I have a dream... and I need some advice

[QDMQDMQDM]

In 2008, I have a sabbatical of up to three months. Finances permitting, I would like to take the missus and three boys (6,8,10 by then) around the USA -- Maine to Florida to Baja California to Alaska to Quebec / Newfoundland, the lot -- in a C206 or a C185.

I'd almost certainly have to buy the aircraft and sell it afterwards. Any advice, thoughts etc would be appreciated.

What a super trip that would be.

Thx,

QDM

[metar]

Don't you think it would be cheaper to lease / hire in the States... a lot can go wrong in three months and that wouldn't be a problem if it wasn't your aircraft!? It's so cheap to hire out there and I am sure you can find a company willing to hire out a Cessna for three months if you guantee to fly "x" hours per day on average.

I don't claim to be an expert though!

[Norfolk Newbie]

I'd be interested in the answer here - particularly with regard to hire as Mrs Newbie wants spend 6 months in America in a couple of years time and doing some of it by aeroplane sounds like a great idea (I obviously need to pass my PPL first!).

[the dean]

hate to throw water on a nice idea ( and you do'nt say whether any of them do'nt like flying )...:eek: ...but if i wanted to see the country i would take the train...:}...or a car..or commercial airliner from place to place..

your family are young...would'nt they hate being cooped up in a little plane for three months on and off..:{ ...and how often can you listen to ''when are we going to get there daddy''...:oh:

why not take thge strain out of it...hire a car...go by train and some commercial airliners...by all means hire a plane in a few locations and sightsee... but for transport..I WOULD'NT:= ..

if your gang are like mine were at that age they will want to see disney, sea world,and all the other great attractions around the country, hang out on the beach , eat ,shop,shop,shop,shop.:rolleyes: ....and do a bit of sightseeing:O ..

if you're going to do it...invest in noise cancellin earphones as a must...and wear them all the time EVEN IF YOU'RE NOT FLYING...!!!:}

good luck.:ok: ..... in my experience wives and partners just about MAYBE tolerate light aircraft...:* !!!!!

the dean.

[SkyHawk-N]

I agree with The Dean.

We go to the US for a few months each year and the sights you encounter while driving across the country are what makes it special. Stumbling across towns and getting out of the car and meeting the locals is always interesting. I suppose you could fly into towns and then 'hub' out from the airport using hire cars to see the local area but I think you might miss some of the experiences to be had. If it were me and it was feasible I'd do a 50/50 mix of the touring in an aeroplane and touring using a car or Winnebago.

It is probably a personal thing though.

[QDMQDMQDM]

Thanks, chaps, but the boys are very light aircraft friendly and two or three hours a day in an aircraft as compared to 8 or 10 in car is no comparison. They can do Disney and Sea World etc, but young children are not quite as simplistic as not to like some of the stuff grown-ups like as well.

Leasing would be a good option if one could find someone to lease an aircraft like that.

Norfolk Newbie, if it is just the two of you hire a 172. That's easy enough. A 206 or, especially, a 185, is a different matter.

QDM

[denhamflyer]

keep up that dream - dont let those "flying is not for the family" guys get to you.

I've done a lot of america in a car, and for many hours it is very boring...if i had my license back then, it would have been a "no brainer" as they say ;)

best of luck

[tangovictor]

I'd be interested in the answer here - particularly with regard to hire as Mrs Newbie wants spend 6 months in America in a couple of years time and doing some of it by aeroplane sounds like a great idea (I obviously need to pass my PPL first!).

not only pass your ppl, but also get a US visa, 90 days is max time allowed

[aluminium persuader]

I rented a C150 some years ago, for a couple of weeks with a stipulation that I put at least x hrs on it. Flew from Centralia, Illinois as far south as Dallas/Love and several places in between. Had my backpack in the rear & pitched my tent under the wing at most places. Great fun!:ok:

[J.A.F.O.]

Can't offer that much advice except:

1: Do it
2: Strongly consider leasing
3: Do it
4: Don't listen to those who say you can't/shouldn't do it
5: Do it

Better to do it and have a terrible time than to spend the rest of your life wondering how great it might have been. It will be a fantastic experience for the boys who, even if they don't appreciate it right away, will find out just what a beautiful world this is and just what a terrific Dad they've got.

[SkyHawk-N]

keep up that dream - dont let those "flying is not for the family" guys get to you.

I didn't mean that I agree with 'don't do it due to the family', I just agree with the see the USA from the ground part. There may be long boring bits in between but I just think that you can't get a full appreciation of everything from the air, and I've done both. As I say it is probably a personal thing and only QDMx3 can decide.

[fernytickles]

That sounds like a great trip.

Have you though about a Piper Lance or a Cherokee Six rather than Cessnas? Personally, I prefer the take-off performance in the Cessnas, but having carried a family (not mine) on a long trip in a Lance, I can see the advantages. With the rear seats facing into each other there is much more leg room for everyone and much more space in the middle for picnics, dvd players, drinks, blankets, etc etc. Plus the kids could move around a little, which helped on the longer legs. It really opened my eyes to the advantages of this type for family transport. If you've never flown one, its very straightforward to fly, just be aware of the take off performance and don't be expecting too much from it, especially in the higher elevations.

It is possible to rent a Lance, I guess I can't post the company I know of on here, but email me if you wish and I can send you their details. Or else just do a search on Google, and you should come across them.

Whatever you decide on, try to get one with an autopilot - makes your life a lot easier.

Very good info on the Cirrus owners website about flying to and from Alaska. We used it as a reference in the Spring and found it very helpful.

If you are going to do this, I'd go for Howie Keefe's chart books, rather than carrying lots of little individual sectionals. They're not cheap, but compare favourably when you add up buying sectionals for the whole country, and make far less muddle in the cockpit. They cover the whole of the USA, but you'd have to get separate charts for Canada.

Use www.airnav.com - its a great reference for airport/FBO info, but doesn't cover Canada, unfortunately. Use AOPA's info and EAA's info too. If you're not already a member, you might find it helpful to join both those organisations.

Its fun to arrange your flying around pancake breakfasts and fly-ins. Both AOPA and EAA list those, as well as each state if you do a google search listing fly-ins and the state name.

Come to AirVenture - the kids will have a blast and you'll make lots of new friends, who are highly likely to invite you to visit them.

[Ridgerunner]

I would suggest you plan carefully and select an aircraft that is in PERFECT nic if you are considering going up to Alaska and across the middle of Canada. I have been there flying and you won't need me to tell you that it is very remote, wild country and for SEP I would be quite cautious about the routes and places I would be flying to. Coast to coast US would be feasible, but Alaska and Canada are different kettles of fish.

I assume you have a bit of experience to be considering such a trip, but think carefully about going to Alaska if you have never flown those stretches before and know the local sort of things to watch out for.

If I were on my own without a family, I would jump at the chance to do that, but otherwise I would think carefully.

RR

[Saab Dastard]

Suggested reading: "Flight of Passage" by Rinker Buck - 2 teenagers coast to coast in Piper Cub!

Good advice in there about crossing the Rockies!

SD

[QDMQDMQDM]

Thanks, everyone. Useful advice.

So my mad friends at the strip today said I should do this in an AN2 and sling hammocks inside to sleep in. Sounds splendid and you really see the world at 90mph!

What do they actually consume in fuel and oil at 'economic' cruise and what is the cost of avgas in the US these days?

[fernytickles]

Fuel is ranging from $3.50 to $6.00 a gallon at the moment. I just bought 3 cases of Phillips X-C (12 bottles in each case) for about $95. Something makes me think you'd need more than 3 cases ;) Not sure where you'd be able to rent an AN-2 tho'. I've seen plenty of them rotting around various airports, but few flying, sadly. If you're going to be that nuts, how about a Beaver, preferably on floats?

[QDMQDMQDM]

Yes, it's pretty mad, but boy it would be fun! 45GPH for fuel adds up, though, even at US prices...

[david viewing]

Not a strictly aviation point, but try to get 3rd party car cover before you go. American Express offer a policy that covers hire cars and (hopefully) the 'courtesy cars' that are still offered at many rural airports. The courtesy car is a huge convenience compared with renting but the snag is that the owner will often assure you that it's 'insured' not realising that because you are a foreigner your personal car insurance doesn't cover you in the US. Driving uninsured is illegal in many states and a seriously bad idea. Sorry if you knew this already.

[QDMQDMQDM]

David,

That is a really good idea, thanks a lot!

David

[fernytickles]

Also you might want to look at renters insurance - for aeroplanes. Its been mentioned on here before, tho' I'm not really sure what it entails.

45 gph is a lot, admittedly, but it would be pretty cool :ok:

[QDMQDMQDM]

Pretty cool?! Look at the trips these guys make in their AN2:

http://www.antonovllc.com/home.html

I would love to sit here with my legs dangling out:

http://www.antonovllc.com/pictures_files/OpenDoor04.jpg&msg=25F5D2EB-9A78-4E84-9D0E-F6599C251751&start=0&len=3442313&mimepart=5&curmbox=00000000-0000-0000-0000-000000000001&b=6705aebd00ff6bc20230a232491cc1f1&disk=10.1.jpg

[david viewing]

Also you might want to look at renters insurance - for aeroplanes. Its been mentioned on here before, tho' I'm not really sure what it entails.

To my mind the renters insurance question has never really been answered because the companies offering this cool off if told explicitly that you do not have a US address. This is despite successful claims having been apparently made by UK visitors to the US.

One of the well known advertisers has stated to me that you could use a friends' address, but not that of the FBO. I suspect this may be because they are brokers and just need a plausible address to pass on as if it was your own to underwriters. Hardly a satisfactory basis for an insurance contract.

If anyone knows of a company that will accept a foreign, ie UK, address I for one would be glad to know of it.

[Paat]

QDM,
Having flown in USA and Australia I can thoroughly recommend it.
A few thoughts:
Ensure you apply to the FAA in ample time (weeks if not months!) for them to complete all the post 9/11 security checks before they'll validate your PPL in the USA.
An FBO who'll give you a few hours ground training on national planning procedures, flt plans and SAR cover etc would be worthwile. The FBO in Australia gave me a morning's free (yes free!) training which was invaluable.
Regards
Phil