Qf Engineers Ready For Industrial Action

[Anulus Filler]

From the ALAEA Federal Secretary.....
TO: ALL QANTAS ALAEA MEMBERS COVERED BY THE LAME EBA
RE: PROTECTED INDUSTRIAL ACTION AUTHORISATION
Notice of authorisation is given to ALAEA members covered by the Licensed Aircraft Engineers (Qantas Airways Limited) Certified Agreement (EBA7) to take industrial action in regard to supporting or advancing our claim for "The securing of and maintaining aircraft maintenance work in Australia" made in respect of the proposed collective agreement (EBA8).
Following the giving of this authorisation the action if it is to be protected action, cannot take place until after a "protected action ballot" is conducted of the employees covered by the "Notice of Bargaining Period" and proposed to be covered, by the new EBA8. To do this the ALAEA needs to obtain an order from the Australian Industrial Relations Commission that will authorise a protected action ballot to be held and hold a protected action ballot that may authorise the industrial action. Depending on the result of the ballot the action may or may not proceed.
"The protected action so authorized is the banning of routine work, routine Certification or any release to service on aircraft VH-OJQ and VH-OJO for normal service until such times as the said aircraft have undergone afull "D" type check inspection by Australian Licenced Aircraft Engineers licenced on the type of aircraft, in a CASA approved maintenance facility within Australia under Qantas CAR 30 approval; and to ultimately cause such work to be brought back into Australia"
Lets get ready to RUMBLE!!:ok:

[Managers Perspective]

Using the words of Darryl John Kerrigan, "tell him he's dreaming".....

[QF MAINT OUTSOURCED]

time to get out your overalls and spanners MP

[Anulus Filler]

time to get out your overalls and spanners MP
He's still looking for his brain though.........

[domo]

I think the alaea is wrong on this the chances of qantas redoing two "D" checks is a joke
Lets work with the company to retain jobs and create future jobs instead of trying to refight past battles that we lost
Heavy is gone I dont see it coming back

[The Mr Fixit]

FFS

whine about inaction, whine about action

You guys are pathetic, grow a backbone you association has, you gave it the charter by you vote in the ballot and when they follow your wishes you b!tch

The ALAEA is standing up and it's time you did

By the way read the notice in it's entirety and understand this it prompts the company to act, if it is challenged then a discussion will take place in or out of the IRC and a suitable compromise will be reached. A full D Check is not required just the checking of the areas that were disturbed during those checks.

My money's on two things

One, Lames are sick and tired of being taken for granted and will support the ASN grounding the aircraft

and two, more than staples will be found on OJO and OJQ

[Twitter n Bisted]

The ALAEA is standing up and it's time you did

I am more than willing to go in for a stouch for the right reason.
What do we hope to win from this action as an association for members current and future?? As Domo said H245 is shut. Next battle

From my point of view it looks like a public pissing competion between SP and DC.
And the winner gets to say

I TOLD YOU SO !!

Does not look contructive and I doubt it will fly.

Baby with the bath water comes to mind...:ouch:

[Talkwrench]

Twitter n Bisted,I agree that some improvement in T and C’s would be good, did you have anything specific in mind? I think it will take some pretty fantastic T and C’s to convince the majority to accept a deal when 3% is the most likely offer from the company with regard to remuneration.Also it is worth noting that although H245 is gone, there are still some QF Heavy Maintenance facilities in this country. The things that the staff in those areas are being asked to accept in the eba in order to keep HM (and their jobs) in Australia are fairly substantial and if the eba gets up, they will have ramifications across all departments, line included. The proverbial thin end of the wedge.

[QF MAINT OUTSOURCED]

this is about aircraft safety,these aircraft were done under sus standards,which has been proven,this is about passenger safety and the integrity of these 2 aircraft,and your license being used for continued certification of these aircraft,remember if one of these aircraft fall out the sky,who do you think Qantas management will come after SASCO or the last LAME to sign off on the aircraft

[Clipped]

QMO,

Exactly. Our actions must be seen as protecting the integrity of aviation in this country - that the maintenance program on those two aircraft has been compromised and this has to be addressed.

What do we stand for?

We are always complaining of DC's inept and our spiralling standards at QF - well isn't this the most obvious response.

And, where is our Regulator?

[squawk6969]

Offer to do the D checks free of charge, on the condition that if and when you find serious matters that have not been done at SIA then they pay you full pay and agree to the T&C's mentioned.

You put your money where your mouth is, and so will they!

Cant see it happening though.........:ugh:

SQ

[QF MAINT OUTSOURCED]

are you suggesting a part ownership between Qanats and the ALAEA in a maintenance facility ,why not:ok:

[The Bungeyed Bandit]

QF MAINT OUTSOURCED

I think it has already been done - It's called Avalon manned by Forestaff and the main winner was a slime of an ex ALAEA rep called Wally.

[chemical alli]

Maybe an out for all concerned is to carry out certain stages of the d chk at each consecutive A chk just a thought .That way its a win win for both parties. Aircraft arent grounded and integrity of the safety culture is restored. I believe that the alaea are making inroads as rumor has it some chks have been seriously looked at to come back onshore.

lets not play who has the biggest johnson campaign.lets get it done .also i have to agree the eba is getting tired

[QF MAINT OUTSOURCED]

i don't think an A check is enough time for some of the inspections that need hundreds of hours to complete,ie internal wing inspections/horizontal stab,under floor inspections,under toilet,seat track,and the list goes on:cool:

[Bolty McBolt]

Qantas management will come after SASCO or the last LAME to sign off on the aircraft

Get it right, If you going to run with a conspiracy theory get the names correct and you may sound more credible :}

There are 2 MROs at Changi airport (Singapore) SIAEC and SASCO.

SASCO are not in the picture this time, and anecdotal evidence suggests they do good work there

SIAEC is the MRO whom completed the "D" checks on the 2 aircraft subject to industrial action.

[Air Ace]

Bad industrial relations decision! Maintenance checks in Singapore are unrelated to the terms and conditions of an EBA.

The proposed ALEA action will rightly be seen as an attempt to disrupt the company's operations, in order solely to advance an IR claim and protect jobs.

Not siding with Kwonnas or the engineers but don't expect public support, especially from any passengers whose travel plans are disrupted.

[Torqueman]

It's about time the ALAEA grew some balls.

I do think the industrial action will be an aberrant failure though.

[Mustang Man]

Does the ALAEA only look in the past ? Isn't there another 747 in SIN now for a D check? That hasn't been mentioned in the proposed action.....

[rammel]

This action may work. If Qantas argues in the commission against it, the union can court the public with the "we're concerned with pax safety, and obviously management isn't". The Today Tonight reports are still relatively fresh, so this could be very interesting.

[Jabawocky]

It's simple....as a QF PAX who just booked a return trip (on 738's) I want to know they are being maintained 100%, not like the OJ's mentioned above nor the CAC 737 in Japan or any other dodgy.

To me its black and white, fix it right the first time. I think most aussie pax think that way. We expect QF/JQ & VB all to maintain to a standard set in the past. About time we all stood up for it, PAX included.

J

[fordran]

Lets have a look at our options and how they will be viewed by the public -
-overtime and higher duties bans in support of EBA - greedy
-full stop work meetings in support of EBA - greedy and disruptive
-strike in support of higher wages - greedy and another reason to return Howard
-blackban OJO and OJQ in support of Aus Maint- already winning PR battle so why not

Remember these aircraft failed audits in Singapore and have had nothing but trouble since returning. We may all know about the staples in the EEL lighting on both aircraft but what about the other crap that didn't make the papers such as the steering bolt that was fouling because it was installed the wrong way. The swarf that was found in the WIU racks and last weeks finding on JQ. An oxy drop was attempted and only 1/3 of the jungle appeared, on investigation blanking plugs were found in the line from the check in Singapore 12 months ago. No need to worry though Qantas security were there to make sure the 500 did't fall in the wrong hands. It was rushed straight to DC who put it in the appropriate file. :=

It's time we made a stand on this one. We had a pi$$ weak union when they shut syd HM and they did nothing. This is our chance to get rid of the turd who did this to our workmates and so far the public is onside. I am yet to hear from one passenger or person in the press who doesn't care about safety and that QF aircraft get maintained properly. Cox can't drag us down in the press because he knows he is putting money before safety. ALAEA thanks for giving us a union again its about time.

[Managers Perspective]

It's simple....as a QF PAX who just booked a return trip (on 738's) I want to know they are being maintained 100%, not like the OJ's mentioned above nor the CAC 737 in Japan or any other dodgy.
.

How does the CAC 737 fire become aligned with militant industrial action?

That incident resulted in a world fleet inspection for a manufacturing deficiency, the inspection requirement doesn't relate to only those that have had maintenance performed.

Come on, keep up, you seem to be falling off a bit down the back there.......

MP.

[QF MAINT OUTSOURCED]

i'd say his point is would the AD's get a look in with these 3rd party operators ,would it be just a sign off with out looking

[NSEU]

"That incident resulted in a world fleet inspection for a manufacturing deficiency,.."

Seems like Boeing engineering standards are dropping, too :} (probably due to cost-cutting measures... oops sorry... as DC might put it... processes to survive competitive environments).

Boeing have made great airplanes in the past... and probably have saved many a passenger's neck (and maintenance engineer's reputation).

On the other hand, maintenance engineers have (in history) provided feedback to Boeing leading to an improved product. Undertrained and overworked engineers won't have the skills to recognise potential risks or the time to fill out forms every time they see a potential risk (and probably lack the incentive to do so if the company is undervaluing their efforts).

[chemical alli]

beware of what you ask for the public may turn if you upset their travel plans,safety at a cost until it effects joe blogs once a year trip to hnl with family.and just be aware maint issues happen everywhere

[mahatmacoat]

Grounding 2 aircraft won't interupt the public it will just mess with their scheds. I'd rather ground 2 aircraft than hit my own pocket with o/t bans. Is anyone really concerned about DC winning a pr battle? I can't see that happening.

[Sunfish]

The obvious question to ask is how would Qantas like it if instead of a CAC 737 burning on the Taramc it was a Qantas 747?

"Design deficiency"? my arse! Rotten maintenance.

[Going Boeing]

mahatmacoat

Grounding those 2 aircraft would cause flight cancellations as well as delays because at present Qantas has no spare long range aircraft (due to the delay in A380 deliveries).

I do not want to stuff up joe public's travel plans but it is imperative that these aircraft have all the necessary inspections to ensure that they are safe. Qantas has been very lucky that the aircraft that fordran wrote about didn't have a depressurisation - lives would have been lost. No amount of spin from DC. GD, PG, MAJ, etc could justify lives being lost because of their desire to save/make money.

[QFinsider]

If the "management" thieves had their way, it would be APA's puppy now!

Unfortunately for the yobbo it is still on his watch...Cost cutting has a limit and it was passed. It was supposed to happen on another's shift...
It is a direct result of the Dixon edict.

Take a perfectly reputable airline and cut the living daylights out of a couple of things that made it what it is..One of those was maintenance, Dixon wanted it offshore, it is and look what happens!!

I will not strap my backside to OJO/OJQ until they are passed inhouse!
:E

[Bolty McBolt]

Grounding 2 aircraft won't interupt the public it will just mess with their scheds. I'd rather ground 2 aircraft than hit my own pocket with o/t bans. Is anyone really concerned about DC winning a pr battle? I can't see that happening.

Grounding 2 744 would result in in CANX flights eventually. The sched is so thin on the 744 fleet that within 1 week you would start to see effect
.e.g. Late departures due to awaiting the incoming A/C.. QF does not have spare aircraft sitting around so the sched is juggled and aircraft swapped constantly between flights to meet the demands. This works ok with known ground time. There is enough buffer built in to handle unscheduled engine changes etc but take 2 pieces out and the house of cards may not stand up should other non sched maintenance be required.

FOG

[NSEU]

"Design deficiency"? my arse! Rotten maintenance.

So now we are insulting Taiwanese engineers? (As well as Philippino and Singaporean?). Any more comments like these and the public will start to believe DC's insulting remarks about QF engineers being xenophobic.

BTW, wasn't it a brand new aircraft?

http://www.easybourse.com/Website/dynamic/News.php?NewsID=293251&lang=fra&NewsRubrique=2&pageliste=

[Going Boeing]

NSEU

BTW, wasn't it a brand new aircraft?

5 years old. recent maintenance was carried out on the offending part.

[NSEU]

Thanks, Going Boeing... I stand corrected.

[HotDog]

Going Boeing,
5 years old. recent maintenance was carried out on the offending part.
The Boeing inspection, subsequently made madatory within 24 days by FAA Emergency AD 2007-18-51 has now been escalated by Emergency AD 2007-18-52 to within 10 days and repeat every 3,000 flight cycles on the basis of initial inspection results. Those initial inspections uncovered several other cases of detached hardware; in some cases on recently delivered aeroplanes that would not normally have had any maintenance work carried out in this area.
How do you know recent maintenance was carried out on the offending part?
Not that it matters in light of the above report.

[The Mr Fixit]

Would you prefer

"I fkn lie here dead because Aussie engineers didn't have the balls to ground defective aircraft"

FFS money over safety every time for you clowns

[mahatmacoat]

Who said that we are striking? That's why banning two unsafe aircraft has been chosen so we don't get the public offside. Frozo have you read the papers, seen the tv or heard any negative comments about the action on the radio. The public are 100% behind the union.

eg. I was watching a news program on CNBC Asia today that is based in Singapore and they had a story on the grounding of the 2 planes. The ALAEA had the balls to talk to them live. They read a preprepared statement from SIA backing the SIAEC facility in an attempt to ambush the asn and within 30 secs it was completely turned around. The interviewers from Singapore even agreed that grounding the planes was the only action so open your eyes and see whats happening.

What arguments can the press run when so many problems have been generated from the o'seas facility?

[Sunfish]

You'll win no friends in the public by striking?

Err not true, if the union invests the time and effort in crafting a good PR campaign to match the one that Qantas will no doubt launch.

I think it is now time for the ALEA to push the big red "SAFETY" button with the public real hard.

For example, if its true that QF has provisioned for a hull loss in the next five (or was it ten?) years, then this fact should be widely (and negatively) reported.

To me, it appears that Qf senior management are adopting the same approach to safety as a certain large oil company whose Longford plant blew up.

"Do what you can with the money we give you."

"**** the regulations and training manuals, for which you will receive princely rewards"

" Hope that nothing happens on your watch, because you will be the scapegoat if it does."

[QFinsider]

That Qf engineering was second to none is unquestioned. I was always in awe of our maintenance, the knoweldge of our engineers nd the standards they adhered to professionally.

Short sighted management will come and go. It is the engineers who carry the can. It is time the airline was reclaimed by those with the operational expertise and these "visitors" be sidelined...Airlines are about moving people and freight safely and efficiently from A to B. That involves operational staff not bean counters with no understanding that safety does in fact cost money.

Q bean counters have "costed" an accident, they had better hope they are not on their junket when it happens


A properly targeted safety campaign is not industrial no matter what Cox or Dixon alledge. It is us with our bums strapped to the seats and those who maintain them and whose signature appears on the Tech Log who lose!

It isn't about race, it isn't about nationalism. It is about standards. This regime has sold out standards and ought be held to account before it is too late. If the regime won't listen the public will!

[Clipped]

Well said

Safety before schedule -- whose motto?

[NAS1801]

No I'd prefer you do the job your signed up for and stop this strike crap. ...Frozo, as far as dix n cox are concerned, QF engineers are paid to get planes in the air, not to find problems with them. As long as the plane has an aerobridge hooked up and a flow of pax, they are fat, dumb and happy. They care not one bit about the quality and safety of the plane. Those days are gone. If something goes wrong, if one hits the deck, who do you think is going to end up in court? Dix? Cox? or the QF engineer?

You, ManagersP, HDog and Aircraft need to get your heads around this.

[Wod]

To take issue with Sunfish.

I'd expect a prudent management, (QF, DJ, NZ, SQ ) doesn't matter which,to understand what a catastrophic hull and life loss event might cost.

And then make provision for it. It's called good management.

I don't know if a rolling 5 or 10 year period is right (not a bean counter), but some provision and recognition is sensible.

Nothing to do with engineering outsourcing.

It is said that Swissair's demise was in part related to the fact that they had not considered or understood the need to manage the costs of a catastrophe.

FWIW

[The masked goatrider]

Sorry Sunfish I have to agree that the hull loss plans won't win favour with the public.

Being a mate of SP I can say that the ALAEA are seeking expert PR advice from an external consultant every time they talk to the press. The issue of hull loss has been raised and dropped when more newsworthy items seem to be grabbing the attention.

[Sunfish]

Thank you Goaty! I'm glad you are getting professional advice. It's very important (although it shouldn't be) to be able to put your case to people in very short 'sound bites".

[NSEU]

And then make provision for it. It's called good management.

I see in the news that Qantas provisioned for a $40M fine for illegal price-fixing of cargo rates (in conjunction with other airlines). Just shows how much management cares about Joe Public.

[Bumpfoh]

All along I thought it was the "two balls one sack" scenario.

"Being a mate of SP"

Guess I stand corrected.:E

[rudderless1]

The concern now comes is if the current mindset of management believes there is more money to be made driving maintenance down to and accepting crashes/accidents COMPARED TO best maintenance to prevent all accidents, then the most profitable will be chosen! The latter is ideal, the former may be a real:\ business decision:ooh:

[blackhander]

Any word on what happened in the commision today?

[Hardworker]

Obviously The Cox/Murray/Hespe motto is running hard

Bonus before Saftey & Schedule!

[chemical alli]

looks like the boys got smashed in the commish,no vote ,looks like rafaelli has some more first class tickets coming

[The Mr Fixit]

Apparently the President's the devil and the IR manager's a saint

Only in John Howard's Australia could the laws prevent you from protecting people

Guys, hes gotta go

[Managers Perspective]

looks like the boys got smashed in the commish,no vote

Well surprise, surprise, surprise..........

MP.

[lowerlobe]

MP you're right for once......Big Business....Government....and then the employee/the general public and guess who won.........thats right no surprise at all really.....

[domo]

Reading coxes email it looks like they want to settle the eba to stop this sort of thing.my prediction vote november 3% back pay paid befour christmas. another 3% in january

sop

[company_spy]

It's not over 'till the fat lady sings lads, watch this space.......

[Jabawocky]

So what has happened?

Are OJO/OJQ still flying or are they being inspected?

[Hardworker]

You have to be kidding 3% after another record profit!
Time to wake up it has to be a hell of a lot more than that somewhere between 6 - 8% nothing less....even the bus and train drivers are getting 5% backdated....you want to settle for 3%?
No more overtime no secondments no higher duties...
See how that works...

[Redstone]

No more overtime no secondments no higher duties...
See how that works...

That would send a clear message, it would have probably greater impact than grounding two 744's, however it will never happen. Solidarity is a thing of the past.

[binrow]

negotions progressed well, RDO bank, DIL bank, OT bank, suiet of rosters for all H/M lames and if you are lucky and are employed in H/M Victoria you get to drive up and down the Geelong F/Way for a small allowence yet still no $$$$$ on the table. So as you can see once again QF have loaded the cards to create a rift between H/M and ACS (yes i am simpathitic to your one man pushback and roster issues) lets hope all will think of the future when the time comes to show how well the progress has been and not worry about the 3% backpay just in time for xmas as mine will equal 2 weeks worth of O/T and I for one will stand on the the old saying "ALL FOR ONE" stay strong and focused for a better than 3% outcome

[employes perspective]

the whole lot of you are piss weak,it's September now the EBA run out 9 months ago,spineless and weak,MP must be laughing his tits off at you lot:mad:

[Bumpfoh]

Off to a good start aren't we.:E

I suggest you re-visit your dictionary for your user name before posting another wind up!:ugh::ugh:

[Clipped]

Cox's notice - just another of his long long list of untruths.

Every once in a while I stare at that Strategy Map screensaver and I remain perplexed to the extent of this management's perversion of our business and existence.

Have we all read the latest LE. Cox has got himself a new group (another empire). Keep growing the number crunchers and deplete the number of guys working the planes, whilst the fleet grows, just figure that out.

Remember "Our standard of maintenance has never been better". I would LOL, but the direction we're heading is quite tragic.

[employes perspective]

bumpfoh it's the only way it would fit mate

[NAS1801]

Almost inclined to agree with EP here. When there is a perceived lack of action on the ALAEAs part, the majority of members whinge. Finally, the ALAEA recommends industrial action and what happens? The majority of members whinge again. I don’t think SP is laughing, he is probably shaking his head in frustration at this attitude. Dix and Cox are the ones that are laughing.

[woderwick]

The question is, will Dixon take a pay cut during those times too? (And I don't mean just his salary or bonus. I mean a genuine cut in his total remuneration).

[NAS1801]

That's because he gets what he wants and he know he will. Besides that, he is over paid to start with. Engineers are on pathetic $$. Time to get off the high horse PAF.

[employes perspective]

piss weak,i've got some gardening for $ 30 per hr that needs doing,any takers

[lowerlobe]

PAF...A few years ago when things were not so rosy the company asked most of us for a wage freeze.That was fair enough but when you looked at the figures Darth actually gave himself a huge pay rise.

Why would he need to strike or take any action when he is doing this?

[Sunfish]

PAF:
It really does beg the question. When QF profits decline (as they will eventually) are you willing to take a 6-8% pay cut, nothing less?

You seem to have the wrong handle on the concept of ownership here.

It's the shareholders who are entitled to ALL of the surplus that Qantas makes. That is what they receive in exchange for assuming the risk of investing in Qantas.

If the company does not make money, it's the shareholders who have to cop it, not the employees, barring of course an in extremis situation where some staff MIGHT agree to a pay cut to save their jobs.

However this is a rare event for no one is going to supply anything (including their labor) for less than the cost of its production - and that applies to every business, as I have occasionally found to my sorrow (and so by the way have a number of car manufacturers - to their sorrow as well).

PAF:

I haven't seen Dixon making pay demands or threatening to strike as CEO if he doesn't get what he wants!

You are once again demonstrating your complete and total naivety

For a start, Dixon's pay is established by remuneration consultants on an international comparative basis, and even one years pay (about 6 million) is more than its more than enough to provide financial security for himself and his family for the remainder of his life. Then there are the stock options, Golden handcuffs and a golden parachute.

This is all tied up in a contract that will have been negotiated by Dixon's lawyer and Qantas lawyers and backed by a Board level remuneration consultants report. So of course Dixon doesn't grumble about his pay! He negotiated it himself!

The reason for this is simple. Being a CEO is a Pr1ck of a job. If you foul up, you will never work again and become a figure of ignominy for the rest of your sorry life. It's a bit like being an actor, and at some stage the audience says "Enough" and you are out. You maybe even have to commit management suicide, if it is in the interest of shareholders, by recommending a takeover bid and the consequent elimination or your own job.

In other words, being a CEO is a "One Off" job.To do it, you need a guarantee of absolute financial satisfaction whatever the outcome, otherwise it simply isn't worth doing.

And finally, if I was making a billion dolars for the shareholders, I'd want a chunk of it to stick to my fingers as well!

Employees on the other hand, have nothing to bargain with except their labor. They have families to feed and zero financial security beyond the next paycheck as they work their way hopefully towards eventual retirement and perhaps enough superannuation to live on.

Then in striking a bargain over their supply of labor, the Howard individual AWA's provide a massive assymetry in bargaining power between the individual (who must bargain maybe once every three years) versus the company - who employs specialist industrial relations consultants who know all the tricks and bargain every day.

Is it any wonder then that employees want to band together and bargain as a group?

Since the deliberate destruction of the (old and arthritic) conciliation and arbitration system there is nothing that can be done without the application of pressure by both sides if negotiations fail.

And finally, management is dreaming if they think there is an ocean of qualified people willing to work for peanuts. To me, thats an often fatal assumption.

But then of course Frozo, you don't get to bargain about your wages do you?

[lowerlobe]

While I don't agree with PAF, I think this part of your post is not entirely correct.
If you foul up, you will never work again and become a figure of ignominy for the rest of your sorry life.

In some other jobs when you foul up you are no longer alive.So to argue that as a case for huge remuneration packages is not exactly accurate.

There are also examples of board members causing significant cost blow outs if not huge losses and they go on and get jobs on other boards as if nothing ever happened.

[splashman]

Like a lot of S/Lame's, DMM's, and MLM's....Stuff up, bend a bit of metal, wreck a reverser cowl (MLMWA). How to ensure a proactive measure has been taken to aviod the incident reoccuring, get them away from the aircraft...how...promote them......Glad I left

[satos]

in some other jobs when you foul up you are no longer alive.So to argue that as a case for huge remuneration packages is not exactly accurate.

To add to that "Some other jobs if you stuff up they promote you to a higher paying position"to get you out of the way.

[The Mr Fixit]

one question

Are Engineers willing to back up their bravado and go for IA in support of a pay rise ?

[Talkwrench]

I am. I further believe that there is majority support for IA in the Hangar that I work at, given the flexibilities that the company is asking for the 3% they will surely be offering. It is fairly clear that 3% is unacceptable. There must be further financial inducement, be it by percentage pay rise or moving people up the scale. There is only one way to test the resolve of the members. If the members vote the action down, they can't then turn around and blame the executive for a poor EBA.

[blackhander]

Hate to use an americanism but bring it on

[domo]

I just went up a grade thats an extra 6%
get 3% eba
thats 9% not bad eh

thats this year alone with more to come next year

[QF MAINT OUTSOURCED]

No That's 4.5%p/a,and You Look After Aircraft,oh My God

[F-Class]

And todays "Australian" stated Dixon's package had increased by 27%..........
I've been in this game for 30 years, a unionist for 26 years and an ALAEA member for the last 20 years...........
I've never been on strike............
Worst industrial action I've participated in was to attend paid stopwork meetings!
The only industrial action I can remember was when I was a first or second year apprentice. The LAME's were on strike for a short while(over Super, I think) and the tradesmen in the workshops were stood down for a few days. The apprentices were working, cleaning the workshops........
Management need a reality check...............:=

[Apophis]

all talk no action thats what it comes down to

[domo]

(over Super, I think)
i believe it had to do with parking

[The Mr Fixit]

Only two recorded IA instances that resulted in a walkout were QF LAMEs in SYD over carpark issues and Australian Airlines LAMEs over Tea and Coffee.

The first in the eighties the second in the late seventies

I ask again " Do you have the balls for a long vigorous IA campaign ?"

[The Mr Fixit]

The Deal will be as years gone by, info from notices and feedback meetings I reckon the deal will be as follows

3% per annum
3% increase in quota levels
some payment/increase for DMMs, DTMs, SLIIs and PCT trainers etc
if we're lucky removal of quotas from Level 9 (should have been removed last EBA)
Oh and the special 'Overarching agreement' to keep HM onshore and bring the A330s onshore

in exchange for

HM only
Suite of rosters to be implemented at 14 days consultation
Cross utilization MEL-AVV
RDO and DIL banks

ACS
Part time and casual quotas pushed to 25% of relevant workforce
A380 - 'Special' team separate of mainstream ACS
Fixed term contractors

ALL
Training provisions - single time whilst on training
Home on weekends

So when it is laid out for our exec, would you recommend it to the membership ?

[Redstone]

The companys appeal to the AIRC on the 12 hour roster decision failed.

I say we tell 'em we no longer wish to work 12 hour shifts.

That will set the cat amongst the pidgeons......

[Long Bay Mauler]

Bring on the 8 hour.

I could do with a change of pace.:ok:

[domo]

bring on the 8 hour mate it be great it be over befour it starts
iv got the sh*** with the 12 hour the days off are great but your body realy suffers from 12 hour nightshift