Mme Departures

[DIRECTTANGODELTA]

I have noticed recently that departures from MME towards the South East (Dutch) airspace now route towards GASKO -RIMTO - MAMUL-DOLAS rather than UMBEL-OTR-DOLAS. The KLM pilots always request early left turns on depature but rarely get them adding another 10-15 minutes flight time. Is there a reason for this as I am aware of the CTR boundaries etc and the military tanking areas but this happens on a weekend aswell and also for arrivals in the reverse. Just curious.

[10 DME ARC]

Its company policy (KLM) to route via Controlled Airspace, however the crews always seem to want to route direct OTR! Could be something to do with fuel bonus?? If KLM still give captains this?
:)

[Midland 331]

If I was a KLM skipper, I'm not sure that I'd appreciate a tour of West Yorkshire.

Is The Vale of York really that busy?

[Get me some traffic]

It can be at times!!

[Midland 331]

I seem to recall an Air UK EDI-STN flight coming overhead Teesside (i.e. edge of the AIAA) at FL230, and the service being suddenly downgraded from radar advisory to radar information with no prior warning...

Ouch!

[Larsman]

The problem with changing the route lies with Manchester.
They are often asked for a direct route towards the south east but as the KLM files via GASKO this is nearly always refused.
Its a case of he has filed thet way so he is going that way.

Not very flexible

[shakinhed]

Larsman I'm afraid you've got it wrong.

Manchester are as flexible as they can be.
In fact turning the aircraft east as soon as possible has tactical advantages for their North Sector but often northbound traffic on P18 makes an early turn undesirable.

If a company files a plan via Gasko and Controlled Airspace , that is the way Manchester are obliged to proceed.
I don't know the reason why NT and NV KLM deps are routing that way but it may be an insurance requirement.

The alternative route may take them into an Area of Intense Activity and although the Military will provide a limited service to them until entering controlled airspace , that service is not guaranteed.
Even in the Pennine days no controller would provide a RAS in the Vale of York as a normal activity.

The practical routing does not add 10-15 minutes.
It is however safer but causes more work for ATCOs at Manchester.