Luton's Expansion Plans

[newswatcher]

From the Independent:

"THE NEW operator of Luton airport unveiled plans yesterday to triple passenger numbers to 20 million a year in an attempt to ease mounting air traffic congestion in south-east England.

TBI, which took over Luton in May after buying out Barclays' controlling stake for pounds 58m, said expanding the airport would eliminate the need for another runway in the South-east. Keith Brooks, TBI's chief executive, said passenger numbers at Luton could be increased from last year's 6.5 million to 10 million without any significant investment. However, a further expansion to 20 million would probably require more terminal facilities and a direct rail link into the airport.

The airport - Bedfordshire's biggest employer, supporting 8,500 jobs - is negotiating a new agreement on landing charges with easyJet, its largest customer. Mr Brooks said he expected to sign a deal "satisfactory to both sides" before 1 August, when an interim agreement with easyJet expires. Under the present arrangements Luton charges easyJet pounds 5.50 a passenger, compared with the airport's standard tariff of pounds 7.89.

Mr Brooks refused to disclose what the new charges were likely to be but said it was in all interests for an accord to be agreed giving easyJet long-term certainty and the incentive to continue to expand at Luton.

Pre-tax profits for TBI rose last year by 6 per cent to pounds 19.3m, thanks to a strong performance from its Cardiff and Belfast airports. But Stockholm's Skavsta airport and its airport services arm performed poorly. Mr Brooks said TBI was keen to buy more UK airports."

Rather brief on detail, but might keep Easyjet happy!

[The Zombie]

'Luton charges easyJet £5.50 a passenger, compared with the airport's standard tariff of £7.89'

Why should easyJet pay less than the rest?

ZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzz....... :rolleyes:

[morroccomole]

easyjet pay less because: when they first went to Luton the airport was dead on it's knees and desperate for business. LLA offered them a 5 year start up deal at the £5 rate. That deal is now over, easyjet are I believe, negotiating for a new rate. They believe they should have a preferential rate owing to the fact that they provide Luton with more than 80% of it's work. Seems fair to me, open markets etc.

[OLNEY 1 BRAVO]

The "start up" deals as described in this thread are far from unusual. I seem to recall that STN introduced a very much reduced tariff 4/5 years ago where any airline starting up a scheduled route to a destination not already served from STN got very, very preferential rates. If I remember correctly a number of charter operators suddenly converted to scheduled operations .. I'm sure Finnair's weekly charter from Helsinki was one of those.

Turning to the original thread, it seems that TBI are undertaking a cull of the existing Luton Management .. the following from the Luton Airport Website:

"MANAGEMENT AND SUPPORT POSITION RESTRUCTURING AT LONDON LUTON AIRPORT OPERATIONS LTD

TBI plc (“TBI” ;), the owner and operator of regional airports and related businesses, which acquired a further 46% of LLAOL in March 2001 and now owns a majority stake of 71%, has completed a comprehensive review of LLAOL.

During the first three months of TBI’s ownership of LLAOL, the senior TBI personnel installed by the Group in March have undertaken an in depth organisational review at the airport. The aim of this review was to reposition the organisation to enhance its performance recognising that there are significant efficiencies and synergistic benefits with other airports within the TBI Group.

The management team has recognised that continuous improvements are necessary to maximise the performance of LLAOL. In line with this assessment management are proposing to implement a new organisational structure during a formal consultation process with potentially affected individuals and their representatives. About 40 management and support positions will become potentially redundant in the reorganisation.

The aim of the programme is to ensure that London Luton Airport is better placed to face the competitive pressures in the rapidly changing air transport market."

If TBI are serious about increasing flights, then they need to start laying some more concrete for new stands now.




[This message has been edited by OLNEY 1 BRAVO (edited 27 June 2001).]

[PAXboy]

Because EZY want to make money?
Because EZY are their largest customer by some margin and so have muscle?

Just the usual I guess!

One service that might expand is the IOM. Currently at one rotation per day - year round. When BA chooses to reallocate the Manx LHR slots from a 146 to a 777, then LTN will be the most likely destination.


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A window seat on the sunny side of the aircraft, please!

[Spoonbill]

Dont expand it - move it!
Luton is a sod to get to from most directions for anyone north of Watford because of the crap road connections, (from where I live Luton is 82 miles, Stansted is 85, it takes one and a half hours to get to Stansted and nearly 2 and half to Luton).
I know this raises the "new airport - NIMBY" issue", but the sale of the land which Luton sits on would make significant inroads into the investment required on an existing ex airbase site nearby.
Most of the jobs there would be portable, as would be the base operators.
OK, big scheme - but worthy of thought?



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It wasn't me.

[Flybywyre]

I recently flew from Luton but I would not do so again until they have a rail link. Getting there is a nightmare.

[Freddy Forks]

Spoonbill-

Much easier solution------You move.
I could easily sit here and say I live 80 odd miles away from East mids and it takes over an hour to get there.Big deal.I could also say I live 30 miles away from Heathrow and it takes over an hour sometimes to get there too.Its the crap road link I suppose-the M1.

[LTN man]

Snoonbill and Flybywyre - what are you talking about. Luton has excellent road connections and has a rail link. Admittedly there is a 5 minute journey by shuttle bus to complete the trip from the new airport station to the terminal but then there is a 5 minute walk from the Heathrow Express and Underground to get to some of Heathrow’s terminals.

If you want to catch a train between 18:00 and 19:00 to London then Heathrow will provide 4, Stansted has 2 as they are now operating an off peak service while Luton has 9 calling at 6 central London stations. Luton also has a 4 train an hour service to Gatwick and the south coast plus a direct rail link to Nottingham and the Midlands.

[stand37r]

Bad research flybywyre - Luton Airport railway Station has been open for some time now on the Midland mainline, with through trains to London and as far south as Gatwick and Brighton (direct). Personally though, it isn't my first choice of airport either.

[OrsonCart]

Good luck TBI, the place sure does need a 'new' mentality.

[autobrakemedium]

M1 (&M25) A1, A5, A6,

Thameslink trains!

Crap. yea sure!

[flap15]

What are the expansion plans for LTN? Will passengers be unloaded on arrival or still have to wait for another aircraft to finish its loading or unloading? The airport can not expand untill pax handling airside is improved.

[LTN man]

This is the short term plans TBI have up their sleeves. A new carousel in arrivals. Next there will be new stands added to the north of the new apron by the new terminal which already has planning permission.

The longer-term plans include a new taxiway to join the old main apron with taxiway Delta. A full length parallel taxiway, which will give the runway a starter extension.

Anyone noticed the new hotel being built that will over look the Magic ramp.

[FlapsOne]

Yes yes yes.........but still only one, sigle carriageway road leading from the vauxhall roundabout to the airport. Can't see any room to change that, can you?

Just witness what happens there after about 1600 each day. More pax = more cars = a bloody awful journey to and from LTN.

I've been flying for 23 years and I have never seen such a badly 'designed' airport.

Departures needs to be flattened and totally re-designed and rebuilt. Absolutely no amount of altering what is already there will change things now without a total re-build.

[LTN man]

The journey out of Luton from 16:00 to 18:00 can be a nightmare but all of London’s airports have congestion problems at peak times. There are plans afoot to dual the road from where the dual carriageway ends at the moment and build a new road in a cutting between the runway and the offices on the corner of Airport Way.

Departures are set to move to the first floor of the new terminal, which is presently empty. This will happen when walkways and air bridges are built. Again the airport has planning permission for this work. The old terminal will then be partly demolished.


[This message has been edited by LTN man (edited 28 June 2001).]

[togathrust]

Surely the real problems for expansion of aircraft movements are in the layout of the 2 main aprons. Congestion is already a problem at peak times due to the fact that they are both cul de sac's, and the planners in their wisdom built the second apron 20 odd feet lower than the original, scuppering any chance of having a loop.

[kala87]

I must admit to a certain nostalgia for Luton as I started my PPL there in the days when light GA traffic outnumbered commercial movements, but that's another story. The place is a classic example of poorly designed piecemeal development. The airport still doesn't have a parallel taxiway to both runway thresholds. I can remember this being discussed in the 1960's. Ever seen even a small airport in the U.S that puts up with this nonsense? From a pax point of view my family and myself have had numerous awful experiences at LTN. Until the recent new baggage reclaim area was built, retrieving your bags was a rugby-scrum affair reminiscent of Calcutta. EZY were right to complain about the shambolic days of last winter when the place ground to a halt after a couple of inches of snow. The entrance to the terminal and surrounding areas are frequently carpeted in litter. London's fourth airport? Some joke,surely? What would the place be without Stelios? Let him have his bargain pax tax - there's no-one else as committed to the place, and LTN need him more than EZY need LTN.

[PAXboy]

LTN is my local, depending on direction and the seat I am in - I often see my home on departure/arrival and I have been using it for a dozen years or more.

EZY: A great development and I use them frequently for business and leisure. However, whilst LTN needs them, they should not get too cocky for the simple reason that they cannot move!

Go to STN and enter 100% competition with Go + Buzz? I doubt it. EDI/LGW and be at the mercy of BAA? I doubt it.

Transport has improved a lot but the single access road (as opposed to the two that we had) was big mistake. All the usual examples of short sighted planning abound.

The new check in hall is a cow shed and such an effective Faraday cage that few mobile phones work. If you are in a queue for the best part of 45 mins in working hours, this is not funny.

The eastern extension to the taxi way fell short of making it to the Easterly threshold by only a short distance.

The disparate heights of the two aprons is a colossal failure.

I have a long list of 'niggles' that pax experience but I will not trouble you with them. I have already been in correspondence with the management. But I suspect that the helpful person who wrote back may not have their job anymore!

As with any facility that you use regularly, learn the pathways and dodge those newcomers who are still staring around trying to figure it out.


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A window seat on the sunny side of the aircraft, please!

[Spoonbill]

Having a great road network nearby is no good if it still takes an extra 45 minutes to do battle through Luton and onto the single approach road and park. Rail would be an option - except that to get there by train would take even longer.
I, like any other passenger, have the choice of where I fly from, and now that most operators from Stansted offers a wider range of destinations and cheaper fares I'm afraid that I won't be going to Luton anymore.
I'm not knocking TBI or anyone who works there, merely it's location and accessibility.


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It wasn't me.

[Lawyerboy]

Have to say folks, Luton would come way above Heathrow or Gatwick in my easy-to-get-to list. I live slap bang in the middle of London and Luton and Stansted both take less time to travel to/from and are easier than either of the two major airports - and that's by train OR car.

Now, ask me if I think it's anything more than a big shed with a runway attached, and I may have something else to say... :)

[BOEINGBOY1]

so has ltn learned the lessons of the past 2 or 3 winters, when the airport was closed virtually all day on several occasions due to snow. NO proper snow plows, and screwed up snow clearance procedures that as on the occasions i witnessed, thay don't even beging to clear snow when it is still snowing, thereby allowing the existing snow to compact and turn to ice.
ltn has allways been, and will allways be a regional airport.

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IT'S BETTER TO BE ON THE GROUND, WISHING YOU WERE IN THE AIR - THAN IT IS TO BE IN THE AIR, WISHING YOU WERE ON THE GROUND !

[LTN man]

The two aprons will be connected, honest, I have seen the plans though I can't give you a date when the work will start. When the new stands are built to the north of the 6 pack the stands will sit at a higher level than the existing new apron. Taxiway Delta was realigned during redevelopment work and now gains height when it passes the western apron. This was done so the two aprons can be connected at a later date.

I was in terminal 2 at Heathrow at the weekend. The check-in area was grossly over crowded and the feeling of claustrophobia was immense due to the 7ft ceiling. Terminal 2 must me the only major terminal in the world where even midgets can touch the ceiling. Later in the day I returned to Luton and was struck by the amount of space each passenger had.

[OLNEY 1 BRAVO]

TBI seem to adopting a two pronged approach.

In the interview in "The Independant" that Newswatcher posted to start off this thread, the Chief Executive of TBI spoke at length of expansion at Luton. I understand that the MD at Luton has also made similar claims on local radio and in the local press, even to the extent of suggesting that the local council release land for the purpose.

However, I'm getting feedback from a large number of people who work at the airport (not just for the airport) that the local management are actually saying that they now intend to do nothing for the next two years and that Luton is in a period of "maintenance" which presumably means not a lot is going to happen.

So TBI, which one is it?

[This message has been edited by OLNEY 1 BRAVO (edited 03 July 2001).]

[jumpseater]

With them laying off around 40 staff in Planning and Development, Environment, Marketing and IT, and other areas, one might think that it's going to be a bit quiet for a few years!.

[LTN man]

Certainly there are no major projects to be started in the next 12 months as TBI reckon they can squeeze 10 million into the new terminal. They do recognise there is a problem with the single entry/exit to the main apron and that they will need new stands and an extra carousel sooner rather than later. I don’t know if this view will change though with the management clearout.

[euroboy]

LTN is one of the easiest airports to get to with good public transport links ThamesLink, Midland Main Line trains and coach connections to LHR LGW STN, Central London and various parts of the UK. Living North of Luton I have no problems getting to it, and imagine coming from the South just as easy.
In the old days 1970`s there wasnt the dual/single carriageway leading from the M1, you drove towards the town centre and then through small streets.
LTN problems have arisen because new housing developments during the 1980`s which are at the back of the airport and the residents have to use the airport roadways to get into the town centre and M1. The airport has moved on from the daily Britannia and Monarch charter, and I believe the old Luton Council never saw the development and future in the airport, seeing house building as the way ahead.
I think it was a totally stupid move to build the new terminal accross the once through road, so now there is only one way in and out. Bit like LHR and the tunnels. One problem and the whole airport grid locks.
You also have the Vauxhall site with the shift changes although these dont happen at rush hour. Dont get your hopes up coz the Vauxhall works at closing....they are, but the land is not being sold and there is very little you can do with it. There is talk that it will re-open in 2-3yrs.

LTN is enclosed by residental areas, Green Belt and Herts County Council, all bit of a problem for the managers at the airport I expect.

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Warning:This cape does not enable the wearer to fly.
_ _____________________ _
Warning label on a Superman costume.

[This message has been edited by euroboy (edited 05 July 2001).]