PPL - Night - Multi - Hour building?

[Ian_Wannabe]

Hey guys
Just a quick question - I was on a certain flight training website before and they stated the progression for building upto a CPL as:
PPL - Night - Multi and THEN hour building...
I was just wondering if this is what most people would do?
I always figured I'd do my night then get a IMC (just for safety) then concentrate on getting those hours in?

[maxdrypower]

Its basically up to you how you it matey. You need a PPL then you need to do the atpl or cpl groundschool before you even think about CPL , and in my experience this is certainly the most rigourous and taxing part of the whole affair . You definately need the hours that is set in stone , a night rating is also something you will need if you're going for an atpl as is a multi however you dont need as multi to do a cpl but some places do it as a joint course and offer discounts .
In short to hold a frozen atpl you will need
PPL
Hour Build
ATPL Ground exams all 14
Multi
Night
IR
andfor most employers an MCC
There is a lot of debate on here regarding the IMC do a search and see what suits you personally.Dont be swayed by the doom and gloom merchants if you wanna do it then do it it will make you a better pilot , however if your doing the whole thing one after the other then dont bother with IMC as it wont be long before your IR all being well

[KandiFloss]

Hi Ian, i'd ditto the remarks made by MaxDryPower. When I was trying to find out what to do when, etc, I spoke to Multiflight and they told me that an IMC is not compulsory, and at around £1500 it's money to put towards another part of your training. So far, ive done my PPL, but i'm planning to begin my ATPL theory next year.

Where are you thinking of doing your PPL?

[Ian_Wannabe]

Hey guys and girls - cheers for the replies, much appreciated.
Well I have my PPL already so Im in the planning stages of where to go next ya see. I was thinking of doing my commercial ground study whilst building hours - getting a night rating perhaps in this time whilst i hit the books.
I'll take on board re: the IMC as you make sense.... I'd hope to be able to get my IR pretty sharpish so it would seem a bit of a "waste" to spend my money on the IMC and go for a IR.

[BullHughes]

Hi mate. If you do an IMC rating early in your hour building, (i.e after 75-80hrs total time) it'll give you loads more options and confidence during the rest of your hour building, plus being a useful taster for the IR (so I've heard).
Im doing my IMC then Night at the moment, before I start any serious hour building at all. I also intend to do my multi as an add on to my PPL as soon as I can (70hr PIC required), and squeeze some expensive Seneca trips into my hour building.
One of my mates has done this and has got just 140hrs total (80PIC) and he's got PPL/Night/IMC/Multi, mind you he's a rich, clever sod who flies all the time.
I think you can do an IMC rating test on a multi engine aeroplane if you really want to be a clever clogs, but I'm not sure about that I might be wrong, and for a low time pilot it just sounds like inviting an accident to me.
My friend has just started the first stage of the ATPL's distance learning as well he says he's finding them a lot easier and more interesting because of his multi/imc, as he can "apply a practical basis to all the theory on heavier aeroplanes and IFR procedures."
Be careful though, because maintaining an SEP and MEP rating currency at the same time can be quite a handful apparently (unless your rich). All the best whatever you decide. Leeds for 3yrs. You a SPEME grad?

[gcolyer]

This is the route I would take:

1) JAA PPL, make sure that 5 hours of your PPL covers the night qual (perfectly legal hardly antone does it)

2) Get FAA PPL based on JAA PPL

3) Get JAA Multi

4) Get FAA multi added to your FAA PPL based on JAA multi

5) Get FAA IR (you can get an IMC based on that added to your JAA PPL)

6) Get FAA Commercial and transfer FAA Multi and IR to it

Congrats... at this point you are an FAA CPL/Multi/IR

7) Do the 14 ATPL exams

8) Do the JAA CPL conversion (from FAA)

9) Do the 15 hours IR hours required to convert you FAA IR to JAA IR

Congrats you are an FAA/CPL/IR and JAA fATPL

[bigfoot01]

...but could you explain the reasoning behind the approach?

Many thanks...

[gcolyer]

I try to explain...

Getting an FAA PPL based on your JAA PPL is free (apart from the £39 fee to the CAA).

For the airlines you will need multi so might as well get it and add it for free to the FAA PPL (apart from £39 fee to the CAA)

So at this point you can fly P1 in the States or JAR land.

Why pay for an IMC???? pay a few grand extra and get the FAA IR, now in an N reg aircraft you can fly airways. At this point you can get the CAA IMC based on you FAA IR obviously you will need to pay the CAA licensing fee.

Now at this point in an N reg full IR privelages. In a G reg in the UK you can fly IFR but not in the airways and limited minima.

As for getting the FAA CPL for the sake of about £4k you might as well get it done and transfer the FAA multi and IR to it, at least now you have the oppertunity to fly N reg aircraft for living. It also prepares you for the JAR ATPL's.

Now with your shiny FAA CPL/ME/IR it is time to do the ATPL's. Once you have sat these you can then convert your FAA CPL and FAA IR. To convert the IR you need to do 15 hours JAA IR training and JAA IR check flight.

Once you have done that you have an fATPL. There is nothing to stop you studying the ATPL's right from the outset, and that will save you some time.

One thing to keep in mind is the minimum hours you need to be able to start various courses.

[Ian_Wannabe]

Hey, some good points to consider thanks.


Bull - I did take the course at Leeds yeah, but stupidity of living like a student too much meant that I got behind and decided to drop out. Something I regret!

Are you a speme student?

I'm going to try and make a plan of what I need to save for in "x" amount of time and see if that works, anyone used this approach of trying to meet targets by a certain date? Did it work for you?

[BullHughes]

Ian,
Yeah graduated in 2006, joining army as an avionics tech in November, but at the moment just bimbling around the Pembrokeshire coast in a 172 enjoying my brown book.
From what I gather, a fair few people who graduated from the degree are doing integrated ATPL courses at the moment. Banks tend to like giving loans to graduates, but the idea of adding a 50k commercial bank loan to the debt of a 10k student loan fills me with dread.
Earn it first, then spend it on flying and enjoy it! Theres no reason why someone cant patiently work their way through the ratings and licences over 4-5yrs fitting around their personal lives, providing they haven't got too many work/marriage/mortgage/children commitments and can afford it. (You don't need a CPL/IR to fly your family to Ireland in a twin):ok: