Wannabe a pilot! (And I'm too damn lazy to do a search)

[stickandrudderman]

If you feel you've got sufficient intelligence to complete the course, there are plenty of schools who will take your money, then it's up to you whether you pass or not.
I can't speak from experience, but I can't imagine any employer differentiating between ATPL holders with or without the preliminary academic qualifications.
I can conceive of a scenario which will mean you having to work for a smaller, lower paid employer, but one presumes you're not in it for the money anyway!:=

[bill49miller]

Sean,
Forgive me for barging in on this thread, but I noticed you said you are enrolled in a JAA ATPL distance learning course.
I am a captain for Alaska Airlines flying 737s. I am 57 yrs old, and as you may be aware our FAA will force me to retire in less than 3 years. I am interested in obtaining a JAA ATPL (well accepted worldwide) so that I may find employment outside the USA after I have turned 60. I will need to sit the 14 exams. A distance learning course in preparation seems wise to me.
Where are you enrolled?
Bill

[bill49miller]

Ray,
I have been flying professionally since 1971, married since 1979. My wife hated my job in 1979, and she still does.
I am a relatively senior captain on Alaska Airlines 737s (bidding about 62 out of 240 in the Seattle base) and I am normally gone about 280 to 300 hours per month (it prints out on my per diem allowance line on the pay sheets). That is more time away from home than most jobs. We fly (get paid for) 85 hour lines here. Duty time is usually about 155 to 165, with quite a few 2.5 to 3.0 hour sit-arounds (we sarcastically call them "productivity breaks") during our duty days.
Bill

[Adrenaline]

Hi,

I am a student currently aspiring to be a pilot, wondering if anyone here has any information on (Requirements, License (Fees), Scholarships, etc needed).Would really be grateful to you guys if you could sound out some examples.


I know that different airlines have different requirements but is there a basic requirement like eyesight, fitness (diabetic, BMI, etc)?

And as for the fees, if one doesn't has a scholarship provided by a particular airline, how much does he need to pay to get a license, etc.


With Regards,
Adrenaline

[MikeSamuel]

READ HERE (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=251490)!

[Adrenaline]

Ah yes, thanks for the reminder. However, those are quite fixed. Was hopping for something less formal and direct for real-life experiences :).

[gpm72]

first of all, i'd like to say hi to everyone.

my problem is, i would like to get my pilots lic, enabling myself to get to a level of either biz jets, or cargo.
i'm a complete beginer, but not naive. i know it will cost loads, in time and money. i have looked at the forums, to try and pick out a flying school abroad, but the jury is still out on that one......
as a beginer, i'm having trouble with some of the abbreviations, and also unsure what qualifications or courses i actually need to get to the level i would like.

please can someone help.

many thanks,

gary

[future captain]

Helloo :ok:
check this out: http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=131649

[phillpot]

Hi Gary,

To fly commercially you need an ATPL (airline transport pilots licence) you can still get the CPL (commercial pilot licence) however this would restrict you to certain types of work.
The two ways of getting this is integrated or modular
Intergrated, basically you join a school and leave about a year later and a lot poorer (£50-£70k) with a frozen atpl.
Modular you do your PPL (private pilot licence) 45 hr flying plus 7 written exams.
Build hours until 150 total time 100 pic (pilot in command eg on your own)
14 written exams
night rating 5 hrs flying
CPL course 25 hrs flying single engine complex (variable pitch prop and retractable undercarriage)
Twin rating 6 hrs
IR (instrument rating )55 hrs flying in a twin
MCC Multi crew co-operation
all that gives you a frozen ATPL or CPL/IR after 1500 hours plus other criteria you ATPL is unfrozen.

You can swap certain things around but that is basically the format all those times are minimum time and all examinations fees both written and flying will be on top of any prices you've seen, oh yeah and a class one medical is required.Modular will still cost about £50k and when checking schools abroad make sure they are JAR otherwise you will need to convert your licences. There is a book written by Clive Hughes "guide to becoming an airline pilot" a worthwhile read you should be able to get it from www.transair.co.uk (http://www.transair.co.uk)

[Daniel634]

hi im daniel and i wish to become a commercial pilot.at this moment in time i have no experience of flying as i am only sixteen.at the moment i am resitting 2 gcse and am currently studying a Btec national diploma in the built environment.i am hoping you could give me advice on where to go to find out about sponserships as becoming a commercial pilot is very 'pricy!!'

[Daniel634]

yeah i believe you are correct in getting a medical and the built environment is studying surveying and architecture.I have thought this through many times and am willing to do anything to be able to pursue my dream career.i Have reviewed many ways of pursuing my career and am lookng for advice on the best possible way

[future captain]

Daniel634,

What have you got your GCSE's in, have you got a-c in maths, science/physics and english?

The "sponsorships", note the inverted commas are not actually funded by the airline, you pay for the training and upon completion if there are vacancies, you would be taken on. You are monitored throughout.

Even these schemes require two Alevels and a lot of the time in a science/maths based Alevels.

[Daniel634]

i have a-c in maths science and english lang,eng lit and business i am doing btec national which is the equilvalent to 3 a levels.is that sufficient to do any of these schemes ?

[Daniel634]

yeah i totally agree.A National diploma is the equiva;ent to 3 a levels like i said and on most cadet schemes i have researched they have asked for two a levels or the equivalent.I just need to find ways of financing my training as i believe i have all other aspects clear.I believe the best thing for me to do is to gain a ppl as this will open a lot of doors for me and give me a wider range of routes and different types of financing i checked out the air atlantique and as you said the only stipulation is the four year bond!!

[scroggs]

What A levels and degree (if any)? (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=164926)

Sponsorship Programmes? (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=198344)

Loans for funding Flying Training (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=207270)

Background Info (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=134076) on the process of obtaining a professional licence and getting a job.

All these threads are linked to in the Archive Reference Threads - READ BEFORE YOU POST A QUESTION! (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=131649) sticky thread.

Scroggs

[pilot4001]

hi
i have PPL and now flying to collect more hours in flying club,
is it possible to obtain a CPL from south africa if i have 250 hours 100 PIC and 20 cross-country solo?
how to get my CPL.
waiting....:)

[packet_data]

I want eventually to fly a widebody(SIA, CX, BA, etc.). Let's say that after school(having approx 200TT) I can choose either turboprop job(captain after 3-4 years) OR a job flying business jets as FO(x years to captain). Which would you choose? Which job would you consider being more useful to later get a job at the airlines mentioned(or any other major/legacy)? I'm 28 years old when I get my fATPL if that matters.

The turboprop would be ATR 72 and business jet is falcon 20.

[monkeys]

Hey Everyone!

Im hoping that someone out there can help me with my problem as im really stuck at the moment.

I have my PPL :D and now im looking to all that commerical stuff, however ive no clue what im surposed to do.

I know I have to get my ATPLs, CPL, and IR, but is there anything else? and im only 20 and ive read/heared somewhere that there might be an age restriction on the ATPLs, is there? and do I need my night and IMC ratings before I do the ATPLs aswell?

Anything anyone can do to help me, I will be VVVVVVV greatful!

Thanks

[apron]

ok this is my humble advice........
Go and do your 14 ATPL exams. The revision will take several months.
Then do your cpl which should be about an extra 100 hrs ish if you are around the 50 hrs mark.
Then multi engine class rating taking 10 hrs on a twin.
Then i/r....40 hrs.

Then mcc and the airlines will be ready for you

[bobster1]

Hi Monkeys.

PPL (which you have)
14 theory exams (ATPLs) your age is fine
Night rating which you can do during your above ground school study
Hour building to a toatal of 150 hrs prior to starting CPL (100 hrs PIC)
Then M/E if you have done your CPL on a complex single ie arrow..
Then I/R
Then MCC

then thats you done.

[3bars]

And after all of the above, don't forget to budget for a Type rating:E +£20k:{

[robdesbois]

For (lots) more information on all aspects of how to get to the stage where you are an employable pilot, try checking out Clive Hughes book 'Guide to Becoming a Professional Pilot' at http://www.ppl-atpl.demon.co.uk/

It's well-known and has a lot of useful info on every stage from PPL through ground studies, CPL, ME, IR etc.
From memory you will need your night rating *before* beginning training for the IR (although this is included as part of CPL if not already obtained).

Good luck!
Rob

[Re-Heat]

Have you read the references in the sticky thread at the top? If not, read them, and then come back and ask away.

No need to re-invent the wheel here!

[eng1]

I am B1 licensed engineer with a320 and a330 full type ratings working for a major uk airine at lhr. I am looking in to doing my cpl and was just wondering if there was anyone out there that has done the same from an engineering background? There are a few other things that I would like some guidance on:
Where is the best place to train?
Is there financial help available for courses and what sort of cost is involved?
what are the realistic chances of getting a job once I have graduated?

Any information would be appreciated. Thanks in advance :ok:

[nastyevil110]

Hi all,

Can anyone tell is that possible do to the both exams i mean if i sit in one cpl and one atpl like CPL navigation pass it then do the ATPL navigation????? plz reply.

Thanx.:O

[Airbus38]

Why do both??

If you're looking to do the lot then you need only sit the ATPL exams.
A38

[nastyevil110]

Dear Airbus38,

Is that possible? if it is.... then it will be bloody jackpot....


Thanx mate...:ok:

I think it is not possible can't jump straight and do only ATPL have to do the seven CPL exams.....

[Enicomb]

Ok, let me start this by saying I hope I'm not breaking any rules, but if I am I apologise but this forum is mostly confusing me at a time when I'm already very confused :bored:

Anyway, my point, or rather my question is I'd like to become a pilot but after some extensive searching am none the wiser to finding out how, and the different licenses and ratings do nothing but confuse the hell out of me. The only thing I could find was cabair.com who seemed to offer training (for £60k, which I think is about average yes?) but I have no idea whether that'd get me to where I want...and where I want is to be flying for an airline (probably eventually long haul, which takes longer yes?)

Also I don't have £60k, and have been trying to find more information on sponsorship schemes, however my search has been fruitless and I have found nothing. The closest I could find is BA's scheme which closed some time ago, that or joining the RAF, which I don't particularly want to do nor would it get me to where I want (from my understanding you don't get a full license with them, but need to do some conversion??).

Also, could anyone tell me what would be involved in the training, and what is the expected knowledge beforehand; I keep seeing Maths and Physics knowledge needed, but never to what extent.

So yes I'm poor, I'm 22, just about to finish university (IT field) in about 3 weeks and would like some more information, if any of you guys can help, I'd greatly appreciate it.

[dfspilot]

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/LASORS_07.pdf .search for this and download and it will give you the info you require to get started with all the details you require. in regard to finance search under professional training on pprune under sponsorships but be prepared this is extremely tough to get through and if 100 apply ( though there are usually 100s if not thousands) it is a very small handfull that get through. maths and physics and a good standard of english are the min requirments to be a proficient pilot. for a sponsorship you are looking at A level standards at least. hope this is of some help. good luck in your adventure and do as much research as you can. its tough but achievable and very enjoyable ( though like all good things it has its hard times too. there are many threads on pprune on this subject but you should read scroggs thread before you ask a question at the top of each section . it is extremely helpfull. oh and expect this thread to be moved by scroggs to the PROFESSIONAL FLIGHT TRAINING THREAD as thats where your question should be.this is scroggs thread http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?t=251490

[scroggs]

Enicomb go back to the beginning of this thread. Read the first post. Follow the links given. You will learn a lot. Then look through the rest of this thread, and those in the READ THIS FIRST thread dfspilot has given you a link to. You will learn a lot more.

When you have read and learned all those threads contain, you will be in a position to make sensible decisions and frame meaningful questions about the courses of action available to you.

Scroggs

[Airbus38]

nastyevil110

The answer is yes. As a PPL holder (I assume you are a JAR holder rather than an NPPL) you can register with a groundschool to do the ATPL groundschool course (14 exams).

I'd recommend you do a bit of reading up on the requirements before you do this, it's all on here.

[Effee]

As above, do you need a PPL before you can do your CPL with all ratings, or can you just go direct?

[chlong]

only if you go on an integrated course and then you dont actually do a ppl. so in answer to your question
ppl
night rating
cpl
there are no silly questions in aviation.

[Constanse]

You also need 150 hours before you can start your CPL

[EpsilonVaz]

Plus the CPL Theory Exams, most people do the ATPL Exams as they intend to eventually hold that licence.

[edymonster]

Plus to have the thing issued by the CAA you need 200 hours with 100 PIC

[Effee]

thanks for all the replies!

[fonawah]

Dont forget you also need a Class 1 medical if you want a CPL

[hollywood285]

and sh!t loads of cash.

[CHANNEX]

Hi all, well this is my first post on this forum, i am 27 years of age and currently an electrical engineer, i have always had a passion for commercial aviation and my dream is to one day be a fully qualified commercial pilot, with the increase of low cost airlines coupled with the retirement of pilots, there is now an increased chance of securing a sponsorship or part sponsorship for the ATPL.

I have a few questions that i would be most greatful if anyone could answer.

1) i wear contact lenses, would this cause a problem?
2) what is the typical wage for a new starting pilot
3) how many hours are required before type rating is allowed for aircraft such as the 747?
4) what amount of hours would a typical pilot work per week?

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Many Thanks.

[redsnail]

The true sponsorships don't exist any more. For more info look up CTC, Oxford (OATS) and the like. The Netjets Europe cadetship is opening again on Monday the 14th.

Cadetships are possible with easyJet, Monarch, Netjets Europe and so on.

Retirements is a furfy, age limits are increasing.

The contact lenses aren't a problem per se, however, your starting prescription might be. Check the CAA's website for the actual limits.

747s are being operated by BA and Virgin Atlantic to name a couple of British airlines. With Virgin, you'll need approx 2500 hours of medium jet (or Mil) time to get a look-in. BA, you can get in as a low houred pilot via OATS (maybe, to be confirmed) or after doing some time as a turboprop pilot or jet pilot.

Typical wage? Well, I started life in the UK as a Shorts 360 FO on £16,000 per annum. Instructors can earn more or less than this.
A Turboprop FO for an "airline" might earn about £20K where as a jet FO might earn maybe £26-28K per annum. Best check PPJN for more details.
If you hold a full ATPL the FO salary is better but that's for later.

Typical hours? Limited to 55 hours duty per week. The loco's will have you working as close to 900 "stick" hours per annum. (Actual duty will be higher). Depending on who you work for it could be all earlies one week, followed by lates the next. Or it could be a mix of the two.
The relaxed and comfy lifestyle doesn't really exist any more.

[Ropey Pilot]

LASORS 2007 (http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/LASORS_07.pdf)
Is the CAA bible with all the answers.

Bit heavy for the newbie - but it isn't quite as hard to fathom as it first looks.

[A340x]

Hello there. I am new here, and I live in Canada. I have logged 45 hours of flying time therefore i will get my PPL very soon. For 10+ years I've been dreaming to fly large jets for a living. This year I will be finishing high school then I will start college then university in Mechanical engineering in aeronautics, meanwhile i will be logging flying hours. Can a mechanical engineering degree help me to become an airline pilot more easily? My intentions are to fly either the Twin Otters for MAT( Maldivian Air Taxi) or for Ryanair that apparently haas a program for low hours pilots from 200 hours. Could you please tell me that after 5-6 years when ive finished my university degree and when i am with a bachelor's degree, how easily can i get a job with Ryanair with a self-sponsored training being Canadian? My ultimate goal is the B777 for Emirates.

[MON321]

Hi A340x

If you do a search you will find load of threads on the further education versus flight training debate and you may find these useful. Having a background in Mech Engineering will certainly help with the exams but my personal view is that in the current recruiting climate the carriers you have mentioned wouldn't really mind if you have a degree or not. So with that in mind why not consider saving 5-6 years of your life and go do what you ultimately want to do, i.e pass your flying exams and get a poorly paid but hugely rewarding job flying something, then start moving your way up the food chain towards the jet that you aspire to.

To be responsible, I will add the caveat that obviously this is very limiting educationally and if for any reason you didn't achieve your aim you are stuck with far less marketable education in the broader sense.

Asking people to predict the market in six years time is all but impossible as it is changing all the time and at an unprecedented rate. Also, whilst it's great to have specific aspirations MAT, RYR, EI, be prepared to change your plans to take advantage of whatever opportunities come your way, but I'm certain that you would have worked that out for yourself.

Can't answer your questions regarding Canadians working in Europe but a quick internet search should answer that and you'd be very welcome.

Good luck, keep the faith and you will get what you deserve.

[yabadabado_uk]

I did my IMC and night rating at Ormand, and I would not recommend this school to anyone. know that they are very sensitive to postings here, so enough said.

[irabdlatib]

Anybody had any knowledge or experience with Egnatia Aviation school in Greece. The program includes all modules required for a JAA fATPL licence such as PPL, Night Qualification, Hours Building, Multi-Engine Rating, ATPL Theory, CPL and IR and the cost is quite affordable.

Please advice coz I've to make decision very soon