had to post this...

[mustangV8]

...a little surprised at reading this but is it not typical of OUR diverse society that is so wrongly referred to as a 'melting pot'?

...keep discovering

mV8

http://www.geocities.com-SoHo-cafe-9653-emirates2.html

Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2004 8:44 PM
Subject: Complaints about Emirates

Just read your numerous complaints after a colleague told me about the
site...and I had to respond after I'd picked myself up off the floor where
I'd been crying with laughter!! Are you lot really serious?! Yes I do work
for an airline and I'd like to share a view from the other side of the fence
(the no-chip-on-shoulder don't-expect-the-world-on-a-plastic-plate side) -

1. You have a baby. Yes, it's YOUR baby. So bring nappies, milk, soft toys.
It might need feeding or changing on a ten hour flight.
2. You have a child. Or six. Yes, they are YOUR children and YOUR
responsibility. So keep them in order. Bring toys, books, games. They might
need entertaining on a ten hour flight and if they don't eat regular food
bring whatever the spoilt brats do eat. An aircraft is not a creche.
3. A window seat is not a God-given right. Or an aisle seat. Or a row of
four to yourself.
4. Sitting with the rest of your family/group is not a God-given right.
Especially when you check in ten minutes before the flight closes.
5. Aircraft do go tech. They do break down. It pisses us off just as much
sitting around waiting for the flight to take off as it does you. At least
you aren't forced to stay awake for hours at four am with only abuse from
passengers to look forward to. We don't get a hotel room either.
6. Have you ever tried to take off or land in British or east-coast US
winter? Sometimes flights will be delayed because of weather. Fact. We
haven't yet perfected the weather-control system.
7. You reckon Asians are treated worse than "others" at Dubai. Have you ever
stopped to see who it is that behaves the least civilly to those working
there? And funnily enough they always seem to have a non-Asian passport
conspicuously poking from a top pocket. Didn't realise that elevates your
status in life. By the way the rest of us aren't so bothered about the world
knowing where we "come from" and keep them in our bags. Those of us who
really are British/American.
8. Baggage. That's what it means. Not the entire contents of your house. Why
are you surprised when you are asked to pay for excess, if the weight limit
is 30kgs and you turn up with 80 (and hand baggage the size of a small beach
hut hidden round the corner with your nan)?
9.You didn't order vegetarian. We are not telepathic. What do you suggest we
do at thirty nine thousand feet above the Atlantic? Divert?
10.Your bag got lost. One bag amongst the millions that travel every day.
Ok, bad luck, but you put jewellery worth $10k in it? Are you daft? Emirates
lost my brother's golf clubs and he's a golf pro. Kind of relies on them for
work. We got them back (and $100 compensation, both delivered to our door)
three days later.
11. Your bag arrived at Delhi airport but not to you. The airline proved it
did. Are you out for compensation even though it was your own corrupt
airport's fault by any chance?
12. You need a glass of water. You HAVE to have it cos you're a heart
patient. Yeah, you and the other 319 passengers in Economy on a B777. You're
in an aisle seat right next to the wall-mounted water dispenser. Rocket
science, is it? No bloody wonder you get glared at when you ask.
13. Some nasty crew member refused to lift your bags up to the hatrack. Poor
you, that horrid mean crew member. I mean, why should YOU lift your OWN bag
with YOUR possessions that YOU brought all through the airport perfectly OK?
Never mind the back problems crew experience, they were nasty and mean to
you not to lift your bag. Myself, I'd be happy to lift your bag. When I
eventually get back to flying - I'm still recovering from spinal surgery to
correct a slipped disc.
14.The crew were rude. How awful. What, incidentally, did you say to them in
the first place? If it was something along the lines of "get me Pepsi"
...... "I want a blanket" ....... "give me chicken" ... "TEA!! TEA!! TEA!!"
then hardly surprising!! Do you think please and thankyou were invented just
for spelling practice? And don't expect friendly facial expressions if you
are offered tea by a crew member carrying ONE pot and you hold your cup out
and demand coffee. It's not a magic pot.
15. One final thought - who are all your complaints from? Face it, you may
get out and swindle a passport from the UK or the US (everyone knows British
passports can be obtained from the back of Kelloggs packets and for some
reason sending one member of the family to school in the US miraculously
provides access for the whole family including Great Aunt so-and-so up the
road and the neighbour's dog) but at the end of the day you are still Indian
or Pakistani. We know that, you know that. So stop pretending, you are a
laughing stock in the country you now call your own even though you barely
speak the language. Accept it, get the potato-sized chip off your shoulder
and while you're at it why not stay in your own country, stop emigrating and
use only your own airlines then you wouldn't have anything to complain
about.

Actually, what would you do for entertainment then?

Best regards from the airline industry!

[CAYNINE]

A literary master piece stang.

Bravo, all the above relavent and accurate.

[A300Man-2005]

Superb. Superb. Superb.

[Desert Whine]

Thanks for posting that masterpiece, we needed some comic relief around here.

Yes, extremely well-said and obviously straight from the heart. Someone put a lot of effort into that which means he/she has been putting up with this wonderful "diversity" for a long time.

The link doesn't work. Does the site contain a collection of agonising whinges from the sub-continent about how much they were wanting wanting?? :uhoh:

Should be good for a laugh..... :ok:

[White Knight]

Pure poetry:ok: :ok: Always wanting:{

[28one-to-nine]

Superb, indeed.

[SecurID]

Bloody hilarious! Also, sadly, bloody true!

[mustangV8]

my mistake

http://www.geocities.com/soho/cafe/9653/emirates2.html/

that should do it...

mV8

nope, that didn\'t work either.

SO, try this... type in \'emirates complaints\' in yahoo or google and it should be the first link. you\'ll know when u see it.

mV8

[miss petal]

Aaaaahh THE website...

it's been a long time since the last time I looked at it.. obviously the last post made them some thinking...
any chance they still leep posting the complaints.. it's my entertainment!! :D

[Fart Master]

One of the best postings I have ever read:ok:

[mustangV8]

So, we should just stay in our respective countries, dont travel, dont dare use your 'god-given' right to complain, treat cabin crew like they are celebrities(dont ask them for anything!) AND be super conscious of yourself if you are from the sub-continent since you are an embarrasment .

So, this person is an emirati who has not emigrated herself to find a job(yeah right!)...AND her job is so prestigious that god-forbid certain paying pax(whatever their potato-chip on shoulder) treat him/her like anyone else would any where around the world.

Do waiters/waitresses on the ground complain like this?

I know the flak im gonna recieve...but I think that post went beyond frustration...more into racism/hatred.

mV8

[White Knight]

MV8 - you're missing the point COMPLETELY old son.......

It's all about treating people with a bit of respect, ie the way some pax talk to the cabin crew is way OUT OF ORDER which is what this post is all about. And try looking at THE CONDITIONS OF CARRIAGE with regards to Carry On allowance and hold baggage allowance. And THEN think about how obnoxious the other pax think you may be, you know, the pax that say "please" or "thankyou", and wait politely for their turn..

It's not about racism or hatred - just REALITY, so less of the PC bull****:yuk:

[miss petal]

Do waiters/waitresses on the ground complain like this?

Hahaha funny enough they do!

My friend resigned from Emirates and continue his study in state. He's also working in a restaurant. We feel sorry for him when he started complaining... ( exactly the same issue Kate Murray was talking about )

It's not only coming from cabin crew in Emirates, or a friend who works in a restaurant
but also stories from other Airlines! Other country! Other industry.. book shop, boutique, supermarket....

So PLEASEEEE refrain using this EMIRATES cabin are racis/hatred... if you get what I mean. It's not fair. The one who posted already resigned anyway...

For your information we are the nicest/ the most tolerance crew towards this act. Other airline??? ( I don't want to think what are they going to do with them... ) :}

[Uplink]

I dont think it is just in this industry. With over 1 billion in one country it is happening in world wide industry.

What I can never understand is why someone who has lived in a country for their whole life can get a passport from Canada, England or America. They then call themselves nationals of that country. When asked where are you from "I am Canadian or English etc. There is no national pride. As someone said we all know where they are from. It is as though by getting a different passport others will treat them differently. Its a bit like supporting a football team and changing to another team when that team wins the world cup. No loyalty.

Heres the rub though. When they go and live in the new country, they try to change it back into the country they have tried so hard to run from. The trouble is the way they change the country is how they leave an aircraft at the end of a flight. Go into Hounslow or Birmingham or Toronto and you will see what I mean.

Whats it all about ?????

[mustangV8]

As I understand it, you have to be already living in a country for a certain period to get the passport, right? Live the life, spend the money...thats what its all about...MONEY. Why would the 'civilized' govts even offer citizenship to others? Aren't there enough of the indigenous population paying taxes, or do they just want more color on the streets. maybe the govts just want to piss you off.


"for some
reason sending one member of the family to school in the US miraculously
provides access for the whole family including Great Aunt so-and-so up the
road and the neighbour's dog) but at the end of the day you are still Indian
or Pakistani. We know that, you know that. So stop pretending, you are a
laughing stock in the country you now call your own even though you barely
speak the language. Accept it, get the potato-sized chip off your shoulder
and while you're at it why not stay in your own country, stop emigrating and
use only your own airlines then you wouldn't have anything to complain
about.

Actually, what would you do for entertainment then?

Best regards from the airline industry!"

If that seems funny, relevant, accurate to some ppl, we have some issues, especially that last line...


Anyway, this is an aviation forum so I stop here.

mV8

[Desert Whine]

I don't know why you even started here...... :rolleyes:

:p

[Ahad Adump]

Mustang

You lost the plot bro ?

You start the thread.......everyone loves it........YOU start slagging it off.

Catch a wake-up man.

[SecurID]

Yeah, I got confused about that! Yo, Mustang!! You started this! :cool:

[mustangV8]

yeah, yeah I DID start it and now Im finishing it...I got what I wanted from this.

Apologies if I wasted anyone's time...


mV8

[Desert Whine]

I got what I wanted from thisAnd what would that be, then... a jolly good kicking? I guess you did, at that! :p

The line about "the crew were rude to me" just hits such a nerve. I've lost count of the number of times I hear that from the girls who've just had enough of trying to please such a nature.

The other classic is the one about the carry-on and suddenly they can't lift it to the bin. It's like it's some kind of statement.... "YOU lift it up and then I, the owner of the bag, will feel justified somehow."

So tell us MV8, how can EVERYONE here all be so wrong?

Careful though, you're preaching to a lot of guys who've spent a lot of time "discovering" about other cultures since living in Dubai...

Over to you:

[miss petal]

Best regards from airline industry? You wary from that statement.. how about best regards also from hotel industry, custom industry, immigration industry, all customer service industry, hospital industry, sport industry, shop industry, bank industry, marketing industry, ad industry, queueing at ATM industry, driving industry... blablababalballalalalbabalalalalallalalalalallaaaaa

[BYMONEK]

A very prophetic statement " I got what I wanted from this"

Just sums up the feeling of many here the exact reason why resentment runs so high. People get what 'they' want from their adopted country and put very little back!

Also, shows your own lack of respect towards a profession whom you compare to that of waiters/waitress. I'm not for one minute knocking the 'waiting' profession but fundermental differences exist.

In a restaurant:

When there's a fire, the fire brigade are called. On an Aircraft it's the Cabin Crew who deal with it!
When there's a drunk, the Police are called. On an Aircraft it's the Cabin Crew who deal with it!
When your child is choking, the paramedics are called. On an Aircraft it's the Cabin Crew who deal with it!

You see, a little 'please' or 'thank you' is not such a big thing to ask, is it? It's called respect. People only recieve it if they give it. Get my drift!


That's why they have 5 weeks intensive training, NOT 5 hours!

[mustangV8]

aaalrightyyyy, then!!

Not taking the flight-safety responsibility(eg emerg's etc) away from cab. crew just alarmed by the total support of nationality bashing evryone here is so comfortable with...enjoy it while u can. You go back to your own countries and try it and see the liberals tear u to shreds. It will make you feel like an alien in your own country.

As far as demanding pax, c'mon what did u ppl expect flying around regions with a large amount of low-lower middle class?! Was it a surprise?? Or maybe u expect everlasting respect since you r expats. I dont know.

"So tell us MV8, how can EVERYONE here all be so wrong?"

maybe you r right, maybe emigration to other countries should be banned(should've been done when the brits set sail), maybe airlines should classify which nationalities are allowed to travel with them(hmmmm), maybe some nationalities should not be allowed to question or show dis-respect to other 'superior' nationalities.

ok, guess im the minority.

PEACE!

mV8

[BYMONEK]

Mustang V8

Well, what I find highly ironic in this 'debate' is that possibly the two countries most guilty of class distinction and expecting respect from those in a lower social standing are India and Pakistan. And I thought the UK was a 'class' society.

I really don't care what colour, language or Country a person is from. People will NEVER gain respect unless they are prepared to give it themselves.

[max AB]

I don't think you're fireing on all 8 cylinders MV8....

[mustangV8]

BYMONEK and gang

who do u think introduced the class concept/system in those countries?

Im not saying everyone in india and pak. excercise this attitude but the ones that do have learnt it from previous generations...the generation that endured a foreign ruler.

Im all for the respect thing for each other...especially abstaining from stereotyping. I too have worked for many years as a flight instructor in the past and singled out a nationality or two that always seemed to possess the poorest of attitudes inside and outside the cockpit with poor language skills to boot BUT never imagined to take away their kellogs box passports(funnily enough always canadian??!!) or confine them to their little strip of land...

but thats just me...Im aware there are no takers for this 'revolutionary' way of thinking but thats my ring of truth...

'over to you:'


mV8

[masalama]

flying 4 an indian carrier (private) and do understand some of the problems faced by crew when dealing with Indian/pakistani passengers.....

We have in India a new generation of passengers who're being pampered, courted and offered amazing deals and inflight services by the increasingly competitive and cutthroat aviation market....imagine a 40 minute flight on our airline where an economy passenger gets a cold towel, welcome drink, hot meal with choice of beverage(non-alcoholic) , hot towel , icecream...choice of newspaper/magazines .....the list goes on...... R we spoiling them???? U bet ur shiny 330 we are....

Some of the passengers( I don't want to generalize) have become rude, insensitive and uncourteous ....while the majority are well behaved too.....

But guess what, where do most airlines expect to make money the next 10-40 years?,who's going to fill the seats on that brand new 380? , what sectors had the highest load factor/profitability?...it's not rocket science....with the economy doing so well in India and a booming cash rich middle class numbering around 400 million...that's right approximately 15 times the population of Australia.. ready to explore the world and keep discovering.....they're gonna be falling over themselves to attract the pan chewing , aisle crapping, lewd looks giving,I want chicken saying, no, demanding Indian traveller....

So what's the solution.....I believe airlines can do their bit ...for eg.
hiring more Indian/pakistani crew to cater to those flights , maybe hire ex-crew from indian/pakistani carriers who have immense experience dealing with this specific traveller.....

specific training 4 the non subcontinent crew on how 2 deal with "the" passenger , cultural , religious issues and what 2 expect....

I believe that over time things will improve , the Indian passenger will be more world-wise and understand how to communicate effectively with crew and express him/herself in a civilized manner.....

in the meantime our carriers r slowly trying to grab these passengers away from your carriers but it's going to be tough....we need to improve on many fronts to effectively compete with the likes of Emirates, BA and the whole world....again , call me optimistic but I think we're getting there ...

in the meantime I think the spot between 10 F and 11 F looks like a great place to take a crap for me:E ....
take care all and masalama....

[Ahad Adump]

"I got what I wanted from this"

Were you trying to gently fish for brown trout with a home made fly on 5 lbs floating line on the Test?

Well you fished for Great White with half a horse carcass on this forum.

[kokkos]

"the generation that endured a foreign ruler."

Yeah it's the Brits who taught them arrogance, public spitting, snorting and head whobbling.

It's like "aparthyd".... the previous regime caused it all.

Yeah now you got it.

[harry the cod]

Reminds me of a disaster in Kenya around 7-8 years ago. A train from Nairobi to Mombassa de-railed and there were quite a few fatalities. The investigation lasted a long time and eventually they released their findings and the main cause of the accident....

The British, during their foreign rule, had not built the track wide enough!

Perhaps it was on the Kenyan governments long list of 'to do' things which they never quite got round to doing after..............how many years of independance?

Harry

[Uplink]

When will there come a time that a caucasian can call racism.

I dont mind if someone goes to live in my country. I do mind when someone gets the passport, lives in the country and then tries to change it.

A colleague of mine was in LGW at the crew hotel. He went for breakfast at the exec lounge. Some gentlemen of a different origin were in front of him. He went into the lounge after them and sat down by himself. The lady came to take his tea or coffee order. She then disappeared. He was the only caucasian in there. 30 mins went past and nothing had materialised. The group of gentlemen over the way were getting everything. He called the lady over to complain. He then had a thought. He told her she was being racist. He explained he had been sitting there for 30 mins and that the group had been served. In fact they had bent over backwards to serve the gentlemen of ethnic persuasion. Smart move. !!! The manger then got involved and my colleague explained the situation. The hotel now could not do enough for him. He got the champagne, the free fruit bowl etc.

The moral is, you go and live in someone elses country as we do here. Then abide and respect that countries rules. In England whether this is an urban myth or not. The latest "event" that I heard was an englishman being told by the police to move his christmas tree away from the window as there had been complaints that it was offensive to people of ethnic persuasion.

Chrismas lights for the tree are not allowed to be called that anymore. It has to be festive lights. There is talk of christmas being called the festive season, so as not to offend others. Last time I looked England was a christian country. We live in Dubai and abide by the laws here. Ironically so do the Indians and Paks. Why do they then behave differently in the UK, Canada etc.

The Ozzies had the best idea when some fundamentalists wanted to introduce Shariah law into Australia. The answer was
that there is only one law in Australia and that is Australian law.


Sounds about right to me.

[mustangV8]

chine

you misunderstood my post...the class thing I mentioned was in response to an earlier post. READ what is in front of you...CLASS, not CASTE...and, yes, this 'class society' was brought into india by your friendly neighborhood empire.

"Talk about an ingrained system of discrimination"

...what r u talking about it

[Brianigham]

:( Yeah Mustang,

You did confuse me a little there.

I must say that it does represent the true sentiment of the industry.

Customers are a funny lot aren't they!

The one I ussually get a little upset with is the " put my bag up there" bark. No I dont get to hear it, but my poor cc tell me lots of stories.

Cultures, race and inferiority complexes aside, I have however tried to put myself in their shoes,

It may be easier to accomodate passengers who have done quite a bit of flying, and come from a certain background. Lets call it middle class, or there abouts. These people are concious of the fact that cabin crew are people who have a job to do. They do not take the advert that shows one cc attending to one pax at face value

The working class asian ( migrating maybe to get a better life abroad) , may not be all that polished. They may have the impression that the ticket they bought with a few years savings, entitles them to personal butler service. They dont see where they err.

Why would they be trying to impress upon others that they now hold a "western" passport?........I believe its because there is that complex. Maybe in their minds all they have seen is the people from the country that they have a passport with, being treated with more respect. It boils down to more than one issue. Chances are they are not in the habit of reading self improvement books , or books on " how to travel". They probably live in areas that many would call "below par".

Then they have that flight to catch. The jam, The immigration, the baggage etc. The moment they step into the cabin, they feel as though the whole airline owes it to them to understand and act as though they are the most important people in the world.

I feel sorry for the people who have to face these customers day in and day out, and I also feel sorry for these customers who dont know they stick out like a sore thumb.

But mostly, I take my hats of to the employee who, at the end of that hell of a flght,makes the most irritating passenger feel as though they "were" the most important person in the world.

[turtleneck]

i'm about to burst out in tears.........

[tiramisu too]

eeyam sow sorrey Mister Basheer yis notin hiz boxey you calla bak eyaftir faiyve minutz.

or

Eay want to speak to the captain!

:E

[mustangV8]

brian.

very well said...a true gentlemen


MV8