Wh?ch Air Band Radio

[EGMC]

I am soon to be a TATCO, and on my two tower visits I was positively nudged in the direction of getting acquainted to the validated-speak.

Apparently TATCO's passing through the college are good at what they have been told, but struggle to adjust to the way it's ACTUALY done.

...Also- I think it'd be fun to listen to the skies (I know not to write tail numbers down:8 or transmit:= , its just to get my ear in so to speak)

Any recommendations/tips?...here is my general spec:

Digital- I know most are nowadays
Memory for at least 10 frequencies
Automatic scanner, so I dont have to look up in a booook
Is rechargeable/useable in the home (through mains) and in the car (through my un-used fag-lighter)
Spend is about £80-£50 deep, and 2nd hand is an option!

I live in the Southeast, right near an airport [EGMC!-obviously] so range wouldn’t be a problem, and I could see myself at EGHH on weekends at the college too

[54north15west]

Read the manuals for standard phraseology cos usually in operations phraseology goes to **** quickly.....:ugh: :ugh: :ugh: :ugh:

[Speedbird1T]

EGMC

Congratulations on getting through the NATS selection process.

I suggest you download CAP413, available at the CAA's website here:

http://www.caa.co.uk/application.aspx?categoryid=33&pagetype=65&applicationid=11&mode=list&type=subcat&id=4

BAW1T

[EGMC]

Sorry- shoulda mentioned:

I have a PPL + RT lic therefore I do have CAP413... and every now and then flick through it reading the boxes in my head.

BUT- I really AM keen on listening in on the frequencies, I can see the risk of sliding down the slippery wedge and ending up with a slack grasp of PROPER RT. But also I can see the positive that I WILL gain from becoming used to the flow and speed. The situations which can arise and how they play out in real-time. I HAVE given the internet live-streaming a go to hear JFK and even better places in Australia. The CAA doesnt allow UK RT on the internet though!

I like the idea of visiting an airfield/ or even studying the college stuff with a radio and some mates... it’s a more interactive learning process too- I think that the more varied inputs I use, the easier CATC will be... I'm one of those ACTIVE learners.

PS: During my solo PPL, I had THREE 7600's, and I dealt with them increasingly well- so I AM grateful for the experience. But I always thought how convenient it would be to reach behind to get my own radio out of my flight bag and use it in an emergency... One guy used his mobile phone to call Tower [but I think he was just scared of following light-gun signals to be honest]

... Sorry for that 'PS' babble, but any recommendation’s for the radio?

[Gonzo]

EGMC, there's a thread about scanners over on 'Spotters' Balcony' somewhere.

Please don't take this the wrong way, but be careful about being complacent with the ATC r/t you'll be learning. In many cases, and I'm speaking from personal experience here, it's more difficult to teach correct r/t to someone who's been using it recently in another context, than a complete novice.

You appear to recognise this yourself, which is good. :ok:

Flow comes with practice, rather than listening. Also, you'll find that most of us actually slow down when busy. Yes, it means one keeps control of the r/t, but also it lessens the chance someone will come out with 'say again' or misunderstand.

[EGMC]

OK Gonzo, Thanks for re-emphasising the true negatives. I HAVE taken your post on board and therefore see the -ves outweighing the +ves.

I got thinking on alternatives, so if anyone else is a budding controller may I recommend http://www.pooleys.com/prod_list.cfm
which is a good replacement for the radio idea.

PS: I havent ACTUALY listened to the tapes, but they are well recommended and up-to-date!... also, for Morse-coder's... Pooleys tapes are a fun way of learning [esp in the car/in traffic reading numberplates].

One more similar Q: What do ATCO's think about things like VATSIM for getting used to the 'game', I mean- is there a lot of dangerous shortcuts that players will pick up? [I havent done any ATC sim yet as I am still weary of the pros/cons].

[Speedbird1T]

EGMC

Using VATSIM IMHO can only be a good thing purely from the experience and knowledge point of view. You must also bear in mind that the Uk division also has several active members who are also rw ATCO's. I believe it has definitely 'helped' several others become rw ATCO's over the last few years and continuing to do so.

On the other hand one could potentially develop 'bad habits' although you are 'examined' at every stage of the ratings system with Vatsim.

What do you have to lose ?

If you fancy area or approach, why not try 'London Control'. Having visited LACC over the weekend I was amazed at how close to the real deal LC is !

BAW1T

[Gonzo]

In my experience, VATSIMers going for a real world ATCOing fall into two categories. Those who have the ability to be ATCOs anyway, and it has helped them become aware of procedures, rules, phraseology etc. The second group, far less numerous, think that because they were pretty hot at VATSIM then they'll be pretty hot ATCOs, and already see themselves valid at Heathrow Tower or on Clacton or TC North before they've even arrived at the college. It's not very pleasant training those. I remember one came for a visit and listened to me doing Ground and thought I needed a few tips. Not that I'm averse to criticism, but he wasn't doing himself any favours!:ok:

[rickypbrown]

Cheeky buggar Gonzo! I'm surprised you didn't give the ol' whipper-snapper a clip round the ear!

[discountinvestigator]

ICAO Doc 9432 looks rather like CAP 413 as well.

[BackPacker]

EGMC, The "Bearcat" line of scanners seems to be preferred by spotters around the world. I got mine cheap 2nd hand for 40 EUR. Note that not all Bearcat scanners include the aviation bands - check the spec sheet before putting your money down. And I have yet to find one which includes VOR and ILS frequences. (Why? The ATIS at my field is over the VOR only...)

I also rigged a simple dipole antenna in the attic using some leftover RG-58 ("thin ethernet") cable I had lying around from before I switched my home computer network to UTP. I did a detailed description of this in one of my other posts a while ago.

[EGMC]

Thanks for the tips and tricks people, but I’m probably NOT going to do anything practical [apart from visiting other units], Mainly because there is an abundance of things I can learn without picking up bad habits such as:
Learning Morse code, decoding SNOWTAMS, perfecting Met/wx understanding & a/c recog.

The problem I’m having with the last topic is that everywhere I look [t'internet/Janes/Boeing...] I seem to see a slight variation in figures. The recog will be ok especially thanks to angled pictures on airliners.net….. but its things like TAS [cruise/max], total pax variants, range, level [cruise/max]... i.e. the figure work are varied from source to source, and if I am going to commit numbers to memory I'd better make sure that they are the ones that NATS follows... can anyone forward me the pdf/DLP of a/c info that you get when you start at the college?

[Ppdude]

yep. learn morse code. That helped me throughout my training, and I often use the clicks in RT to communicate in RT fail situations.

[Ppdude]

and by the way, all you need to know is that Jets go really fast, the small things go slower. Thats served me well enough so far. I would stop worrying about the different TAS of the 777 series and worry about how your going to pay your rent. ooppps, back to other threads we go!