flyglobespan melt down!! [Archive]

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weiss5

20th Dec 2006, 06:32

Think before you join flyglobespan! do your research! this airline from outside is the best around but inside now falling apart!!

only a warning to new pilots joining! talk to the pilots already there they will tell you they are not happy. conditions not close to what promised.

Eff Oh

20th Dec 2006, 08:52

How so? Do you work with GSM???

tewkesbury

20th Dec 2006, 09:35

From what I here on the ground, it would be sound advice! as their provisions for maintenance leave a lot to be desired, snags not recorded, defects cleared against dubious references, on the odd ocasion when a certified engineer is available, and that is very very rare. The Maintenace provider at one base has no certifying staff, and is resorting to approaching other companies to sign off defects!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mr Gammon Flaps

20th Dec 2006, 09:52

Absolutely true. It's about time someone said something. All of those people waiting for a crap contract with only 15 days leave, think again. The company is massively disorganised. They have zero regard for crew welfare. The crew are getting pushed to do extremes of duty times, sometimes over 24 hours with several sectors positioning after a flight. Sometimes they stay at crap hotels with no food available.
Listen to this if you do not believe me, and check the Flyglobespan website to confirm it: The new schedule for the Cape Town flight is as follows: MAN-CPT 15:25z - 06:00z, and then minimum rest in CPT for a 21:35z check in for the return flight the same day!. Two 12 hour night flights. Excellent.
The report time for these ETOPS longhaul flights is a ridiculous 1 hour before departure, just to make it legal. Although, even that doesn't really help because there isn't even a proper rest area onboard, so it is making a mockery of CAP 371.
MAN-Toronto: Crew fly out to Toronto, hang around on the aircraft for 3 hours and then position back, sometimes in Economy. Duty time 20 hours through the night!
Toronto-Man outbound crew coach down to Cardiff which takes 4-5 hours, hang around in the airport for a couple of hours and then fly to Toronto with Zoom. Duty time 19 hours.
All because the company do not care and will not pay for a direct flight. I even heard a story that D********* takes a personal interest in crew not staying too long in a hotel down route, in case they forget they are at work and start thinking he is paying for their holidays.
The GLA-SFB flight is going on a B737-800, and they haven't even told the pax. Outrageous.
They are constantly chopping and changing the schedules so the crew are constantly dealing with pissed off punters.
The rosters are getting later and later. The xmas rosters have only just come out!!!

If I were looking for a job at the moment I would wait for Zoom to get going.

Nil further

20th Dec 2006, 10:28

come on Blackbushe , tell us what it is really like then ?

weiss5

20th Dec 2006, 10:59

all stated above is true. I have just been here one month and now making an exit plan. All other pilots i have spoke to are doing the same. I left a well established airline thinking grass greener NOT SO!! and it's a shame, think it's all down to new contract in india and under crewing etc..
All FOs were promised (carret) upgrades again... NOT SO!

It is not bad grapes with me, no just warning others to dig deep to find truth before making move. I'm now having to apologise to my wife for uprouting!! seems prior to november all was well.

Floppy Link

20th Dec 2006, 11:31

what happened in November...anyhting significant, personalities, contracts etc? What's the India connection? Doing GLA-SFB for the rest of my career would be just fine...

Jet2

20th Dec 2006, 11:36

Would that be Mr D******** that left everyone at Excalibur penniless on payday back in 1996???? :mad:

Mr Gammon Flaps

20th Dec 2006, 11:53

Did anyone else receive a christmas card from Zoom inviting them to an interview in January?

spinnaker

20th Dec 2006, 19:06

............The company is massively disorganised. They have zero regard for crew welfare. The crew are getting pushed to do extremes of duty times, sometimes over 24 hours with several sectors positioning after a flight. Sometimes they stay at crap hotels with no food available........

Absolutely nothing has changed then. In my experience, they treat limits as targets. I'm ashamed that I ever worked for them, I should have known better. They don't care and they never have.

Banzai Eagle

20th Dec 2006, 19:21

weiss 5 - grass is always green. Gammon sounds a right old mess bordering on the verge of illegal practices, mind you I bet if the company threw money at it you would all love it!

weiss5

25th Dec 2006, 12:59

Gibson,
you have obviously got your head in sand! you must be glasgow based! you should be supporting your fellow pilots not knocking them.. oh, or are you pushing for a command, SAD! Flyglobespan needs less of people like you and more pilots to stand up for everyone/improve conditions and tells it how it actually is. Shame on you, hope you P++++ off to zoom.

You mention:- mr D..!!? seems like you wanting to kiss his arse for that cmd you so much want.. I'm sure all around you can see this. Stay in glasgow we don't want you hanging around us.

weiss5

25th Dec 2006, 13:04

:} oh ya... I will not be working days off for £250 but i think you will work day off for nothing for mister D.

Happy holidays

6000PIC

25th Dec 2006, 14:25

Sounds like the CAA should get involved here. Thankfully it`s people like Weiss 5 and Mr Gammon Flaps that bring to the public`s attention shoddy operators like this , unfortunately it people like W Cdr Gibson who blindly support and defend such a bad operator as this out of self interest and an overall lack of intergity. We don`t need back stabbing pilots like that , there`s enough about already. Let`s hope they disappear.

Ediboy

25th Dec 2006, 14:29

Anyone shed some light on how the Cabin crew are treated with this outfit ??? And how moral is with them ??

PocaHostie

25th Dec 2006, 21:55

Well said 6000PIC

A lack of integrity is unfortunately becoming all too common at GSM these days...!!
Started off as a great opportunity.. first class support from the traveling public... and generally a great bunch of guys and gals operating on the aircraft(s)..!!

But the eye appears to be very much off the ball at the moment particularly on the B737 fleet... with an "If you don't like it .. you can eff off"... attitude permeating it's way down to the troops on the frontline..!!
Additionally - no salary review .. not even an RPI increase.. since March 2005 - you can guess that a large number of CV's are already in circulation with the opposition..!!

P.S... What's the betting that W Cdr Gibson is Black_Bush incognito??... There is something in the style of his post(s) that mirrors exactly the threatening drivvel of the standard B737 fleet memo's..!!!

Such a pity... it's been great. and it's been fun. But it ain't been Great Fun!!!

Banzai Eagle

26th Dec 2006, 09:50

6000PIC
Fairly common practice these days for Charter airlines to get crews to operate out and deadhead back on the same aircraft, commonly a end of season thing. OK it might not be nice roading it to CWL and then paxing for a total of 19 hrs but its again a fairly common practice for "lean and mean" Companies.
Whichever way, the CAA are not interested in the stuff above, it's all legal (but not sociable i agree)

Colin Monkfish

26th Dec 2006, 10:00

Monarch Man

26th Dec 2006, 11:56

Fairly common practice these days for Charter airlines to get crews to operate out and deadhead back on the same aircraft, commonly a end of season thing. OK it might not be nice roading it to CWL and then paxing for a total of 19 hrs but its again a fairly common practice for "lean and mean" Companies.

Something that happens at MON all the time, although the current CC are getting plenty of support to change this unreasonable and quite frankly morally corrupt practice.
Don't forget that your vehicle insurer as well as the CPS would take a dim view if you had an injury causing accident, and it could be proved you have been on duty for an excessive length of time.

spinnaker

26th Dec 2006, 13:47

Couldn't give a 'tinkers cuss' if this deadheading back to base is legal or not.
By flagging these issues up it means we can make an informed (to a certain degree) decision who we would like to work for, and nobody in the right mind would be putting up with T&C's like GSM.
Real shame these LoCo companies are just cheapening evrything they touch.
MOL being the worst offender
I'm afraid the LoCo operators have dragged the industry into the gutter, from which it will never recover.
Although it may be legal to deadhead back to base, it is still wrong. The crew still have to drive home.
So here's one for the Chief Execs:
Do you really want to share the same road as one of your crew, who has been on duty for the previous 19 or 20 hours?
......and why do you expect the public to do the same, when you know full well that fatigue is a major cause of road traffic accidents?

Nil further

26th Dec 2006, 14:39

spinnaker

26th Dec 2006, 15:42

....... if its that bad leave !
I did!

You only mention Orange, and then, only the money. There's more to life than just money, unless you’re a bit on the shallow side.

BTW do you think it is safe to drive home in a state of fatigue? Just curious.

Alycidon

26th Dec 2006, 19:31

Eff Oh and Nil Further....

Sorry, our posts were deleted as the thread degenerated into expletives from third parties.

My (deleted) point was not personally directed and I hope you did not feel in any way offended, but I was alluding to the possibility that an airline with poor Terms and Conditions would not be particularly concerned about the standard of its crews. Since we cannot see one another on Pprune, the impression we give others is in what we write.

As it happens, I agree 100% with Nil Further and I hope you guys saw my apology to you before it was deleted by the mods.

One can only sympathise with the guys who work for companies who would exploit them rather than give them a fair deal and I think that this is the real issue here.

A few years ago I couldn't even spell pilto and now I are one!

Eff Oh

26th Dec 2006, 19:39

Fair enough. It was getting out of hand, which is what my post was about.

spinnaker

26th Dec 2006, 20:01

Mods. Any chance if you are going to remove posts that you inform people of reasons why. Sometimes the context of following posts is not applicable without the deleted posts. Not telling you how to do your job, just a bit of feedback.
I agree. I am a member of other forums (unrelated to aviation), when things get out of hand the mods do step in, but they also leave a note as to why. There have to be rules, and the mods have a job to do, but a one line note helps in the interest of healthy debate.

Just a suggestion that's all.

Captain Greaser

26th Dec 2006, 20:53

Is it true u guys at Globespan are operating outta Ireland this summer on behalf of Excell Ireland. Any Irish bases going?

The Red Max

26th Dec 2006, 21:04

[QUOTE=weiss5;3037001]Gibson,
you have obviously got your head in sand! you must be glasgow based! you should be supporting your fellow pilots not knocking them.. oh, or are you pushing for a command, SAD!
My god, I can't beleive there are people with nothing better to do on Christmas day than to bitch about their employer, that is SAD!

Scottie

26th Dec 2006, 21:37

I'm afraid the LoCo operators have dragged the industry into the gutter, from which it will never recover.
Although it may be legal to deadhead back to base, it is still wrong. The crew still have to drive home.
So here's one for the Chief Execs:
Do you really want to share the same road as one of your crew, who has been on duty for the previous 19 or 20 hours?
......and why do you expect the public to do the same, when you know full well that fatigue is a major cause of road traffic accidents?

Spinnaker, careful who you tar with that statement. Not all Loco's are the same. I too am happy with my renumeration and my workload.

From the EZY rostering and crewing agreement:
When a pilot returns to base having gone more than 1 hour into discretion or having been on duty 14 hrs the pilot may request hotel accommodation at base at the Company’s expense in order to reduce the possibility of an accident, due to fatigue, whilst commuting home.

I accept your forthcoming apology.

9 minutes to landing

26th Dec 2006, 21:58

Scottie,

well said - perhaps some members may have a chip on both shoulders depending on how well their interview went !

Mr Angry from Purley

27th Dec 2006, 09:50

Scottie

What a sensible idea, any idea if that is seen as a taxable benefit? (accom at home base), - at my Company it is....:\

27th Dec 2006, 12:33

Colin Monkfish/Spinnaker
I dont know about MOL's terms however as a humbleorange line Captain withe just over 5 years in i am on target to do over £100k this tax year .If the share price keeps on going up or even staying where it is , my share options alone next year are worth nearly £50 k.
Your right , these loco's are ruining everything !
yes i work hard when i am at work so what , most people who work for anything other than local government these days work long days everyday without the 3 or 4 days off after 5 working days .They dont get standbys either .I wouldnt fancy a real job and if EZY keep on "ruining it"like this then bring it on i say !
There is a world of difference between the likes of EZY and the likes of GSM / Flybe gents .The orange world is not perfect , however as a safe credible employer with an overall reasonable financial package its pretty good .
There wil always be startup's like GSM who are cutting everything to the bone in order to try and get things going , it is very difficult to compete with EZY and FR now due to their cost base , free capital and brand presence .Mr D may have deep pockets are they deep enough ? time will tell . In the meantime there are jobs in Scotland on Jets for those who are prepared to put up with the crap , if its that bad leave !

Well said. Too many people out there just don't realise how much EZY has changed in the last 18 months. Yes we may do 800+ hours per year - but so do BA shorthaul and they do a lot of their duties away from home for 3-4 days at a stretch - great for family life :hmm:

EZY now has 5/3/5/4 roster agreement in place for Winter AND Summer 07 with possible further improvement for Winter 07. My rosters are always published on the 17th of each month for the next month and are very stable with perhaps one or two changes per month (disruption payments can apply).

All staff were given two weeks basic salary worth of shares recently as recognition of our efforts during a "difficult" summer - a nice touch from a LoCo! I've been in the current share schemes for about 16 months and they are currently "worth" over £40k - not too bad and I am well aware that the price of shares can go (right) down as well as up!

It's musical chairs at the moment for pilots - jobs abound. But ask yourself where would rather be when the downturn inevitably comes. I've said it before - you could do a lot worse than the Orange order.

For those concerned about positioning and then driving home - just mention the words "duty of care" and "Corporate liability" to your management. Any responsible company WILL provide you with accomodation.

Happy New Year to you all,

Fly safe in 2007.

A4 :ok:

cunningplanmylord

27th Dec 2006, 14:12

Bus429

27th Dec 2006, 14:45

Is this not the norm for low-cost or charter ops? Whilst employed as an LAE - I've got 767 B2; maybe I'll approach Globespan! - I worked mainly for the maintenance arms of UK charter airlines. Keeping costs to the minimum was the norm (I'm not condoning the practices mentioned above). I remember one company would carry an engineer on board from the UK to Kenya, expect him to deal with the turnaround and then fly back with it. Didn't last for long - someone raised a CHIRP.

Nearly Man

28th Dec 2006, 16:51

Tis just because they're a bit stretched with the Air India stuff.
I'd think it'll get better when they finish their fleet buying and recruitment.
Mates there like it, just a bit hectic at mo and tell they don't have a rod up their arse like FC does!

Remember, 'only believe half of what you see and nothing of what you read'?
Then again, you could not believe that either :confused:

supergimp

29th Dec 2006, 11:02

Anyone heard rumours of Flyglobespan buying Jet 2?

despegue

29th Dec 2006, 12:29

Supergimp,

Elaborate please?!
Where have you heard this?!

captplaystation

29th Dec 2006, 17:20

Your long-hall ops sound like Blue Paranoia ( that infamous farce of an airline from MXP and FCO) reincarnated ( although they haven't died yet)My god this long haul lark sounds like such fun (not). Oh well, good luck with staying awake on the drive home, maybe I'll try and think of you next time I feel like wingeing too much about my lot in Ryanair. . . . or then again maybe not, I'm still entitled to want better too.

Scottie

29th Dec 2006, 23:04

Scottie
What a sensible idea, any idea if that is seen as a taxable benefit? (accom at home base), - at my Company it is....:\
I don't know! Haven't had to use it yet but it is nice to know we have the option. :)

NG708

31st Dec 2006, 10:12

Could anyone tell how frequently this deadheading back To MAN after a transatlantic flight occurs, surely it must be a temporary thing and occurs only when absolutely necessary.

Seems to be a permanent arrangement.

Also heard recently from the staff at LPL that 737 flights are to stop from March. 757 only to operate to NY.

The Big Easy

1st Jan 2007, 11:44

Just curious, are Globespan recruiting for direct entry commands on the 767?

TBE.

Speedbrake Lever

2nd Jan 2007, 10:12

Well the agencies are looking for DEC for Globespan on 76

well as of one week ago they were

S.L.

pdg75

2nd Jan 2007, 12:38

Wynwith(?) is still recruiting for 767.

Its been interesting reading this thread as a mate is contract 767 Capt at Globespan and it appears that all the problems pre-Christmas (air india contract?) appear to have been worked out and January rosters are pretty much back to normal.

From what I hear there are quite a few 767 crew in training or due to finish it soon which is taking pressure of rostering.

breagh01

2nd Jan 2007, 23:38

Really? who'd have thought :)
Wait till the reputation the FGS have the shortest seat pitch in the universe on the 600's then see what happens to ticket sales.

wobble2plank

3rd Jan 2007, 07:58

Hmmm FGS's business plan sounds like the sort of thing that MOL would be itching to buy if he got his hands on Air Linguini!!

I have friends in both MOL's outfit and in Orange and they are totally different fish in both the ways they operate and the way they are perceived by the staff. Don't knock all LOCO's due to one abhorrent one.

Don't like the sound of these 'positioning' sectors back from FGS, must really screw up the days off afterwards. Makes our 'shortened' LH rest times sound like paradise!!!

W2P

weiss5

5th Jan 2007, 15:37

Looks like the exodus has began!! :uhoh: the damage already done min rest etc, no pay rise!

weiss5

5th Jan 2007, 15:59

The Red Max:

[quote=weiss5;3037001]Gibson,
you have obviously got your head in sand! you must be glasgow based! you should be supporting your fellow pilots not knocking them.. oh, or are you pushing for a command, SAD!
My god, I can't beleive there are people with nothing better to do on Christmas day than to bitch about their employer, that is SAD!

Are you stupid? do you have problems reading the English language??Christmas day, that's me working! For the company! Away from wife and kids! Bitching, not so! Trying to improve life here in FGS. After reading your other post Seems like you have nothing to do but point your inexperience empty rod where it's not wanted! Is your flying club the boring?

breagh01

5th Jan 2007, 21:06

Hear hear, if we can't moan or bitch then we get pissed off then thats worse. let people say their piece and get at least a little of their chest.
As for supporting fellow pilots not knocking them, you know full well there are a few captains who make life complete hell for everyone else so if you were in that boat would you support them too. don't think so. have a good new year. :)

G-IBBO

6th Jan 2007, 18:03

Haven't been on here for ages and just noticed a new user with the name Wing Cdr Gibson. The profile is similair to mine too? 29 years old and living in Glasgow. Are you working for flyglobespan? Why haven't I met you yet?

I don't want to add anything to this thread... just wanted to state the difference between myself (G-IBBO) and WCG. Just in case WCG says anything stupid, I don't want those people who know ME to think that I'm being a ****. Ta :ok:

Rainboe

10th Jan 2007, 15:41

and sadly no i am not after a command as I don't fly unless I'm a passenger.
What exactly are you here for, commenting in this section then? Do you feel it's your job going around a pilots' forum whipping them into shape? Begone with you! Nobody is interested in what you have to say!

Hudson Bay

11th Jan 2007, 10:16

I heard that Globespan are starting a route from NCL to somewhere close to Toronto. I have also heard that it might not get off the ground. Is it advisable to book with them or not. I am worried it might be another Flywho airline.

Callsign Kilo

5th Mar 2007, 16:26

I'm not listening to any of it :p , I live in Glasgow and have always kept a close eye on GSM. What's the chances of me getting in with a measily 250 hours, an MCC and the ability to fund a 737 rating? hypothetically speaking. It might sound nauseatingly corney, however GSM have always been top of my 'wish list' every since I began training, especially as the missus, me and the forthcoming little 'un all want to stay in Glasgow.