More Qantas jobs to go Overseas

[AllInGoodTime]

When is it going to stop. I know these aren't pilot positions, but an airline is a team effort and I am sure you would agree an airlines IT department in this day and age is equally as important as its HR, marketing and other internal functions. So 300 IT jobs to go to India, and Qantas have the nerve to have 30 indian IT people running around inside Qantas picking the brains of the local staff on how to do the job before they do it over in India. When are they going to out source the tech crews to india? It must be coming!

From smh

"Qantas sends 300 jobs to India"

Qantas is set to axe 300 Australian information technology workers and send their jobs to India.

The airline said it was impossible to find enough high-tech expertise in Australia to carry out computer systems maintenance and shortlisted two Indian companies to take over the work.

A review of the airline's information technology jobs has almost been completed, and an announcement is expected in the next three weeks.

The Australian Services Union said Qantas had already granted a contract to one of the Indian companies that allowed 30 of its workers to "scope out" work in the Mascot IT office.

ASU assistant national secretary Linda White said: "At least 30 Indian nationals are working in the IT office and asking people what they are doing.

"To say there are not the skills here already is crap. They are asking our people how to do it."

The move is just the latest in a string of moves by big corporations to dump expensive local workers in favour of cheap foreign labour.

A public outcry forced banking giant Westpac to temporarily shelve plans to shift the jobs of 485 workers at Concord, Sydney, to Bangalore in India.

Amex is reportedly negotiating with the Federal Government to allow 160 Japanese call centre staff to be recruited to work in Sydney for $6000 less than the minimum wage.

Ms White said Qantas was an iconic Australian company that was sending highly paid, highly skilled jobs offshore.

"This is pretty outrageous, particularly as the jobs are such an important part of the Qantas operation. It is also completely wrong for them to say they cannot source the levels of IT expertise they need in Australia.

"It is complete spin because they currently have 830 people already doing the job. To say otherwise is an insult to the Australian university system that is educating these people."

Jobs at risk are in the airline's internet operation that deal with holiday bookings, frequent-flyer programs, operational logistics, crew and engineering operations, financial and payroll systems.

In July the airline shortlisted two Indian companies, Tata Consulting Services and Satyam, to take over the work.

Both have stepped up their Australian presence in recent years. Tata has already signed a $3.85 million deal with the Victorian Government's Curriculum Assessment Authority that will let some work be sent overseas.

A Qantas spokeswoman said it was finalising a review of its IT development, maintenance and support services.

"The review has included a shortlisting of two outsource providers in India," she said.

"The providers involved in the tender process have a capability and depth of expertise that we can no longer source in Australia.

"No decisions have been made at this stage."

[Sonny Hammond]

The airline said it was impossible to find enough high-tech expertise in Australia to carry out computer systems maintenance and shortlisted two Indian companies to take over the work.


It's not surprising really, when they are offering $3.50/hr.

This company is completely stuffed.

[Redstone]

:yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk: :yuk:

[Pimp Daddy]

Didn't Qantas outsource all the IT to IBM and Telstra a few years ago?

Or was that just the desktop support?

[FlyinLow]

Don't get scared, but over the next few years Australia will see a large influx of immigrants, it has already started to happen.

[Ultralights]

a good friend of mine, who is in IT, took a job at QF in the IT department, he left after just 3 months, being paid just $45K, his reason was extremely inflexible managers who refused to listen to ways to improve the service etc, so he quit and took a job paying $120K at JP Morgan.

is it little wonder that QF cant (dont want) IT staff at a pissy wage of between 30 to 40K?

[podbreak]

QANTAS - the Spirit of Asia:yuk:

[Airbornespanner]

QANTAS - "The Spirit of Australia" thats where they are heading the Spirit in Australia the body overseas.

But don't worry guy's with all Australia's work heading off shore in a few years we will become a third world country and those cheap jobs will come back on shore !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

One question when will we start out sourcing the senoir management positions offshore the companies will save MILLION's of dollars with say an Indian CEO we would only have to pay them a few hundred dollars a week for the same work !!!!!!!!!!!

[kq777]

So a few Qantas IT jobs go to India, but i've also heard lots of Indian student pilots are training here. Thousands of Indian students paying full-fees at Aussie universities.

Free Trade works both ways!

[Taildragger67]

"The Spirit of Australia"...

because it's becoming Australian in spirit only?

:{

[Led Zep]

http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/1145/VHEAB-02ozAsia.jpg

:\

[slamer.]

Air NZ to outsource 70 jobs in finance to Fiji in 2007

Saturday September 30, 2006

Workers at Air New Zealand face more outsourcing of jobs with the airline confirming about 70 finance department clerical workers' jobs will be outsourced to Fiji.

An Air NZ spokeswoman said workers who were affected by the decision were told about two weeks ago, through an internal-only announcement.

About 70 clerical jobs in Air NZ's finance business area, now called Financial Shared Services, will go to Fiji from January 2007.

The spokeswoman said the airline had no further comment to make on the decision.

The Service and Food Workers Union - the union representing the finance workers - said members had been in a constant state of consultation and restructuring for years and workers were demoralised by the lack of response from the airline to their submissions.

Union regional secretary Jill Ovens said Air NZ corporate management was driven by ideology. The focus was to secure a low-paid workforce who were passive and compliant, she said. Ms Ovens said it was likely more jobs in finance would go over the next 18 months.

- NZPA

[podbreak]

Well at least we can look forward to some good vindaloo when they outsource all catering. Hmm, I can just see it now, emergency landing due flight crew incapacitation :}. the curry will be the end of us...

[Fox3snapshot]

Those jobs won't be given to the Fijiian Fijiians! It will be the 'jinglies' or the Indian Fijiians!

I don't give a hoot which company it is in OZ or NZ it is criminal that they can send these jobs to the sub-continent and elswhere!!!!!!

Do you not all find it ironic that the government will not allow foreign ownership on any grand scale but quite happy to let all our jobs go overseas with no protection of our own labour market!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Bl**dy Joke!!!!! vommit, spit, hack :ugh:

[Ex QF]

Many years ago – prior to 1992 – QF IT was set up as a separate company, why? To pay their IT people better rates than the QF awards, basically so that they could retain their IT staff and recruit good IT people. The loss to these people was some of their travel benefits such as interline entitlements. Big deal – they were going to be paid market rates.
QF use to sell their developed systems to other companies, some very good IT people/management was lost to other companies such as Cathay (CIO) and Amadeus (VP Operations).
Then in the past 5 years we have seen the most senior of management in IT, chase their bonus by reducing their costs all for short term gain. These people sold out and replaced some very good systems with functionally poor software because these firms could offer something cheaper – and these same managers knew that they wouldn’t be around in 3 years when the ****e hit the fan.
But who is responsible for some of these major decisions? The board – when will shareholders wake up and stop voting these people in – look at the Qantas board – when did any of them last ‘work’ in the coal face? Do any of them know what IT is? They are no different to the board at St George Bank. – and they do it because they want greater profits.
It Qantas were losing money you’d say OK we have to do something but they are not – they are profitable and they will surprisingly keep making profits. So why outsource anything? Except their senior management.

[FlyinLow]

Don't many aussie pilots fly for indian charters, the system works both ways. They need good pilots and you need hardworking IT geeks.

[The_Cutest_of_Borg]

Don't many aussie pilots fly for indian charters, the system works both ways. They need good pilots and you need hardworking IT geeks.

A few may, but only because India can't produce pilots in the sort of numbers they need. Australia has IT people up the wazoo...

It is not a system, it is a rort.

[Anti Skid On]

Gees, are you guys flying red tails or just displaying red necks? Can you tell me any multi national company that has NOT outsourced either IT, telecoms, customer service or everything to Bangalore, Chennai, etc...

A buddy of mine was an Indian instructor here in NZ who could not, despite ATPL passes and lots of hours, get a foot in the door in the industry either here or Aussie, needless to say he is right seat in a 737 now back in India.

This is the 21st century, we have technologies that are post-industrial age - on TV here the other week they were moaing because CT scans in hospitals were being sent electronically to Lebanon to be interpreted by radiologists there because there are not enough of them here (apparently they all go to Aussie cos the pay is better). This is the world we live in, it isn't going to change back no matter how much you want it too.

[Ejector]

How do other Vic's feel? I lifted this from the 1st post.

"Both have stepped up their Australian presence in recent years. Tata has already signed a $3.85 million deal with the Victorian Government's Curriculum Assessment Authority that will let some work be sent overseas."

OK, I and other Victorians pay the Gov wages, they work for me to provide me services. I think this is a massive injustice too.

Just food for thought, the Fed Gov wants to know if I sneeze under the name of terrorism, and yet they don’t care about issues like this. They actually seem to encourage it. :mad:

People get on here and scream blue murder, yet the majority of them voted Howard and Anderson, The Minister of Qantas back in, knowing their policies against the good of "non QF"Aviation in oz. :ugh:

[The_Cutest_of_Borg]

Anti Skid on, that post of yours was just so Kiwi. :yuk:

[FlyinLow]

A few may, but only because India can't produce pilots in the sort of numbers they need. Australia has IT people up the wazoo...
It is not a system, it is a rort.

This world is becoming ever more small, immigration has taken over Europe and North America, I think Australia is just catching up. In Canada we have seen our economy bloom due to immigration

[L1A]

Hi all

Just a quick note coming from an IT engineering job at an Australian airline (resigned two years ago)

Technical Publications for Aircraft Engineers naturally come from Boeing Airbus etc. The publications are updated when required usually on a fortnightly basis on all types of Aircraft parts, not all of the technical publications are updated only when an update is required such as a new wing part etc.

The stringent policy CASA has place on Technical Publication are quite amazing. If a new publication is listed it must be updated ASAP in a certain time frame. The old CD or DVD must be destroyed (and stored) and new CD must be placed in a secure filing cabinet and recorded when it was installed, by whom, what was updated etc
(Much more to it, but you get the drift)

I hope that Qantas managers has really thought this one out as Technical Publication are the bible to Aircraft engineers and must be kept up-to-date. Who will be overseeing that publications are updated in India, CASA (I don’t think so).

I feel that if a third party Indian company or whoever understands the importance and implications to if Technical Publications are not up-to-date.

You come to your own conclusion.

:)

[Ejector]

http://ninemsn.video.msn.com/v/en-au/v.htm?g=9bd422a5-a3c3-4b45-87fc-5a3306d01587&f=imbot_en-au&fg=rss

[Ex QF]

Air New Zealand confirms 70 jobs to go to Fiji
Wednesday, 4 October 2006



Air New Zealand management has given to the green light to a proposal to outsource most of its finance department clerical work to Fiji.

It was revealed that approximately 70 clerical jobs in Air New Zealand’s finance business area, called Financial Shared Services will move offshore to Fiji from January 2007.

The latest move has demoralised current finance workers, with the union representing them quick to criticise Air NZ.

Service and Food Workers Union regional secretary Jill Ovens commented: “Air New Zealand corporate management is driven by ideology. The focus is to secure a low-paid workforce who are passive and compliant. If the outsourcing is a failure, it will be a huge cost to the company. But they will have succeeded in de-unionising a whole section of their workforce, so they probably think it is worth the risk.

The group will also announce this week whether it will contract out Air New Zealand ground staff at airports. More than a thousand jobs could be shed by the company if the contracting out is implemented.


So will QF Finance follow? As more and more departments go off shore - perhaps it's time that all unions/staff work together on this. Betcha IT nad Finance have never worried about Tech and Cabin crew before? Betcha they will start to take an interest in what's happening now?

[blackguard]

We all get on here and highlight the shortcomings of Aviation management.
We Can do something about rather than just complain.
A good place to start is always the ballot box.
I have had enough ...staff wages are too high so outsource to India.
CEOs salaries must always be compared to those in NYC.
Where is the goddam fairness in that?
Workchoices legislation is supposed to create jobs...but we have full employment...so we increase immigration.
There is an genda here...we will end up being the working poor..a la the Amercian model(dream)
Get me the rifle Martha I'm goin huntin.

[slamer.]

Anti Skid on, that post of yours was just so Kiwi. :yuk:


The COB, that reply of yours was just so Ocker ............http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/26/26_11_12.gif


I'll assume you are from Queensland........................... ;)

[lowerlobe]

A leaked media report today October the 9th 2020 reveals QF is about to make it’s last Australian employee redundant.
Apparently Mrs. Beryl Johnson a tea lady in the QF boardroom will be made redundant after she has returned from forced Long Service Leave.Mrs Johnson who has worked for QF for 25 years initially joined the company as a second officer.

Board member and financial officer Mr. I.am.Greedy said it was the culmination of the company’s Sustainable future and Australian employee minimisation program. It is essential he said that if the “Spirit of Australia” is to survive then it cannot and will not employ Australians. “Australian employees actually believe that they are entitled to earn a living,” he said outside the local Porsche dealership where he was picking up his latest company car.

We cannot be held responsible for their cost of living and if I am going to be able to send my children overseas to boarding schools then this is how it has to be. Mrs. Johnson was dogmatic with the board in negotiating her last AWA Mr. Greedy said.” She actually believed she was entitled to a lunch break and wanted the weekends off, how absurd”

Mr. Greedy also said that since the board was relocating to Monaco it has no further need of a tea lady in Sydney. He also said that reports that the board was self centered because of it’s generous bonus payments this year were false.

“Do you realise the cost involved not to mention the stress of moving to Monaco, my third wife does not know where to start and we have had to hire a removal’s consultant and the cost of transporting my Porsche is huge. Then there is the cost of renting an apartment suitable for our needs but luckily we are going to be subsidized by the company

The share price rose 2c to 58c

[Mr Qantas]

I might have left the airline now but I doesn't disregard that there needs to be some balance. The sad truth is this-

Qantas needs to compete with overses operations and that is a fact and as soon as you understand that then we can all move on. If that takes some pain in the meentime then so be it if you cant recognise that then you wont have a airline. The board on the other hand also need to be competetive and we need the best board members. This also takes matching simalar prices for there services that they would get overses because there jobs are always on the line and can get voted off the board if they dont perform. Its supply and demand and some of the pruners need to understand that before they enter into complicated debates on maters they now little about.

Best of luck to you all :ok:

[lowerlobe]

Mr QANTAS...And I thought I had a sense of humour but that one takes the cake....I especially like the one about performance from directors and if it is not up to scratch then they get shown the door...

Can you explain then the performance of a Australian telecom company and it's profit/share price plummeting and the increase in the bonus and remuneration for the CEO...kind of contradicts your theory just a bit.....

There is nothing complicated about greed which is rampant throughtout the corporate sector....I would like to see the steps Darth would take if the company were making a loss instead of a healthy profit

[Jetsbest]

but did anyone else see the article in Monday's Australian's business section titled 'Bob now bats for other team on CEO pay pitch'? It quotes the former Westpac CEO, Bob Joss, who makes some very interesting observations about executive remuneration and what he views now to be the flawed logic which sets the high sums in many packages. To me it also provokes interesting comparisons with the logic used by managers toward employees (why pay more if they're not leaving?) as distinct from the smoke-and-mirrors for themselves.:hmm: :rolleyes:

I'd post a link if I knew how...

[Taildragger67]

http://theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,20547165-643,00.html

[rammel]

Which QF director has ever been shown the door? I can't think of any. I could be wrong, but the only one that has been replaced was Trevor Kennedy. And I think that was more to do with his legal troubles not how he conducted his role of director.

[lowerlobe]

Not that I have kept a close watch on many company's but I can't remember any directors that have been kicked off the board anywhere.

Some have left but have taken a multi million dollar payout if they have left before their contract has finished.

The part about QF is that they keep harping on about the "SPIRIT OF AUSTRALIA" to get sympathy and loyalty from the Australian public but then outsource Australian jobs and are still making a healthy profit even with the increased fuel prices.

If they only worked with their employees instead of constantly attacking them they would have the best airline in the world

[Taildragger67]

Yep... nought in the Qantas Sale Act to say that they needed to keep it majority Australian staffed. Owned and run (ie. directors), yes, but staff...

'Spirit'? Possibly operating to the letter rather than the spirit of the Act.

[assasin8]

So when is the Qantas Board and CEO position going to be outsourced to India ??? Just a thought...
"Tell 'em they're dreamin' !" :p