Pondering my Future...

[1mag1n3]

Hey guys, and im new so bear with me :}

Right, im 16, and i have just left school, and i am going onto college to study Further Maths, Maths, Physics and either geography or computing. At GCSE level i hope to get grades into the region of A's and A*'s.

Looking over the forums there is hundreds of wannabes, which is obvious as a job in the sky is an appealing one. I know the drawbacks, the positives, and i believe a future in aviation would suit me.

As far as i know you need an fATPL, which enables one to become an First Officer, then you progress to over 1500 hours and become a Captain. To get to fATPL level you need to go to a Flight School, and the ones i know of are, FTE, OAT, EPST and CTC. Currently i like the look and success of FTE, and OAT with its brilliant course. Any other FTO's out there?

This is all i know guys, and i would love some input into helping me decide where to go, where to apply to, and such like.

The more random the information the better!

Oh and i love Facts :)

Thanks a million,
Chris.

[5150]

If you're up in Teeside, there's Multiflight at Leeds I believe

Couple of mates went through there many moons ago. . .

[TINTIN25]

I don't live in the U.K so I can't give you specific details but I think it is a good thing you are considering doing a degree in a non-aviation field incase something happens to your medical you will have an alternative career path.

As for training why not consider doing your pilot training in Australia? If you did it here you would have your license and all your ratings within 1 & 1/2 years and I bet it would end up being cheaper than doing your training in the U.K

[1mag1n3]

Hey thanks TinTin,
Yeah i heard Australia was a good place to train, do you know of any schools out there?

And 5150, MultiFlight, ive heard that is a great school from word of mouth. What are your mates doing now, are they employed with an airline, and how did they find the course.

Thanks guys for this, any more:hmm:

[captain_rossco]

First 16 year old that has come on here in a long time and not spouted endless uninformed ****e and with a host of spelling mistakes. Good for you matey!!!

Best of Luck

CR

:ok:

[wannabe there]

.. that reminds me, wonder how JustJoshing is getting on.

[1mag1n3]

Haha, thanks Cpt. Rossco! :)

[5150]

They're both in jobs, but both went down the single pilot route, before getting their first multi crew position after about a year.

I've never been to Multiflight, but have heard good things about them.

[1mag1n3]

Hmm, i suppose it is a difficult decision, and yes MultiFlight seems great.
Any other thoughts?

[1mag1n3]

Hey again.
I have just got a job, and i am hoping to save money to do my PPL. Could anyone tell me about this, such as price, hours, etc as my knowledge is limited on this.

This would show my parents how much i want to be a pilot to maybe in the future put their house on a secured loan to get into a decent FTO!

Thanks,
Chris.

[1mag1n3]

It was a passing comment! Dont take it so seriously and make false judments please.

Anyway, can anyone shed any light? I am wanting to start a PPL, and have limited knowlegde, could someone tell me about this, such as hours, prices, etc. Thanks a lot.

Best Regards,
Chris.

PS.I asked for information, and price was an example of ONE of the things which i would have liked to know. Thanks!

And they know i love flying!

[Canadapilot]

1Mag, have you considered training in Canada? That's where i'm currently doing my training and would highly recommend it. Here in BC there's the congested airspace, challenging terrain, very variable weather and also a high quality of training...all for a lot cheaper than the UK. Currently i've got my PPL and about 35hrs solo and spent a little over 7grand. Give it some thought before you sign over a small mortgage to Cabair!

[The Mixmaster]

This forum never ceases to amaze at how people stick the boot in so unnecessarily!!!

1mag1n3, good on you for coming on here and looking for a bit of extra info. I'd reccommend asking and just general browsing in the private flying section on pprune. Loads of informative threads on there for PPL related matters. I'd imagine if you're working a job while you're at college you'd be better off paying as you fly at your local flying club, the caa website has a list of FTO's approved for JAA PPL training. To give you a rough indication, the minimum hours you need for PPL license issue is 45 hours for which you'll be paying roughly anywhere between £4000-£6000 depending on school rates. All the best mate:ok:

[1mag1n3]

Ahh, right thanks for them simple answers guys :)

At this moment the world is my oyster! There is so many brilliant courses all around the world it is amazing! Spain, Canada, US, Australia, New Zeland, UK, and within them there is more FTO's than you could imagine!

Canada seems like another door to be opened, could you say where your training Canadapilot (ironic name :p) and i love the sounds of the challenges there as this would make the flying not just better for your future, but also for enjoyment!

And the PPL does seem to be a very likely thing to happen in the very near future, i may learn to fly before i learn to drive :ok:

Thanks for the help,
Chris.

Oh, and ill have a browse of those pages and see whats what Mixmaster :)

[redsnail]

In Oz, you'd probably would look at the WAAC (or what ever it's called) in Perth, WA. The radio work is similar to the UK/Europe and the weather is a lot better.

You'd come back to the UK to do the Instrument rating so plenty of time to get used to the lovely weather 'back 'home'. I believe it's done at Cranfield.

[Canadapilot]

1mag i train at Boundary Bay airport...i think it's the busiest training airport in Canada, and touches onto Vancouver airspace. Also as there's so many international students many of the local homeowners rent out rooms and include all your meals. I have a huge basement suite and don't have to budget for any bills/food etc, all for about 350 quid a month. The training cost may not differ that much from Orlando, but hey at least it's not full of Americans here! And you'll have a lot more interesting flying experiences to talk about at that first interview! You'll be flying into 2000ft landing strips high up in the mountains, and returning home through some of the busiest airspace in Canada, while along the way navigating through 10,000+ft high mountain ranges and learning those associated skills.I'm biased so you'll have to do what's best for you!

[1mag1n3]

Both Oz and Canada look rather amazing, their courses seem to be flawless. The Oz course at WAAC seems very reasonable in price, and also the accomdation is extremely good value. The Canada training also seems extremely good, the experiences would be once in a lifetime.

So far i have gathered there is more to the world than about 3 schools!
Here are the schools i have gathered so far (This is to help me as well :}) and their prices...so here goes! :
OAT- £75k
FTE- £65k
CTC- £65k+
Cabair- £68k
EFT- £55k
Boundry Bay- Unsure...
WAAC- £50k
MultiFlight (local) - £45k (Modular)
Hmm...what to think!!!

Looking at that list i could see the most appealing ones have to be WAAC and FTE, yet MultiFlights modular course also seems good, because of its locality.

This boggles my mind!

HELPP! :8
Chris.

[Canadapilot]

1Mag to fill in your answer for Boundary Bay, i'd say to go from zero - PPL,CPL and Multi IR you should budget about 25grand. And then once back in the UK, 3 grand for ATPLS and 10grand for converting the CPL and IR (about 4 weeks of flying).40grand for all the training would be a good estimate (plus maybe 3grand for accomm. while in Canada)
I know of one guy who trained at my school and now works for Easy, and he spent about that much.
Sorry i don't have any "Pound" sign on my ****ty Canadian laptop!!

[1mag1n3]

Haha, dont worry about a measly pound sign :) but look £££££££ feel free to copy and paste these with all my english keyboards permissions. :}

I think i must keep my options open now as i am only 16, and i think i need to get my A-Levels to a high standard to put me one above the rest.

Hmm...
I was wondering what to do at this moment in time...

1. Get my PPL for about £5k on a sort of pay as you go basis and have no money left over for an FTO in the future,

OR

2. Save most of the money to put towards going to a decent FTO...

I know this is a simple question, but Number 1 or Number 2?

I would like your opinions on this please :)

Thanks in advance,
Chris.

[Canadapilot]

If it was me 1Mag id concentrate on saving money and getting your A Levels done. The PPL will cost you less when you can commit full time to it after college. Although it may be advisable to have a few flying lessons to "get a feel" for flying, and to reconfirm this is the career you want (as patronising as that sounds!). You seem to have your head screwed on so i'm sure you can decide what's best for you, everyone's different and there's no definate path that works for everyone.
Myself, i went to Uni for a couple of years and got 40hours flying with the local university air squadron which decided it for me. I took the decision to leave Uni and work, and saved a lot of money which is what i'm haemoraging out now! Although i'll still need a loan when i'm back to convert to JAA (disgustingly expensive!).
Some may disagree, but you're still young and there's no rush. You'll be flying until you're 65 so why not get lots of money behind you and study all you can now. Believe me, it'll take the stress off later!

[1mag1n3]

Heh, yeah i totally agree!

I think a PPL would be a nice thing to have in your pocket, but as would be a nice lump sum of about £6k with working through college.
I dont think Uni is right for me to be honest, and i cant really explain why!
And yeah, i think with my first wages ill hop into a nice prop and have a senic instructed flight, only to reinforce what my thoughts are now!

I have had one flight when i went to RAF Leeming for my Works Experience, which was more of an acrobatic flight, but i still got to have a nice turn of the controls and got to do a loop!

And you said get "loads" of money behind you, the most realistically is about £12k including the money earned through college, this would mean spending some whilst learning to drive, and little bits and bobs here and there.

I am sure my parents would also help with money, not sure how much they would put in mind. Say, if i went to FTE they would most probably have to put their house on a secured loan, which would be the biggest help, but im not sure they would go this far :sad:

I just wish i could go into the future and be ready to go to an FTO with some nice A-Levels behind me, and a nice sum of money!

Thanks again Canadapilot,
Chris.

EDITED for this question :8

How much would an unsecured loan go up to, the largest possible unsecured loan on the planet? Anyone managed to get one with a highstreet bank for a fairly large sum of money? If so tell tell tell!

[jaymak]

Chris,

About flying school's in Australia, I'm about to start my CPL practical at Adelaide Flight Training Centre, based at Parafield Airport.

http://www.adelaideftc.com/

It's pretty good. But I'm thinking about going to FTE after I get the CPL. Not much point coming to Aust. unless you want to work in the region.

[PAPI-74]

1mag,

I am a flying instructor and an FO at London City. All of the schools you listed need to be visited to see where you are most comfortable. Remember, you are there for quite a while and you must be relaxed.
I went modular at Bournemouth, Professional Air Training, as I felt very unimpressed with OAT and Cabair. PATwere very helpful, compared to OAT who due to large numbers, forget the individual. The sales is very heavy, but it takes a step back to see through it. Don't just believe all you hear, get in and ask probing questions. I didn't fancy training in the desert in temps over 45 deg. I asked the sales bod at what piont did they stop flying......45 deg. That means that the cockpit is way above that, with no air-con. Nuts to that.....
Cabair will tell you what you want to hear re-jobs. Again, ask for previous students e-mail to get the truth. OAT claim to have a recruitment team, but I hear you are just forgotton once you have parted with you cash.
Expect nothing, and allow enough money to fund a bond / TR. I didn't have to, but many do. If I went to Easy with my Turbo Prop hours, I would still need to font the money for a TR. Needless to say, I won't be applying to them. I would recommend you instruct for 6 months or so. It is really good fun and gives you exceptionl handeling skills on those rough days, while maturing you very quickly.
There are no guaranteed jobs. Luck and knowing the right person at the right time is vital. Most airlines get 50+ CV's per week, most low houred. It is luck if they pick yours.
Example: On my sim check, the other bloke being checked had 5000hrs flying all sorts of twins. He didn't get the job and at the time I was on 450hrs with a bit of instructing. The ops dest is littered with mugs with pilots details on. Clever idea, but they are just laughed at.
Not trying to pi## on your strawberries, but there is a reality to the dream, and lots don't make it, having blown money they have to pay back. Some get the FATPL and never find work becauce they don't chase hard enough. Don't pay for a TR without a written offer of a job. I know 2 people who paid for 737 TR's and 1 is instructing, the other is back in IT.
Good luck!
Don't listen to bull and be suckered into a bad deal. You are the customer so if you are not happy, tell them. Go a bad instructor, get rid.

[matt85]

Really good post.

[Re-Heat]

Go a bad instructor, get rid.
Qualify this comment though - take valid criticism on the chin, and don't become an arrogant pilot, else you will kill yourself.

You need to the schools for yourself to see what is right for you. Don't be taken in by either marketing, or doing the training at the cheapest location - neither are always the best.

You need to learn from experienced instructors at that stage, so choose somewhere that gives you that best experience and instruction, instead places with limited instructors who have few flying hours themselves.

[1mag1n3]

Thanks for the replies again guys. Sorry i have not posted for a while, ive been in Turkey for a fortnight chillaxing around the pool:)

Anyhow, back to reality.
Thanks for your post PAPI-74, it explained a lot. Marketing is obviously a major factor to the FTO's as without it their would be no students there!
If any of you were to reccommend a school what would it be, i know this is a very large and wide ranging question, but with both personal and non personal opinions which school would you say has the best money to success ratio, as i obviously dont have a money growing tree.
Obviously OAT and FTE are the big ones, but as you say they are most probably marketing until they get enough students get their cash and bye bye.
I am sort of wondering what the hell to think at this moment!

Thanks,
Chris.

[Mach44]

Another good place to look could be Stapleford (www.flysfc.com) :ok:
Haven't been there myself yet, but from what I have heard and read, one great school.

[1mag1n3]

Ive seen this school in Ireland, http://www.pilottraining.ie (http://www.pilottraining.ie/)
Is it any good?

And reality is obviously there, but when your heart is set on something it is hard to see reality, but i do tend to take a step back and see the whole picture.

Like PAPI said, many might go to an FTO and not even get a job, which then your stuck.
I dont know what to think at the moment!

Best Regards.
Chris.

[Nibbler]

One of the easier ways to both fund and prove to everyone you have the desire is to get a part time [if you are continuing your education] or a even full time job with a flying school doing anything at all, sweep the floor or whatever.

You may even get a discounted rate for your PPL training as an employee, or at the very least be able to 'pay as you go' rather than be forced to fork out a lump sum.

If you can do this whilst living at home then all the better as the costs of living on your own are just not going to give you the spare cash to fund your PPL in your spare time.

Get your PPL this way and both your parents and potential employers will look at you a whole lot differently than they do now.

GOOD LUCK! :ok:

PS - a quick 10 point reality check.

1. Getting a job a a FO with an airline is not easy [check all the posts on here]
2. You don't yet know if you are capable of the ATPL rigors yet so PPL should be your first taste of what is to come
3. At the moment you will need to get 500-1000 flying hours, after you get your ATPL, to have a hope of getting a FO interview. Getting a job as a flying instructor is the only realistic option to build and pay for these hours
4. You may well need to pay to obtain a 'Type Rating' [TR] to secure a FO job
5. Working on an airfield gets you experience beyond that of flying which can be very handy and maybe pick up some contacts in the industry which you might need to call on in the future
6. If you go the 'Modular' route to your ATPL then expect to pay 40k just to qualify and we are talking lump sums of cash for each section here
7. If you go the integrated route then it's around 70K as a lump sum
8. Unsecured loans are not an option at your age with no job
9. Banks are starting to refuse funding for integrated training for ATPL and you are required to start repaying this loan [if you can get one] as soon as you qualify - job or not.
10. Flying Instructors earn about 10k a year give or take

[jaymak]

5. Working on an airfield gets you experience beyond that of flying which can be very handy and maybe pick up some contacts in the industry which you might need to call on in the future.
That's a good point. I've picked up a few contacts in the last two years of flying, and by basically hanging around the FTO I fly with. There is so much more to aviation than just the flying. These people help you learn the 'ways' of the industry.

And in aviation, one of those things is 'it's who you know, not what you know.' Believe me, if you know the right people, the doors seem to beg you to walk through them.

[SILENT_BADGER]

Chris,

Have you looked at CTC's wings scheme? Its not quite the same thing as the traditional FTOs like OAT, Cabair etc. They run a set of selection tests and then if all goes well they train you up to MCC/JOC level and deliver you to one of their customer airlines. You then spend the first few years of your career paying back the cost of this training.

Most of the new F/Os at my airline are from CTC. In my batch 9 were CTC, 2 were RAF and 2 were from other airlines. This is what I would have done in your position because the biggest challenge I think most people find is getting that first job. There are quite a few threads on here where people who know more (usually) about it than I discuss the pros and cons.

This rather assumes that your target is the airlines, there is of course much more to commercial aviation than just those.

The other thing I would suggest is to think about the qualifications you are capable of aquiring in the next few years in a larger context than purely being a pilot. It's a wonderful thing to go for but it is vulnerable to things outside our control like losing a medical (getting diabetes puts an end to the show), economic downturns or another 9/11. Always good to have alternative options.

Good luck with it all, reconnaissance is never wasted.

Cheers,
Gareth

[1mag1n3]

Yes, CTC wings looks brilliant, but the demand for these courses is simply massive, and your chance of being chosen is very small. However it does look very good, and i think once it comes to the time i shall apply for the selection process.
Has anyone been on the course at CTC wings, if so tell me about it! :)

Thanks,
Chris.

[1mag1n3]

Going back to one of my previous posts, i was wondering what you thought of http://www.pilottraining.ie (http://www.pilottraining.ie/) which is an irish school. I was basically wondering what it is like and what you guys think of it?

Thanks if you can shed any light on this.

Chris.

[Sky Wave]

1magin3

Agree with SILENT_BADGER.

I think CTC should be your first port of call. I went through the Wings ATP route having already gained my fATPL but I've met many CTC Wings Cadets and it certainly seems to be one of the best ways of getting into the airlines if that’s what you want.

My reasoning?

1) Everyone who makes it through the course gets into the right hand seat of a reputable airline.
2) Their training is extremely good and is just what the airlines are looking for.
3) There's no hidden costs and accommodation and transport is included in the price.
4) They will help you arrange an unsecured loan so no need to mortgage your parents house.

That's just some of my reasons.

I trust you've been to their website and read all the FAQ etc.

http://www.ctcaviation.com/

your chance of being chosen is very small

Less of that sort of negative talk. They take everyone that meets the grade. If you do your research and you have what it takes to be a commercial pilot you should be able to get through their selection process. They took me, I'm no Chuck Yeager and I'm certainly not the brightest pebble on the beech but I got through and I now fly 737's for a living:cool:.

The above said, you do need a plan B and a plan C just in case.

You should also go and get a class 1 medical straight away. It would be a shame spending the next 2 years planning and working towards a goal which is unachievable on medical grounds.

All the best.

SW

[1mag1n3]

Thanks for that SW. What you say is very positive, and i think from my perspective it is what i need to hear. When the time comes i will most definatly be applying to CTC wings, as it seems to be very good training from those who have mentioned it. And what ive read in the past from the website seems very promising.

And excuse the negative comment about the selection, but from what people say it is very tough to get in, but generally i am a positive person. If i apply i would think i could get selected, but i would not get my hopes up to be selected. I would say i am more of a Realist ;)

Anyway, as the time is coming in a year or so to get my act sorted out, when would be the best time to apply to schools? 6 months before is what i heard, as it is enough time to be sorting out medicals, money etc.

My reasoning?

1) Everyone who makes it through the course gets into the right hand seat of a reputable airline.
2) Their training is extremely good and is just what the airlines are looking for.
3) There's no hidden costs and accommodation and transport is included in the price.
4) They will help you arrange an unsecured loan so no need to mortgage your parents house.
Wow these reasons are just what you want to hear, all are almost as good as another but number 1 just pips it ;)

Thanks a million guys,

Chris.

[WildDart]

Just my little input from the experience i have got :)

Before going further with a career and future plans, make sure you want it, try get a trial lesson in if you enjoy that then over then next two years try to get your PPL depending on money issues.

Beginning to learn can be difficult at least this way you have less pressure and can do it your own time and build up a knowledge of flying rather than jumping into the deep end (Zero to ATPL)

Hope all goes well!!

In addition there are hundreds of flying schools out there that all offer the same thing becareful because quite a few are scammers and you will not get your money worth. start Googling, emailing and ringing they are there to help. Its hard to say which school is the best, as i found out. Just look around and you will find one that suits you and your learnings style.


WD :ok:

[BerksFlyer]

With regards to what WildDart said, does anyone know if CTC take cadets with a PPL?

On the website it says 'people with little experience', yet this is a bit ambiguous in relation to the amount of hours a PPL could have.

[1mag1n3]

BF,
I think that the Wings scheme is for people without any flying experience, yet i would not see why they would not accept you onto the course with a PPL, but i really have no idea about this, someone else would need to say!

My parents now are curious about my plans, they seem to be giving me more support toward going to an FTO, and are wondering where i would possibly go. I have mentioned CTC as my number one choice, FTE as my second, and Oxford or Oxford as my third, and if all these fail then i would go to a local school in Leeds, which offers modular ab-initio training, for a decent price.
I was basically thinking if this is the right frame of mind to be in, as i know selection into these schools is fairly hard, and many of them are identical to each other.

And i heard that you need to be 19 to be accepted onto the CTC wings cadet scheme, is this true?

[BerksFlyer]

1mag1n3,

It is 18 to apply and to start going through the selection system. Not sure if you have to wait until your 19 to start, but I wouldn't have thought so. It would probably have to coincide with being 19 to recieve a CPL, so you could start whilst 18 as long as you will be 19 by recieving the CPL which would be likely as the course takes about a year :ok:

[1mag1n3]

Ahh, right i see :)

Just i read somewhere that you needed to be 19 from a BALPA sponsership document thing!
Open to Min. age 19-29 yrs on date of application.

I hope it is 18, as i would love to train at CTC, it seems to be the best regarding job oppertunities.

Thanks,
Chris.

[BerksFlyer]

The reason I know is because I came into some confusion regarding minimum age, but to clear it up I emailed them to ask, and the reply was 18-29. This was fairly recent aswell, so hopefully it still stands true :)

Oh, and also this post on the CTC wings thread clarifies it http://www.pprune.org/forums/showpost.php?p=3551691&postcount=954

[1mag1n3]

Ahh, cheers BF. Was unsure myself but thanks for clearing it up.
Ill definatly be applying straight after college if not before, as i know that it is a superb school.

However my second choice would be either Cabair, FTE or OAT, or any other really... Unsure personally! Its a bit like :ugh:

Thanks ,
Chris.

[1mag1n3]

Guys, just thought I would re-appear in this thread I made 2 years ago, meaning I am 18! I was thinking, and I remember being sat 2 years ago thinking I wish time would go quicker. Looking back, its gone in seconds. I am just about to commence my final exams, for 2 of my 4 A-Levels. I already have 2 A's, in Maths and Geography and my final two are in Further Maths and Physics. I am hoping for an C in Physics, and an A in Further Maths. Anyway, enough about grades!

The situation at the moment is quite terrible for those commencing training. Its hit all the banks and the FTO's simply meaning you cant fund ab-initio training. I know this is simple but it puts any large FTO out of the window for me. Its a bad enough time to be training, and worse to be put in an unthinkable amount of debt.

Back in my younger days I had 3 plans,
Plan A- go to an FTO,
Plan B- go onto a cadetship and fund training with the money from that,
Plan C- university to study Maths...

Now, I am thinking plan B is the best option. You would get a degree in a Maritime subject, while earning money, and once the 3 year degree is over you get $40k starting wage as a third officer. I was thinking this could fund flying training sufficiently, within say a 5 year boundary. Say save 6k through university, then 10k throughout working per year. And then any financial help from my family. I think by the time I am 23-24 I could happily be in a financial situation to fund flight training...


To be honest guys, there is a huge brick wall in front of me, and the path around it is unfortunately 5 years in length.

Any ideas, thoughts and suggestions?

Thanks chaps!
Chris.

[Bealzebub]

Yes life has a habit of dropping reality into your lap. I think you have to decide what is right for you. If you are going to spend 5 years working, in order to save up the funding to assist with your flight training it may well be worth investigating those paths that would yield the best returns for that time investment. That isn't necessarily the job that offers the highest pay, since the input costs (or variables) associated with a particular line of work may not always give the best net yield. On top of that there needs to be consideration to the fact that 5 years (and it might be longer) is a fairly long time to be doing something that makes you miserable. To that end a balance may need to be struck between job satisfaction and potential yield.

Whilst working and saving towards your goal you can also apply for any opportunities that may arise in the meantime. Competition for those opportunities will be fierce, but as you have a fall back position, you would have little to lose.

Although you descibe the path around your particular obstacle as being "5 years in length." The truth is that is only a guess. The speed at which you travel varies over time and is also dependant on many variables.The dynamic is so complicated in reality that it needs a flexible and adaptable attitude. In reality it might be much shorter or much longer, and you should be prepared for either.

In summary, flexibility coupled with determination is key. You will also need a healthy measure of luck. Some of that luck you can probably manufacture for yourself using the first two ingredients.

[Gav28]

Plan C- university to study Maths...

Can't go wrong with a maths degree from a decent University either. I found it quite easy to get into a high paying (albeit dull) job in the financial sector with mine, from there saving up for training and paying off loan was relatively quick and easy. Might be a bit more difficult these days though.

[1mag1n3]

Thanks for the replies!

I do think its a pretty difficult decision to be in :( Its hard choosing what to do, since it will influence the rest of your life.

Also, the job I would be going into would be the navigation of a cruise ship, travelling the world. To me this sounds awesome. Its all expenses paid as well. No debt. And a job guarantee at the end. Well, as long as you pass.
To me, a Maths degree would be good, I would enjoy it. I have enjoyed Maths at college and teachers have said how its disappointing to lose such an able mathematician by not going on further. The university would be Durham, which is pretty much the creme de la creme of Maths...

Also, cruising would be difficult with regard to opportunities arising since there is almost a 50:50 chance of being away at sea...

Obviously the figures I quoted are just total guesses, of course many things could change. In 5 years I could have a girlfriend and have kids, I mean the amount of variables is massive. 5 years is counting 3 years at uni, and 2 years working which is the minimum needed for the cruise company...

Its all a bit like head-banging a wall at the moment, if im honest...
:ugh::ugh:

[Lew747]

Hi Chris,

I've always pondered a second career (originally a first choice) as crew on cruise liners. Don't suppose you could send me some web links for these cadetships your referring to? I've never been able to find much info about such a career so far!

Cheers,

Lewis :ok:

[Lew747]

...And don't worry, i'm in that same 'head-banging' boat at the moment! :}

[stuzzy1980]

Glad to hear you are taking a considered approach to things.....In my humble, and perhaps somewhat uneducated opinion, I think the most important facet an airline pilot can possess is the life experience that can only be gained outside the classroom.
Relax, enjoy your life! you are only 18!!! Travel, see the World, go to Uni, know what it like to live off baked beans and pasta!
I may joke, but seriously, you have all the time in the World...keep your eye on the prize, but don't let it impeed any dreams you may have in the short-term....
just a thought.......

[1mag1n3]

Thanks for the replies once again!
Stuzzy, thanks for supporting my decisions. I really need some kind of backing since my parents are just taking a back seat, and letting me make my own decision which I believe to be a good position to be in.

Now, the choice stands between University to study maths or a cadet ship. Obviously either will be good, both giving a university experience. The maths degree would leave a huge debt, yet the cadet ship wouldnt. Cadet ship guarantees you a job, providing you pass. Cadet ship lets you travel the world. Cadet ship has a lot to do with becoming a pilot, such as the degree material being somewhat similar to that of the ATPL's such as mass and balance, meteorology, navigation etc.

Clicky Lew. (http://www.careersatsea.org.uk/career_companies.asp)

The only horrible thing about working at sea, is the fact your at sea for 3-4 months at a time...

Why oh why did the recession come now!
:ugh:

[stuzzy1980]

I think either route will stand you in good stead long term....From my own experience, I knew fine well at age 18 ( and this is by no means a reflection on you, everyone is different) I had neither the maturity nor financial security to contemplate starting Pilot training.
I decided to go to University, to study Economics. Not only did this give me a qualification to 'fall back' on, but it taught me the ability to work independently to deadlines....there isn't anyone cracking the whip at Uni, Its pretty much down to you. Most of all though, I had a great time!
I also managed to get a bit of free flying from the University Air Squadron....
After that I went traveling for the best part of 4 years, and carved out a back-up career, should I need to fall back on.
At the ripe old age of 28, I feel that now I have all the elements in place, personally speaking, to make the best of training.
Aptitudes aside, the main thing I have gleaned from the number of assessment days I have attended at various FTO's, is this: 'Could I sit next to this person, sealed in this aluminum tube, for the next 3 hours?"
I think the cadet programme sounds equally appealing, and a break from the 'norm' of University. I recon that would learn allot from this experience, and would be an excellent platform upon which to build. Not to mention an excellent thing to have on your cv! In these uncertain economic times, If you are considering self-financing your studies (as I am) you need to be certain you can maintain the loan repayments should you not find employment soon after graduating.
I hope I'm not coming across as some arrogant 'I've been there, I've done that, I know it all, I been traveling....man' type , but all I'm trying to impart to you is my feelings about the value of taking your time, making informed decisions, and most importantly, enjoying life!!!

All the best,

Stu

[1mag1n3]

Well, I do agree with you totally here. Its not really a choice for me to make since I cannot begin training now. I think one main factor which I cant comprehend now is time, Im thinking that if I dont go now, then too many factors will influence my life leading to a possibility of never reaching the final goal. Obviously this is quite "annoying" but patience is the key, I suppose.

As far as maturity goes, I do believe I am capable of training now, genuinely. Now, this is in the sense of personality, since there is many other factors such as life experience, so in a sense, am I mature enough? I just dont know...

I do know about the loan repayments, and how :mad: large they are, and in reality I cannot begin to imagine having to repay it.

I got a letter today off Durham uni, asking what accommodation I want. I am going to try my best to defer this place until next year, so I start in 2010. This gives a year to get into a cruise company, which should be ample time. If I do get in, then I shall go for it, see how I find it and stick at it. If other opportunities arise, such as CTC beginning the HSBC loan then brill, Ill go for it, but otherwise Ill finish with the cruise company and work for them. Then time will bring in the cash, et voila.

Stuzzy, the one thing which rings loud in my mind is just what I could be doing at 28. I could be some maths dude, a officer on the deck of a ship, or a pilot. I know of a guy working for BA at 28, and I wouldnt want to be that age thinking "I wish I had done..."

A teacher said to me today, "Go for what your instinct wants, and if your instinct fails then at least you know that you did what YOU thought was right, and can take it from there..."

Thanks though :D
Its nice having someone in a similar position, just 10 years on!

[stuzzy1980]

...trust me, you might think 28 is forever-and-a-day-away, but my how time flys!!!!!
One minute you are 18, leaving school with the World at your feet, blink and suddenly you are 25, cough and there you are at 28, thinking, " man I'm nearly 30!!!"

Seriously though, best of luck to you. It sounds like you have your head screwed on and aren't jumping into anything rash.

As for me I'm off to Oxford in June...can't wait!

Happy Flying......

[1mag1n3]

Yeah, well 28 is far! Honest ;) Just think when im 28, youll be 38! Hehe sorry I dont mean to make you feel old :ok:

Well best of luck in Oxford, I am sure youll have a ball of a time. I am NOT jealous in the slightest. June? Its June already!

I do agree about time though. One minute ago, I was sat looking through college books thinking "What the hell is this!" but now I am done with that, and will be coming out of college with some shiny A Levels! Well 2 years in a flash. I suppose I do believe you!

Youve earned what your getting into, now enjoy it! Just think 2 years and you could be making a 737 go zooom with a swift movement of your wrist...

[Thick Blue Line]

1mag1in3

When I was 18 I subscribed to this site, I had GCSE and A Levels and could not even begin to contemplate doing anything other than flying. I tried and failed several sponsorship assessments but couldn’t afford an air training school. I got a cr@$py retail job and did about 10 hours towards a PPL before ‘giving up’ in favour of the pub.

I languished in retail for 6 or 7 miserable years before working my t!ts off and managing to get a job I actually enjoy. I now consider myself in the extremely fortunate position where I have a job I really enjoy (most of the time) and that pays (reasonably) well. I live comfortably, enjoy my work and am now looking at flying again mainly for the pure enjoyment of it and then see where it leads.

You hit the nail on the head yourself when you said you cant predict your personal circumstances over the next 5 years, so you clearly are less blinkered than I was at 18!

From what you have said, you have a good set of qualifications so far and opportunities to do further education that will actually lead to a job rather than the sort of ‘nondescript’ degree I did.

In the current climate, getting yourself any sort of job is hard enough, never mind house/car/holidays/day to day living that goes with it.

I suppose what I’m saying is, don’t pressure yourself in to doing everything at once. You have options, and options = choice!

Apologies if I’m waffling . . . !

[stuzzy1980]

Have you thought about teaching Maths after your degree?
Sit your PGCE's, which, in certain circumstances can be accelerated to take 6 months....Plenty of government funding available, and a 5k 'golden hello'
It's a solid fall-back plan, with a guaranteed 20-25k salary attached to it.....
It is an industry that is in demand, and one you could return to quickly and easily (relatively) should you not gain immediate employment following finishing up at an FTO.