Route to becoming an instructor

[EliasL]

I'm not too sure if this is the right forum or not, I hope it is. If it isn't, sorry for the inconvenience!

I am fairly interested in becoming an instructor, I was wondering what would be the best route to go about it! Thanks!

[ab33t]

Search this forum there are loads of posts. A bit more info will go along way to help give the correct answer... have you completed your PPL etc.

[EliasL]

Yeh I haven't completed my PPL, I'm fourteen mate!

I've searched for a while and I can't find anything at all, can someone please just explain how much it will cost in total and what licenses have to be done?!

[AlphaMale]

Free advise - drop the attitude.

Kids come and go on here, if you want advise then I suggest you make it as clear as possible in your first post and not expect other users to sift through your previous posts to find out.

You'll find the answer to your question here at PPRuNE using the search button. :bored:

But here goes;

PPL, FI and CPL theory will be sufficient to instruct (I'm pretty sure). If you want to get paid you'll need a CPL, you'll be limited by the weather with what I suggested but an IR will solve that.

So really you need a CPL/IR/FI if your looking to get into the airlines then ATPL exams are needed, so it would be worth sitting these exams before your CPL & IR.

Meaning to become a flexible instructor getting paid and ready for the airlines you need: ATPL's/CPL/IR/FI so basically a fATPL & FI (£45k+).

Good luck.

Thread 1 (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=267377)

Thread 2 (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=204622)

Thread 3 (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=279130)

[kiwi chick]

Are you the same Elias that asked about joining the Air Force?!

Mate - pick a career! Two completely different paths and I would be willing to state that there aint much switching between the two!!

Alpha Male

Free advise - drop the attitude

I already gave him the waggly finger := on another thread for the same thing...

"You can lead a horse to water....."

Good luck with whichever way you choose - you may need it.

KC :ok:

[EliasL]

To answer kiwi's question yes, I'm trying to find out different types of jobs around aviation before I choose one.

Maybe my posts weren't understood correctly, don't take that in an offensive way either. I guess I kinda made the impression I'mpatronizing you if that, sorry if it seemed like it.

Having said that I do sincerly appreciate your efforts on still telling me the route, its very respectable and thanks!

On topic:

I don't think I'll be wanting to hand over 45k for an atpl making it something stupid like 70k total inc flight hours, do you have any idea how much just a CPL+IR+PPL would cost? Thanks for the reply!


EDIT: My bad! I should have searched, i've found it now!

[AlphaMale]

I don't think I'll be wanting to hand over 45k for an atpl making it something stupid like 70k total inc flight hours, do you have any idea how much just a CPL+IR+PPL would cost? Thanks for the reply!

Both the CPL and IR will have a theory side plus exams, You'll study the CPL theory + exams and then 6 months later you study the IR theory + exams.
When you eventually decide you're good enough for the airlines you'll need to do the 14 ATPL exams which are much the same as the CPL & IR theory. So in a sense you'll be paying for your professional theory twice.

So:

PPL > CPL(+theory) + IR (+theory) + FI(r)

or

PPL + ATPL then > CPL (practical only) + IR (practical only) + FI(r)

Unfortunately becoming an instructor is going to cost you a huge amount of your hard earned cash. And take a look at the pay you'll be on (£10k to £15k pa) so if your taking home about £1k a month you don't want any loans to pay off either.

So self funding is the best way to achieve this route. If you're only 14 you have plenty of time to save £70k :ok:

If you can get into the RAF and have your training paid for by the tax payers then that's the best route to take IMHO.

[kiwi chick]

I don't think I'll be wanting to hand over 45k for an atpl making it something stupid like 70k total inc flight hours, do you have any idea how much just a CPL+IR+PPL would cost? Thanks for the reply!

Not to mention (correct me if I'm wrong here Alpha Male?) that if you only do up to CPL then you'll being doing work like mine (photography - FUN!!) or remaining in the right hand seat of airlines....

Seems like a bit of a waste of money if Airline Captain is what you want, huh?

:ok:

[EliasL]

Actually kiwi, photography was what I had in mind!

Now you mentioned it is it ok if I could get some more information on it, like how popular is it? Do you need your own plane? Is the payment good?!

Thanks loads for your answers and again, excuse me for what I said before!

[maxdrypower]

Elias , so you want to be a flying instructor who takes aerial pictures in the RAF ? All the answers to all these questions are in the sticky at the top of the page . Remember if your going to apply to join the RAF initiative is a big thing you'll be judged on as is assimiliation and digestion of information , amongst a lot of other things. Try looking a bit harder if your still confused then ask intelligent questions on here and you will find you will get intelligent answers .

[EliasL]

Sorry but I have to say you've gotten the wrong point or your stupid.

Instead of asking me to read things, why don't you read the reply I gave to kiwi. Incredible!:\:eek:

Although I appreciate the advice, I wish you guys would read instead of telling me to when I honestly do.

[maxdrypower]

Ohh Kiwi you are right about the attitude , we got a right little one here havent here .
Quote
Actually kiwi, photography was what I had in mind!

Now you mentioned it is it ok if I could get some more information on it, like how popular is it? Do you need your own plane? Is the payment good?!

So what point have I not got here , or are you asking about being a photographer on the ground ? If so why would you need your own aeroplane ? and why would you ask about that on a flying forum?
Quote
Although I appreciate the advice, I wish you guys would read instead of telling me to when I honestly do.
Today 18:24
If this is true young man then how come you are asking questions that are answered dozens of times on this forum and can easily be found with a very quick search .
Do yourself a favour and forget the RAF you wont last two minutes

[EliasL]

Now you're talking about my common sense when your reading the wrong comment, it's a shame, really.

You told me to search and read, and yet, you can't even find reply that I had in mind.

Since you can't find it here:

To answer kiwi's question yes, I'm trying to find out different types of jobs around aviation before I choose one.

[maxdrypower]

Aha so we have to guess now do we . Grow up lose the hoody attitude you ll go a lot further

[EliasL]

Hoody attitude? Not quite.

[maxdrypower]

Bless !!!!!!!!!!!

[EliasL]

Good luck on your trolling, have fun, thanks for kiwi's answers!

But before I stop posting and fueling this stupid arguement, are you in the RAF?

EDIT: No reply? Oh ok, nice.

[kiwi chick]

Elias

Do you want some honest advice, from not only a pilot but from a "mature" woman who is also a mother and has a little life experience?

If so read on - and I promise it will not be snarky (well... I'll try my hardest! ;)) Life advice first - flying stuff second. That is the order of importance.

[was going to do this as a PM all... but there may be other young guys who fall into this trap so let me put it out for all to see...]

Firstly. The people on here get annoyed with new - and young - people who ask advice and smart-ass back if they don't like the answer.

Whilst you may feel that you were "sticking up for yourself", you need to learn to play the game. This is something that will come with age - hopefully - or sadly, maxdrypower will be 100% correct and you won't go anywhere. Especially with the Air Force.

It may be a bit different over there, but here in New Zealand, Aviation is a very, VERY small place - so to speak. Any incidents - like the public arguement you've got yourself into below - do not fall on deaf ears. They fall into the laps of the people that will, one day, be hiring you. Or Firing you.

There would be hundreds, thousands, hundreds of thousands, of boys (young men) your age who start out with the same dream as you. They get weeded out pretty fast.

Life Lecture over - onto the FLYING!

As I see it, there are three real areas you can head into:

1) Military
2) Airlines
3) GA - General Aviation - which covers things like Flight Instruction, Photography Flying, Small Charter flying etc etc - anything really that does not fall into 1) or 2) !!

1) Military - seems to be a bit of a different process over here, but the end result is the same. I've done the testing and passed - but without sounding arrogant, I am an intelligent woman with very very strong numeracy, logic and spatial skills. Of the 14 of us that turned up, only two of us passed the initial tests. After all, in my opinion, the Air Force pick the creme-de-le-creme because they CAN!

[Disclaimer: to all other Pilots!! I am not stating here for a minute that all other pilots are a class below - just saying that they have a higher starting "benchmark" than GA!!]

So I guess my point here is if you are not overly strong in these areas, maybe look at the other two alternatives.

2) Airline flying - can't really advice you here as this holds no interest for me, but I understand from reading on here that there are all sorts of "sponsorship" or "apprentice" type opportunities to get straight into jets with F:mad: All hours. We have a training school over here called CTC and is full of Poms! So search on here for "CTC" or similar. Look up a member called "Polorutz", he has posted some threads that will be very helpful to you.

3) GA flying - this is what I do and it is FUN!!!

Once qualified with a commercial pilot's licence, you can start earning money for it. A lot of people start out with Flight Instructing - I did until a student tried to kill me. ;) (actually, EVERY student tries to kill you - you just have to be on top of it... :ok: I did it to mine, and you'll do it to yours)

Other options, which may be more abundant over here or in Australia, are parachute flying, aerial survey work, mustering work, ag flying [Ag flying is a very specialised area - look up "tinpis" on here and ask him for advice - if he doesn't know it, it's probably not worth knowing IMHO]

and Photography flying! I fly low level, with the door off, navigating my way round hills, power lines, trees, rivers etc. It sounds like lots and lots of fun but there is no room for error. I am very inexperienced in the whole scheme of things, I have less than 1,000 hours but I am a very cautious pilot and I know my limits. I would not recommend this type of work for someone with less than 500 hrs, but others may disagree.

I don't own a plane. :ooh: I don't pay for the plane, or the camera, or the photographer - I am paid to fly. I don't think there's too many jobs like mine around :confused: these parts, and a lot of it comes down to personality as well as skill. (I met my boss in an Aeroclub bar whilst telling dirty jokes... :ok: I was hired the next day)

There is another member on here called "spernkey" - look him up too and ask him for advice on photography flying.

So there you go my boy, tried to give you "Aviation Careers 101 in a Nutshell".
You have some homework to do and some people to contact. Go do it. :}

Feel free to ask any other questions - just make sure they haven't been answered first!! :ok:

[foxmoth]

I had thought that EliasL was getting the message re attitude:-
Maybe my posts weren't understood correctly, don't take that in an offensive way either. I guess I kinda made the impression I'mpatronizing you if that, sorry if it seemed like it.
I do sincerly appreciate your efforts on still telling me the route, its very respectable and thanks!
Thanks loads for your answers and again, excuse me for what I said before!
Then he goes and spoils it:-
Sorry but I have to say you've gotten the wrong point or your stupid.
Instead of asking me to read things, why don't you read the reply I gave to kiwi. Incredible!
Elias you need to lay back a bit and listen or you will not get far with anyone in this business, the attitude you show in the top examples I have picked out will get you a lot of help and good advice, the last post I quoted just gets peoples backs up, yes tell people they have got the wrong point - but do not call them stupid (and it is you are or you're):suspect:!

[AlphaMale]

KC, I think we figured him out within his first 6 posts didn't we?

Elias - Take a look at KiwiChick's post and decide what you want, there's keeping your options open but you can't join the RAF, Airline and do GA work :=

You're 14 if you want to join then I suggest you get your head down and get a A*'s in all core subjects. When you have these apply to the RAF for a 6th form sponsorship. When you have completed your 3 A levels in Maths, Physics and another subject at the best grades possible (straight A's would be good) either go straight in for the kill and apply for the job (assuming you/they think you're mature enough) or apply to University using the RAF sponsorship.

You will evolve into a different person while studying at Uni and it will give you options too. Study a subject that will benefit the RAF/Airline route and open doors in other areas should you lose your job or medical.

At University you should look at joining the Uni Air Squadron to build up some hours and get involved in the organisation. (I think you have to be part of the UAS to have the Uni Sponsorship actually).

Then as a 21 year old graduate with top qualifications from GCSE > A level > Degree who is physically fit, has good common sense (not the geeky type), a good team player, has ambition and can achieve goals through hard work you MIGHT stand a chance of getting in.

As KC said they can pick the creme-de-le-creme. Should you not be able to fly FastJets (Tornado/Jags/Eurofighter) they may say ... "We'd like to put you on the Hercs or Helicopters". Flying a Herc through a Valley with 3 tanks in the cargo bay must be fun for sure, it may not be 1,500 mph but the multi crew & multi engine time will look good on your logbook for when you apply to the Airlines (should you wish to do this when your 40 years old for example).

By going this route you need to be the best of the best ... of the best! But you get rewarded by flying some of the best aircraft around and your training if free!!!

If you decide the Airline if for you then you need to find £70k, A levels are not as important as RAF route but may benefit you should you want to get on a sponsorship or get into a FTO like CTC. Apparently only 2% who apply to CTC get in, and of those applicants none that anybody knows of has come away not being able to find an airline job.

Other options are OAT / FTE / Cabair etc or the modular route. (Search)

If you want to do what KC is doing then you'll need a CPL but not really the ATPL's. So get your PPL done, then your CPL and maybe an IMC/NightRating etc but as KC stated, unless you have 500+ hrs on the logbook don't bother.

Get into the Air Cadets and get straight A*/A's in your GCSE's and see where it leads you.

And start respecting the forum members!!! KC/Max/myself are posting on this thread as we're trying to help you, we do have better things to do you know. I only post in these threads as people helped me out when I was confused, but never did I disrespect them. So I'm only putting back into this forum what I took out ... It's the circle of life.

[A Very Civil Pilot]

BALPA, the British Airline Pilots Association have a 'How to become a pilot' (http://www.balpa.org.uk/intranet/How-to-bec/index.htm) section on their website