Owning a flex-wing microlight

[james747james]

Hi there, whats involved with owning a flex-wing microlight? Apart from getting a permit for it what other costs are there involved?

Also has anyone learn't to fly microlights abroad? How long did it take roughly?

Cheers James :ok:

[Blink182]

You will get all the answers to your questions ( and more ! ) at the BMAA....

http://www.bmaa.org

[xrayalpha]

Hi,

Since you have asked:

Registration fee (to put it in your name)
Somewhere to keep it.

That's it.

If you want to fly it then somewhere to keep it becomes more complex:
ie hangerage to keep it at an airfield, a bottle of whisky to a farmer to use his field or trailer it to and from your home.

You'll also need a licence and third party insurance - about 150 quid - to fly it.

Maintenance and annual permit are all variable, as are running costs (ie fuel and oil)

Getting a licence is another lengthy topic too, and much of what is said on Pprune regarding overseas light aircraft training applies to microlights too - except that the only microlight training recognised by the UK CAA is that carried out by UK microlight instructors.

Have a few lessons first, chat to fellow club members - and, dare I say it, your instructor.

Or feel free to give me a phone on a rainy day - 0797 997 1301

Very best,

XA

[Barshifter]

james747james

XA has covered most bases already.

By far the cheapest way into the sky after gaining your Licence is to rent and Im sure XA has an angle on this subject too but there may be some legal issues which may prevent a newly qualified pilot from rental.XA will update us I hope.

Other than that a syndicate is the other option.A second generation two stoke flexwing that is shared between say two or three of you shouldnt cost you too much money unless its a brand new one of course!.Everything split three ways brings your over all costings right down compared to outright ownership.Only bad points is on a nice day all the syndicate members want to fly it on the same day.If you can fly on say a mid week instead of a weekend,availability is much improved.Dont be put off from an oldish machine.My first aircraft was an Pegasus XL and I had some of the best flying in it.There are still loads of these examples flying today and when they come up for sale are great value for money.You still get the same view from an older machine as apposed to the latest hotship and you get more time to appreciate it!

Choose carefully.Biggest may not always be the best.

Regards

Barshifter

[xrayalpha]

Hi Barshifter,

Yep, the latest on rental is that the paperwork is with the CAA to allow rental for two seat use - so it should be available for the summer.

To rent a microlight, it must get a special exemption from the CAA for that particular airframe. If it already had an exemption for rental for single seat use, it will need a new exemption to allow rental for two seat use.

We plan to offer a 912 Quantum weightshift for £75 an hour and a C42 Ikarus for the same.

For more frequent users we already have a syndicate scheme: see
http://www.sportflightscotland.com/own_your_own_aircraft.shtml

for the C42 Ikarus and

http://www.microlightscotland.com/microlight_ownership.shtml

for the weighshift.

Personally, I think a syndicate scheme like this is better than just renting as it encourages people to keep flying - ie I am paying for this so I will use it. Otherwise in winter, people can go a long time between flights!

But doing a check flight with one of our instructors and then renting to view the fabulous Scottish isles from the air will be a good way of acquiring the 60 minutes with an instructor every two years to keep your NPPL current!

Very best,

XA

[Genghis the Engineer]

Having owned a cheap flexwing for years, and had great fun in it, fixed running costs are roughly:

Annual permit: £200-£300
Cheap farmstrip hangerage: £300 pa
Odds and ends: £100 pa
Insurance: £250 pa

Fuel: £15/hr


So, roughly plan on £1000 per year as basic ownership cost, then about £15/hr for the flying. Add in probably £50-£100pa for membership at your local club, maybe £50pa to keep your charts and airfield guide up to date, and £5/landing when you visit other airfields.

Reasonable second hand aeroplanes seem to start around £3000.


Types to look for (if going for cheap second hand): Mainair Flash 1, Pegasus XL, Pegasus Q, Raven-X. There are others, but any of those are a good cheap starter machine.

Reckon also on a couple of weekends a year of "fettling" - just routine fiddling and maintenance outside of your actual flying time. It's also well worth owning (or at least knowing where you can borrow) a trailer: even if you keep it at the airfield, it's nice being able to take it off places (or retreive it after weather traps you in the back of beyond) so if you don't have one, budget for sticking a towbar on your car as well.

G

[BristolScout]

Genghis.

Thanks for the PM. For some reason I can't reply via the same medium. You mention you have a Raven, what's it like to fly? Is it trimmable?

[7120]

If someone flexwing trains for the NPPL (M) and then wishes to fly 3 axis microlights do they have do a formal conversion course plus flight test? Or does the NPPL (M) cover all microlight types irrespective of type?

Apologies for "hijacking" this thread.

[Barshifter]

Im sure(Genghis will correct me if im wrong)all you need to do is to have some "Differences Training" which has to be logged in your book.Theres no set hour limit for this and is usually up to the individual and your instructor of course.Some people are naturals and convert in a few hours some take a bit longer.

[Genghis the Engineer]

BristolScout: PMs should work, or [email protected] gets to me.

Barshifter: I think it's become fairly complex depending upon what you've flown before and what your licences are. Best bet is to ask Roy Hart in the BMAA office I think.

G

[james747james]

Thanks everyone!

So i should plan about £1000/£1500ish a year.
If i didn't want to keep it in a hanger but kept it at home (if i have space!) could i just tow it to my nearest airfield and just set it up there and fly off?!

james :ok:

[Genghis the Engineer]

Yes.

Reckon on about 2 hours to rig and an hour to derig when you're starting, coming down to around 45 minutes / 30 minutes once you've really got the hang of it.

One warning - the wing is always about 1½ feet too long to fit in a single garage!

G

[james747james]

Is it?!?!? in that case could i dismantle the wing completly? is that advisable?!

Cheers james :ok:

[The Flying Pram]

No! you can't dismantle it any more than referred to above. Most 2 seat flexwings have about 35ft span. When folded this comes down to the length of the leading edge which is about 17ft. It's exactly the same as a hang glider wing, only a lot stronger. The wing in its "Bag" is only about 1ft in diameter, so you could always knock a hole in the garage wall! (But don't allow it to get wet when stored).

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

What's the typical pilot weight limit for a flexwing? I quite fancy some cheap fun grass roots flying.

Also, does the wing have to be renewed after a certain time?

SSD

[Barshifter]

Some flexwings are rated on 17 Stone for the front seat.Quite a lot of the older flex's are at 16 Stone.The wing fabric will last quite along time.It depends how you treat it.Rigging and derigging wil affect its lifetime as will storage.Common is to be kept in a hangar although I have seen them left semi-rigged outdoor and constant UV can drasticly reduce its lifetime.

[The Flying Pram]

Also, does the wing have to be renewed after a certain time?
UV can drasticly reduce its lifetime.My Mainair Flash 2 wing finally failed it's annual Betts test after 16 years and 1,100 hours, which I think was pretty good all things considered. Cost me £2,200 for a new sail and rebuild. I often used to leave it outside for several days in a row if the weather was fine, and it would be getting the sun all day. I remember reading that tests have shown leaving one out in the Sahara desert would terminally age it in just 3 months!

The manufacturer says it's best to keep them fully de-rigged in the "Bag", but it's so easy to tear the fabric or crease a cable doing this that I prefer to keep the wing fully rigged and just remove it from the trike for storage. This only takes 10-15 minutes, as against at least 45 minutes (with some help lifting) to fully de-rig.

[BristolScout]

There seem to be two different schools of thought on wing storage, reading around the various microlight sites. One says always derig and store in bag, the other says leave rigged. I guess that there are valid reasons for both arguments but, having the use of hangar space, I would be inclined to keep it rigged and attached. Any comments welcomed.

[Barshifter]

Bristol

From a getting in the air point of view keeping them rigged is best.Nothing worse than spending an hour or so rigging it up and then the weather changes so you cant fly.Also lifting the wing up on to the trike can be challenging if its blowing a bit unless you can rig out of the wind.

Only bad points for keeping them rigged that I can see is getting it damaged whilst in your hangar.Careless handling by other flyers can often result in hangar rash issues such as bent wing battens split fabric and even dints in your pod.You have to rely on your collegues having respect for your kit when shifting it about.When I first started you could always tell who hadnt flown for a while as it would be their trike at the back of the hangar.I used to dread it if Id not flown for a bit.It was always a good incentive to keep current!

If your in a large hangar its not such an issue but at small Farm Strips available space to manoever is at a premium.

[james747james]

Does any know where i can find any farm strips in Buckinghamshire near Wycombe airpark?? When i get my licence i would prefer to fly in and out of a local farm strip but i have no idea how to find out about them!.

Cheers james :ok:

[The Flying Pram]

Get a copy of Brian Lockyears "Farm Strips Guide" to start with. And if that doesn't help go to some local fly-ins and ask around. But remember that many strips are operated on the 28 day rule (planning problems) so you won't always find they want any new aircraft. If you do find someone ask if you could operate from their strip when they are also using it and see if they (and the neighbours) are happy. You might find this helps to get a foot in the door so to speak! It worked for me....