AIR CHINA CARGO

[future G-V driver]

Hi, I have tried a search ref the above, no joy. Can anyone please provide any info on ACC, what they are like to work for, base, routes etc.

Thanks in advance

[alexb757]

Also, any age limits?
CX, SIN Cargo, EVA all have them but you have to dig through their websites to find out or write to them to ask. Some airlines do, others don't. Knowing beforehandwill save a lot of time and energy!

[Crossbleed]

For F/O's the Chinese CAA (CAAC) wil not recognize Co-pilot endorsements regardless of country of issue. :confused: Your options then are to upgrade to a command rating (find a sim and examiner etc.. etc..), or to submit to the Initial type-rating course all over again.
I'm told this may take up to 6 months to complete,(ACC are desperately trying to shortcut this nonsense), and during this time you will be payed 50% of salary ie. USD 3,000 with no per diems. If you choose to reside in the flight-crew accom. building at the training facility across the road from the airport, you are charged RMB 6,000 p/m. ie 2 thousand more than your allowance. The building is 4 star hotel-type accom with all meals in cafeteria-style setup.
Should be a reasonable gig when the wrinkles are ironed out. This is the first time expats have gone through this neck of the woods, I believe, and there are new issues arrising weekly.
Stay tuned...

[co-joe]

Should be a reasonable gig when the wrinkles are ironed out. This is the first time expats have gone through this neck of the woods, I believe, and there are new issues arrising weekly.


Right you are Crossbleed. Although this would not be the first time expats are coming through these neck of the woods. There are many foreigners flying for Shenzhen Airlines in southern China. Although they seem to have their issues ironed out by the CAAC's Southern District Office.

There are also a bunch of foreign pilots with Okay Airways, based in Tianjin, who are the first expats trying to break into the Chinese aviation market. These pilots have been waiting for over 1.5 years now, waiting for CAAC (Northern District Office) to iron out their policies on hiring foreign pilots. Although I do believe that this would be Air China's first official attempt to hire foreign pilots. CAAC is notoriously known to being extremely slow in processing new policies and regulations.

[Crossbleed]

Didn't realise there were expats over there.:hmm:
Suppose it's a case of wait and see. A watched kettle never boils, they say. Must sit on hands and try not to sweat it.

[CuriousPilot]

Expats working for AIR CHINA directly??? And living in Air China complex???
I hope this work out nice, but it's not easy for expats pilots to work in Chinese company from the mainland that never had expat before......
Cheers

[akistar]

Is there any possible chances of upgrade for co-pilots?

[Crossbleed]

Discussions with company reps. seem to indicate that expats will be upgrade-able inline with normal company criteria. Exactly how they are slotted into any existing seniority system is unknown to me at this time. There was talk of expats operating as a somewhat homogenous group on the aircraft (whether this is to negate translator requirements, or for seniority/upgrade reasons is also unknown).
The first group of expats have arrived in-country as of last week I believe, more to follow shortly. 4X 744F's to be delivered in total, first due very soon.
Living in the pilot/FA dorm isn't mandatory but access to training base and need to find your own appartment make it an easier option at least until the training is in hand.

[Blueair]

Expats working for AIR CHINA directly??? And living in Air China complex???
I hope this work out nice, but it's not easy for expats pilots to work in Chinese company from the mainland that never had expat before......
Cheers

Expats working for Air China Cargo directly, and living in Beijing or Shanghai. Though they have never had expat before, but they will get help from us, we can help expat to work well in Chinese airlines.

[CuriousPilot]

Expats working for Air China Cargo directly, and living in Beijing or Shanghai. Though they have never had expat before, but they will get help from us, we can help expat to work well in Chinese airlines.


Yeap...I hope so!!! But will be the first one !!! Just ask for anyone working in EVA, China Airlines and few others in the area (SHENZHEIN AIRLINES ALSO)....... Of course you can have such nice persons working with you, but most of times the foreign pilot never will be right!!!
I can tell you for sure more than 20 cases where the VP of Operations don't even listening to the foreign side of the history...

Cheers

[Crossbleed]

The past experiences of expats working in the region will provide a worthwhile opportunity for ACC to not repeat the mistakes their competitors have made in the past. EVA is a shambles with morale lower than ever. CHINA Airlines the same. Don't have any feedback re: Shenzhen? Anyone??
All the expats want is to be treated the same as the nationals, there should be no favourites, equal chances for upgrade and their voice to be heard by management. These are the obvious problems at EVA and CA. ACC shouldn't have any difficulty making sure they are the better employer in the region if these prior bad-examples are noted.:)
I believe Blueairs sentiment is admirable and if reflected by management there is great opportunity at ACC.

[Deske1]

The past experiences of expats working in the region will provide a worthwhile opportunity for ACC to not repeat the mistakes their competitors have made in the past. EVA is a shambles with morale lower than ever. CHINA Airlines the same. Don't have any feedback re: Shenzhen? Anyone??
All the expats want is to be treated the same as the nationals, there should be no favourites, equal chances for upgrade and their voice to be heard by management.


Where is this airline?In Asia?:\ In China?:} In Hong Kong maybe.......

[Crossbleed]

Air China Cargo: freight arm of the national carrier. Based in Beijing, possibly Shanghai later. See job adverts at IAC global, Rishworth and Direct Personnel etc...

[tonylollo]

:) :) Haha Huaxhan Technolgoies bit of free advertising is that allowed Mod.
Anyway aren`t you the guys who thought Loss of Licence Insurance was when you did just that, left in a taxi, had it stolen etc........ .......... Rishworth IAC think you should put your terms out for us all to see on PPRUNE , save you a fortune on advertising..:ok:

[Crossbleed]

Anyone on the first intake of Air China Cargo
What's it all like?
What's the story with staff-travel?:uhoh: :uhoh: :uhoh:

[Start4&3]

Has ACC hired any Expat 744 Captains ?

Yes, two guys from my airline got hired there last Feb. as DECs.

[Blueair]

Anyone on the first intake of Air China Cargo
What's it all like?
What's the story with staff-travel?:uhoh: :uhoh: :uhoh:

ACC stop requirement of foreign pilot very suddenly after many candidates have been interviewed.....

[Crossbleed]

Blueair; is that because they have enough crew now??

[Blueair]

Blueair; is that because they have enough crew now??

They just get enough Chinese crew.

[Blueair]

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Air China Senior Officials Statements: Fact OR Fiction ?
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http://www.china.org.cn/images/webcast/logo.GIF (http://www.china.org.cn/logo/E-logo.htm)


Foreign Pilots on the Horizon for Air China


Foreign pilots are to be brought in by the nation's flagship carrier to meet the demand of its expanding air fleets.

Air China said it was planning an overseas recruitment drive because it was suffering a severe shortage of pilots.

"Air China has planned to introduce 20 to 30 airplanes within this year, but the exact number will depend on the supply of aircrew members, particularly the pilots," said Li Huxiao, a senior staff from the Beijing-based airline company.

"Currently, we are short of at least 40 captains, so we will try to recruit foreign pilots," Li said.

In the context of the rapid growth of civil aviation industry, the shortage of pilots, particularly captains, is a serious problem, said Hao Yuping, deputy senior director of Air China.

He gave no details about the exact number of foreign pilots his company planned to recruit.

Air China's problems reflect the fact China's booming commercial aviation industry is taking off faster than the country can train pilots.

According to statistics from the General Administration of Civil Aviation of China (CAAC), the industry regulator, about 11,000 pilots are employed to fly more than 770 aircraft operated by the major Chinese commercial airlines a figure industry experts say is inadequate to cope with rocketing demand for passenger services.

The Civil Aviation Flight University of China, the nation's major training school for commercial airline pilots based in Sichuan and Henan provinces, graduates a maximum of 600 pilots a year.

Based on the delivery of new aircraft, industry experts estimate that China has needed between 1,200 and 1,600 new pilots every year since 2000.

To the major State-owned airlines such as Air China, China Southern Airlines and China Eastern Airlines, another increasing challenge is the expansion of private carriers in the country, as pilot headhunting frequently occurred to the companies from last year.

Ten captains from the Jiangsu Branch of China Eastern Airlines asked to resign in December, something that had never happened before the growth of private airlines.

Copyright © China Internet Information Center. All Rights Reserved E-mail: [email protected] ([email protected])

Tel: 86-10-68326688



Above is a very old news, things always change quickly and suddenly. Air China tried to employ foreign pilot since 2004, but no one was employed...

[skycruiser65]

The relentless posting of such statements does not actually imply, that there are really good jobs.
As long as authorities can afford to protect their local pilots markets against foreigners (India, China and many more), the so called "lack of qualified pilots" seems to be nothing more than a myth to me.
Or check this from directpersonnel.com:
Type Rated B747-400 First Officers
Job details:
Our client has a requirement for B747-400 First Officers for their operation in China.
Required experience:
We are currently accepting expressions of interest for the following: We will accept 'low hour' First Officers, however, they must satisfy the following criteria: A B747-400 Type Rating 3,000 hours Total Time on all aircraft 1,500 hours on a Jet Aircraft weighing more than 93,000 LBS and current on this aircraft (Last flight within the past 6 months) Class 1 medical No record of accident or incident. This is an excellent oppertunity to discover the Far East, working for a national carrier. I look forward to receiving your 1 page resumes. ***ONLY CANDIDATES SATISFYING THE ABOVE CRITERA NEED APPLY***
Location:
China
Type of contract:
Long term
Start date:
ASAP
Duration:
min 12 months
We offer:
An excellent remuneration package

What does that mean?
They urge those "keen on widebody hours pilots willing to fly for food" to make a B747-400-rating on their own expenses and then apply.
As long as industry can make such fatal offers, the economic aspect (cost savings) still weighs out the aspect of a smooth and safe operation with no cancelled flights due to lack of personnel

[alexb757]

The relentless posting of such statements does not actually imply, that there are really good jobs.
As long as authorities can afford to protect their local pilots markets against foreigners (India, China and many more), the so called "lack of qualified pilots" seems to be nothing more than a myth to me.
Or check this from directpersonnel.com:
Type Rated B747-400 First Officers
Job details:
Our client has a requirement for B747-400 First Officers for their operation in China.
Required experience:
We are currently accepting expressions of interest for the following: We will accept 'low hour' First Officers, however, they must satisfy the following criteria: A B747-400 Type Rating 3,000 hours Total Time on all aircraft 1,500 hours on a Jet Aircraft weighing more than 93,000 LBS and current on this aircraft (Last flight within the past 6 months) Class 1 medical No record of accident or incident. This is an excellent oppertunity to discover the Far East, working for a national carrier. I look forward to receiving your 1 page resumes. ***ONLY CANDIDATES SATISFYING THE ABOVE CRITERA NEED APPLY***
Location:
China
Type of contract:
Long term
Start date:
ASAP
Duration:
min 12 months
We offer:
An excellent remuneration package

What does that mean?
They urge those "keen on widebody hours pilots willing to fly for food" to make a B747-400-rating on their own expenses and then apply.
As long as industry can make such fatal offers, the economic aspect (cost savings) still weighs out the aspect of a smooth and safe operation with no cancelled flights due to lack of personnel

It means they (DPI & others) are trawling!!:)
It's simply to get guys to whip up their resumes/CVs to see what's out there....they play the game, just like the pilots do.
I've lost count of the number of "airlines" whose ads I have answered, willing to go half-way around the globe (sometimes more) who have NEVER responded to my documentation. Then two months down the road they come up with the exact SAME ad with the addition of "new and improved terms & conditions"!! What does that tell you??:hmm:
And in case anyone says that they do not have the manpower to respond to all candidates, taht's just B.S.!! They are a business and that is part of their job! Most pilots who respond are genuine, interested in the position and want to find out more. Most are also qualified for the position - they are not wannabes.....
I had one instance about a year ago when an "agency" apparently lost my paperwork and then back-peddled saying that their client had rejected my application. But......I had to drag it out of them! They "forgot" to send me the rejection email. They did this twice for two different contracts on two different aircraft. I was notimpressed and this was one of the better ones.
In my experience, recent and past, these airlines and some agencies are fairly inefficient at what they do. Quite a few do not follow through and the amount they must be spending on advertising around the world and on the net, would make many a start-up airline blush;)
Moral of the story: do not believe everything you read or that they tell you. It does not necessarily mean that there are open positions available and agencies as well as clinet airlines change their minds all the time, ACC is a case in point and they are not the only ones.

[alexb757]

Skycruiser65 and Alexb757,

Both are bringing up very valid core points of underperforming operations and some clueless crew contractors which are definitely
trawling and playing games. But, All are just wasting their time.

The Bottom Line is , All are not producing anything, are behind in their so-called expansion plans and the winners are only the Competent Operations which are clearly identifiable thru their Actual Results.

(Now, ACC's latest effort: Air China Cargo - China Cargo of China Eastern - Dragonair Cargo, to merge for a better future.)

I think you are right actually. So much for "saving" money by screwing your most valuable resource - the drivers without whom you cannot even start! Oh great, let's all merge now. We'll all save money now........yeah, right.