Pilots & Rampers Charged in USA w/Immigration Charges/Arrested

[AA SLF]

Seven (7) Pilots & two (2) rampers have been arrrested on Immigration charges in the USA. Charges ranged from fake Passports to faleshoods on Social Security applications.

Two (2) of the Pilots were from American Eagle. One from DFW and the other from MIA.

An Immigration official said - "they lied to get into the cockpit and should never have been there". All those arrested are reported to be from Venezuela and may have paid as much as $20k USD to get into the USA and to get the "paperwork" that allowed them to get their jobs at the airlines.

General discussion by the TV talkingheads about all of them being from "South America" and "drug smuggling, etc.". .dAAvid -

[flite idol]

The two Eagle guys were Venezuelan nationals apparently with fake stamps in their passports. They are talking about a ten stretch in the federal pen if guilty. Every flight crew member at DFW now has two weeks to get an FBI finger print and background check done, one guy has already been fired because this revealed a prior felony not disclosed on an application filled out over a decade ago. The federales are saying this is phase one of a five phase major investigation of cockpit crews flying for US carriers. If you have skeletons in your cupboard watch out.!

[james707]

Thats just the tip of the ice berg in arrests theres an outfit in Miami Falcon Air flying 727 pax and cargo and they are bringing in pilots from south america to fly there airplanes at half the going rate the govt hasnt done anything about that while we have tens of thousands of people on the street since 9/11

[Kubota]

Breathe, James, breathe!

[redtail]

flite idol, can you post a source about their documentation? A news article or something?

[TheGreatLeslie]

Kubota.

I could not help but have a little chuckle at your inspriational advice for James. It is good to see in this world of gloom and doom that we have not lost our sense of humour.

Cheers.

[flite idol]

Redtail the info came from a press conference I think it was in Miami. I saw it on a TV news report but it must be in print somewhere. Sorry I`m a computer dummy so if I found it I`m not sure I could post a link.

[aspinwing]

Try this:

<a href="http://sunsentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-pilots0210.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines" target="_blank">pr ess report</a>. . <img src="wink.gif" border="0">

interesting <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">

[Willit Run]

Unfortuneatly, I know zip about the details, but, I do know two of these guys personally, and they are two of the nicest guys you could ever hope to fly with. I wish them the best and hope to see them in the cockpit soon.

[redtail]

Thanks aspinwing. Folks like these guys make it harder for the rest of us who try to do this legally.

[Roadtrip]

It's about time that the INS and Justice Dept started doing their jobs. I'm sure these people are "nice" but I'm sure there are also a couple of "nice" American citizens that got screwed out of their pilot jobs because these "nice," yet DISHONEST ILLEGAL ALIENS THAT LIED AND FALSIFIED OFFICIAL DOCUMENTS, took them instead.

[ 12 February 2002: Message edited by: Roadtrip ]</p>

[411A]

Hope the airlines concerned get fined.....very BIG fines...as in multi-million dollars.

[Staysafe]

Don't forget that we "foreign" pilots leave quite a bit of money at your flight schools and trainingcenters over there.

Glad the INS never looked deeply enough into my legal status when I flew for a known commuter some years ago. Great experience though...

today I fly heavy... yes, also across your country.

[ 12 February 2002: Message edited by: Staysafe ]</p>

[Ichnusa]

Roadtrip:

Halloooooooooo?!? Go and visit some of the flight schools in your area, and tell me how many people with the green card or with the legal right to work in the US you'll find among the instructors: thirty per cent maybe. All the others are here illegally, with student visas or tourist visas as well. Do you really think INS knows nothing about it? C'mon. It's like the indians in the gas stations or the mexicans cleaning up your roads and serving you the burgers, or watching after your babies: splendidly illegal, but damn useful. And regarding airlines: a friend of mine, a foreign citizen married to a yankee, got hired by a big regional airline this year: out of 22 pilots in his class, ONLY 2 were american citizens! You simply don't have enough qualified people to fly those shiny jets, so no bull...p, ok?

[Roadtrip]

You don't necessarily have to be an American citizen to work in the US. BUT, you do have to be here legally with the "right" to work, the proper VISA, etc.

Your misrepresentation of speaks for itself. Sure there are lots non-US citizens working for airlines, but they'd better damn site have the right to work here. Maybe the gentleman from Norway who claims to gleefully violated US law a while ago by flying for a commuter illegally would like to tell his current employer that he has no respect for obeying US laws. Maybe he thinks respecting FARs is beneath him also.

Thanks for the info, Ichnusa. As far as people working in the US without the "right" to work here, they'd better be looking over their shoulder. I'm going to fire off a letter to my senators and representatives today and enclose a copy of this thread. We Americans are in a very foul mood right now, especially with people who cynically abuse our hospitality and good will. To those who respect our laws and do it right, welcome. Glad to have ya flying our "shiny jets". To the rest like you Ichnusa, ******-off.

[TALUFTEN]

Hey Staysafe, you wouldn't be stating that so smuggly if you were doing some HARD TIME with a roommate named Bubba.

[B Sousa]

ITs unfortunate that the guys just trying to make a living got caught up in this mess. On the other hand what else did they possess that was fake to get them flying....Once you lose credibilty you can never get it back.. .Adios Dudes....

[ 13 February 2002: Message edited by: B Sousa ]</p>

[bugg smasher]

Roadtrip my friend, anger management is a difficult thing around here these days, please relax if you can, there is no need to threaten the Ppruners, they are by and large very decent folks. I’m reasonably certain the FAA/DOJ/INS monitors this website for indications of aviation-related terrorist leanings, no need for you to write the Senator.

A good friend of my wife’s was on the roof of the North Tower, waiting to be rescued, saying her final farewells to her husband via cellphone when it collapsed on that impossibly sunny day last September, onto a good friend’s brother. Neither of them have been recovered, the families were presented with ceremonial ash at Ground Zero last week. (God help us all). Even though I have been mercifully spared the loss of direct family, the experience has been a devastating one, all the better I think to show the steely stuff that New Yorkers are made of. Most are certainly still welcome with open arms.

Al Qaeda sit up smartly and take note, mess with us, and find out how fast you depart your thieving and miserable little mortal and motherless canine coils (a little anger management therapy might be indicated for the bugg as well).

[ 13 February 2002: Message edited by: bugg smasher ]</p>

[Roadtrip]

buggsmasher - . .Don't confuse anger with resolve. We Americans have been far too passive, acquiesing, and politically correct. 9/11 was the shock treatment and punishment for our collective stupid naivety. Brits and foreign nationals come to the US for pilot training, NOT because they want to contribute to the American economy, but because their own government's policies have made pilot training grossly overpriced. But I suppose they think it worth it, even with the headaches of converting the FAA certificate to UK or JAR standards. A very few stay illegally and try and get jobs because their own economies do not or will not support a robust aviation industry. How many Americans go to the UK and Europe for pilot training or for a job for that matter.

When someone like Staysafe abuses his welcome here, or someone like Ichnusa takes pleasure in rubbing our faces in the failure of the PC INS to control our borders, it's time call a spade, a spade.

I've lived for several years in foreign countries, both in Europe and the Middle East. I respected their laws. I expect foreigners in my house to render the same reciprocity.

A roundup of illegal aliens in the US and killing Al Queda terrorists has less to do with anger than fixing a problem we should have fixed long ago.

[polzin]

Griz bare

You comment is not worthy of this thread . I do not like your use of the F.... word!! .

[ 14 February 2002: Message edited by: polzin ]</p>

[FrontWindowSeat]

Roadtrip,

Unfortunately the INS makes it absurdly difficult to work legally in the US, even when the economy was/is screaming out for the skilled professionals that the US educational system has failed to deliver. There are plenty of examples of people lving here and making a significant contribution who have fallen foul of some trivial technicality and become "illegal".

I have no doubt that you have lived legally in European countries - it is quite easy to do - but without paying for the services of a good Immigration Lawyer, I doubt you would have much luck doing the same as a foreign national in the US due to your extremely Byzantine laws, rules and interpretations, and their wholey inconsistant application by the INS.

Of course there are many people who don't even try to comply with immigration laws, and I don't condone them, but you really shouldn't paint the world in such simplistic black and white hues - it belies your obvious intelligence to do so.

[Airbubba]

This would get you booted out or imprisoned in most of the countries I've worked in...

________________________________________________

. .February 13, 2002

Pilot With Fake ID Faces Deportation. .By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS. . . . . .Filed at 12:14 a.m. ET

GRAPEVINE, Texas (AP) -- An American Eagle pilot accused of using a false passport to get his job will appear in immigration court to face possible deportation, an immigration official said.

Luis Garmendia, a Venezuela native, was arrested after landing a flight at Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport on Saturday. He was among seven pilots and two ramp workers arrested in Texas and Florida and charged with immigration-related offenses.

The others airline employees are being held in Miami.

Lynn Ligon, spokesman for the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service, said Monday that there was no indication the employees were involved in terrorism.

Garmendia paid $25,000 for a counterfeit stamp in his passport indicating he had applied for a green card, according to the U.S. attorney's office.

But Garmendia, released on bond Tuesday, told television station KDFW that he received the stamp from a lawyer. When he learned a year ago that it was counterfeit he said he reported it to Miami INS officers.

"They kept my original passport and everything saying they would look into it,'' he said.

A spokeswoman for the U.S. attorney's office in Miami said the case is being reviewed.

American Eagle officials said they were aware of the investigation before Ligon's arrest and he has been put on unpaid leave.

Garmendia's pilot's license is valid.

[Roadtrip]

FrontWindowSeat -. .I make no excuses for the INS, either from a policy or enforcement basis.

But, I submit that if we took all the illegals in this country, the number of questionable cases would be mincule compared to the people that are here clearly illegally - i.e. no visa, expired visas, no paper at all. A supposed labor shortage is no excuse for crashing a border.

$25,000 for a stamp? And he thought it was legal?? Oh, please. Adios, amigo.

And BTW, despite what someone else said, there is NO shortage of qualified pilots in this country. There are lots of US citizens standing in line for pilot jobs, especially at the regionals and majors. Our two AE friends need to go back to Venezuela and work there.

[ 13 February 2002: Message edited by: Roadtrip ]</p>

[411A]

...and STAY there!

[GlueBall]

Bug Smasher: The North Tower roof neither had an observation deck nor access to the general public. It was the tower with the big antenna. Only the South Tower had an observation deck. Nevertheless, there are yet unanswered questions about why neither of the two media helicopters attempted to rescue anyone from the roofs, if indeed people with cellphones had called for help.

[spinproof]

Staysafe,We welcome you and most foreign students to use our facilities..yes its expensive..yes we have the best..we just can't be sure of everyones intentions since 9-11!. .With all due respect to you and my flying brothers and sisters, we've all made sacrifices for our careers. Without a certain amount of preparredness and security one forgets why we have to police our own.To give these guys a pass would be to invite a recurrance of the past.Paranoia takes many forms and I'll say it again, Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they ain't out to get you!!!! <img src="tongue.gif" border="0"> Flysafe Staysafe!

[bugg smasher]

Absolutely correct Glueball, apologies for the error.

[polzin]

Glueball

Did people actually get up to the observaton level? The original story was that the doors were locked and no one could get up there.

This in spite of the plan to use choppers for evacuaton if the buildings ever caught fire.

[ironbutt57]

That's right grizzly bear...then came back over and saved your country for you...

[Staysafe]

Spinproof: I suppose I came acroos a little disrespectful in my posting. I apologize for that. No other contry would have given me the opportunity to become a pilot... - not even my own, unless I was the son of a rich father. Believe me, I am more than thankful for my US experience. I would never have been where I am today, if it was not for the US.

What I wanted to point out is that I feel we all get a litte tunnel vision when we speak of illegal immigrants. I tried to think back of myself when I was at the start of my carreer and what I would have done to make it. Fortunately for myself I was able to get a greencard... I did not buy it and I did not get married to get it. There was nothing disqualifying me when I finally received my resident alian status. But I am sure, if the US didn't want me, they would have been able to deny my legal status for some reason.

These Venezuelans most likely just wanted to be pilots. Their problem was that they were from the wrong contry. They should respect your laws... absolutely. But when some fat lawyer is waving some fancy papers in front of you, for the exchange of a nice fee... telling you this will take care of it all, the temptation would be strong. Tell me, who is really the criminal?

I have never forged my logbook.. I don't have a DUI or any criminal record. But I know plenty of pilots in cushy jobs... yes even in the US, that have. So lets not throw stones, folks.

[spinproof]

OK Staysafe. .Thanks for the clarification! I'll get off the box! <img src="frown.gif" border="0"> ...I feel so silly... <img src="frown.gif" border="0"> ...Friends? <img src="wink.gif" border="0">