Flight Planning systems

[cyco]

I was wondering how many different types of flight planning systems/software are out there.

I am currently using Airpath/Eagle which is a nice PC Windows based system, and have talked to some guys who use Jepperson.

Any feedback on the most common in use out there ?

[BONDMAN]

SITA's flt planning system is very simple to use, or what about airdata? I haven't used it myself but have been told it's quite a pain when trying to build your own routes etc

[Whooaahh]

Cyco,

Check you mailbox, buddy.

Whooaahh!!!

[You splitter]

BONDMAN,

Have used both in the last four years and can honestly say Air Data wins hands down.
As for route construction, no it won't do it for you. (it's random route construction is not great). However if you are sitting down with the charts out, the interface to input the route is actually very user friendly.

These days with the SRS changing every Airac cycle, you generally end up having to tweak your FPL's and Plogs quite regularly anyway. Can SITA automatic plans take SRS into account when constructing a routing?

cheers


[This message has been edited by You splitter (edited 10 June 2000).]

[Whooaahh]

SITA's automatic plans or ARB ( Automatic Route Build ) as it is officially known WILL generate SRS compliant plans by the end of next week. If you're using the SITA FBS system, ARB v5 Phase 2 goes live on the 6th July, so it should make your summer schedules a lot less time consuming to manage.

"Tweaking" as you call it will probably always be required for any CFP output, but if it wasn't you guy's would be out of a job wouldn't you?

Computerised Flight Planing systems are a tool for Dispatcher to use, not a replacement. As I have been known to say many times, "You can't teach experience" and a computer will never be able to take over the functions of Ops Controller or Dispatcher.

Whooaahh!!!

[greenband747]

May I ask what's the IATA defined each passenger weight ( Body wt, baggage
and hand carry) for flight planning

Greenband747

[vapilot2004]

GB, Check your thread in the questions forum for the FAA guidelines here (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=251103)

[Low life]

The company I worked for switched from SWORD to Airdata I always thought SWORD was a great Ops flight planning tool so I think I was always a bit down on Airdata, but I have never liked the system. Used Jetplanner for a while though it was great, but a little bit of a mess around. Getting use to Graflite at the moment, in general a very good system.

[Austin_Danger_Powers]

Lufthansas LIDO is pretty good.
Meanwhile approx 70% of all mayor Airlines uses LIDO.

here are some: BA, EK, LH, KL, AC, SQ, AZ, FX, QR, MP,QF, AY and so on...

[merlinxx]

I used Jetplan for over 20 years applied both to civil & military ops and can't help but say it is the best. All SRS routes have to be tweeked at some time even if theye are auto loaded, 'tis trial and error. Have fun as this is now a very tightly marketed product line. Talk to those that have to download thier own grib wx !!!!!!!:ooh:

[Low life]

Had a small play with Lido when it was on the bench at BA, Looked a great system, but big price tag. Hence only a big boys toy

[Raethmeon]

I use Air support pps program.
seams good at pricing, optimum flight level selection for the day and flight planning......
Reasonable price as well

[ferchik]

I have been using several flight planning softwares along 20 years and I would think there would be a classification for them in relation to quality, efficency and price. On my point of view, it should be like this:

Cat 1:

LIDO from LH Germany
Jeppesen from USA
NAV from Nav flight services Czech Republic
EDS from Swisszerland

Cat 2:

Air Data from England
Flugverzeuge from Austria
NavTech from Scandinavia and Canada

Cat 3:

PPS from Denmark
Rocade from Sweden
Sita from England

There are some 4 or 5 more I do not consider due to I do not know them :confused:. All depends what features are you looking for. The point is that normally the national carriers does not have any doubt at the moment to analyse the price, they normally go to Lido or Jeppesen, and I think due to popularity only, since I have been reading that even Jeppesen is having some problems on specific fields :\ . But who not!! Moreover I saw some good performances and features on the others.

Thanks you. :ok:

[guidoknigge]

If you want your system to read the Notams, check the weather and cook the coffee, there is only one: Lido.
Jeppesen, Sita, Navtech, EDS, Skytrack and PPS are only 1960's green screen mainframes with a windows GUI. Like buying a golden watch for a corpse.
Maybe there is hope. Look out for F:WZ

[airfixer]

If I wanted to cook my coffee as opposed to drinking it in its liquid form, I would indeed chose LIDO. Ever seen how long it takes to get a Eurocontrol compliant flight plan calculated on it !!
Lido is not the only system that reads weather and there is some contention as to the value of auto processing of NOTAMs given the inconsistency of Q codes on occasions. "Whooaahh" is right - a flight planning system is a tool that still requires varying degrees of intervention and therefore ease of use, flexibility and a price tag that is somewhat less than the GDP of a small African nation would get my vote . . .

[JGAN]

I do agree on all things stated here. My personal experience is that PPS does the job ok. When planning trips around Europe and Eastern Europa it comes out with a valid flightplan in most cases. I would estimate that 90% of the plans generated are ok. The CrewBreifing.com is also a big help in the distribution.
Last but not least you can buy PPS for much less than LIDO OCC. What are your experiences with PPS ?

[The Highlander]

cyco email me i might be able to help

[Fat Clemenza]

With all the brands stated above, what are the average prices for those products???

[Expat abroad]

Hi all

Have used a number of different systems over the years and all have there good and bad points.

Jepps have used 2 different versions and both were okay. sometimes a bit fiddly until you get used to it, especially for building a new route, but as it's about 8 years ago, could have changed.

PPS is okay, but would only use it for european or short haul. Think it lacks some of the features you want for long haul ot ETOPS flights. But again an easy enough system to use, possibly a little slow, but it depends on your pc spec.

Skytrack from EDS is current system. I find this a very felxible system to use and real easy to build routes in. Auto generated routes are mostly RAD/SRS compliant with just the odd one not working. Generating routes for long haul is very quick at finding best route for winds, then just a little toying with either end to make sure its comliant. We use it in conjunction with a graphical world display, with route, sector, FIR and restricted areas overlaid, and this makes a big difference.

Just my 2 pence worth.

Regards Expat.

[opsbloke]

They are all only as good as the information the user inputs......:eek:

[amorski]

Hi Gents!!!

I would appreciate if somebody can help me with this:
I work in small airline having three business jets and we are planning to use programm for flight plan calculating...
Which one would you advise to use for our situation?
Thank you in advanse!!!

[desertopsguy]

Jetplan.com is ideal for the kind of op you have. It's easy to use and has the benefit of being web based so you can acess it and run and file flight plans from anywhere with a laptop and internet connection.

It has a very handy comms centre too that allows you to send AFTN/SITA msgs..

Just my opinion

DOG

[ESH]

Big fan of Jetplan myself.

My current company uses Navtech Dispatch pro.
Hated it at first as it was very clumsy to use.

Still do not like the FOMS section of the program as it is appears to be based on a DOS system.

System is ideal if you have a 2-5 aircraft doing long haul flights as it does take a bit of time to do a flight plan and file it.

Or is it me thats a bit slow.....!!!!

[mutt]

Jeppesen is good, suggest you stay away from Sabre....

Mutt

[silversaab]

Using NavTech and quite happy now that I'm used to it.


Mutt, I'm genuinely interested to know why you don't you like Sabre? I had a very close look at it a couple of years ago and was very impressed. Big $$ for sure, but it has all the bells and whistles and is very well thought out IMHO.

SS

[mutt]

Considering that the request is from small VIP operator, i doubt that they have the resources to support the Sabre databases.

Plus i have severe doubts that Sabre can deliver on their promises.

Mutt

[silversaab]

True, in consideration of the size of operation, your comment that i doubt that they have the resources to support the Sabre databases is spot on. No-one would want to be lumbered with having to hang off UNIX boxes and then pay the $$ for the "privilege".

Interesting re your thoughts on Sabre delivering on their promises. What I saw was pretty darn snappy, but that was 3 years ago and they may well have been surpassed by others in the meantime.

Several of the web-based products do a pretty good jobs these days with enough of the bells and whistles, and at a good price considering what they deliver.

Rgds

[Broomstick Flier]

Hi Amorski,

Currently using CTO2000 from Skyplan Canada
Works fine, and support is quite efficient.

www.skyplan.com

Cheers

BF

[sandokan]

Expad abroad wrote:
Hi all

Have used a number of different systems over the years and all have there good and bad points.

Jepps have used 2 different versions and both were okay. sometimes a bit fiddly until you get used to it, especially for building a new route, but as it's about 8 years ago, could have changed.

PPS is okay, but would only use it for european or short haul. Think it lacks some of the features you want for long haul ot ETOPS flights. But again an easy enough system to use, possibly a little slow, but it depends on your pc spec.

Skytrack from EDS is current system. I find this a very felxible system to use and real easy to build routes in. Auto generated routes are mostly RAD/SRS compliant with just the odd one not working. Generating routes for long haul is very quick at finding best route for winds, then just a little toying with either end to make sure its comliant. We use it in conjunction with a graphical world display, with route, sector, FIR and restricted areas overlaid, and this makes a big difference.

Just my 2 pence worth.

Regards Expat.I can agree.....

worked with LIDO which is for e a pain in the ass for that kind of price tag.
Slow when doing long range and looks like from the 70`s with no improvement. Too overloaded. Was not able to get a solid flightplan for a GLEX......

Agree with PPS - good for EUR section.

Agree with EDS Skytrack + Flight Globe together.
The way to go and for a Dispatchers point of view - solid,fast,reliable and ease to use. It`s not the 100% cow - but its very well worth the money you spend.

regards
sandokan