Herc in heavy landing in 'Stan?

[PPRuNeUser0211]

Just seen on BBC SW that we trashed a herc in Afghanistan, C-130 K in heavy night landing subsequently destroyed by our own troops. Any further news? Can't find anything on the web... Also an interview with Nigegilb

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Just watched it on BBC SW and whilst I normally find myself in agreement with a lot of what Nige says his proposal that we should simply supply a few more troops go out to secure the crash sight to allow engineers in to fix the A/C in situ is really quite barking, and I am sure will be used by some in the future to question his credibility :rolleyes:

PS IAW the new "leakage" mandate there was no way anyone was going to put this on Prune in advance of the media publishing it :eek:

[Grimweasel]

Any one know the tail number? Hope it's not my fav kite 196?

[Jackonicko]

Not another one of the C1P minifleet, surely?

So it's one shot down, one destroyed after running over a mine (and subsequently burned out), and one destroyed in Kosovo.

And the -130J blown up by our own people after damaging a wing and engines (another mined strip incident?).

[nigegilb]

Yea, have to agree with SFFP. BBC were running this story tonight regardless. I had reason to believe there was a force protection issue which I now know to be incorrect. I will take it on the chin. The wider points about operational impact and serious training concerns remain valid.

4 Hercs down in Iraq and Afg and the Govt has still not decided if it will replace these aircraft.

I doubt if any allowance was made for the loss of these aircraft or crew.

Thankfully, in this case the crew walked away.

MoD/RAF confirmed a MK 1 Herc was destroyed.

[PPRuNeUser0211]

Not to worry nige, keep up the good work old bean!

[lastmanstanding]

link here??http://news.bbc.co.uk/player/nol/newsid_6960000/newsid_6969400/6969491.stm?bw=bb&mp=wm&news=1&ms3=6&nol_storyid=6969491

[Heywood Djablowme]

£50m for a k? I'd give you 50 quid.;)

[Chugalug2]

Until, or if, we learn more, the only thing to say now is thank goodness everyone involved is safe. Given that this forum is communicating less now, thanks to our "open" government, that sentiment goes for all you guys and girls. Stay safe and let us at home do our best to try to make it a little safer still for you all by insisting that the duty of care is properly met.
Chug

[TAC Queen]

Just good to know they are all OK.
Ill buy you all a beer when I see you.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

TQ,

With you in that sentiment.

Nige,

A reply like that is as rare as a senior officer sending messages UP the chain admitting things are not quite right and I take my hat off to you, well done sir :ok:

[nigegilb]

SFFP, thank you.

I am still pretty new to this game. I learned to sit on my hands for a while longer tonight, no point pretending otherwise.

As you intimated, the reason force protection was not so much of an issue in this case was because of the damage to the aircraft.

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Nige,

Having previously witnessed first hand the media "stitching" Caz Leavey rest assured earlier this evening I would have bet my mortgage you had been stiffed in a similar manner, so please excuse my comments.

Having read all of your previous posts on here and of the belief that you are nothing but extremely well intentioned by all means occasionally sit on your hands but please don't make a habit of it :ok:

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

If the BBC had any sense they'd keep the Station Barber on a retainer.

Or me.

Eleven missed calls since this post went on Prune, (just got back) and was safely asleep on the sofa.

[k1rb5]

Hello big fella.

No wonder it was a 'heavy' landing.;)

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

Wotcha k1rb5

Sorry, misled you there, crew change and frame swaparound happened a couple of days before the incident.

Came back on a C17 though, and the GE was a rival to my crown.

I'm amazed everone's okay. A bit of whiplash or a jarred back would set you up nicely for the Rugby World Cup!

[The Swinging Monkey]

Just heard from atruckie mate about this, and delighted all are OK. To hell with the aircraft, Gordon can replace it if and whenever he feels inclined.
Keep safe Guys and Girls.
TSM

[Lancelot37]

To hell with the aircraft, Gordon can replace it if and whenever he feels inclined.
=========================================

He'd rather waste money somewhere else than support our troops. Look at the equipment (or lack of equipment) that they have to use.

[chappie]

thank god that the crew are safe, that is of paramount importance.despite the fighting that i have done to to assist nige to ensure the safety of the remaining aircraft, it is for the safety of the crews and troops that we do it. i know all to well the pain of the crew not surviving when i lost bob, and yet the fight goes on.
to echo the comment made by TSM, yes to hell with the ac, but the notion that gordon...indeed anyone will ensure the safety of all ac and/or effective replacement of the ac is a notion too far, sadly. it is something that belongs in cloud cuckoo land which is unbelievably sad. the true cost of losing an ac and the crew has yet to hit home enough to the government and the powers that be so as to ensure a blanket safety to ALL hercules. it may take the loss of another crew before they get to realise the true cost and do something with out those of us left behind to fight.
i did not see the BBC piece, but having spent a year at the hands of the media they are very good at portraying their view and in accurate editing and portrayal of your views leads to confusion and mis repreasentation. all one has to do is see nige's track record and realise what a fantastic job he has done. i will always support nige, so must we all.

[Top Bunk Tester]

SPLC

Glad to hear you weren't on board mate, although you have adequate padding for any heavy landing. Most glad that all of the crew are OK, shame about the frame, but frames can be replaced:ugh: eventually.

TBT

[billynospares]

Glad everyone ok thats the main thing. Any news on a tail number yet ?

[speeddial]

Where's ABIW these days?

[Gainesy]

Good Point, he went EMCON just after the J got binned in Iraq, hope he just got a carpet dance, rather than something nasty. Maybe the Movers got him.:uhoh:

[blogger]

Not seen a whisper in the press about this. Any futher news about?

[flipster]

Oops - It must have been a spectular landing to have Cat 5'd a Mk1!

That said, I'm suprised some of my attempts at landing didn't damage the ac!

Joking aside, I'm really glad everyone got out ok - well done to all.

[ZH875]

The landing may not have Cat 5'd the frame, it is just that no work could be carried out to check for any damage.

At least they got some spares off the frame this time.

[billynospares]

The story i have heard was that it was well and truly cat 5d !:ouch: Still everyone out of it ok

[jtech]

It was XV205

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

Flip,

I doubt whether those involved would think "spectacular" was the best choice as a descriptor :eek:

[XV277]

It was XV205

Mmm, some expensive stick-on bits on that one!

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/1131298/M/

[Seldomfitforpurpose]

"Mmm, some expensive stick-on bits on that one!"

All removed apparently :ok:

[Whaaa newark]

All of them Tac Queen, you sure?????

[jete]

Thanks for the link.:ok:

[flipster]

Seldom-f-f-p
You are right, sorry. However, I was not trying to make too light of this incident but that the most important thing is that there are no funerals at Lyneham this week.
.
The job in the sandbox is inherently very risky and there but for the grace of God.......etc.
Hope all the EPA worked well.
Flip

[The Gorilla]

As I sit on my sunbed drinking cocktails I raise my glass to a happy ending and a fine herc!

I am but a few miles from Hickham AFB and in the last few days have seen more hercs than the RAF has left. By my reckoning we have now lost 10% of the fleet?

Something is going to have to give soon. Glad all are safe.
Regards
TG

[VinRouge]

Great... looks like another K det line J wing will have to cover.... :-(


Thank god everyone got off OK.

[BeefyBoy]

Xv205 & XV206 - Well, thats the 1312Flt (Stanley) Memorial Flight out the window then! :{

Glad everyone is safe.

[El_Presidente]

Cat 5 for sure, nothing to do with a 'Heavy' landing tho...

:suspect:

[VinRouge]

Well, lets put it this way, I wouldnt mind betting a fair few crack dens and mud huts in Afghanistan are sporting the latest in cammed-up aircraft aluminium roofs!

:}

Can anyone confirm or deny the following?

1) 205 was the 47 Sqn Print?
2) The RAF now has more Mk1 Spitfires than Mk 1 Hercs?

[WytonPJS]

Now there's a thought! Wouldn't have worked anyway - short of a few tankers! Pity......
Sad to see the old girl go but heartened that all onboard OK (good testimonial to the build)!

[Jackonicko]

How did they destroy it?

Any truth in the rumour that a Harrier can now have a Herc silhouette under the windscreen?

[nigegilb]

I think it was a Tornado last time!

I understand that XV205 was destroyed by explosives, laid by troops at the strip.

[El_Presidente]

They do indeed now have more Spits than Mk1 Alberts...

:eek:

[Jimlad1]

"They do indeed now have more Spits than Mk1 Alberts..."

We'd better be careful with statements like that, or the front page of tomorrows 'Daily Hate' will be "RAF has more Spitfires than Hercules" :ugh:

[Runaway Gun]

No doubt some enterprising statitionisitionist (?) will declare:

"Nothing to see here - A higher proportion of Hercules are now serviceable than ever before..."

[The Gorilla]

It's also one way of reducing Air Engineer manning requirements. Should help with the so called shortage!

The bean counters will be happy though, no doubt they will be thinking of reducing herc funding accordingly.

[fergineer]

You mean there are a few Engineers left at Lyneham field........how many of the FE carrying hercs are left now, cant be that many. Glad the guys got out of it ok could have been any of us.

[N Joe]

"Can anyone confirm or deny the following?

1) 205 was the 47 Sqn Print?"

Heard that after losing 206, they were trying to get a Sqn print with no tail number (or a made-up one) but were having hassle with the bureaucrats who were insisting on a valid tail number. Don't know what the outcome was.

N Joe

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

Squadron Prints #904 - XV205 & ZH878

http://www.squadronprints.com/images/904_hercules_xv205_zh878_47sqn_raf_tn.jpg

Don't say it, don't even think it

[flipster]

TRUTH IS STRANGER THAN FICTION!!!!!

However, surely even this sqn print is out of date, as I note some Js are flying around in a green scheme now. Perhaps they should leave off the tail numbers on sqn prints from now on?

But why haven't we painted the few remaining Hercs a sandy colour - they go nowhere much else ?

[SirPeterHardingsLovechild]

Article today in The Sun that is so wildly innaccurate, I thought we'd lost another!

http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2007410361,00.html

£50m Hercules blown up

[Picture of C130J]

By JOHN KAY
Chief Reporter
September 05, 2007

MILITARY chiefs blew up a 50million aircraft so its high-tech gear would not fall into enemy hands, it was revealed yesterday.


The decision to destroy the specially modified RAF Hercules was made after it crash-landed in a southern Afghan Taliban stronghold.
The loss of the plane, used to move SAS troops and equipment, is expected to hamper special forces operations for a while in the lawless Helmand badlands.

The hushed-up accident occurred last week in a blacked-out night landing on a rough dirt air strip.
Pilots using night vision goggles were guided in by four SAS troopers on the ground.

But the Hercules from 47 Squadron at RAF Lyneham — which is the most highly decorated unit in the air force — was badly damaged in what was described as a “very, very hard landing”. None of the crew or troops on board were injured and they were able to evacuate the aircraft.

After some equipment on board was removed, Army engineers were sent in to plant explosives and blow up the giant transporter and the rest of its contents. A source said: “The loss of the Hercules is a big blow but it was better to blow it up rather than risk letting it fall into the hands of the Taliban.”

The Hercules planes used by the special forces are equipped with highly classified digital encrypted satellite and high frequency communications suites to relay messages and video from SAS troops on the ground straight back to UK headquarters from anywhere in the world.

They are also fitted with the latest defensive aids including missile-approach warning gear — and have the ability to jam anti-aircraft missiles with flares and chaff launchers, which release millions of tiny metal particles to confuse radar systems.

Aircraft for SAS missions also have to be able to carry the Who Dares Wins regiment’s very heavily armed Land Rovers or Mad Max-style Special Utility Vehicles.

They also transport the SAS’s raider speed boats and mini-subs.
Until the RAF is able to convert other Hercules, the SAS will probably have to cadge rides with American special forces units.

Last night an RAF spokesman said: “We continue to manage our aircraft in order to maintain a required level of defence capability.
“Our first priority is to support operations.”


PS. Don't anyone go pointing out the mistakes, don't fall into that trap. But maybe the MOD should release just a little more to avoid this sort of thing!

Stoppers, you deleted your post. Have we been penetrated?

[N Joe]

"PS. Don't anyone go pointing out the mistakes, don't fall into that trap. But maybe the MOD should release just a little more to avoid this sort of thing!"

Completely agree - we wouldn't want anyone thinking that we do actually "manage our aircraft in order to maintain a required level of defence capability".

N Joe

[flipster]

Ah, of course, this is just PMA 'management' of the number of airframes to fit the number of crews!:sad:

[SVK]

So, squadron print wise 47 have now lost 298, 179, 206, 205. Or basically the last 4 squadron prints is a row. Perhaps they should introduce a new tradition of not numbering their prints from now on. As the saying goes (or something like): "Once is chance, twice is coincidence, three times a conspiracy." I don't think the quote mentions a fourth time but I think you get the picture/Jonah.

[CdnGlobemaster]

Just to confirm, at least from
http://www.ukserials.com/results.php?serial=XV

was indeed the one destroyed.

'XV205 Hercules C1 w/o 27/08/2007'

Spot of bad luck, at least I think thats what you Brits say,
sure cuts into the C1[SF] / C3A[SF] specialized SF support fleet. :uhoh: