PPL Captains Brief

[sclan]

Hi everyne. I am a PPL student with 35 hours under my belt out of Bristil Int. On the PA28 check list at the end of the pre-take off checks there is the captians brief. Could anyone out there please tell me what the captain is meant to say for this. :) Thanks SCLAN.

[Malcolm G O Payne]

It is some time since I was involved, but as far as I remember it is a case of stating the actions to be taken on departure, speed to be used (rotate and climb), any airfield specific procedure in the initial in the climb-out and action in the event of engine failure after take-off.

[tmmorris]

The idea is that you brief anyone else in the ac (or yourself if you feel the need...) on the forthcoming takeoff and any emergencies... e.g. (a long version):

'This will be a standard shortfield takeoff with 15 deg flap selected. I will hold the ac on the brakes, apply full power and confirm 2300 rpm before releasing the brakes. Rotation will be at 55kts for a climb speed of 65kts.

In the event of a problem on the runway I will close the throttle and brake. In the event of engine failure after takeoff if there is sufficient runway available I will land back on; if not, I will choose a field within 30 degrees of the nose and land there. I will ask you to open the door and wedge it with a shoe, then adopt the brace position until we come to a standstill. [In the event of engine failure above 500ft I will attempt to land back on the airfield.]*

Any questions?'

*this bit is controversial but the RAF do include this in the standard Tutor takeoff brief, though I couldn't swear to the height (e.g. could be 600 or 700).

Tim

[BEagle]

Look, it's a little PA28, nothing more...... Why bother mentioning the take-off and climb speeds? Who else is interested?

State who will be flying the take-off - and what anyone else should do if there is an emergency at the time.

NB the best course of action regarding fields for EFATO.

But do try to avoid sounding like a total "Captain Speaking" pratt with half-a-dozen tin bars on your epaulettes!

[172driver]

On the FAA side of the pond there is something called the 'FAA Passenger Brief' and it is, IIRC, a requirement before taking off with pax. Note that it's not called anything nearly as grandiose as 'Captain's Brief'. What this does (and I do it every time I fly with pax, especially those who aren't around small a/c a lot) is to explain emergency procedures, where the lifevests are (yes, really!) ask not to interfere with flight controls, communications between pax and/or myself and usually also ask them not to jabber away while ATC is talking (on some of the a/c I fly I can isolate the pax intercom, on some I can't). I usually also tell them the initial departure route, pointing it out on the chart and warn of any expected turbulence.

[tmmorris]

Quite right, Beags, and I don't usually do it. But I do a short version if flying with another pilot - just to confirm that it'll be a shortfield takeoff, for instance, and planned actions on emergencies - usually while taxying. It seems sensible for us both to know what's going on...

Tim

[Zulu Alpha]

Why not start off with" Welcome to white knuckle airways...' we always get you down' and then welcome your passenger in business class and then the two in economy" After this then let them know what to do in the event of an emergncy ie how to open the door (show them the two latches and how to operate them).

Normally a mixture of humour and safety info relaxes nervous first time passengers but also shows them what they need to know if you had an engine failure. I normally point out how unlikely it is that anything unusual will happen but that being prepared is a good idea.

[bagpipe]

Sclan,

The captain's brief is to yourself as a prompt to pre-condition your response for abnormality on takeoff. One trick flying with passengers is to give yourself the brief with your mike well off to the side so they can't hear you, --don't forget to put it back after.

[theresalwaysone]

No such things as captains these days they are called commanders (as all instructors should know.)

You do not need to brief out loud unless you are flying with someone else.

If you are flying with an instructor the commanders brief should include what action is going to be taken by whom in the event of an emergency.

Explaining where lifejackets are and involving yourself in elaborate passenger briefing should be done at the aircraft before start up not at the holding point.

Tims briefing (TMMORISS) is a good example but I would substitute CONSIDER for attempt to land back. I would also love to see the passenger removing his shoe in this situation and putting it in the door jam, i would just says 'doors ajar'.

In regards to EFATO very few schools/clubs have gone to the trouble of publishing a 'best plan' for an EFATO after take off for each home airfield runway, which can prevent lowering the nose to find The Nelson Mandella council estate in front of you. Eg why climb straight ahead towards an area where there is little chance of a sucessful EFATO being performed.

Something that is rarely considered is what about a partial engine failure? Do you know the minimum safe power setting to take you around the circuit for a re-land, which is far safer than landing back(in my opinion). Do you also know the minimum height you would fly this procedure.

Do you also know what you would do if any doors or hatches opened on take off, an event that is much more common than engine failure on take off. Both incidents I can think of one pilot was seriously injured and in the other 5 passengers were killed. Both because both commanders took the WRONG action when the doors/hatch opened.

By the way I used to teach both of these exercises pre solo.

QUOTE But do try to avoid sounding like a total "Captain Speaking" pratt with half-a-dozen tin bars on your epaulettes!

It dosnt matter who you sound like, even if you sound like an instructor speaking pratt with a chip on both shoulders, its pre-arming youself with a practical rehearsed plan that will get you through an emergency.

[LH2]

Do you also know what you would do if any doors or hatches opened on take off, an event that is much more common than engine failure on take off.


Good point. Any suggestions as to how to deal with such an event?

[mcgoo]

if you haven't reached Vr abort the takeoff, if you have left the ground ignore the door, complete a circuit and land.

[tmmorris]

There shouldn't be a problem with simply completing a circuit to land as normal - it'll be noisy and you may be effectively NORDO but you should be fine. The crucial thing is not to be spooked by it.

The other one (which I think has killed?) is seat adjustment latches failing on rotation leaving you sliding backwards pulling the nose up as you go. This has happened to me but fortunately at the start of the takeoff run, so I had time to stop and sort it out...

Tim

[sclan]

Thanks everyone, will take it all on board....................

[172driver]

Has happened to me both in a PA28 and a C172RG - gets a bit draughty, but otherwise a non-event, at least in these two types. The door simply trails slightly open. To close, you typically close the vents, open a window and pull it shut. Pushing it out a bit first helps. However, if you're alone (and don't have an autopilot), it's probably better to simply leave it and land as soon as practical.

[Lister Noble]

This happened to me last year early on in my solo student period.
Top latch on the PA28 didn't shut properly and I didn't realise until after take off when it started to open at the top.
These latches are horrible things and difficult to close at the best of times.
I continued my exercise and landed ,told CFI and he said I should have landed as soon as I realised what had happened.
I thought slipstream would keep it closed but it really was bulging open at the top and a knowledgeable pal told me they do open due to neg pressure on upper wing surface(Benoulli and all that)
Is this true?
Lister:)

[172driver]

Lister, funnily enough - that's almost exactly what happened to me. T'was on my first solo X-country (a few more moons ago than yours...) and about 30 mins into the flight the :mad: top latch popped open, somehow folled by the bottom one. Got out the POH and tried to follow procedures - in vain. The :mad: thing simply wouldn't close. Aborted X-country and returned to base. CFI somewhat perplexed asked why I didn't just carry on to my first stop, as the door would just trail w/o doing anything bad. In fact he demonstrated that on a quick flight (in a way I of course knew already, having flown INXS of one hour with the door open! - but tell that to a student :ugh: like me at the time....).

[Gertrude the Wombat]

One trick flying with passengers is to give yourself the brief with your mike well off to the side so they can't hear you
Most pilots talk to themselves much of the time - OK, not all of us recite every FREDA, but plenty do, as discussed here in the past - so I just find it easier to say to passengers "not to take any notice of me talking to myself, most pilots do this, it's just that you can't hear them in an airliner".

[kookabat]

I usually add something along the lines of 'don't worry about me talking to myself, I'm either doing a checklist or talking to ATC - it's when I go very very quiet that you should be worried!' :ooh:

[wbryce]

Look, it's a little PA28, nothing more...... Why bother mentioning the take-off and climb speeds? Who else is interested?
State who will be flying the take-off - and what anyone else should do if there is an emergency at the time.
NB the best course of action regarding fields for EFATO.
But do try to avoid sounding like a total "Captain Speaking" pratt with half-a-dozen tin bars on your epaulettes!


how true beags!

just tell them what they need to know in order to keep them safe and you safe i.e. how to vacate the aircraft, what safety equipment you have, what direction to run from aircraft and the do's and don'ts....

Get them familiar with the seat belts and doors as silly as it may sound - in a rush of panic - the twin locking system on a PA28 and other such types is enough to catch anyone out...I've even found myself wondering why the damn thing wont open a few times! ;)

[Dr Eckener]

pax brief - legal requirement (belts, doors, evacuation, jackets, phones, etc).

captain's brief - not a legal requirement.

if you do wish to give one then if something is standard do not amplify. ie standard take off, standard efato drills, crosswind from the right. if it is non standard then comment on the differences. ie short field take off with 25 degrees flap, rotate speed 50kts, retract flaps at 200' and adjust to standard climb, standard efato drills except we will have flaps below 200', crosswind from the right.

something along those lines - short and sweet.

[LH2]

McGoo et al., thanks for the advice.

it'll be noisy and you may be effectively NORDO but you should be fine. The crucial thing is not to be spooked by it.

As a skydiver, it's flying with the door closed that feels weird :} (not to mention hot)


The other one (which I think has killed?) is seat adjustment latches failing on rotation leaving you sliding backwards pulling the nose up as you go.

Good point. I recently flew a 172 which had a ratchet thingy fitted on the front seat detent to stop it from sliding backwards. I had this happen to me but on a car not an airplane--admitedly it was in less than pristine condition :E