Steps to become ME Instrument Instructor

[lgt]

Hi all.
I´ve just finished an integrated course (ATPL frozen) with only 200 hours.
Now I´m considering to become an instructor, but I would like to teach IFR in Multi Engines.
I think the minimum requirements would be 500 hours for the ME and 200 IFR for the IRI, wouldn´t it?
Could you give me some advices about in which order should I do the 3 courses FI, MEI and IRI?
Where would it be the cheapest...and where could I find a job (in the UK if possible) if I´m not UK citizen but I can speak English more or less fluently??
Thanks!!!

[FlyingForFun]

That's exactly what I'm trying to do, but I'm a bit further down the line than you. You would need to:

- Become a FI(R) - restricted flying instructor
- Remvoe the restriction by logging 100 instruction hours and supervising 25 solo student flights. (An FI can't teach instrument flying or multi-engine whilst still a restricted instructor.)
- Remove the "No Applied Instrument Instruction" restriction from your FI rating. (You should find that the time you logged during your IR will already have you at the minimum for doing this - either 200 hours IFR, or 50 hours by sole reference to instruments if you want to teach for IR, less if you want to teach for IMC.)
- Hour-build to 500 hours total time, and 30 hours P1 on MEPs. (The 30 hours P1 on MEPs might take a bit of financing)
- Add multi-engine privileges to your FI rating

Hope that answers the question,

FFF
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[lgt]

what do you mean with "Remove the "No Applied Instrument Instruction" restriction from your FI rating
". I´ve never heard about it. So, how do I remove that restriction? And after removing it, do I have to do the IR Instructor course??

[Whopity]

Of course not, it only applies to UK issued JAA licences, nobody else in Europe does it that way.

The UK National FI rating was issued with limitations that could be removed following additional training. When we changed to JAA licences and ratings the CAA never reprogrammed the computer so the JAA licences have the same limitations. In simple, removing the "No applied IF limitation" is exactly the same as completing the IRI course.

THe reference to having enough IF hours is again a UK thing! Because we do not log time in accordance with IFR, the CAA agreed to accept time by sole reference to instruments which we do log, on a 4:1 ratio, so that 50 hours by sole reference equates to 200 hours IFR. Other European countries will not do it this way.

You would be better to qualify to teach instrument flying before completing the ME Instructor course as there is not much chance of teaching ME IF without the relevant SE experience.

[lgt]

Thanks for your response
Well, so better if I get only the FI(R) and get experience ´til doing the MEI IRI.
What would be my chances to be hired in the uk around september??? Note I´m not UK citizen, but my english is more or less fluent.
Thanks

[Dr Eckener]

As well as this many hours of this and this many hours of that, you should also think along the lines of building relevant instructional experience:

1. As a restricted FI you need to show you can teach and judge solo readiness
2. As a FI you need to show you can get people through the PPL to a good standard
3. Once you can teach applied instrument you need to show you can get people through the IMC test to a good standard
4. Next comes CPL instruction, proving you can teach to a standard acceptable to a CAA examiner
5. Finally you arrive at MEP & ME/IR instruction, and again you need to get people through the test with a CAA examiner.

Instruct for a couple of yours and you can achieve this. The hours required should pretty much fall into place over this time period.

[lloydsky]

Hi
I dont think that you will have the requirements to teach Instrument after just doing your IR! You would need 200hrs IFR or 50 hours in Total IMC. When I finished my IR I had about 3 IMC hours and about 40 IFR hours. Thats a long way to go!!!

I have a question.

I would also like to go down the same route. I am currently in USA building PIC hours for my CPL conversion (from FAA) and I am trying to do as many of these hours in IMC to count towards my 200hrs IFR. I also have FAA ME CPL

Here's the question - Should I do 30 of these hours in a Multi Engine to get the 30 PIC hours out the way for the ME IR Instructor requirements (since I have no ME PIC hours at present) or should I leave it because I believe some of these 30 hours need to be in the last year and it will take longer than a year to become an ME IR instructor.

Thanks

[FlyingForFun]

Lloyd,

In the UK (yes, I'd better make that clear this time, since I didn't last time!) it is possible to remove the No Applied Instrument restriction with far less than 200 hours. If you are only going to teach for the IMC course (rather than the IR), it is just 40 hours IFR, or 10 hours by sole reference to instruments (which can be either IMC or under the foggles). Since an IMC course has a minimum of 10 hours by sole reference to instruments, this means anyone with an IMC rating can train to have privileges to teach for this rating - unbelievable, but true.

But is it really possible to get an IR with only 3 hours by sole referene to instruments? Even with maximum possible simulator time (and therefore minimum possible aircraft time), you must surely have logged more hours than this on your IR course alone???

To answer your question about multi-engine time, though - do 20 hours of multi-engine P1 time now during your hour-building. The requirement is for 10 hours out of the 30 to have been within the previous 12 months, so you will need to save the last 10 for later.

FFF
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[lloydsky]

Thanks

But I still believe you need the equivelent 200 IFR hours to teach IR (whether it is by 50 IMC hours or a combination)

I have a another question;
Do many people in UK take IR single engine courses (I know the main is ME IR) and do many people take the IMC course?

Also what do you need to teach to a commercial stamdard? Is it just the solo restriction removed?

Cheers

[Dr Eckener]

To teach commercial - 500hrs instruction, plus restriction removed. Also having applied instruments should be a requirement (although the CAA do not specify it as a requirement), as 10 hours of the CPL is instrument.

[silverknapper]

I would imagine you may struggle to find either an employer or a student willing to spend their £12k on an IR with you if you are very low houred. Indeed you could well be teaching someone with more hours than you. When I was choosing a school for the IR I looked at what experience the IRI's had. The one I chose in the end had 1000's of hours commercial flying experience. And it showed in the way he taught.
From memory I think there is a way an ATPL holder with experience can become an IRI without an FI course. I will look it up when have time.

[FlyingForFun]

From memory I think there is a way an ATPL holder with experience can become an IRI without an FI courseYou are correct.

There are two routes to teaching for the IR. The first is to become a FI, then remove the No Applied Instrument restriction. This is what we've been discussing on this thread up till now.

The second option is to become an IRI. There is no requirement to be an FI first, and therefore an IRI will not have privileges to teach ab-initio students; the privileges only applying to teaching for an IR.

The requirements are to hold an IR and to have logged 800 hours IFR (of which 400 are on aeroplanes). Time logged by sole reference to instruments counts in the same 4:1 ratio. There is then a 10-hour course and a test (vs 5 hours for an FI to remove the No Applied Instrument restriction).

This only gives privileges to teach IR on single-engine. To teach on multi-engine would also require you to be a ME CRI. You can combine the CRI course with the IRI course, in which case the combined course is 15 hours.

All of this is in LASORS section H2

FFF
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