asia: Usually 24 hrs at dest.

Crewing:

Double Crew (2 capt, 2 fo) for approx 12:30 and beyond, Augmented (2 capt, 1 fo) approx 11:00-12:30, 3 pilot (1 capt, 2 fo) 7:00-11:00, 2 P approx upto 7:00. Highly simplified of course. Depends on many factors, including acclimatization, time of dep, etc.

Destinations:

Europe:AMS, CPH, MAN, CDG, ATH, DME, IST, FRA, BCN, MXP, ZRH, FCO
N.America: YVR, SFO, LAX, IAH
Australasia: PER, BNE, MEL, SYD, ADL, AKL, CHC
S.Asia: DEL, BOM, MAA, BLR, CCU, DAC, CMB, LAH, KHI, MLE, AMD, ATQ, HYD
SE Asia: BKK, CGK, HAN, SUB, MNL, KUL, PEN, DPS, SGN
E Asia: HKG, TPE, ICN, NRT, FUK, NGO, KIX, PVG, PEK, NKG, CAN
W Asia: DXB, AUH, JED
Africa: CPT, JNB, CAI

S$ is not pegged to US$. MAS (Monetary Authority of Sin) uses exchange rates versus a basket of currencies to manage inflation in Sin. Since most things are imported, S$ can expect to appreciate in the near to medium term.

Rents have probably peaked. Buying an apt is cheaper than renting, in the long term, as mortgage rates average approx 2.5% p.a presently.

New CA (Collective Agreement) being negotiated. Despite posturing on both sides, can expect a 10-15% increase in package when the dust settles (at best), or status quo (at worst).

[EL CAPITAN]

LOCBLUE Thank you very much for taking the time to enlighten us, it is about the best response I've seen so far in this thread and certainly will help us a great deal in our decisions, Thanks ...The Capt.:ok:

[chapola]

Yes, Thanks to all that provided any of this valuable information.

Housing allowance:

-Is it possible to use the housing allowance towards a mortgage?

This new CA:

-If you sign up (expat terms) prior to the new CA being signed, do your terms change according to the new CA, or are the terms agreed to with the offer of employment the ones you live with for the duration of your contract?

Your answers to these questions are very much appreciated.

Thanks again,

Chapola

[locblue]

Chapola,

Yes, you can use your housing allowance to service your mortgage.

The new CA will supercede the CA in force when you sign up. All terms are adjusted accordingly, regardless of start date, unless specified otherwise.

[boeingdream787]

Locblue-Many thanks for this absolutely amazing and intensely informative post. Prolly one of the best on this thread...:ok:
So basically,as a vary ball park figure,one can expect to make anything between 18-20K a month with an expense platform in the range of 12-13K...?? And then about 10% taxes? I take it that would be a fair assessment..?? Therefore a very approximate savings of about 4-5K SD would be a reasonable guess i figure.Sounds like quite a decent plan.BTW whats this 'joining bonus'..? Some kinda company lure to join up I guess.Taxable? And the 10K gratuity.....is it paid yearly or mebbe at the end of the 5 year term,like u suggested. AND MOST IMPORTANTLY,the 13th month bonus....what exactly is that.Sorry,but a new concept to me...!! And when u said its paid 3-6 months,does that mean you could possibly get 3-6 months of your basic pay as a bonus per annum...???!! Sorry for these rather stupid q's,but like they say,the simplest of q's sound also like the stupidest. Pardon me.....but just trying to understand the logistics.....
Cheers now.......BD.....:p

[Cubbie]

boeingdream787:
13th month bonus is not a bonus!
If you were paid weekly you would get 52 weeks pay in a year…
If you are paid monthly 12 months at 4 weeks in a month is 48 weeks
So you are short paid by 4 weeks..hence the 13th month or additional 4 weeks pay
Hope that clarifies! “Weakly” yours….:)

[boeingdream787]

Thx for the clarification cubbie.Which means that one would get a 13th month salary,which essential would constitute one months basic plus change. BESIDES this 13th month salary I assume one gets paid a 3-6 months basic pay(depending on company performance of course) as a bonus...?? Thx in advance for the clarification.....

[kk pilot]

Reality check
- I have not heard of anyone offered any kind of joining bonus in years
- do not count on that 18 - 20k each month - you have vacation time and they will assign it if you don't attempt to bid it - your pay will go down significantly for that time spent on leave (no flt pay and you must take the time off) - also, turn arounds don't pay the same
- 10 % tax is the best you will do, most pay more
- 13 month pay is just the month's basic pay - not all the extras - nice, but not the 18 - 20k that you envision
- bonus is just that - a bonus - it was roughly 6 months basic pay last year but not nearly that much the previous year so don't count on it to be there every year.
- the gratuity is paid at the completion of the contract (if you complete...:eek:)
- count on $6k+ minimum/mo for rent anywhere - and I guarantee you will not want to rent "anywhere" - things are going toward $8 - 10k month rapidly in the typical expat areas and unless you are fluent in chinese, those are the places you would likely look to live.

It is getting very expensive here - be ready

[Ndicho Moja]

Singapore is NOT a cheap city. Inflation above 6% mainly due to housing and cost of food. Be sure of your figures before committing to a sizable bond and moving half way around the globe. Be careful.

[kk pilot]

The bond should be the deal breaker - if you have the rating, take a look - if not, don't sign the bond. Just my opinion

[casio man]

Singapore inflation probably climbed to 25-Year High

Singapore's inflation probably accelerated in January to the highest since 1982, adding pressure on the central bank to curb price gains even as the economy weakens. The consumer price index jumped 5.6% from a year ago, after gaining 4.4 percent in December, according to the median estimate of 16 economists surveyed by Bloomberg. The Department of Statistics will release the report at 1 p.m. on Feb. 25.

The Monetary Authority of Singapore last week increased its forecast for inflation this year, predicting consumer prices will gain at more than double the 2007 pace. Rising prices may increase pressure on the central bank to allow faster gains in the currency in its next review in April, economists said. "It's a difficult time for the central bank", said Tetsuo Yoshikoshi, an analyst at Sumitomo Mitsui Banking Corp. in Singapore. "It cannot tolerate an excessively strong Singapore dollar but at the same time the central bank needs to bring down inflation from these high levels.''
Prices probably rose last month as the government raised property valuations for public housing, the island's biggest power company increased electricity tariffs and the advent of Chinese New Year, celebrated by the majority of Singaporeans, boosted food costs.

Currency Factor

Finance Minister Tharman Shanmugaratnam last week said Singapore will use its currency and diversify its sources of food supply to curb inflation. Still, the government warned there is a limit to the Singapore dollar's appreciation because it reduces the island's competitiveness. The currency has climbed 2.1% against the U.S. dollar this year, adding to a gain of 6.7% last year. It reached the highest in 11 years today, gaining 0.2% to S$1.4074 against its U.S. counterpart. Singapore's central bank expects inflation to average between 4.5% and 5.55 in 2008, after gaining 2.1% last year.

Source: bloomberg.com


Publication date: 2/22/2008

[ArkPilot]

$6k mo is a bit high imo. $4500-$5500 should be adequate depending on family size. Downtown/Orchard road you're looking at $6k+. Airport, much less. East Coast in between. You can go north and west but what you save will be offset by higher cab fare. Then again, if you have children you may want to cut down on their bus ride by living closer to the school.

The idea that you must live near expats of your own nationality is a personal choice. It was not a prime consideration for me.

The training bond is what it is. Learn about it, and make your decision accordingly. I can honestly say it had no bearing on my decision.

Good luck!!:)

[locblue]

Boeingdream787,

Cubby has explained the 13th month "bonus".

"The profit sharing" bonus varies, obviously in keeping with the company's performance. In a "good" year such as last year and perhaps this year, one can expect approx 6 months of basic+mvc+a portion of avc, paid out in July in a lumpsum. In a "normal" year 3 months can be expected. In a "bad" year such as 2003 when the region was racked by the effects of SARS and travel collapsed, one can expect between 0-1 month, depending on the extent of the crisis. Historically, and from a planning perspective, plan on 3 months profit sharing bonus.

The joining bonus is optional. Company will only use it if it has difficulty recruiting. This has rarely been the case.

Everything is taxable, with the exception of meal allowances. Tax rates at http://www.iras.gov.sg/irasHome/page03.aspx?id=1190#resident
Click on "for YA 2007 onwards".

To elaborate slightly on the intricacies of MVC and AVC...MVC is determined at the end of every financial quarter. If the co makes a profit, you are paid the MVC for the next quarter. I shall not go into full details of the exact numbers, suffice to say that the co has only once made a quarterly loss in its history. The AVC is paid out in a lump sum in June, if the co makes a profit for the full financial year. The co has never made an annual loss. The sweetener for retaining your AVC until June is a 15% premium, i.e., you are paid $767 x 12 months x 1.15.

One of the annoying aspects of the pay structure is that when you are on leave, you are only paid the basic and mvc for the month. No PPA or meal allowances, since you did not fly. However, the figures i have quoted are averaged out for the 6 weeks that you are on leave, meaning that for some months PPA and meal allowances can be quite high, just as they will be low for the month when you are on leave.

Inflation in Singapore has historically averaged 2-3%. This year has peaked at 6.6% in Jan, and 6.5% in Feb, partially as a result of the GST (VAT) increase by 2% mid last year, and partially based on calculation from a low base. Of course, commodity prices have shot up world-wide, and that inflation has been imported into Singapore. Property prices and rents too have shot up in the past 12 months, having laid dormant for almost 10 years previously.

The outlook on inflation is for it to moderate to approx 4-5% by mid year on the basis of adjustment of the calculated base. Inflation, however, remains a worry not just for Singapore, but for most industrialized countries.

The good news is that interbank rates are falling, likely resulting in cheaper mortgages.

Eating out can be an inexpensive affair if you want just a regular meal without the fancy trappings. A meal with a soft drink at a foodcourt in any mall, even on Orchard Road, will only set you back S$5-7 at most.

[kk pilot]

Arka*****e - You can take comments like that and cram them somewhere the sun doesn't shine.

[ArkPilot]

KK,

I was going to apologize for the humor(less) comment. But given your response I find I may have touched a raw nerve.

In any event, I offer my sincerest apologies. I will remove the offensive part of the post.:oh:

[kk pilot]

Accepted
thank you

[remlap]

locblue,

What is the 4 hour STBY on the Europe and US rotations?

Remlap

[millerscourt]

That standby covers the crew going back to Sin or elsewhere the day before you are due to go back in case they go sick or get delayed and run out of hours.

[boeingdream787]

Great replies locblue,Arc and KK.Many many thanks.Just got a couple of morre q's or you guys...:p.
1)If one is offered an interview on expat terms can one change to national terms.How...
2)If on expat terms,is ther ANY internal career growth whatsoever....ie Cp/TRI/TRE within the framework of the contract.Any upgrades possible to management positions at all(not that i'm looking for any,but would make very interesting equations).
3)What licence do you fly on.Do you keep your licence of origin(ICAO)current all the time....??
4)Hypothetically,if say another SARS happens(touch wood),what are the chances of just getting laid off.What are the company's obligations towards you and your family.And would it be any different if you were on national terms(do u have a choice to begin with).
5) Lastly,KK u said in post #122 that "if not,don't sign the bond".....just wondering,IS THAT an option available at all...??!! That is to join up(non type)and STILL work around the bond.Cause although all intentions are honourable,just coming up with that kind of money( 56K+ SD ) would be SUICIDE.....to say the least....!!! So wondering if at all any detour is available.Rather, is the bond negotiable at all such as "collateral in lieu of"or other reasonable terms for both parties.
Please....honest replies only.Will be duly rewarded by a six pack of your fav brew.....:E

[RnR]

BD787,

Will try an answer, ALL PLS FEEL FREE TO CORRECT......
1) You can just tell them you want National terms, but no education or housing allowances.
2)No internal growth on expat as far as i know... may be wrong,
3) Fly on Singapore ATPL, your own licence you renew yourself....
4)Expats are the first to get laid off, then expats on national terms and so on...
5) Basically if not type rated.. No Chance, you have to bring the money with you.

Hope this helps,
OFF to,
RnR...:)

[gb777]

BD787

Point 5 :

If your bank has a Singapore office (and only then) you can place the
money in a locked account in your home country (i.e. a fixed deposit). Your bank (Singapore Branch) will then issue a bank guarantee to SIA. (So no need to bring the cash to Singapore)


It requires some paperwork, but in this way your money will at least generate
some interest. Worked fine 7 years ago.
gb

[ArkPilot]

Point 2:
I assume you are talking about instructor positions (LIP, SIP). Yes those are available to expats. Never looked at chief pilot.:hmm:

[hahaha]

One Question On Bond.

If You Have To Leave Unwillingly Before Your Contract Finishes, Say Due To Health Problem Or Loss Of Licence So On, Do You Still Have To Pay For The Training For The Remaining Term? Does Sia Take It From Your Bond?

[BANANASBANANAS]

Very good question. I stand to be corrected here but I think each case is taken on its merits. But there are no guarantees of course.

[fourgolds]

Gents
Just a question , are they flexible with the 3000 hr pic requirement on commercial jets ? What if 2000hrs on A332/A340 and B777 all command time. Have more than 3000 hrs pic if you can count Kingairs and Cessna,s.
Just curious. I guess no harm in applying.
Also if one has say 300 hrs pic on 777 ( increasing monthly) , and one were to join , would you be regarded as type rated , or will they not wiaver the 1000hr requirement.

Thankyou la.

[fourgolds]

Gents
Another question. Could somebody publish the " local terms"
I heard a rumour that if you are employed on local terms after a period you are elligible for permanent residency and eventually citizenship. Can anyone confirm or is this an old wives tale.
Lets say I caome from a part of the world that offers very little future to ones offspring.Aslo is it feasable to live in Malaysia , are there any SQ pilots commuting to Johor or even KL.

TKS.

[BANANASBANANAS]

Yes you can commute but I would not recommend JB. It's not the safest city in the world by a long way.

I believe some guys commute from KL, Penang etc and don't have too many problems. You just need a mate in SIN with a spare room so you can cover your stand by duties etc.

[fourgolds]

Thanks Banananananas.
Now to just see if I have enough experience for them.

Cheers Four

[ArkPilot]

Concur with BB on the bond exception issue. In fact, I believe the wording allows for discretion on the part of SQ.

Four Golds,

"Local terms" are the same as expat, minus the housing allowance and children's education allowance. You can become a PR or citizen while you are on "contract terms". However, if/when you become a PR or citizen you are automatically placed on "local terms". Suggestion, as a DEC start on "contract" terms. Then switch to local as your status changes.

As for the hours requirements, you don't know unless you apply.

Good Luck!!:ok:

[fourgolds]

Ark Pilot
You,re a team player . Thankyou.

[boeingdream787]

RnR,Gb777 thanks.Great replies.....!! Arc..double that for you bro.Very helpful posts and replies. The bank guarantee part sounds conducive. Of course I assume that it all boils down to SQ accepting the terms and conditions of a bank guarantee. In my earlier post Cp meant check pilot,TRI-Instructor and TRE-Examiner. So basically I was wondering if one could eventually hope for a career progression within the company on expat terms. I dont think however that one could expect for a managerial position with SQ on same terms.
Also,guys,what would be the procedure (if possible) for me to import my current car from my home country to Singapore for my use.Would it attract huge taxes to import or run/maintain. Cause I know for sure(as understood in the forum) that maintaining a car in Singapore is a HUGE cost by itself. Wou the case be similar if I imported my current vehicle.Thanks again.....
BD

[ArkPilot]

Thanks four golds.

BD787,

Someone else will have to help you with the auto. Public transport is my means of travel. sorry.

[Metro man]

Basically forget bringing a car with you, there is an age limit that it must be under, then a large fee plus duties and certificate of entitlement. If you really want one, buy it here and pay it off over ten years at 3.5% interest.

[point8six]

Expat instructors are not common in SIA, Singaporeans are preferred. One of the requirements was for 5 years service as a Captain with SIA. Cargo has recently appointed some expats as instructors, but "mainline" DECs would be a better option for employment.
Lay-offs occurred after the SARS epidemic caused severe problems - they weren't all expats. Just don't p*ss them off, as SIA operate a '3 strikes and you're out' programme (unofficially of course).:E

[millerscourt]

Only one Tail Strike at Auckland and he was out!!!:D Then again perhaps it was three?

[locblue]

BD787,

1. Yes, you can switch to national terms. They will be more than happy with that, and so will alpas.

The negatives to local terms are: no housing, education, gratuity, and signing bonus.

The positives are: If you take up a PR (permanent Residency) you contribute compulsorily to CPF (Central Provident Fund) tax-free approx $1600 ($900 your contribution, balance from company) every month + a portion of your bonus that are treated as extra wages. click on www.cpf.gov.sg for more info. Of course, even on expat terms you have the option of enrolling in the SRS (Supplementary Retirement Scheme) wherein you can contribute approx $15000 every year. That amount is tax deductable, but is taxed at a lower rate at withdrawal...a tax deferred scheme of sorts. Google SRS for more info.

Other positives of PR: Subsidised medical care, govt services, preference for jobs for spouse and family, lower salary requirements for credit cards, lines of credit, convenience of not having to renew status for 10 years, ability to sponsor family on a long-term social visit pass upto 1 year, easier housing loans, etc

2. Training positions are available to all, expats and locals. Given the rate of fleet expansion, the co cannot afford to discriminate. Many expats are in training positions. Other options are Management posts such as MPSD (Mgmt Pilot Special Duties, entry level), FSP (Fleet Safety Pilot), and possibly even upto ACP (Assistant Chief Pilot). Beyond that you need to be a citizen.

You can also contribute in alpas (pilots association) as an expat rep dealing with all expat issues. You can be nominated to the Executive Council.

3. Singapore ATPL. Other Licenses your responsibilty.

4. When push comes to shove, local or expat, if you've been a naughty boy, in a crisis requiring layoffs, you will get "retrenched" (laid off) with benefits. There is no advantage to being local or expat in this regard.

5. No way around the bond.

Importing cars not worth the hassle. You end up paying a lot in taxes, equating to what you'd pay to buy locally.

Now, about the six pack....

[gb777]

Point 1

If you choose to become Permanent Resident, your male children will
be called up for military service, (at least if they are in Singapore as PR)


See

http://app.mfa.gov.sg/generator/asppages/hongkong/prapplication.asp

"explanatory notes"

14. Under the Enlistment Act, all male Singapore Citizens and Permanent Residents (PRs) are liable
for National Service (NS) upon reaching 16½ years old. They are required to serve 2 years of fulltime
NS at 18 years old, followed by 40 days of Operationally Ready National Service per year till
the age of 50 years (for officers) or 40 years (for other ranks).

15. Main applicants who are granted PR status under the first generation Professionals, Technical
Personnel and Skilled Workers Scheme or the Investor Scheme are exempted from NS. Male
children who are granted PR status under their parents' sponsorship are liable for NS upon
reaching 16½ years old.



gb

[Dani]

I lived 3 years in SIN (flying for Tiger) and had a car. Bascially, all short haul guys have cars, because you travel to the airport every day. If you are long haul, it's maybe not worth it. Depends on you. Family might want a car.

Prices have come down considerably. If you take a modest model, you get it cheap. 3 taxi rides a day and your car costs are covered.

Advantage with a car: You can take apartments a bit off the route, so you might pay a bit less.

hth,
Dani

[locblue]

gb777,

If you as a PR sponsor your male child for PR, then he indeed does become liable to serve National Service (NS), as a second generation PR. The easy way around this is to not sponsor your male child for PR; instead apply for a long-term social visit pass, valid for 1 year, renewable as long as you maintain your PR status.

If you intend to live in Singapore for the very long-term, your son can apply for a PR on his own merits when he lands a job in Singapore. He will then be considered a first generation PR, therefore not liable for NS.

[boeingdream787]

locblue....thx again.Just outta curiosity,what if your male child is say 19 when you apply for PR....does he still HAVE TO do the NS. And more importantly,what if he has some health issues due which he does'nt/can never pass their NS medicals ( i'm sure they'll have one...!!). Just wondering.....
Bout d six pack....offer just doubled for u mate....!! You're a rockstar....:ok:..:cool:..:ok:....!!
Oh....also,would'nt a bank guarantee suffice in lieu of the bond if my bank,with its Singapore branch, guarantee's me for the bond amount and period. Basically,transfer the funds in the local (singapore) branch of my bank in a fixed deposit where it gathers mebbe some interest too over the 5 year period.....got that from a ppruner too.....lol.Your comments please....!!

[millerscourt]

boeingdream787
Please excuse my curiosity but why on earth would you want to become a PR of Singapore having joined SQ presumably on expat terms as a B777 Captain and then have to go onto national terms?

[boeingdream787]

mc,
I might just start to like singapore a little more than i anticipated.Dont you think.Initial expat terms would obviously be due to fear of the unknown.Would want to tread softly initially,untill I get a feel of things in singapore.Also mebbe give the inflation etc some time to settle down(if).Cause,by what i've heard,the inflation and the rents have pretty much peaked as of now(touch wood).Only way now is south.....
Just my 2 beers worth.......

[Dani]

I don't think so. If you compare prices with the first "gold rush" in the 90s, they still are much more lower. Remember that there is a limited amount of land available (ok, they reclaim a lot of it).

Nonetheless SIN has a bright future ahead. :ok:

Dani

[millerscourt]

boeingdream787 Cannot see what inflation and rents in Singapore have to do with being a PR. You also seem to have failed to grasp the Bank Guarantee/Bond issue.How well do you understand English?? The Bank does not guarantee the Bond you do.The Bank Guarantee is what the Bank Guarantee hence that is why it is called that.:=

[locblue]

BD787,

If your son is 19, he will presumably attend University. He can apply for a Student Pass which is valid for the duration of the course. At the end of the course, has to return to his country of origin, and re-apply for a tourist visa/social visit pass/Employment Pass/Work Permit. Therefore, not liable for NS.

I cannot comment on health issues vis-a-vis NS.

PR vs Expat: I have not heard of too many people switching to local terms from expat terms. In fact, none at all with SIA. Many expats stay on expat terms for 10-20 years until retirement. The loss of expat perks is substantial. The gain in local perks is relatively inconsequential, monetarily. A foreigner can purchase property just as easily as a local. Getting a loan is not that much more difficult. There are other advantages of being on local terms as listed earlier, of course. At the end of the day, your decision.

MC is right about the bank guarantee.

[Reno07]

The B777/A330 captain vacancy notice is vague about the age limit for the position. I am 55 at the present and wonder if that is why there has been no response to my application. A five year contract would put me past age 60 upon completion.

Thanks

[boeingdream787]

Locblue/mc,
Pls correct me if i'm wrong.Basically,if i have the required funds in my bank in my country of origin(sd56k) and my bank has a singapore branch,then my bank(singapore branch) would be willing to stand guarantor for me for the required amount.Provided of course i deposit or "freeze" the amount in a "fixed term deposit" for the required period.In this case,5 years. Now,IN A CASE LIKE THIS,would'nt the Bank guarantee(alongwith the frozen funds of course....which stay in my name throughout),be sufficient for SIA towards the 'bond'. Well,it worked with my present company.This way the funds are frozen in my name + the bank.BUT the amount also picks up interest over the years....which could be a substantial amount! Which is how I might stand to gain a little bit.IF of course,SIA agrees....

[Phil Squares]

Locblue/mc,
Pls correct me if i'm wrong.Basically,if i have the required funds in my bank in my country of origin(sd56k) and my bank has a singapore branch,then my bank(singapore branch) would be willing to stand guarantor for me for the required amount.Provided of course i deposit or "freeze" the amount in a "fixed term deposit" for the required period.In this case,5 years. Now,IN A CASE LIKE THIS,would'nt the Bank guarantee(alongwith the frozen funds of course....which stay in my name throughout),be sufficient for SIA towards the 'bond'. Well,it worked with my present company.This way the funds are frozen in my name + the bank.BUT the amount also picks up interest over the years....which could be a substantial amount! Which is how I might stand to gain a little bit.IF of course,SIA agrees....

In a word NO! While what you propose is very logical, logic has nothing to do with SQ's position. They want the money in a joint account, with both parties names on the account and they want it in Singapore. You have to understand SQ wants it both ways as they are the 500lb gorilla and you're not.

[expat400]

bd87

I have not transferred a single cent to Singapore for my bank guarantee. The Singapore branch of my "home" bank has issued a guarantee to SIA to pay the 56 K whenever SIA wants it.
As a collateral for this my bank first accepted my shares in a European Company. When I bailed out from the stockmarket one year ago they transferred the collateral to my home in Europe.

SIA don't give a s__t about how you guarantee the money towards your bank. They only require the letter from a bank with a branch in Singapore. They don't even know whether you have transferred the money or not.

[getsetgo]

expat 400:ok:
you are bang on
singapore bank will take sevice charges for issuing a letter to SIA.
all banks know the format for SIA. Very user freindly.

[gb777]

Locblue

If you as a PR sponsor your male child for PR, then he indeed does become liable to serve National Service (NS), as a second generation PR. The easy way around this is to not sponsor your male child for PR; instead apply for a long-term social visit pass, valid for 1 year, renewable as long as you maintain your PR status.

If you intend to live in Singapore for the very long-term, your son can apply for a PR on his own merits when he lands a job in Singapore. He will then be considered a first generation PR, therefore not liable for NS.

Thank you sir for that information.

Great thread by the way
gb

[gb777]

bd87

I have not transferred a single cent to Singapore for my bank guarantee. The Singapore branch of my "home" bank has issued a guarantee to SIA to pay the 56 K whenever SIA wants it.


Same here

And:
The duration of the bank guarantee is 5 years and 5 months from
the signing of the employment contract.
(As your 5 years contract will start from the date of your "Check-out"
on the line. SIA counts 5 months for the conversion training)

gb

[expat400]

Getsetgo

You are correct. I forgot to mention my bank's charges. I pay 1 % of the guarantee per year to my bank. Reasonable to me.

[Hey Driver]

Being forewarned of some of the quirks my help ease your entry into SQ.

Here are a few,

Days Off - you get 2 per week however they only appear on your roster after trips of 5 days or more, otherwise they are blank. If you have 3 blank days you could be assigned to fly on any one of them, if this is a long trip your roster will be out the window. At the moment if you have more than 3 days you’ll be assigned standby.

Crewing is one of the reasons you have to ask for permission to leave Singapore on your days off.

A roster day off is from midnight to midnight, i.e. you often start a duty just after midnight following a day off.

Roster - The “bidding” system allows 12 points per year, 1 point per month. A minimum of 3 points for a Trip. 1 point for a day off max 2 in a row.

3P flights - SQ operate some longer flights with 3 Pilots, 1 Captain and 2 FO’s. Problem for the Captain is that the FO’s are not certified to provide in-flight relief for the Commander.

Paxing - EY upgradable to J and 1st. J Class is mostly full (airline is doing well) and 1st is not available on all flights. At the moment we have whole crews paxing all over, saving Hotac and crew days. Paxing will not always be on the direct flight, paxing through another station improves their standby coverage. LAX TPE SIN is a great flight in EY. This area is a mystery to all.

[millerscourt]

expat400 is correct in that you do not have to bring the bank guarantee cash with you to Singapore provided your home bank has a branch in Singapore and is prepared to complete the documentation to SQ's satisfaction. Make sure you get a copy of the paperwork so it is all set in motion before you arrive in Singapore as you have 20 days to produce the paperwork or you are taken off the ground school course.

[hahaha]

Can you please name some of the banks that have branches in Singapore and do this guarantee services? And which documents should you bring when you arrive in Singapore?

[CDRW]

Ref the 3 strikes - anyone heard that the Lahore chap - the fellow that got to 300 feet agl 6 miles out, had 30 seconds of GPWS before going round, that the company is keeping him in his position with a few more training sectors to help him improve his SA!!!??

[boeingdream787]

Thx again guys for all replies.So I have to basically convince my home bank to provide me with a guarantee letter from its singapore branch to the tune of 56kSD. And this should not be too difficult if I have the requisite funds in my home bank account.Frozen or otherwise.
Phil,dont you think it would be reasonable for a bank to provide a guarantee for your ones own funds.Moreso if the funds are locked in a joint account,ie myself and SIA. I guess,time( and SIA ) will tell.Sounds quite fair to me.....but again whats fair to me.....
Also guys,when exactly do you start getting paid the Captains salary.Is it as soon as you join up or only when you are released on line as captain.
Appreciate your input......:)

[BANANASBANANAS]

Reduced basic salary (and no flying allowances of course) while in ground-school and simulator. Makes the first 2 or 3 months quite interesting as expenses are probably at their highest - 3 months deposit on the house rental, up front school fees for the kids etc.

Took us about a year to start saving any money.

[kontur]

Can anyone shed light on how tough the medical?May one expect it`s the same sh..t like in others asian countries(South Korea,China)?:confused:

[BANANASBANANAS]

Well, they took me! Its thorough but not ridiculous. If you can pass a CAA or FAA Class 1 you will have no problems.

The Docs seem to have a sense of humour too. I recently did my tri annual medical board and the Doc was commenting on my rather 'portly' physique and increasing weight.

Doc: "Captain Bananas, Your weight has steadily increased over the last few years. Tell me, what do you do when you feel like taking some exercise?'

Bananas: 'Well, I usually lie down until the feeling goes away!'

Doc saw the funny side and I was 'in and out' of his office in about 2 minutes.

[millerscourt]

hahaha

HSBC and Standard Chartered have branches throughout the world

LloydsTSB have a single office in Millenia Tower, Temasek Ave where you can get mortgages etc


DBS have a branch in London where you could no doubt deposit £Stg or whatever to cover the Bank Guarantee part of the Bond.


PS I can confirm that if Bananas can pass the medical then anyone can!!!:D

[Left Coaster]

Ditto! (same for me...and the missus will confirm my heavier than air status!) Seriously, there are no sneaky medicals here,and even though it's thorough, it's not anywhere near the JCAB astronaut medical...good luck!;)

[boeingdream787]

Just found something out from my bank. Apparantely it does'nt have a branch in Singapore....:rolleyes:..!! So i've contacted another bank (of which i,m not a customer yet),and which DOES have a branch in Singapore. Now i'm supposed to deposit 56Ksd (in MY local currency of course),in this bank in a fixed deposit for the required term (ie 5years 5 months). Only then will their branch in Singapore release a guarantee letter to SIA,in the required SIA format ( which is still a mystery to me ).
I'm guessing this procedure is correct. Of course.....to begin with,i've got to be selected first....!!! ;) ....!! Got a strange feeling that all this "information quest" is prolly gonna be all for nothing.....lol. But better to be prepared than be caught with ur pants down,I always say.
Oh,BTW this bank which is willing to issue me a guarantee for the required amount and period is also charging me a "small" fee. Manager said it was 3% per annum of amount guaranteed for. For the entire period. I managed to get it down to 2%. Did'nt know these things were negotiable...!! Might pick up some spare change at the end of the 5 year period by way of interest on monies deposited,through all of this though.
Still wondering though,what were these papers that one was supposed to take with oneself..?? Are these bank papers required for the interview..??!! I certainly should hope not! Will take a little more time....:ooh: .
OF COURSE......SIA HAS TO AGREE TO ALL THIS.....!! ( Right....???!!? )

[expat400]

Yes, it is the correct procedure. SIA will provide you with a sample so the bank can issue the correct guarantee letter. 2 % is a little on the high side but since you're a new customer to the bank I guess you have to pay a bit extra.

They are not required for the interview. I know of guys that didn't provide them until halfway through their line training but that's not a good way to start your relation with an employer.

Good luck!

[Round D. Globe]

Maybe I missed the answer to this in the numerous threads on SIA but
wouldn't it make more sense to buy the type?

Would it not free up your life a little knowing you can leave when or if you want not having that commitment albatross around you neck? Wouldn't it be worth the investment?

If you already have the type but no time on it, do you still have to sign your life away?

Maybe some of the SIA veterans can help me with this one.

I was just in Singapore last week via Singapore Airlines and both the airline and the city is wonderful.

RDG

[BANANASBANANAS]

Not sure if SIA would accept no bonding if you have the type but no time. Certainly no chance of a DEC.

We have some Captains (SIA Cargo) who were fairly high time 747-300 but they still had to accept the same bonding arrangements as the rest of us who had no previous 747 experience at all - and go through the full conversion.

That said, the market is slowly starting to favour the pilots, especially with the recent below inflation pay rise so it might be worth a go.

Bear in mind though, that after 5 years you are bond-free whereas if you pay for your rating elsewhere it is money spent that you will never see again.

I have to agree with your opinion (from a passenger point of view) of the Airline. The country also has much to attract an expatriate. Unfortunately, the high cost of housing and education, and the company's unwillingness to award inflation matching increases to either allowance is starting to affect operations.

The SIA Cargo rosters already have remarks on them referring to 'crew shortages.'

[goma]

Morning Gents,can anyone tell me what time period from SQ cargo getting an application form to calling you for an interview(if one was lucky)

Any ifo appreciated,
Goma

[BANANASBANANAS]

If you meet all the criteria, no time at all.

[Asia_flyer]

"...Can someone please break down the $210 000 annual salary..."

Salary = $210,000

Cost of Living in Singapore = $210,000

Plus Tax = 8 - 22% (Depends who you ask at IRAS)

Bottom line... ETIHAD!!!!

[horizonhunter]

Hello all,

SIA has asked for my medical documents to be translated in English but my country does not offer this. In your opinion can I do this myself or must be notorized?

Thank you,
HH

[boeingdream787]

HH....yes you can do them yourself but it MUST BE ATTESTED and/or notorised. Oh BTW,how was the interview.And did the bond issue come up at all?? How was the sim.....Anxiously waiting.....

[horizonhunter]

Thanks,

Haven't gone yet. Getting everything ready now. Will report.

Thanks again,

HH

[boeingdream787]

HH,
Whats your date of interview if I might ask.....?? Thx.

[horizonhunter]

Hello boeingdream787,

check your pm.

Thank you,
HH

[B7,etc]

For info it took about three weeks between "Application sent Time "and "Interview invitation Time"
Now, can someone give an approximate time between sucessfull interview and an employment offer.plse?
Thks.

[shoguns]

Hey H.H
CONFIRM THIS IS ON THE 777
THKS

[boeingdream787]

B7.Hey,just wondering.Was this the 777 interview u went for?And,just outta curiosity,how do u know u cleared it..?? What was the interview,sim and meds like?? Thx in advance bro...! Also,any mention of the training bond pls??

[boeingdream787]

Holy crapp.....!!!! Words fail me at this point...!!! Speachless....!!! Is ANY of this true....???!!??

[skymouse]

FlyingtheLine

Good truthful post. That is how it is, at last someone that has posted what actually goes on in SQ and gives one an insight as to what to expect.

A lot more could be added.

You have been warned.

[Round D. Globe]

AAAWWW MAN!

And I was just about to hit "send" on my app. too!:ugh:

RDG

[gb777]

Flyingtheline

Eloquent and accurate.
Great post.

[Metro man]

I am not talking nonsense about intimacy. You sign a specific agreement about that at SQ (no kidding).

Is that the agreement where you are not allowed to have a flight attendent in your room ? :E Often you will be in seperate hotels anyway but that may change as moves are afoot to reduce the standard of hotel given to pilots from 4* to "suitable" Guess who decides what's suitable.

DO NOT use the agents the company "gives" you to find an apartment. Look in the newspaper.

If this is the same one I think it is agreed. She seems to be interested only in people who have recently arrived and don't know the going rates. I tried her myself, one of her first questions was "How long have you been here ?" Answer six months, never heard back from her.

[kk pilot]

Ark - Hmmm,Yank? Just what do you have against someone (lucky) enough to have been born in the US? Talk about bitter - couldn't get your own green card I guess....His post is fair and accurate to the letter - a clearer picture of the current expat situation has not been written. Period. Go ahead, we're all waiting on your "clarification".

[expat400]

Flyingtheline is mostly correct in his observations, but he seems to be the "the glass is half empty" man.

All the contractual issues he mentions are revealed before signing the contract. If you read it...

Bond: I agree it's ridiculous. A 156 K bond for a 30 K training should be thrown out by an independent court. Don't try to take them to court in Singapore though.

Kids education: No secret, the contract is clear. Most guys with kids under 5 come here with a wife so the cage is not really necessary. Wifes can work in Singapore but I wouldn't count on it until the kids are a bit older.
Be aware though, they only pay for two children.

First officers: Yes, they are often inexperienced and due to lack of flying their skills are not always what you experience in US and European majors with shorthaul traffic.
But what do you expect? That is the main reason they hire us!

Layovers: The FO:s often asks me about dinner plans but I usually turn them down. I simple do not have so much in common with a Singaporean that is 20-25 years younger than me. The 10 hours or so we spend on the flight deck is usually enough. Besides, if you have some social competence the world is full of bars where you can meet interesting people. Of your liking...

Other pilots: I'm sorry, but I have never considered other guys Gelang activities being something negative to my life in Singapore.

Local pilots: I have been invited to parties, golf but not dinners. I don't consider that strange. I haven't really invited anyone myself.

Housing market: Now, if we're in the end of a bubble as you say. That is a good thing for the new joiners, isn't it?
However, it seems like youre bitter for missing out on the run. An apartment is worth exactly as much as someone wants to pay for it. Be it 300K or 1,5 million. Not what you consider it's worth.

Overall I do not think Flyingtheline is wrong in his observations. I have experienced it all myself. The difference is that it is exactly what I expected. I am a hired mercenary in a foreign country. I do not expect to be welcomed by all, I do not expect to be "respected" by the company. I do my job, enjoy the benefits (like 10 % tax, a safe society, a wonderful climate, fantastic food and nice travel opportunities in the area).

I'm on Cargo and I'd pay a lot for the chance to be on the 777 in mainline. They have the roster stability we miss. They have the chance to bring the family on trips and they have 42 days of leave...

Come, but come with reasonable expectations. If you want things to be like home... Stay at home.

[Round D. Globe]

Thanks for that Expat400

App sent.

RDG

[BANANASBANANAS]

Yes, 2 schools of thought here.

First one says that you should read the fine print carefully before you arrive. And if you then get shafted its actually all your fault. The second one is that actually its not the fine print that is the problem - rather the manner and attitude in which the company choose to interpret and apply it. I think most of us did scrutinise the fine print but are still somewhat taken aback at the way SIA Cargo subsequently interpreted and applied the contract.

Example? Housing Allowance. $3000 per month (when I joined). "... will be reviewed if there are significant changes in the market rate" says my contract. Well the market has seen rentals increase 100% while Housing Allowance has gone up 11% - and that is taxable. The company attitude is 'Hey, we reviewed it mate!'

The result of this indifference to its employees welfare (whilst supposedly safe in the perceived knowledge that we are all trapped by the punitive bond) is that there is a lot of bad feeling and lack of trust - not with the Flight Ops Managers as such, rather with the money men who actually drive company 'policy.' But the Managers applied for their positions and accepted the keys to the Executive washroom and therefore must take the flak that comes with the job. They cannot credibly feign surprise when guys refuse discretion, have 'just had a beer' when called on a layover to accept a no notice flight etc.

This all has a very definite impact on the 'bottom line' but as no beancounter can quantify it, it is deemed to simply not exist. If the SIA corporate culture could undergo a slight sea change and actually recognise and act on the premise that people are any company's most valuable asset then I suspect SIA Cargo would reap a substantial 'bottom line' benefit from the return of some goodwill.

Unfortunately, there is no sign of that happening, people continue to resign and the stand off continues for those that remain.

What a shame.

[Phantom Driver]

BB's;

Are you sure people are resigning? I have my doubts....

[BANANASBANANAS]

My comments are from the SIA Cargo side of the fence. And, yes, the latest resignation was just a few days ago. Off to fly B777 in the sand pit.

'Crew Shortage' in the remarks column of our April rosters at a not particularly busy time of the year and a requirement to recruit 30 Captains asap is a fair indication of what declining Terms, Conditions and Corporate attitude has done to the SIA Cargo pilot workforce. The company really do need to address this urgently.

We have also lowered the selection bar in an attempt to attract quantity rather than quality and are now interviewing guys (and offering them DECs) who did not previously even meet the criteria to apply.

[locblue]

I was under the impression that this thread was for SIA, and not SIA Cargo. Lets not confuse the two. There is a world of difference between the two, in many, many respects.

[locblue]

I cannot locate FTLine's post. Can anyone help?

[kontur]

FTLine seems to hit smbody`s sore spot."Wise" decision to delete his disputable but strong opinion:=

[expat400]

Too bad he deleted it. I don't understand why. Although I disagreed on the perception of the issues, the factual content was correct and it just shows how it can make you feel about working for mainline.

[ULH Extreme]

I'll put my money on Ark complaining to the Mods, who then deleted it on condition that Ark removed his post as well. Sad , as their were some home truths in there.

[ArkPilot]

ULH,

Keep your money, you would lose!:=

I didn't complain to anyone. I did however, remove my post as the subject (FTL's post) no longer existed.:oh:

[ULH Extreme]

Double or nothing on FTLine's next post:)

[ULH Extreme]

According to the news over on the HK Forum, OASIS is shutting down, so SQ will have a bunch of 744 guys banging on the door tomorrow morning, prepared to sign anything. SQ have the luck of the Irish.

[ArkPilot]

ULH,

You're on!:ok:

(I wouldn't know how to complain to the "mods" if I wanted to!!;))

[boeingdream787]

ULH,
I reckon the OASIS fellas would have to join up SIA as non type rated(B777)....?? Or is SIA just taking ALL who qualify.Typed or not...??!!

[ULH Extreme]

SIA will take anyone who fits their req's. A bunch of highly qual. unemployed, will take anything 747 boys, fits perfectly. What pilot shortage i hear them say, as the next paycut looms.:uhoh:

[ArkPilot]

ULH,

Just curious, what "next paycut" would you be referring to. Or would that be a lack of sufficient pay raise?

I do agree that whatever perceived leverage may have been enjoyed has vanished.

[ULH Extreme]

Anything less than the inflation rate for Everything in the next CA, is what i consider a pay cut. Eg. your cargo housing[at least you got one, zip so far in mainline], work after 60yrs-10% cut. Go back 15yrs and you will see a nonstop erosion of our CA. Don't expect any surprises in the next.

[millerscourt]

I doubt if the demise of Oasis will help SIA Cargo find extra Captains as every time I have seen their Captains in the Copthorne Hotel near Gatwick where they nightstopped they all seem fairly old and probably well off ex BA or Cathay retirees. Cannot imagine they need a job that badly to join on the T & C's offered by SIA Cargo

[BANANASBANANAS]

We have quite a few of those very people already working here. A few years 'fun in the sun' before final retirement. And who can blame them?

[ArkPilot]

ULH,

Hmmm! Inflation rate, good luck with that.:hmm: Don't mean to sound flip, but I've heard this before in another life!

The much discussed housing allowance pertains to expat contracts on both mainline AND cargo.

Interesting you should mention the 10% cut over 60. It's my understanding that at one time SQ's retirement age was 55. When it was raised to 60 it was initially done with a 10% cut at 55+. I don't know how long it will take but my guess is that some day in the future (near or far is anyone's guess:confused:) the payrates will be seamless to 65. But that's for another thread!:ugh:

At the end of the day we will see what our brothers at ALPA-s deliver.:ok:

[boeingdream787]

Once again.....is this a cargo or a mainline thread...?? Sorry for being so forthright. Did'nt mean to be rude......:O
On another note, has anybody so far done the interviews?? Whats the interview like? And the sims...?? Heard that the paperwork's really REALLY REALLY extensive. Wonder why. Its a LOT about the paperwork, is what i've heard. EVERYTHING must be signed and stamped......AND THEN countersigned....!! Can find a whole lot of faults in that. Well,i guess if I was hiring somebody I did'nt exactly know.....:hmm: .....

[getsetgo]

boeingdream787
Once again.....is this a cargo or a mainline thread...?? Sorry for being so forthright. Did'nt mean to be rude......:O
On another note, has anybody so far done the interviews?? Whats the interview like? And the sims...?? Heard that the paperwork's really REALLY REALLY extensive. Wonder why. Its a LOT about the paperwork, is what i've heard. EVERYTHING must be signed and stamped......AND THEN countersigned....!! Can find a whole lot of faults in that. Well,i guess if I was hiring somebody I did'nt exactly know.....:hmm: .....


As far as getting in to singapore goes...sia or sia cargo most of the recruitment,training 6months,bank deposits for 66 months is same.
also paper work ,signatures,recommendation,is same,
not much confusions.
rated /nonrated all follow same system.

[kontur]

Hi,getsego!
Training 6 month fot type rated?:{

[getsetgo]

yep
every body has to get in to the size required by singapore SIA
including cabin crew, must fit in the uniform issued to them .

[Left Coaster]

Not quite right...IF you join with a type rating (777 B744 etc ) and end up on the fleet for which you are qualified, you will be given a shorter course (ZFT) and no circuits for you! (Yes they still do that here!)
LC

[kontur]

How long is the ground course for type rated pilot!

[black gun]

Oh no Getsetgo is here too....I stopped reading the last forum (unpredictable DGCA) he was contributing too as I could not stop laughing at his rather strange comments...those of you who do not know what I am talking about and have a spare couple of hours for a laugh read his previous comments, try unpredictable DGCA. Sorry guys did not mean to go of the subject, but when you read his previous comments you will see what I mean.

[boeingdream787]

I wholeheartedly agree with black gun's comments in regards to said person.....:eek:. Saying 'said person' cause otherwise he'd understand ( shhhhhhhh....!! ). Probably has a programme that wakes him from his sleep everytime his name is mentioned on a thread in Pprune.....!! Must get quite a few wake calls .......lolol.
Back to topic. I now know a friend who claims to have cleared the SIA interview process. Awaiting his call. Says that the sims were kinda ' different '. Got to get details.Shall post them when available.

[Ridox222]

Hi, I'm a Singaporean currently doing my diploma in aviation with an ATPL in RMIT, Melbourne. I would like to seek your opinions on chances of me being able to join SQ as either a direct entry or cadet after my course?

[Left Coaster]

Try the cadet pages please...good luck!:ok:

[boeingdream787]

Colleagues/Friends at SIA,


I have some questions about the FDTL followed at SIA...

1. What are the different flight time thresh-holds for operating with a two man, three man and four man crew?
2. What crew rest is provided on the B777; just cabin seats blocked off, or the proper Crew Rest (bunks etc)? If bunks, is the crew rest the standard fit as offered by Boeing, or the torpedo tubes (or some variation thereof)?
3. What length layovers do you get normally on the B777? with particular emphasis on North America, New Zealand and India.


Cheers and thanks,
BD

[QAR]

dear friends,

would like to know if SIA takes in direct entry FO and what is their qualification.

i checked on the sia website but nothin on it.

thanks

[Static in the Attic]

BoeingDreamer787 - Your real name wouldn'd be "Walter Mitty" would it? Just getting that feeling. Most of the above questions answered long time ago - stop wasting everybodies time - pls.

[CDRW]

Hey Static - give the guy a break lah! Maybe a new boy to the forum.

BoeingD787 not even going to try and answer your first question - as I am convinced that most of the SQ tech boys do not know how 3 pilot, augmented and double crew FTL's actually work in terms of FTL's and check in times.

Crew rest right now on the 777 is actually ( oddly for SQ) very good. It's the boeing standard crew rest facility, with a business class seat ( 2 if double crew) included. And on the 300ER's the crew rest bunks have video feeds from the in flight entertainment.

Layovers - ahh the bug bear of rostering. Basically in the States and Europe you will get 48 hours in the city ( you may do a standby in that time). India is mostly turnarounds, but those destinations that do a layover it's generally 24 hours, the same with Australia and New Zealand.

Hope this helps

[TangoUniform]

Hey Static, is your response a typical Brit response? Why are you wasting anyone's time by your mean spirited, condescending attitude? Oh, wait-it says location UK...oh well, answers a lot.

[Static in the Attic]

Sorry fellas - no, not a 'typical Brit response'. If you've followed the thread you'll see BD787 not new at all, and as an example here is the answer to a couple of questions - on THIS THREAD, on around p7, kindly supplied by LOCBLUE. I'll say again - the alarm-bells-they-are-a-ringing for a would be DEC.


Typical Patterns, variations abound:

Europe: 5 days, Day 1 report around midnight, Day 2 reach europe early next morning, Day 3 stby for 4 hours, Day 4 dep to arrive Day 5 SIN early next morning. Patterns can stretch to 8 days.

N.America: 7 Days, Day 1 SIN-E Asia, Day 2 E Asia - Day 3 N America, Day 4 stby for 4 hours, Day 5 dep N A - Day 6 E Asia, Day 7 E asia - SIN. Patterns can stretch to 11 days

Australasia: 3 Days, Day 1 report evening, Day 2 arrive oz, Day 3 dep oz in the morning - SIN. Patterns can stretch to 4 days.

Africa: 4 days, Day 1 report after midnight, reach CPT, Day 2 OFF, Day 3 dep CPT, Day 4 arrive SIN early morning.

S Asia: Upto 4 hours, expect turnarounds. Beyond 4 hours, at least 24 hours at dest, extending to 96 hours for some stns depending on frequency. Midnight express much loathed.

SE Asia: Mostly turns, occasional nitestop.

W Asia: Between 3 days and 8 days. Nothing typical. Most tiring is SIN-DXB, 24 hrs, DXB-SIN.

E Asia: Usually 24 hrs at dest.

Crewing:

Double Crew (2 capt, 2 fo) for approx 12:30 and beyond, Augmented (2 capt, 1 fo) approx 11:00-12:30, 3 pilot (1 capt, 2 fo) 7:00-11:00, 2 P approx upto 7:00. Highly simplified of course. Depends on many factors, including acclimatization, time of dep, etc.

[millerscourt]

Static

Take no notice of Tango Uniform. He sounds like a person with a big chip on both shoulders so we can all probably guess where he comes from, not that where any of us comes from has any relevance.:= Why is he wasting anyones times with his kind of comment?

[flyknight]

Hi Guys

Any university allowance for kids in the Singapore pay package?

[boeingdream787]

CDRW,
Thanks for the accurate info. Helps having someone answer ones queries on the forum instead of constant barrages....
Cheers all.

[EL CAPITAN]

Could anybody tell what would be your salary during the 6 months of training????is it just the basic or there is any training salary?? do you get perdiem during your Line training??? Housing allowance??? school allowance??Any replies welcome guys.....The Capt.:ok:

[kk pilot]

once you pass the base check sim ride and a few other subsequent training sims, you go to actual line training(flying) and eventually get your line check - the (almost) full pay starts when you go to that line training - therefore, no flt pay during sims - but you do get all of the allowances - housing, school (only with valid receipts and good luck on getting in), etc. from day one. After passing the line check, you get the full line Captain basic pay rate as opposed to the training rate all of which will be specified in your contract. Any bonus pay should be pro-rated for the time you were employed AND LINE QUALIFIED (ie., not in any training) during the bonus period. They even use to offer a $6k loan, 12 mos. interest free for housing set up - you're gonna need it....

[B7,etc]

kk Pilot,
Thks, nice clear info's.
Can I take you a bit upstream of these stages and ask you : from the time of the "ok" at the interview how much time will elapse before they let you know and make you an offer?
Cheers.

[CDRW]

B7 and all interested parties, one of the things that alot of people do not realise is that there is a "hidden interview" as such. If you jump through all the hoops that SIA want in the interview they have to apply for a work permit from the government, and in 99% of the cases it is granted!! Now that can take a week or three. I have also seen it denied.

BTW just check on the school allowances when you do the interview - they may say that school allowances will only be paid to children being educated in a Singapore school, in which case the schooling allowance is pitifull.

[ddsilva]

Hi folks needed to know from the time you sent your resume on the email listed what is the expected waiting time for a response. would really appreciate the help.

thanks in advance

[kk pilot]

B7 -

Totally unknown. They may take their time (months) or call you in a week. but you need to be ready when/if they do call

[ULH Extreme]

Dd, how long is a piece of string. we here in SIA dont and never will, dont belieive anyone. Good luck , Just jump through the hoops as they come at you.

[boeingdream787]

kk
You did say that the kids' schooling alowances are subject to presentation of valid reciepts. Am I to understand that if my kids are studying during my training period ( or for that matter during ANY period ) in say my country of origin,but I am able to get the paid reciepts to SIA for their schools ( which are in my home country). Would I still be paid my kids' schooling allowances?? Or are my allowances valid ONLY if kids are schooling in Singapore? Also CDRW,what did u mean by "schooling in a Singapore school". Is this with reference to "local" schools and International schools?? Or did u mean school in Singapore....?? Much appreciate all ur replies fellas.
Thx kk,thx CDRW in advance.
BD

[kk pilot]

simple - no receipts, no allowance - they need to see the official paperwork then calculate your allowance - you don't expect them to take your word for it now do you..... It's not as simple as I was led to believe. You do not get a flat allowance, it's done thru some magic Singapore Airline formula - like alot of other things. As for kids in another country going to school there while you are employed by SIA, there might be accreditation problems so there's another can of worms for you to play with. Don't overthink this stuff - if you get the interview and then a subsquent offer, it's all spelled out in the contract. Clear as mud

[Fly3]

On CNN this morning there was a report on expats in the financial business having to leave Singapore due to rental increases and school fees. If it's hitting these guys you can bet that it's affecting SIA pilots much harder.

[boeingdream787]

Wow....fly3. Could that be true....??...:ooh:...!! And could u possibly post a link if available. Cheers...

[Left Coaster]

Same deal for Hong Kong, Shanghai, Dubai etc...Not enough $$$ for some so they leave for greener pastures. It all depends on your needs...

[BANANASBANANAS]

Most people need a home and education for their kids.

I think this mindset of accepting that a crap Housing Allowance in SIN is acceptable because housing is expensive in HKG is wrong.

What is Housing Allowance if not an allowance to cover the cost of housing? Same with education allowance.

[boeingdream787]

LC,
You just mentioned 'same in Hkg,shanghai,Dubai.....so they leave for greener pastures'. Wondering,what greener pastures would those be ( since u've pretty much covered the greenest of them ).....!! Just FMI pls. No sarcasm here.

[CDRW]

Just heard that a mates' mate from the sand pit has just canceled his interview with SIA which was scheduled for this coming week. The numbers just did not add up when he took into just how much outlay there was in setting himself up in Singapore. And to me he was the perfect candidate - kids off his hands, looking for something different.

B787 with regards to schooling in Sin, some of the cargo guys will only get a schooling allowance if their sprogs are being educated in a Singapore school - now that is any school I believe - local to international. If you want a real shock contact one of the reputable international school and see how much it would take to set up 2 or 3 kids into the school!! Have the GandT nearby!

I suppose everyone's idea of greener pastures is what they make of it.!!